Want to give my PC's 4 non class ECL to start campain with

[gawwy]

Hi all,

Im starting a new campaign in a war setting. my idea is to give the PCs all 4 ECL each to play with at character creation. the idea is for them to use these for templates such as half dragon or lich or on high power races such as minotaur or savage progressions ect. essentially the only stipulation i have given them thus far is that they cant be used for class levels.

unfortunately i dont know of any non i have massive strength style things i could do with this off the top off my head.

so my question is this, what cool builds can you make with 4 ECL non classed and 1 class level?

also are there any extra rules / clarification of my rules that you think i should make to help keep the balance between my pcs (im to too worried about the pcs being super strong as long as they are all super strong).

thank you all in advance :)

[Lightlawbliss]

would those 4 ecl include: racial HD, LA, and/or levels that aren't specifically a class?

[Swaoeaeieu]

Just to clarify: ECL is Effective Character Level. ECL= racial HD + LA + class levels.

So i think what you are saying is your PC's start at ECL 5. With 4 racial HD or LA and 1 class level.

But that sounds like a fun campaign. The entire party could consist of mosters of creatures that normaly dont see much play.

[AmberVael]

The main issue I can think of is that this allows free hit dice. And while hit dice aren't as powerful as class levels, they still add most of the things that class levels do, which can let people qualify for prestige classes early, get multiple attacks sooner, have really high saving throws, get more feats, get feats earlier... etc etc. Some of this stuff isn't bad, but it could get messy. (Throw extra hit dice on a martial adept and things really start getting weird).

It'd probably be cleaner just to offer free LA, and maybe knock HD off of things if necessary.

[morkendi]

Feral, dark, half giant psy war... still adds up to only +3, but better than half the +4 out there. Just adding feral and dark is nice to almost anything.

[gawwy]

At the moment the rules are not set in stone. id like to say yes to allowing extra HD meaning that yes i would be going with Swaoeaeieu's interpritation

Just to clarify: ECL is Effective Character Level. ECL= racial HD + LA + class levels.

So i think what you are saying is your PC's start at ECL 5. With 4 racial HD or LA and 1 class level.

But that sounds like a fun campaign. The entire party could consist of mosters of creatures that normaly dont see much play.

especially as the whole "The entire party could consist of mosters of creatures that normaly dont see much play" thing is what i want to achieave.

so go nuts :)

[Lightlawbliss]

starting by naming all of the 4 rhd, 0la races in the mm1

an argument could be made for animated objects (up to large)
with cheese: intelegent: Ape, Heavy horse, manta ray, various monstrous vermin

well that was a short list

[gawwy]

starting by naming all of the 4 rhd, 0la races in the mm1

an argument could be made for animated objects (up to large)
with cheese: intelegent: Ape, Heavy horse, manta ray, various monstrous vermin

well that was a short list

damn that does not really give my players that many options then.

so if we do it AmberVael's way do we start to get more options (I am assuming the reason we get so few is because I have allowed RHD there is not much point in taking non RHD levels?)

Edit: as an example one of my players is wanting to take a natural were-direbear barbarian

[Greenish]

Half-minotaur half-dragon human* is +4 LA, no RHD. Your ancestors weren't picky. Well, that's just a big ugly bruiser.

Stony anthropomorphic baleen whale, +1 LA, 3 RHD. You're a humanoid whale. Except tougher.

Tauric human-phynxkin comes in at +3 LA, 1 RHD (in Magical Beast). Got decent ability mods, pounce, etc. Smaller bruiser.

Dark fey'ri is +3 to +4 LA. Far more sneaky, castery thing than either of the above, if you can bear being a demonic goth elf. Fragile as anything.

Winged githzerai, +4 LA. Just a pile of Dex and Wis, really, but with psionic powers and flight.

Were-Murder of Crows human, +2 or +3 LA, 1 RHD. Yeah, I don't know either.

Volodni saint, +4 LA. Holy wood. (Technically saint is no go, but eh.)




*I use human as a stand-in for any +0 LA humanoid.

[gawwy]

Were-Murder of Crows human, +2 or +3 LA, 1 RHD. Yeah, I don't know either.


I really like that take the +2 lycan template and throw dark on it.

re fluff the crows as ravens.

be edgar allen poe? bard or rogue?

sounds like fun

[Eldaran]

Pixies are 4 LA and no racial HD, and so make amazing casters, rogues, or basically anything really. There's also a lot of really strong templates like Half-Fey that add a ton of interesting playstyle options without just making you a big beefy dude.

[Callin]

Lloth Touched Draconic Half Minotaur Half Giant with the Nameless Psychosis. (possibly not possible with the psychosis if so drop the psychosis)

Savage Progression Ghost 1 Evolved x3

Savage Progression Vampire 1 Psychic, Savage, Persuasive Evolved x3