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MesiDoomstalker
2013-12-03, 01:11 PM
In January, I am participating in an Eberron campaign. I've heard snippets about Eberron from my group but lack any of the books, so I don't know a lot about Eberron. I like tieing my backgrounds to the world as much as possible, so I've run into a dilemma. I know little about Eberron so I can't tie my background to the world as well as I like.

The character in question is a Raptorn Cleric (future Skypledged). I did some google-fu and apparently the Campaign Guide places Raptoran's in the cliffs of Xendrik. Ideally, this character will be a Cleric of a Cause (so he can have the Sky and Undeath domains). The rough background I have is him wanting to be a Sky Pirate, but I don't know enough about Eberron to give him a reason to do so. The character is going to be Chaotic Good or Chaotic Neutral depending on the party composition (many are on the fence for the Evil/Good decision).

So my question to you, Playgrounders, what bits of Eberron do I need to know to make a Sky Pirate from Xendrik? I'm cursing my lack of knowledge here...

Novawurmson
2013-12-03, 02:51 PM
Sky pirate? Definitely an Eberron thing - there are airships in Eberron, after all! Most of them are operated by House Lyrandar (http://eberron.wikia.com/wiki/House_Lyrandar), so they would probably be your main targets/enemies.

Big Fau
2013-12-03, 02:52 PM
The main way for you to become a Sky Pirate is to find an area with Airships. Xen'Drik's Giants used to have them, but not today. In a standard Eberron campaign your character would likely have ties to the Morgrave University or a Dragonmarked House by virtue of an expedition: You were a native brought back to Khorvaire for research purposes. Then, once they've finished their research, your character would have been let go and more or less forced to accommodate for himself.

Your character would fit right into Sharn. Your glide/flight abilities would lend well to Sharn's resident harpy/gargoyle populus, and a flock of Harpies may well be raiders trying to eek out a living on those less protected by Sharn's notoriously corrupt Watch. Darguul/Droam merchants being ideal targets, and you could do business with House Orien/Cannith/Lyrandar (the three houses that invented Airships).

Greenish
2013-12-03, 02:57 PM
Darguul/Droam merchants being ideal targets, and you could do business with House Orien/Cannith/Lyrandar (the three houses that invented Airships).Orien? I don't remember them having anything to do with airships, but if they did, well, I guess they really shot their own foot.

Novawurmson
2013-12-03, 02:57 PM
Oooh...I really like the idea of a "sky pirate" who's in league with House Lyrandar - maybe a broker of the house would maybe pay him to take down upstart airship companies under the guise of "lawlessness," while the house publicly decries that unregistered airships are a danger to anyone riding in them because of the wave of piracy.

Edit: Yes, Orien got in on it. What else were they supposed to do when there's a massive development in transportation?

Big Fau
2013-12-03, 03:06 PM
Orien? I don't remember them having anything to do with airships, but if they did, well, I guess they really shot their own foot.

Orien and Lyrandar are in a "friendly" competition with each other, and when Orien found out that Lyrandar was working with Cannith on a secret project they had to get in on it.

Orien owns the Lightning Rails IIRC, and they sought to expand their sphere of influence to the airways as well. They let Lyrandar captain the ships, but Orien charters the routes and sets the prices.

Greenish
2013-12-03, 03:07 PM
Yes, Orien got in on it. What else were they supposed to do when there's a massive development in transportation?Cry because the competition cut into their profits?

[Edit]:
Orien owns the Lightning Rails IIRC, and they sought to expand their sphere of influence to the airways as well. They let Lyrandar captain the ships, but Orien charters the routes and sets the prices.Huh. Where's that from? I scanned Dragonmarked, FoW, and Explorer's Handbook, and didn't find any mention of such. The latter even has stats for Lyrandar Travel Official, "who deal with the chartering of vessels".

MesiDoomstalker
2013-12-03, 04:19 PM
Alright lets see what I got here then.

Born in Xendrik, captured at a young age by an expedition from the House Lyrandar. Hated the captivity and lack of freedom of the tiny observation cell. When they were done with him, he stuck around, working for them to learn their secrets (like how to navigate an Airship, he's the groups Navigator). Eventually flees with some secret build plans or something.

I've got a good start here, thanks guys.

Dusk Eclipse
2013-12-03, 04:58 PM
I'm pretty sure Orien & Lyrandar are "friendly" rivals, considering the latter Airships are the only mode of transport not monopolized by Orien (who also carry stuff like deliveries).

Greenish
2013-12-03, 05:22 PM
Born in Xendrik, captured at a young age by an expedition from the House Lyrandar. Hated the captivity and lack of freedom of the tiny observation cell. When they were done with him, he stuck around, working for them to learn their secrets (like how to navigate an Airship, he's the groups Navigator). Eventually flees with some secret build plans or something. Flying an airship is a bit tricky, if my memory serves, you'd need either Mark of Storm or a way to control/dominate the elemental directly.


I'm pretty sure Orien & Lyrandar are "friendly" rivals, considering the latter Airships are the only mode of transport not monopolized by Orien (who also carry stuff like deliveries).Where can I read more of this cooperation? Everything I've read suggests Orien has no share of the airship business, and is really sore about it.

Also, Orien doesn't monopolize, or even deal with conventional (well, some of them elemental-powered) ships at all. That does count as a mode of transport, I should think. :smallamused:

Dusk Eclipse
2013-12-03, 05:23 PM
They don't? I always assumed they did control the seas.

Greenish
2013-12-03, 05:30 PM
They don't? I always assumed they did control the seas.No, that's House Lyrandar, with their Guild of Windwrights and Elemental Galleons (and Storm Ships, if necessary). Their only real competition are the merchant/pirate/privateers of Lhazaar Principalities.

[Edit]: Just because one house is specialized in something doesn't mean the other houses don't bud in. See, for example, the mercenary services of Lyrandar and Tharask.

FinnDarkblade
2013-12-03, 05:35 PM
Flying an airship is a bit tricky, if my memory serves, you'd need either Mark of Storm or a way to control/dominate the elemental directly.

I believe it's possible to control one with a Cha check. You can add your Cha bonus to profession checks to control the ship. The instructions for flying one start on page 25 of the Explorer's Handbook.

Psyren
2013-12-03, 05:37 PM
Just because Raptorans live out in the boonies doesn't mean you have to. I could easily see Raptorans roosting in Sharn for instance, a city that extends pretty far into the sky.

Greenish
2013-12-03, 05:46 PM
I believe it's possible to control one with a Cha check. You can add your Cha bonus to profession checks to control the ship. The instructions for flying one start on page 25 of the Explorer's Handbook.Took me a while to find it, but you can also command the elemental with opposed charisma checks (ECS 267).

[Edit]: Don't raptorans have some sort of deals with air elementals? If the ship is powered by one of those, you could conceivably just ask nicely. Also I seem to recall something about rebuking…

MesiDoomstalker
2013-12-03, 05:52 PM
Flying an airship is a bit tricky, if my memory serves, you'd need either Mark of Storm or a way to control/dominate the elemental directly.

Oh I'm not trying to pilot an Airship. The group already has a Captain and a Pilot. He wouldn't want to be either, too much responsibility, not enough flying around in the open skies.


Just because Raptorans live out in the boonies doesn't mean you have to. I could easily see Raptorans roosting in Sharn for instance, a city that extends pretty far into the sky.

Tell me more about Sharn! Seriously, I know next to nothing. I recognize the name as a city in Eberron and thats it.

EDIT:

Took me a while to find it, but you can also command the elemental with opposed charisma checks (ECS 267).

[Edit]: Don't raptorans have some sort of deals with air elementals? If the ship is powered by one of those, you could conceivably just ask nicely. Also I seem to recall something about rebuking…

Was actually going to talk to my DM about this. Raptorans made a pact with Air Elementals a long time ago, which gave them their wings and such. Was going to ask if, at some point (not right away, I think we are stealing our first ship), that I convince an Air Elemental to power our ship, instead of enslaving it.

FinnDarkblade
2013-12-03, 05:56 PM
Took me a while to find it, but you can also command the elemental with opposed charisma checks (ECS 267).

I thought I had read that somewhere.


[Edit]: Don't raptorans have some sort of deals with air elementals? If the ship is powered by one of those, you could conceivably just ask nicely. Also I seem to recall something about rebuking…

They have a Pact With the Wind Lords racial feature that gives them +1 CL on spells with the air descriptor. It is fluffed as bargains made with ancient elementals. As for the rebuking thing, you can stop an airship that way and Raptorans have Cleric as their favored class.

*edit* This (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=184643) thread might be helpful.

Greenish
2013-12-03, 06:00 PM
Sharn is in Breland, southern Khorvaire. It's the largest city on the continent, build on a stable manifest zone of Syrannia (that is to say, bound to the plane of Air) which powers up all magic related to flying and floating. This has made it possible to build huge towers (and even a floating district). The city is divided into a bunch of districts which are further divided by levels. Basically, the more powerful and wealthy you are, the higher you live, and the better the notoriously corrupt city watch treats you.

There has been several cities build on the site (from long before humans arrived on Khorvaire), with the newer ones build on top of the ruins of the older. It reaches fairly deep into ground before giving away to caves in Khyber (Eberron's Underdark).


Also City of Stormreach is a pretty decent book.


[Edit]:
Was actually going to talk to my DM about this. Raptorans made a pact with Air Elementals a long time ago, which gave them their wings and such. Was going to ask if, at some point (not right away, I think we are stealing our first ship), that I convince an Air Elemental to power our ship, instead of enslaving it.There's actually a faction in Zilargo (the gnome nation, the only ones who know how to bind elementals) who believe in asking the elementals instead of just enslaving them, incidentally.

FinnDarkblade
2013-12-03, 06:02 PM
Also City of Stormreach is a pretty decent book.

As is Sharn, City of Towers.

Greenish
2013-12-03, 06:03 PM
As is Sharn, City of Towers.Argh, yes, that's what I meant (though Stormreach is also good).

FinnDarkblade
2013-12-03, 06:06 PM
Argh, yes, that's what I meant (though Stormreach is also good).

Oh yeah, all of the Eberron books are quite good. I generally find Eberron to be the most interesting campaign setting.

*shameless glee* I'm actually about to be a part of a Pathfinder campaign set in Eberron and inspired by Firefly.

Greenish
2013-12-03, 06:11 PM
Oh yeah, all of the Eberron books are quite good. I generally find Eberron to be the most interesting campaign setting.Well, some are better than others. I wasn't too taken by Secrets of Xen'Drik or Explorer's Handbook, for example, and Dragons of Eberron wasn't that useful either.


*shameless glee* I'm actually about to be a part of a Pathfinder campaign set in Eberron and inspired by Firefly.Congratulations.

FinnDarkblade
2013-12-03, 06:14 PM
Well, some are better than others. I wasn't too taken by Secrets of Xen'Drik or Explorer's Handbook, for example, and Dragons of Eberron wasn't that useful either.

Fair enough, I suppose I should qualify that all the "core" Eberron supplements and most of the rest are quite good. The ECS, Sharn, Stormreach, Five Nations, Forge of War, Player's Guide, and Races of Eberron are all rather interesting.

Greenish
2013-12-03, 06:19 PM
Fair enough, I suppose I should qualify that all the "core" Eberron supplements and most of the rest are quite good. The ECS, Sharn, Stormreach, Five Nations, Forge of War, Player's Guide, and Races of Eberron are all rather interesting.Sure, and don't forget Secrets of Sarlona (probably the greatest amount of new, well-written fluff outside of ECS) and Dragonmarked (I just love the Houses).

Basically, after ECS, the preferred reading orders would be Five Nations & Dragonmarked & Forge of War (if you want to delve deeper into Khorvaire) or Secrets of Sarlona & City of Stormreach (if you want to expand your horizons). The latter is IMO a better book on Xen'Drik than Secrets of Xen'Drik itself.

FinnDarkblade
2013-12-03, 06:19 PM
Alright lets see what I got here then.

Born in Xendrik, captured at a young age by an expedition from the House Lyrandar. Hated the captivity and lack of freedom of the tiny observation cell. When they were done with him, he stuck around, working for them to learn their secrets (like how to navigate an Airship, he's the groups Navigator). Eventually flees with some secret build plans or something.

I've got a good start here, thanks guys.

Another thing to tie this to Sharn is that Breland is known as the Gateway to Xen'Drik and Sharn is the main city expeditions sail out from and back to.

Big Fau
2013-12-03, 06:36 PM
Well, some are better than others. I wasn't too taken by Secrets of Xen'Drik or Explorer's Handbook, for example, and Dragons of Eberron wasn't that useful either.

DoE has two bad marks against it IMO: Loredrake and Io'Lokar.

Dragonmarked is an excellent splat from a mechanical standpoint; While some of the PrCs are lacking and feats a mixed bag, most of the non-caster PrCs are quite good and the Dragonmarked Prodigy-style feats are very good.

Just avoid the Medani Prophet like the plague.

Greenish
2013-12-03, 06:44 PM
Just avoid the Medani Prophet like the plague.What's wrong with Medani Prophet?

Psyren
2013-12-03, 06:46 PM
I thought SoX was pretty cool. It presented fresh takes on the Drow and Giants that really highlighted some of the ways Eberron breaks type. It also has the cool Landforged Walker and Primal Scholar PrCs.

It's not the best setting-book by any means but Xen'drik is a nice place for mid-level adventures.

Emperor Tippy
2013-12-03, 06:46 PM
I find Stormreach interesting but it has (to a greater extent) the same problem that all of the Eberron books seem to have, they are laid out very poorly.

It's mostly alright if you are just reading the books for pleasure but when you actually want to use feat's/items/spells/monsters/locations from them you basically have to reread or skim the whole book to find the one little bit you wanted (feats are notoriously bad on this point).

I actually took my Eberron books and taped in another index page on the front with the specific page numbers for all of those little things.

FinnDarkblade
2013-12-03, 06:48 PM
I find Stormreach interesting but it has (to a greater extent) the same problem that all of the Eberron books seem to have, they are laid out very poorly.

It's mostly alright if you are just reading the books for pleasure but when you actually want to use feat's/items/spells/monsters/locations from them you basically have to reread or skim the whole book to find the one little bit you wanted (feats are notoriously bad on this point).

I actually took my Eberron books and taped in another index page on the front with the specific page numbers for all of those little things.

I guess I just never noticed because I work with pfd's and bookmark everything I find interesting/useful during my first for-pleasure readthrough.

Big Fau
2013-12-03, 06:49 PM
What's wrong with Medani Prophet?

Sinfire's guide (http://www.minmaxboards.com/index.php?topic=1072) made me look at the class twice, and I have to say I agree with his assessment:


As if Divinations couldn't break the game all ready, you now have a class feature that acts as a free Divination spell and a perfect excuse for the DM to railroad the party. So that's a mixed message right off the bat. This PrC is a bunch of SLAs, but the capstone ability removes all traces of detective elements from the Eberron setting itself. The DM has to be prepared for this if you plan on taking levels in the class, or else things get complicated.

For that reason alone I ask you to avoid this class, or at least it's capstone, unless your DM has handled these kinds of abilities with a reasonable and rational hand in the past. This is a prime example of abilities that can end a campaign before it starts, so inform the DM prior to both the campaign beginning and to taking levels in this PrC.

Divinations are campaign-breakers in the right hands, and a headache for most DMs.

Greenish
2013-12-03, 07:06 PM
Well, it gets Divination on the same level cleric learns to cast it anyway. The Prophetic Visions are as railroady as the DM. The capstone is pretty damn powerful, yeah, but it's also cool, unique, and fitting.

So yeah, high (campaign solving) power full casting PrC, not appropriate to some campaigns, not particularly terrible. And hey, half elves get nice stuff, yay.

Urpriest
2013-12-03, 10:24 PM
One thing to think about: you don't need to be a former research specimen, and depending on perspective it might not actually fit that well.

Eberron has a culture that's sort of a mix of Victorian-era and post WWI (with a bit of post WWII thrown in). As a native from savage Xen'drik, you might have been taken to Sharn as an exhibit or research subject...but you also could have been a native guide who came back with the expedition they helped, or someone who shipped out when the strange people in the flying ship came calling. Basically, think of any reason a "native" character might end up on a Victorian ship and you've got a reason you might be on an Eberron Airship.

Greenish
2013-12-03, 10:42 PM
Urpriest makes a fair point. Khorvairean society, for all its faults, is fairly humane. Noble Savage (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/NobleSavage) is more likely than a test subject. Though Eberron has space for most anything, so if you want a bit of drama and a motivation against House Lyrandar, go ahead (they can be a ruthless bunch).

Shining Wrath
2013-12-03, 10:59 PM
Xendirk is mostly wilderness inhabited by giants and above-surface drow.

There are flying ships and elemental powered flying ships. Successful piracy is going to require an elemental airship which requires a pilot with the House Lyrander mark of storm, so you'll need a minion.

MesiDoomstalker
2013-12-03, 11:21 PM
*edit* This (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=184643) thread might be helpful.

Awesome link, thank you.


Sharn is in Breland, southern Khorvaire. It's the largest city on the continent, build on a stable manifest zone of Syrannia (that is to say, bound to the plane of Air) which powers up all magic related to flying and floating. This has made it possible to build huge towers (and even a floating district). The city is divided into a bunch of districts which are further divided by levels. Basically, the more powerful and wealthy you are, the higher you live, and the better the notoriously corrupt city watch treats you.

There has been several cities build on the site (from long before humans arrived on Khorvaire), with the newer ones build on top of the ruins of the older. It reaches fairly deep into ground before giving away to caves in Khyber (Eberron's Underdark).


Also City of Stormreach is a pretty decent book.


[Edit]: There's actually a faction in Zilargo (the gnome nation, the only ones who know how to bind elementals) who believe in asking the elementals instead of just enslaving them, incidentally.

Oh sweet Pelor, this is perfect. I wanted to focus on sky, air and freedom, and Sharn sounds like his favorite place, ever.



One thing to think about: you don't need to be a former research specimen, and depending on perspective it might not actually fit that well.

Eberron has a culture that's sort of a mix of Victorian-era and post WWI (with a bit of post WWII thrown in). As a native from savage Xen'drik, you might have been taken to Sharn as an exhibit or research subject...but you also could have been a native guide who came back with the expedition they helped, or someone who shipped out when the strange people in the flying ship came calling. Basically, think of any reason a "native" character might end up on a Victorian ship and you've got a reason you might be on an Eberron Airship.

Oh fun. I'll have to ponder on this. I want him to have a deep seated need to be in the open, where he can see the sky (if we do any dungeon delving, he will complain the entire time), so I need to figure out where that desire came from.


Xendirk is mostly wilderness inhabited by giants and above-surface drow.

There are flying ships and elemental powered flying ships. Successful piracy is going to require an elemental airship which requires a pilot with the House Lyrander mark of storm, so you'll need a minion.

Two things: First the DM said he's loosening the restrictions on the Dragonmarked feat that lets you pilot Airships. Second: The party has a pilot. I don't know what the player is doing with the character, but he's claimed Pilot. Third (shush): I'm a sky pirate. I doubt the party will be, at least by title. Its a backstory, not what I'm going to be doing (though it may be, I have no idea what the game will be about).

Greenish
2013-12-03, 11:33 PM
Breland (where Sharn is) is perhaps the most up to modern sensibilities of all the nations of Khorvaire, with the king Boranel championing the warforged rights in the Treaty of Thronehold (the treaty that officially ended the Last War and recognized the current nations), and even flirting with the idea of a democracy. Sharn is probably the most cosmopolitan city in the entire setting.


Also, the requirements for (Least) Dragonmarks are already pretty lax, you just have to be the appropriate race. You relax them more, well, who's going to be a Khoravar? (Well, probably at least some people, they have pretty nice fluff in Eberron.)

MesiDoomstalker
2013-12-03, 11:57 PM
Also, the requirements for (Least) Dragonmarks are already pretty lax, you just have to be the appropriate race. You relax them more, well, who's going to be a Khoravar? (Well, probably at least some people, they have pretty nice fluff in Eberron.)

Ya I know he didn't like the fact "only Half-Elves can be goddamn pilots" (his words). So I'm guessing he just wanted a player to be a pilot without locking someone into Half-Elf.... I'm frankly glad, since Half-Elves suck...

Greenish
2013-12-04, 12:00 AM
They do, sadly. Still, the dragonmarks were their final niche (and as noted, the elementals could be controlled through other means). That's probably the reason only PHB races could manifest them.

Well, each for their own.

Big Fau
2013-12-04, 08:09 AM
Ya I know he didn't like the fact "only Half-Elves can be goddamn pilots" (his words). So I'm guessing he just wanted a player to be a pilot without locking someone into Half-Elf.... I'm frankly glad, since Half-Elves suck...

Half-Elves got a ton of support from Eberron though, and there's a nifty feat in Drow of the Underdark that turns a Half-Elf into a Half-Drow. They aren't too bad for a Dragonmarked build, it's just the base racial traits that suck.


I'm a sky pirate. I doubt the party will be, at least by title. Its a backstory, not what I'm going to be doing (though it may be, I have no idea what the game will be about).

Remember that IRL pirates (at least in the Age of Pirates) were called "privateers", and were often naval officers payed by their home country to raid enemy ships. That would be easily applied to your character, assuming you side with one of the Five Nations instead of your native Xen'Drik.

MesiDoomstalker
2013-12-06, 10:13 PM
So I got in contact with my DM and he let me borrow the few Eberron books he has: the Campaign Setting, Faiths and Races of Eberron, and Adventurer's Guide to Eberron (which based on its artwork and layout, I think is technically a 4e book). The first thing I read through was the Faiths book, for obvious reason and came to a dilemma. The DM expressed desire for me to have an actual faith listed in a book instead of a cleric of a cause, since he can better enforce a faith's doctrine if he knows it (like that listed in a book) instead of a faith I made up (and could possibly bend due to his (relative) lacking knowledge of it). Which hurts, since I can't take the Domains I wanted (Undeath and Sky) with any Eberron pantheons. I can get close, but it takes some stretching and convincing and I prefer to go by the book when I can.

However, I found a little nugget of information in Faiths, on pages 11-12. The little nugget said, in so many words, that the Sovereign Host and the Dark 6 harbor no ill will between them. That the Schism is symbolic at best and a result of mortal Vassals wishing to distance themselves from the Dark 6's nastier side. So, I pointed this out the DM and he said that if I work into my backstory that I've either been taught, or came to the conclusion himself, that the distinction between the pantheons is a mortal construct, he may worship both and thus take Domains from any of the 15 deities the 2 Pantheon's collectively contain. This still takes some requesting on the DM's part, as none of the deities explicit give out Sky or Undeath, but they give out close, specifically Air (Balinor) and Death/Decay (The Keeper). Would you, Forumites, allow in this situation a Cleric of the Combined Pantheon (what I'm calling it) take Sky and Undeath domains? If not, why?

The character will now be CN or TN, to better represent the dichotomy of the two pantheons. I know he will be basically an outcast to basically everyone, as neither faith would accept his views, and most other religious sects dislike one or both of his component faiths. I'm thinking for background, he'll have been born in Xen'drik, and stowed away in an expedition airship. A Sovereign Host priest in Sharn took him under his wing (heh) and taught him. Then some kind of either religious significant event that made him question the Schism or through his own studies he came upon the realization of the mortal distinction. I'm not sure if I want his faith to be taught or discovered. Discovered sounds better, but taught makes more sense from a fluff standpoint, since he'd either have to be taught by someone who already had this belief or show an unnaturally high Wisdom score to come to such a realization.

EDIT: I checked the publication date on the Adventurer's Guide and its '08, so its 4e. But it seems to be mostly fluff, so its good for quick fluff reference.

Greenish
2013-12-06, 10:26 PM
Sure, there are all kinds of wacky little faiths like Three Faces of War (they worship Dol Arrah, Dol Dorn, and The Mockery equally, since each of them represents an aspect of war) or The Sacred Spark (they worship Onatar & The Fury, the former for crafting stuff, the latter for inspiration, creative madness style thing).

Maybe you ran into a cult that worshipped say, Arawai as the god of birth, Balinor as the god of struggle of life, and The Keeper as the god of death, all parts of the circle of life. Only death can sustain life and all that jazz.

Prime32
2013-12-06, 10:30 PM
There's already precedent for Blood of Vol + The Keeper, and Silver Flame + one of the Dark Six (it was in DDO as "The Duality"; can't remember which).

Even in Greyhawk, where gods can intervene in heresies, there's a LN cult that worships both Heironeous and Hextor as aspects of the same being and still gets cleric powers from it.

EDIT: I checked the publication date on the Adventurer's Guide and its '08, so its 4e. But it seems to be mostly fluff, so its good for quick fluff reference.Note that some of the fluff was changed in 4e. The nature of planes, gods and the lizardfolk tribes for instance. The aberrant dragonmark "house" was made more sympathetic, while King Kaius was made less so.

Kuulvheysoon
2013-12-06, 11:33 PM
There's already precedent for Blood of Vol + The Keeper, and Silver Flame + one of the Dark Six (it was in DDO as "The Duality"; can't remember which).

Even in Greyhawk, where gods can intervene in heresies, there's a LN cult that worships both Heironeous and Hextor as aspects of the same being and still gets cleric powers from it.
Note that some of the fluff was changed in 4e. The nature of planes, gods and the lizardfolk tribes for instance. The aberrant dragonmark "house" was made more sympathetic, while King Kaius was made less so.

See, this is why I don't do 4e. Fluff (ignoring the mechanics). First they ruin the Realms. Now what in the 9 Hells did they do to Kaius?

123456789blaaa
2013-12-06, 11:42 PM
I'm curious as to what they did to House Tarkanan as well. I didn't think it really needed to be more sympathetic...

Big Fau
2013-12-07, 04:53 AM
See, this is why I don't do 4e. Fluff (ignoring the mechanics). First they ruin the Realms. Now what in the 9 Hells did they do to Kaius?

He went from struggling and sympathetic to stereotypical and bland.

MesiDoomstalker
2013-12-11, 12:21 PM
So I've got through with my DM and gotten a backstory. He's approved of everything, which really great cause I wasn't sure what I'd do if he didn't. For those who are interested, the Backstory and Build Layout are spoilered below.

Backstory
Bahar grew up in a set of cliffs in the unexplored Xen'drik, near Titan's Teeth. His village was small, nestled into alcoves of the cliffs, where they eeked out simple, tribal life. The tribe worshiped the Air Elementals to which they pledged their ancient pact as gods. They worshipped strange crystals (actually Siberys crystals) as conduits to their gods. Bahar was quite young when a strange flying contraption, a sign of blasphemy of their gods. The tribe was fearful of the contraption and the strange wingless beings that came from it and spoke in strange language. The creatures were not large, like the savage Giants and their skin was pale. A young man in long robes with a strange 6 pointed figure of yellow and blue (Sovereign Host's symbol) emblazoned on it, approached the tribe after others had failed to communicate. When the tribe's leader told the man to take his blasphemy and leave, the mans shook his head. He offered a hand, but no one dared touch the creature. Except Bahar. Bahar was only 5 years old, and was rather rambunctious and unruly child, broke from his mother's grasp, running up to the man and gripping his hand. "Whats your name?" Bahar asked (in his native tongue) and surprisingly the man seemed to understand (Comprehend Languages). The man bent over and spoke slowly. "San-tee-ah-go" Bahar repeated the man's name and Santiago was overjoyed.

Bahar was chided and punished for his insolence, but when the contraption and its wingless occupants refused to leave, it was Bahar who attempted to communicate with them. Santiago was patient and over the course of a month, Santiago had taught Bahar the basics of Common and in turn, Bahar had taught him the basics of Tuilvilanuue. Santiago told Bahar they were in search of 'special stones' and that the ceremonial stones the Tribe used as divine conduits were the stones they were looking for. Bahar said if he asked nicely, he might convince the Tribe leader to give one over. Santiago looked worried, but Bahar dragged him to the Leader's den, where the largest stone resided. Bahar attempted to translate for Santiago and the Tribe leader but they both used bigger words than he knew, so it was difficult. Eventually, Santiago pointed to the ceremonial stone and then to himself. The Tribe leader became enraged, shouting for the strange men to leave and striking Bahar for interacting with the heathens.

Santiago became equally enraged, but held his temper. He left the cave in a huff, Bahar scampering away to his own cave. When he arrived, his father was standing outside, along with the Tribe leader. He was informed for his behavior, he was to be banished from the tribe, to wander the wilderness alone. Bahar, distraught, sought out Santiago, finding him before he boarded the strange craft. Bahar desperately explained himself, Santiago barely able to utter the spell for him to understand the childs babbling. Santiago sighed heavily when Bahar had finally calmed down. He pointed to the contraption, signaling the boy to board with him. Bahar was scared, for as friendly Santiago was, the other creatures were scary in shiny clothes and strange spears, and the contraption was said to be a blasphemy to the Great Air Lords. Hesitantly, Bahar boarded the contraption. He hid his eyes into Santiago's robes in fear as he was guided to a small chamber. It was different than anything Bahar had ever experienced, but the furnishings seemed comfortable. Santiago told him to stay, and he left.

Eventually Bahar grew tired, crawling onto the floor to sleep. He missed the grass pile that was his bed, and the comfort of his mother's bossom as a pillow. It took a while for Bahar to fall asleep in the strange environ, but eventually he found sleep. His sleep was troubled and he was eventually woken by the sounds of screams and the distant smell of smoke. Bahar's fear returned, but he did as Santiago said, staying put. The screams and smell persisted for a few hours, keeping Bahar wide awake, but eventually the screams dwindled to nothing. Bahar was suddenly thrown to his side as the entire room moved beneath him. It took a moment for him to reorient himself, even more confused. Shortly after, Santiago finally returned. Bahar barraged him with questions, but Santiago was distraught and with his spell he could not understand the child. He got him to calm down telling him "You are safe." Soon the smell of smoke disappeared as well.

Bahar had passed out from exhaustion in Santiago's arms. The next few days confined Bahar to the strange room, that Santiago said was his bedroom. Santiago explained that they were traveling on the contraption, what he called an "Airship" to his home in a place called "Sharn". It took many days to reach Sharn, and no matter what Santiago told him about the place, the City of Towers was marvelous and intimidating. So many strange creatures, all wingless. So many impossibly tall cliffs. Santiago quickly ushered Bahar through the streets, keeping the child close and having him conceal his wings beneath a heavy cloak far too large for him. They climbed high up the cliffs, that Santiago called "towers" to the top of one, which he called his home, Morgrave University.

The name of his new home was far too complex for Bahar on that day, but through Santiago's tutelage Bahar began to learn about the new world he found himself in. He learned the language, he learned about subjects that were completely foreign to the sages of his previous life. As Bahar grew, he was eager to learn, dedicating himself to his studies with Santiago. He learned of the culture of so many fascinating creatures, of maths, sciences and especially of philosophy. In turn, Bahar shared what he knew of his villages practices with Santiago, which consisted mainly of their worship of Air Elementals. Santiago taught Bahar about the Doctrines of the Sovereign Host, and while Bahar was reluctant at first, he eventually converted to the religion, though he held respect for the Air Elementals of his tribal past.

By the time Bahar had turned 18, he had adjusted to his new life well the only way to know he was from the savage Xen'drik was his wings. With great pleading and more than a little bribing, Santiago got Bahar accepted into Morgrave University. Through the University, Bahar continued his education, learning greater stretches of science and philosophy. Bahar excelled, as his fervent studying quickly made him one of the top students of his class. Not all was well, as his strange appearance drew more than a few cruel words and many people shunned him as a freak and a savage. One student, a Warforged by the name of Pummel, found friendship with Bahar in their mutual isolation by others. While Bahar excelled in fields like philosophy, Pummel excelled in swordplay.

To graduate, Bahar had to do a thesis on a topic of his choice. Bahar's thesis, originally, would be about how the Air Elementals that he worshiped were an aspect of Balinor, and that his former Tribe were devout Vassals, even if they didn't call themselves as such. However, in his research, Bahar noticed something strange in historical records. In many ancient texts, the Pantheon of the Sovereign Host and the Pantheon of the Dark 6 seemed to coexist as one. He dug further, learning of the Schism. He had learned from Santiago that the Dark 6 were evil deities that the Sovereign Host shunned for their vile ways. But the records, with one exception, showed the two pantheon's held no ill will towards each other. Bahar changed his thesis into studying the Schism, coming to the conclusion that the Schism was not a result of the Sovereign Host banishing the Dark 6, but of mortal Vassal's wishing to distance themselves from the darker Dark 6's actions.

This however, did not go over well with his Professors, nor Santiago. They called his theory blasphemy, expelling him from the University. Santiago tried to reason with Bahar, convince him his conclusions were unfounded, but Bahar persisted. It spat in all that Santiago had taught him to back down on what the facts told him. Reluctantly, Santiago kicked Bahar from his home.

Bahar took to the streets, and to the skies, eeking out a living for himself. He did odd jobs, whatever he could though he wasn't above stealing occasionally. He eventually secured a small apartment just above the slums at the bottom of Sharn.

OOC Notes:
Santiago arrived at Bahar's tribe onboard an airship chartered for an expedition by Morgrave University, trying to find Siberys crystals. The ships crew wished to simply burn down the village and take them, but Santiago wanted to study them. Only after the altercation with the Tribe Leader did Santiago let the crew pillage the village. Santiago never told Bahar the fate of his village, and as far as he knows it still exists and thrives. Morgrave University and Santiago no longer consider Bahar a student or adopted son respectively, though outside the University walls Bahar's strange faith is not well known.

Build Layout
Book References:
PHB: Player's Handbook
UA: Unearthed Arcane
CC: Complete Champion
RotW: Races of the Wild
CD: Complete Divine
CA: Complete Arcana
SpC: Spell Compendium


Baharroth or Bahar for short
Level Breakdown: Raptoran (RotW; pg 68) Cloistered Cleric (UA; pg 51-52/PHB) 7/ Spirit Lion Totem Barbarian (CC; pg 46/PHB) 1/ Skypledged 10 (RotW; pg 126)/ Cloistered Cleric +2
Cloistered Cleric is a more scholarly Cleric, which fits my backstory better.
For reference the main changes.
HD: d6.
Skill points: 6+Int/level
Proficiencies: Simple Weapons and Light Armor
Skills: Regular Cleric Skills, Decipher Script, Speak Language
Domains: Grants the Knowledge Domain on top of the two Domains normally granted by 1st level Cleric
BAB: +1/2 per level
Spells: Following spells are added to the Cleric's casting list; 0—message; 1st—erase, identify, unseen servant; 2nd—fox’s cunning; 3rd—illusory script, secret page, tongues (reduced from 4th level);4th—detect scrying; 6th—analyze dweomer; 7th—sequester; 9th—vision.
Lore: Bardic Lore, but with Cleric levels.

Stats: Unrolled (Cha > Con=Wis > Str (13 min) > Int > Dex)

Feats:
1st Level Bonus: Extend Spell (PHB): +1 Metamagic, doubles duration of spells.
Level 1: Persistent Spell (CA; pg 81): +6 Metamagic. Makes any fixed our Personal range spell's duration into 24 hours. Fixed is any range that is not variable based on Caster Level.
Level 3: Divine Metamagic (Persistent Spell) (CD; pg 80): [Divine] Feat. When casting a spell, I may spend X+1 Turn/Rebuke Undead attempts to apply the selected Metamagic feat (Persistent Spell) to the spell without adjusting the spell's level. X is the spell level modifier of the selected Metamagic feat. This lets me apply the Persistent Metamagic on spells that I don't have high enough slots to cast naturally by expending 7 Turn Undead attempts.
Level 6: Power Attack (PHB): I can subtract X from my To-Hit to increase my melee damage by X. X can not be above my Base Attack Bonus and if I use a 2-Handed weapon, I increase my Damage by 2X.
Level 9, 12, 16, and 20: Extra Turning (PHB): Grants 4 extra Turn Undead attempts per day.
Extra Feats: Knowledge Devotion (CC; pg 60): I may at the start of combat perform a Knowledge check against all types of opponents in combat, using the appropriate Knowledge Skill (Arcana for Dragons, Planes for Outsiders, etc). I may only make a check if I am trained in the relevant Skill. I gain a bonus To-Hit and Damage dependent on the Skill check result. It also grants one Knowledge Skill as a Class skill (I chose Local). For reference, the Skill check result and the corresponding bonuses.
Check Bonus
15 or below +1
16–25 +2
26–30 +3
31–35 +4
36 or higher +5

Domains: I require a ruling on Domains. The Domains I wish to take are Sky (RotW; pg 174), Undeath (Spc; pg 281) and Knowledge (PHB, granted by Cloistered Cleric). No deity under either the Dark 6 or the Sovereign Host grant the first two domain's directly, because they are from non-core books. However, Balinor grants the Air Domain, and The Keeper grants the Death and Decay Domains. Would it be acceptable to take Sky and Undeath domains, under the precedent that Balinor and The Keeper provide similar and related Domains from Core books? If not, I will be taking the Air domain (if Sky is not allowed). My second Domain (if Undeath is now allowed) is undecided.

Regardless of the above, I will be exchanging my Knowledge Domain for the Knowledge Devotion Feat, as described in Complete Champion (pg 52-53).

Granted Powers:
Sky: +5 Fly/Glide Speed, Add Spot to Cleric Skill List
Undeath: Grant Extra Turning Feat

Skill breakdown (assuming +0 Int modifier):
Class Skills: Concentration, Craft, Decipher Script, Diplomacy, Heal, Knowledge (Arcana, History, Local, Religion, The Planes), Profession, Speak Language, Spellcraft, and Spot.
Points per level:
1: 24 points
2: 6 points
Total: 30 points
Skills per level:
1st:
Knowledge (Arcana): 2
Knowledge (Local): 1
Knowledge (Religion): 2
Knowledge (The Planes): 2
Knowledge (Nature) (CC): 2 (1 effective rank)
Spellcraft: 4
Profession (Navigator): 4
Spot: 4
Bluff (CC): 2 (1 effective Rank)
Concentration: 1
2nd:
Knowledge (Arcana): 1 (3 total)
Knowledge (Local): 1 (2 total)
Knowledge (Religion): 1 (3 total)
Knowledge (The Planes): 1 (3 total)
Profession (Navigator): 1 (5 total)
Spot: 1 (5 total)

Class Features:
Cleric: Spells, Lore, Turn Undead, Spontaneous casting of Cure spells, Domains
Barbarian: Pounce, Rage (1/day)
Skypledged: Skypledged, Divine Spellpool I/ II / III, Beckon Breeze, Instant Supplication, Beckon Winds, Servant Supplication, Beckon Gale, Assumptive Supplication, Cyclonic Doom.

Racial Features:
Land Speed: 30 feet
Sky/Glide Speed: 40 (45 with Sky Domain) feet, Average Maneuverability
Wing-Aided Movement: +10 racial bonus to Jump checks
Gliding: I may Glide. Gliding is similar to Flying but I may not gain altitude, I can not Hover (even if my Maneuverability improves). For every 20 feet of lateral movement, I descend 5 ft (though I may descend more). If I fall unconscious or become helpless while gliding, I float down in tight circles, reducing all falling damage to 1d6 regardless of distance. I cannot fly with a Medium or Heavy Load.
Flight: Starting at level 5, I may Fly for a number of continuous Rounds equal to my Constitution modifier (min 1). I may fly for up to twice this duration, but afterwards I am fatigued. I can start to Glide after I start flying, thus effectively prolonging the amount of time I remain in the air. Additionally, I am Fatigued if I spend 10 total minutes (100 rounds) Flying in a single day.
At Level 10, fight becomes no more strenuous than walking, and may fly unhindered.
If I descend at least 10 feet, and travel at least a total of 30 feet, I can make a Dive Attack. A Dive Attack is a Charge, in all ways, except I can only use a Piercing Weapon and I deal x2 Damage.
I can take the Run Action with Flight, but must travel in a straight line.
Pact with the Wind Lords: +1 CL to spells with the [Air] Descriptor.
Unerring Direction: I always know the direction of True North. Doesn't work outside the Material Plane.
Low-Light Vision
Weapon Familiarity: I treat Footbows as Martial weapons.
+2 Racial bonus to Climb and Spot.
Automatic Languages: Common and Tuilvilanuue

Inventory:
Adventurer's Guide to the Wilderness (50 gp): Masterwork item, +2 Masterwork bonus to K: Nature checks
Adventurer's Guide to the Planes (50 gp): Masterwork item, +2 Masterwork bonus to K: The Planes
Adventurer's Guide to All Things Magical (50 gp): Masterwork item, +2 Masterwork bonus to K: Arcana
Adventurer's Guide to Faith (50 gp): Masterwork item, +2 Masterwork bonus to K: Religion
Adventurer's Guide to Eberron (50 gp): Masterwork item, +2 Masterwork bonus to K: Local.
Masterwork Wand Chamber Longspear (405 gp): A Wand chamber allows me to slot a Wand into the weapon. While slotted, the Wand is considered readied and may be activated without dropping the weapon. Wand Chamber is in Dungeonscape, page 34.
Masterwork Studded Leather (175 gp)
Holy Symbol (silver) (25 gp)
Trail Rations (5 sp each): 10
40 Gold Pieces