Vow of poverty warforged Barbarian.

[Jgosse]

so my question is are there any ways to improve a warforge before taking VOP that he will keep after taking it?


the idea I am going for is this .

A small desert with a secret treasure and a tireless guardian on an endless vigil.

The guardian is a warforged barbarian/frenzied berzerker

I have this image of him sitting in the center and whenever some one enters the valley he knows via some magic warding.

now it states that a warforged needs some kind of stimuli so I was thinking sculpting.

What are your thoughts on this guardian?

[Scarce]

If you wanted to bring the desert sculptor idea even further, consider the Sandshaper PRC.

[holywhippet]

Try some Google image searches for Angkor Wat. The ruins there have a lot of fancy carvings on them, your guardian could be doing something similar. They'd need to be inscribing something specific though maybe so it's possible they are drawing out the history of the kingdom the treasure used to belong to until it fell and the land became a desert.

[Red Rubber Band]

Try some Google image searches for Angkor Wat. The ruins there have a lot of fancy carvings on them, your guardian could be doing something similar. They'd need to be inscribing something specific though maybe so it's possible they are drawing out the history of the kingdom the treasure used to belong to until it fell and the land became a desert.

To take this even further, search for Banteay Srei. It's created from pink sandstone, which is extremely rare. Furthermore it is incredibly detailed and covered with intricate carvings.
Really, really beautiful place.

[Jgosse]

I find it amusing that the focus is on his hobby that i tossed on just for flavor.

[bekeleven]

My input:


Vow of Poverty is a bad build on a barbarian. Bad on everything, but barbarian's doing it no favors.
If you want to maximize the utility of VoP, take it as soon as possible. The two feats have low prereqs (so you can use later slots for feats that need BaB) and you can begin accruing the exalted feats.


tldr: There shouldn't be much "before taking VoP." But if you want one, I'd recommend taking Mithral Plating and becoming a dragonborn first. Mithral plating (benefits from a feat) and the benefits of being a construct/living construct stay with you, so it's just -2 Dex +2 Con and flight. Flight is a necessity as you level, and this is the best way to get it. Warforged lose nothing from dragonborn except for 2 dex, unmodified plating and fortification.

If you're running this character, I'd look around the forums for a Vow of Poverty fix that actually brings abilities more in line with Wealth By Level. Example (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=140428).

If not, I'd consider taking superior unarmed strike. Its damage will outclass a quarterstaff by level 8. And try not to think too hard about the text in the book stating what you can and cannot do, use or own because it will just keep getting sillier, as in sillier than paladin's codes.

Alternatives include the silly, generally-considered-abusive uses of the feat like the dark chaos shuffle.

[Jgosse]

My input:


Vow of Poverty is a bad build on a barbarian. Bad on everything, but barbarian's doing it no favors.
If you want to maximize the utility of VoP, take it as soon as possible. The two feats have low prereqs (so you can use later slots for feats that need BaB) and you can begin accruing the exalted feats.


tldr: There shouldn't be much "before taking VoP." But if you want one, I'd recommend taking Mithral Plating and becoming a dragonborn first. Mithral plating (benefits from a feat) and the benefits of being a construct/living construct stay with you, so it's just -2 Dex +2 Con and flight. Flight is a necessity as you level, and this is the best way to get it. Warforged lose nothing from dragonborn except for 2 dex, unmodified plating and fortification.

If you're running this character, I'd look around the forums for a Vow of Poverty fix that actually brings abilities more in line with Wealth By Level. Example (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=140428).

If not, I'd consider taking superior unarmed strike. Its damage will outclass a quarterstaff by level 8. And try not to think too hard about the text in the book stating what you can and cannot do, use or own because it will just keep getting sillier, as in sillier than paladin's codes.

Alternatives include the silly, generally-considered-abusive uses of the feat like the dark chaos shuffle.

he would be an NPC not something I was playing so the VOP was just for flavor and the idea of the character.

[Starmage21]

My input:


Vow of Poverty is a bad build on a barbarian. Bad on everything, but barbarian's doing it no favors.
If you want to maximize the utility of VoP, take it as soon as possible. The two feats have low prereqs (so you can use later slots for feats that need BaB) and you can begin accruing the exalted feats.


tldr: There shouldn't be much "before taking VoP." But if you want one, I'd recommend taking Mithral Plating and becoming a dragonborn first. Mithral plating (benefits from a feat) and the benefits of being a construct/living construct stay with you, so it's just -2 Dex +2 Con and flight. Flight is a necessity as you level, and this is the best way to get it. Warforged lose nothing from dragonborn except for 2 dex, unmodified plating and fortification.

If you're running this character, I'd look around the forums for a Vow of Poverty fix that actually brings abilities more in line with Wealth By Level. Example (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=140428).

If not, I'd consider taking superior unarmed strike. Its damage will outclass a quarterstaff by level 8. And try not to think too hard about the text in the book stating what you can and cannot do, use or own because it will just keep getting sillier, as in sillier than paladin's codes.

Alternatives include the silly, generally-considered-abusive uses of the feat like the dark chaos shuffle.


IIRC VoP hurts extra for warforged, because you must also take the Unarmored Body feat, which means you cant qualify for VoP until 6th level, unless Sacred Vow and Vow of Poverty appear on your class bonus feat list.

[bekeleven]

IIRC VoP hurts extra for warforged, because you must also take the Unarmored Body feat, which means you cant qualify for VoP until 6th level, unless Sacred Vow and Vow of Poverty appear on your class bonus feat list.

I'm reading the VoP requirements as we speak and I don't see it restrict parts of the body that count as armor. You may be thinking of monk. (is that a thing with monks?)

[Kuulvheysoon]

IIRC VoP hurts extra for warforged, because you must also take the Unarmored Body feat, which means you cant qualify for VoP until 6th level, unless Sacred Vow and Vow of Poverty appear on your class bonus feat list.

Wait, why? Technically, if he took Mithral Body for example, the body has no value and IIRC it's stated somewhere that you cannot recover the material used in a warforged (it was in regards to Adamantine Body).

[Greenish]

I'm reading the VoP requirements as we speak and I don't see it restrict parts of the body that count as armor. You may be thinking of monk. (is that a thing with monks?)The basic plating doesn't even count as armour, so warforged monk doesn't need Unarmored Body.

With enhanceable plating and battlefist, warforged actually make pretty decent monks. There are even ACFs to swap the redundant immunities to useful stuff.

[Jgosse]

So I am gathering I could have his body enhanced prior to taking the vow and it would still stand.

[Baroknik]

I'm not sure if the platings count as an armor bonus or natural harbor bonus. Be warned that AC bonus from VoP explicitly does not stack with armor bonus (not just from equipment).

[Jgosse]

I'm not sure if the platings count as an armor bonus or natural harbor bonus. Be warned that AC bonus from VoP explicitly does not stack with armor bonus (not just from equipment).


Now I know I know that this is a very thin edge but this is my stance
As a Dm I try and follow the rules as closely as possible to build things I want, but I will stretch and bend the rules if that's what it takes. so while I will not give this creature a Great axe and a bunch of gear and vow of poverty I will do anything with in reason. so I think I will count it as a natural armor.

[Baroknik]

Now I know I know that this is a very thin edge but this is my stance
As a Dm I try and follow the rules as closely as possible to build things I want, but I will stretch and bend the rules if that's what it takes. so while I will not give this creature a Great axe and a bunch of gear and vow of poverty I will do anything with in reason. so I think I will count it as a natural armor.

Is say that's perfectly fair in this case.

Though you may have to decide if you want the NA's to stack in this case (VoP gives +1 NA at level 8). If they stack, that's 23+dex AC at level 8 (Mithral body +5, VoP +6/+1/+1)

Just checked it for future reference, it's explicitly not NA, but I see no game breaking change by making VoP stack with plating (though adamantine body may be wonky at low levels)

[Starmage21]

Is say that's perfectly fair in this case.

Though you may have to decide if you want the NA's to stack in this case (VoP gives +1 NA at level 8). If they stack, that's 23+dex AC at level 8 (Mithral body +5, VoP +6/+1/+1)

Just checked it for future reference, it's explicitly not NA, but I see no game breaking change by making VoP stack with plating (though adamantine body may be wonky at low levels)

Their MM entries in MM3 count the default plating as a +2 armor bonus.

[Red Fel]

I would rule that he could take the modified plating feats, but he could not further improve (i.e. enhance) them. And I agree, the benefits may be questionable when you consider that VoP doesn't stack with armor bonus. However, VoP does stack with DR, which you can get from modified plating (like Adamantine or Ironwood).

Here's the issue: Barbarians, like many melees, are heavily gear-dependent. VoP kind of hurts him. What exactly were you hoping to accomplish with this guy? What's the point of VoP on him? You mention flavor - what kind of flavor?

[Jgosse]

I would rule that he could take the modified plating feats, but he could not further improve (i.e. enhance) them. And I agree, the benefits may be questionable when you consider that VoP doesn't stack with armor bonus. However, VoP does stack with DR, which you can get from modified plating (like Adamantine or Ironwood).

Here's the issue: Barbarians, like many melees, are heavily gear-dependent. VoP kind of hurts him. What exactly were you hoping to accomplish with this guy? What's the point of VoP on him? You mention flavor - what kind of flavor?

The Idea of this npc is he is completely devoted to guarding this little desert Vally and it's contents. I am thinking of using the city brawler ACF and superior unarmed strike with this build as well to help lessen the gear dependence. the idea is this is some kind of atonement he failed at one thing and now he has given up every thing and he sits there guarding the Vally waiting for eternity for something or some one that will never happen or show up.

[Baroknik]

Though this departs from the character theme slightly, I wanted to throw out a suggestion of a classic encounter.

Make him a Warforged Juggernaut. I know that is the opposite of a VoP, but that is the point of it as an NPC (if you want it to be a boss type fight -- otherwise, why stat him this deeply?). He lost his Vow benefits and he thinks its because he failed to protect the valley properly, now he is driven mad with the desire to protect it at any cost.

The players meet him in the valley only to have him immediately (or almost immediately if you wish) attack them. If they are able to subdue him (or prior to combat) they can talk to him and find out his past. A player in the party may recognize that these modifications to his body and his single-minded devotion have twisted his view of his Vow and that by returning to the path is the proper way. This gives the options to the players to have a peaceful resolution and make a long-term ally if they can convince him of his err. If they are just gonna kill him either way (the party is evil, for example), it may give them insight into how to corrupt future guardians.

If the warforged is turned back to the Exalted path, then return him to Barb 5 + 3 RHD (instead of the juggernaut) and consider dropping his ECL if you want him to continue to advance in levels, but retain the full VoP benefits of his full character level (this way the VoP is strong for his xp gained, and he doesn't just lose out for his lost Juggernaut levels).

Just an idea, depending on how nailed down you have this encounter.

Of course, you could always do both! In separate valleys or in the same one and have the two guardians constantly at odds with one another (either simply philosophically or actually coming to blows is up to you!)

[Red Fel]

The Idea of this npc is he is completely devoted to guarding this little desert Vally and it's contents. I am thinking of using the city brawler ACF and superior unarmed strike with this build as well to help lessen the gear dependence. the idea is this is some kind of atonement he failed at one thing and now he has given up every thing and he sits there guarding the Vally waiting for eternity for something or some one that will never happen or show up.

That explains who he is and why he's there, not why he has VoP. It might explain, say, Sacred Vow, or something like that, but it doesn't say why Poverty specifically.

[Seto]

The Idea of this npc is he is completely devoted to guarding this little desert Vally and it's contents. I am thinking of using the city brawler ACF and superior unarmed strike with this build as well to help lessen the gear dependence. the idea is this is some kind of atonement he failed at one thing and now he has given up every thing and he sits there guarding the Vally waiting for eternity for something or some one that will never happen or show up.

@Red Fel : I think that's why VOP. For penance. He has given up everything, not only every other interest than guarding the valley, but also every possession he had.

[Chronos]

This magical ward that alerts him when someone enters... How does it work? Is it an item? And if not an item, what else could it be?

[Jgosse]

@Red Fel : I think that's why VOP. For penance. He has given up everything, not only every other interest than guarding the valley, but also every possession he had.

you got it

[Jgosse]

This magical ward that alerts him when someone enters... How does it work? Is it an item? And if not an item, what else could it be?

in the center of the Vally is a circle that shows the layout of the valley and if anything beyond a mundane animal crosses the valley lines it shows up on the valley diagram.