Chokers and the grappling rules--need help now please!

[CoffeeIncluded]

Okay, so I'm having my players fight three chokers--one is enhanced by a couple of hit dice. The two regular chokers attacked Artorias, the rogue/warblade, and the enhanced choker attacked Badger, the ranger. Artorias managed to evade the grapple but Badger got in a grapple (the chokers got a surprise round).

On initiative, the chokers went before Artorias and Badger and attacked. Here's the big question: Badger failed the initial grapple check against the choker, but Artorias succeeded against the initial grapple checks against his two chokers. However, the chokers are still on top of them and attacking. Which of them, if any, is denied their dex bonus to AC upon the choker's subsequent attacks? If they succeed on an opposed grapple check, are they still considered to be grappling and thus lose their dex bonus to AC?

This is important. The answer to this determines if Badger takes 6 damage or 34, and whether she stays upright or falls to -7 HP.

EDIT: Also, if she stays upright and uses the Boots of Swift Passage (MIC), does the choker go with her?

[hymer]

Badger isn't grappling the roper, right? Then she loses dex modifiers.

That was unclear: If you are in a grapple, you lose dex modifiers, but not against those you grapple with.

[CoffeeIncluded]

Badger isn't grappling the roper, right? Then she loses dex modifiers.

She is being strangled by the choker, which I think means it's grappling her? The choker made two attack rolls of 13, which hits her AC without the dex bonus. Do they hit?

[hymer]

If the chokers attacked the one they grappled (which they probably did), then she still had her dex modifiers. But was she flatfooted? Sounds like this happened early in the fight.

[CoffeeIncluded]

If the chokers attacked the one they grappled (which they probably did), then she still had her dex modifiers. But was she flatfooted? Sounds like this happened early in the fight.

The initial attack was pre-initiative. This second attack, where Badger took the crapton of damage and may or may not fall to -7, was on initiative, though it's not her turn yet (she goes next, as does Artorias). This is still the first turn.

[hymer]

She's flatfooted until she acts. Unless she has uncanny dodge [edit: or something similar, I expect, but UD is the obvious ability], she does not have dex modifiers while flatfooted. Sorry, Badger!

[CoffeeIncluded]

She's flatfooted until she acts. Unless she has uncanny dodge, she does not have dex modifiers while flatfooted. Sorry, Badger!

Thanks! Badger's player does NOT have good luck against chokers.

[hymer]

Any time. Have fun!

[Athedia]

I HATE chokers.... I hate hate hate hate hate hate hate chokers. I am now going to sulk in a corner.

[hymer]

I sympathize with you. I have a player who always gets antsy around enemy archers. Two of his characters have been killed by bow crits.
I hope Badger survived after all. How did it go?

[Crake]

Thanks! Badger's player does NOT have good luck against chokers.

Did you take into account the -4 to attacks creatures get when using light or natural weapons in a grapple?

[hymer]

EDIT: Also, if she stays upright and uses the Boots of Swift Passage (MIC), does the choker go with her?

No, it does not. You can't bring passengers with you in your swift boots, even if you wanted to. :smallsmile: Unfortunately, being grappled by a choker means you can't speak, and as such can't use command words, either, which are required by BoSP.

[CoffeeIncluded]

I HATE chokers.... I hate hate hate hate hate hate hate chokers. I am now going to sulk in a corner.

Ladies and gentlemen, Badger's player.


I sympathize with you. I have a player who always gets antsy around enemy archers. Two of his characters have been killed by bow crits.
I hope Badger survived after all. How did it go?

She's at -7, but should hopefully get up after the cleric goes.


Did you take into account the -4 to attacks creatures get when using light or natural weapons in a grapple?

Yep! Also, the choker had monster advancement, it was medium sized.

And thanks for clarifying with the boots!