Pally healer with a gun? (PF)

[Legendairy]

Ok, so I have kind of a tall order I think. I want to play a gunslinger, have for awhile but it seems our party will have no healer. Well, the party looks like this a Standard Pally, a melee smashy killy type and a third undecided. The undecided generally plays the healer but he hates it and usually does it to placate the others. I am generally the DM so I figured I would play the "Healer" but as I said I wanted to play a gunslinger. So to the task at hand, I like the Oradin or palacle build I have seen, Is there a way to modify it to be a gunslinger? It is a home-brew world so I do not know too many specifics. Have not picked a race yet and the ability rolls look like this 16 15 13 16 17 13.


Please help! Thank you in advance!

[Slipperychicken]

What level are you starting at?

[Legendairy]

guess that would be helpful, need to be semi effective early on I would think we will start around 5th level but it may be first by the time the DM figures it all out. So I guess a fairly fleshed out build would be nice that becomes decent by level 5 or so?

Edit: Honestly, I do not know if it has to be a pally, just a good healer with a gun?

[Scow2]

Paizo has just the answer! (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/paladin/archetypes/paizo---paladin-archetypes/holy-gun)

[Legendairy]

the holy gun isn't particularly good at healing tho. Trying to be a main party healer as well.

[grarrrg]

the holy gun isn't particularly good at healing tho. Trying to be a main party healer as well.

While the Holy Gun isn't particularly good at healing, it is no worse at it than a 'normal' Paladin.

There is no reason a Holy Gun Oradin can't work.
That said, the Holy Gun is widely regarded as a semi-weak archetype.

I'd either go with a Holy Gun Oradin, 2 levels Paladin, 3 levels Oracle. From there it's up to you to go with more Paladin or Oracle.

OR
There's the option of skipping Holy Gun and dipping Gunslinger for a level (very front-loaded it is), then going with a 'normal' Oradin build.
Mysterious Stranger (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/base-classes/gunslinger/archetypes/paizo---gunslinger-archetypes/mysterious-stranger) has the most synergy (CHA-based), but an argument can be made for Pistolero (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/base-classes/gunslinger/archetypes/paizo---gunslinger-archetypes/pistolero) or 'normal' Gunslinger as well.
For 5 levels, Gunslinger 1/Paladin 2/Oracle 2. Take you're 6th level in Oracle for the 2nd Revelation and 3rd Life Link and then proceed how you wish.

[Slipperychicken]

Paizo has just the answer! (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/paladin/archetypes/paizo---paladin-archetypes/holy-gun)

I'd consider Divine Hunter, since it gets you Precise Shot for free. Smiting Shot is objectively worse than vanilla smite evil (which lasts for every shot, for the whole encounter). Holy Gun also throws out Detect Evil.


A Divine Hunter build (assuming a 5th level start, in which case the free starting gun isn't important) would probably go like this:

Human Paladin
Dex>>Cha>Con>Wis>Int>Str

Str 13
Dex 17 (+ racial 2 + 1 levelup = 20)
Con 16
Int 13
Wis 15
Cha 16

1st: [EWP: Rifle], [Point Blank Shot], [bonus feat-> Precise Shot]
3rd: [Rapid Shot]
5th: [Deadly Aim]

Spend WBL for something like:


A +1 Pepperbox Rifle (9,300gp normally, lower with Commonplace guns or guns everywhere) or a +1 Revolver. I know that advanced firearms cost all the money, but it's worth it because they never explode and reload faster.
Nonmagical backup weapons (at least one melee, one ranged), just in case.
A bunch of bullets (try to get bullets of several different materials to bypass DR).
Whatever armor you feel is appropriate for the concept. I'd recommend studded leather or parade armor because of your high Dex.
A mount can help your mobility a lot. Remember that, while mounted, you can have it take a normal move while making a ranged full attack (because that restriction only applies to melee attacks. I checked), which sure beats choosing between moving and firing every round.


Because you're using an advanced firearm, you can reload as a free action with alchemical cartridges. Feel free to use normal bullets when you load outside combat or don't feel like Rapid Shot-ing that round. Also, advanced firearms mean that your gun will never explode from a misfire. In case it misfires, get someone to take Mending as a cantrip and fix it after combat.

Your non-smite full attack (with deadly aim and rapid shot) should look something like: +7/+7 for 1d10+5 each. When smiting it should be like +10/+10 for 1d10+10. You're swinging against touch AC, so you should be hitting pretty reliably.

If you feel like not being poor at the cost of combat effectiveness, feel free to replace Deadly Aim with Gunsmithing, and then say you crafted your gun and bullets yourself for 10% of the normal cost. If your game is "Commonplace Guns", or "Guns Everywhere", then you get enough of a discount that you won't be poor.

EDIT:
As for healing, Paladins are good at healing no matter what. Divine Hunter lets you heal from a distance, your Lay on Hands should cover in-combat healing. If you need to be better, ask your GM about combining the Divine Hunter and Hospitaler archetypes (this would let you heal about as well as a Cleric, at the cost of Smite Evil uses). If I were you, I would just get someone to buy wands of Cure Light Wounds and use those for out-of-combat healing after my Lay on Hands were gone.

[Legendairy]

I do like that, only problem is no advanced firearms. I didn't know or it would have been in my first post.

[Slipperychicken]

I do like that, only problem is no advanced firearms. I didn't know or it would have been in my first post.

What's the campaign's firearm availability level?

[Legendairy]

Basically up to the dms whim, all he has said is no revolvers or rifles. muzzle loaders are fine flintlock style. He specifically did say no advanced firearms. Also could you explain the damage of 1d10+5?
Edit: I mean it is dex to damage right? I thought only gunslingers picked up that neat little trick?

[Slipperychicken]

Basically up to the dms whim, all he has said is no revolvers or rifles. muzzle loaders are fine flintlock style. He specifically did say no advanced firearms.

I guess you could do the same thing with a +1 pistol (get Greater Reliable later on?), keep a backup gun or two in case you have misfires (you can afford that when you aren't spending 9000gp on a gun :smalltongue:), get Rapid Reload, and put off Deadly Aim or Rapid shot to 7th level. In that case, a mount will be useful to get you within the 20ft range.

EDIT: You could also use the same build, get a pepperbox pistol as your main weapon, and put off Rapid Reload until 7th level. With 6 shots before a move-action reload, that means you can Rapid Shot for 3 rounds before you need to spend actions reloading, but you're going to have more misfires.


Also could you explain the damage of 1d10+5?
Edit: I mean it is dex to damage right? I thought only gunslingers picked up that neat little trick?
Here's the breakdown for my last post's 1d10+5:
1d10 from the rifle's base damage.
+1 from being a magic weapon.
+4 damage from Deadly Aim.

I know of two ways to get dex-to-damage with a firearm: Gunslinger 5 (or gunslinger 1 if you have Guns Everywhere), and Trench Fighter (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/fighter/archetypes/paizo---fighter-archetypes/trench-fighter) 3.

[Legendairy]

Ahh ok, yeah the big issue is I wanted a gunslinger in all its glory lol. If I can talk him into the archetype stacking I should be fine. But not starting with a 1st level forearm may hurt. Again, thank you all so much for the advice.

[Slipperychicken]

Ahh ok, yeah the big issue is I wanted a gunslinger in all its glory lol. If I can talk him into the archetype stacking I should be fine. But not starting with a 1st level forearm may hurt. Again, thank you all so much for the advice.

The starting firearm only matters if you start before level 3. Otherwise you can just buy one. Also, I edited my last post:


EDIT: You could also use the same build, get a pepperbox pistol as your main weapon, and put off Rapid Reload until 7th level. With 6 shots before a move-action reload, that means you can Rapid Shot for 3 rounds before you need to spend actions reloading, but you're going to have more misfires.

If you want to play a Gunslinger, I suggest seeing if anyone else in the group has Cure Light Wounds on their spell list (doesn't need to be a spell known, just on their class' list). If so, they can use a CLW wand or two to handle out of combat healing, and that's as much healing as you're going to need. They can also do the same thing with the Infernal Healing (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/i/infernal-healing) spell (which many arcane classes have), but it's kind of evil because it uses fiend blood.

EDIT: Also, in my opinion, Gunslinger1/Trench Fighter3 is better than straight Gunslinger. You get dex-to-damage earlier, start with a gun (and perhaps more importantly, the Quick Clear deed), and those bonus feats are going to do you a lot more good than deeds will.

[grarrrg]

Keep in mind, the supplement that Trench Fighter was published in took place in a common-guns-type setting (and from what I hear, it was actually an "our world, early 1900's" type game).
So your DM may not allow it.

[Slipperychicken]

Keep in mind, the supplement that Trench Fighter was published in took place in a common-guns-type setting (and from what I hear, it was actually an "our world, early 1900's" type game).
So your DM may not allow it.

Ssh, the GM might hear you.

Besides, it's legal in other campaigns, and firearms need more boosts like that so they can be competitive.