the undertaker and paul bearer in d&d!

[blelliot]

I have always been a huge wrestling fan. A few months back I took my girlfriend with me to watch wrestlemania and explained the idea behind one of my favorite charachters, the undertaker. For those of you who do not know,, the undertaker gimmick was that he was already dead, and therefore couldn't be hurt. He would not sell any offense, and when he got knocked down, he would do a micheal myers-esque sit up. His manager, named paul bearer would carry an urn that supposedly held the "power" of the undertaker. He would hold the object up when the undertaker needed to make a comeback against the bad gut wrestler, etc.. so my question to the playground is how would you stat the duo out? All this is for an idea that my gf gave me because she said that the idea of the gimmick was something straight outta d&d. Lemme know your thoughts people! Thanks!

[Squirrel_Dude]

Mania was more than a few month ago at this point. TLC happened last night, and The Rumble is on the way. :smalltongue:

Anyway:

On a pure ability score set up: Taker is either Undead with massive charisma, or we're going with the Biker gimmick and he has a massive constitution. Large strength, moderate dex, but with a relatively low in and wisdom. He's the in-ring guy, and not a master strategist (at least now that he just shows up for his annual wrestlemania match).

Bearer (RIP) would have the higher int, lower strength, dex, con, and high wisdom and charisma. He was just the talker after all.

Image of both for those unfamiliar (http://photos.imageevent.com/pizon/8x10candidphotos/Paul%20Bearer%20and%20Undertaker%20b.jpg) Bearer on left. Very young Undertaker of the right.

Undertaker would probably simply be an unarmed fighter, unless we're going all out on the supernatural powers thing. If we're doing the later, things start get weird (fun).

[Barstro]

Since Paul Bearer is the "face" and sort of buffs the Undertaker, I'd think something bardish. Since he is a wrestling manager I'd put his intelligence above Undertaker, but not too high. Same with wisdom; managers always end up doing something very dumb, ala Nale.

[zilonox]

While not a perfect match for the Undertaker, the Ghostwalker PrC from the 3.0 book Sword and Fist came to mind while reading your description.

[blelliot]

I'm all for weird. I was thinking a death knight unarmed melee/ caster of some sort. And as for paul, a bard/cleric focused completley on buffing taker. Any thoughts?

[Squirrel_Dude]

Since Paul Bearer is the "face" and sort of buffs the Undertaker, I'd think something bardish. Actually, he's more of a the heel. :smalltongue:

[blelliot]

Actually, he's more of a the heel. :smalltongue:

I see what you did there... high five.

[holywhippet]

Maybe dragon shaman for Paul Bearer? His using the urn to make the Undertaker get back up is similiar to the vigor aura.

Don't forget that one of the Undertaker's tricks is to take a walk along the top rope (being balanced by his opponent) before jumping off and hitting them. He needs some kind of class ability or skill trick for that.

[Squirrel_Dude]

He also takes suicide dives over the top rope from time to time, and has a finishing move which is a submission maneuver, so (in theory) a monk could be the answer.

If they weren't bad at their job, I mean.

[blelliot]

Maybe monk 1/sorcerer x/ fighter 4/ blackguard x for undertaker? Paul could be cleric 1/bard x?

[justiceforall]

Mania was more than a few month ago at this point. TLC happened last night, and The Rumble is on the way.

The next 'mania is just after Rumble...


Some quick thoughts without reference to optimisation:

- 'Taker has to have improved grapple. He needs to be able to suplex/piledrive/etc people through tables at a minimum. Bonus marks for hell's gating someone out with pin-shenanigans. You can do the move "old school" which was mentioned above just using normal grapple rules to move the victim to a higher point then jumping off.

- if he's not actually undead, endurance/die hard is thematically close. DR could also do the trick, even if DR/magic instead of DR/-. Another possibility is Healing Devotion. If you don't outright kill him, he'll be back up in a couple of rounds...

- he needs fear effects, either magical or intimidate/cower combo

- If you get a third player, make Kane :).

[Amphetryon]

Mania was more than a few month ago at this point. TLC happened last night, and The Rumble is on the way. :smalltongue:

Anyway:

On a pure ability score set up: Taker is either Undead with massive charisma, or we're going with the Biker gimmick and he has a massive constitution. Large strength, moderate dex, but with a relatively low in and wisdom. He's the in-ring guy, and not a master strategist (at least now that he just shows up for his annual wrestlemania match).

Bearer (RIP) would have the higher int, lower strength, dex, con, and high wisdom and charisma. He was just the talker after all.

Image of both for those unfamiliar (http://photos.imageevent.com/pizon/8x10candidphotos/Paul%20Bearer%20and%20Undertaker%20b.jpg) Bearer on left. Very young Undertaker of the right.

Undertaker would probably simply be an unarmed fighter, unless we're going all out on the supernatural powers thing. If we're doing the later, things start get weird (fun).
Remember that 'Taker's early WWF/E career showcased a "you can't hurt me" style of no-selling the opponent's attacks a'la Bruiser Brody (whom he once faced), indicating a strong CON at that point.

[WbtE]

You could also have the Smark's version of the duo as moderate- to high-level Experts. :smallcool:

[holywhippet]

Remember that 'Taker's early WWF/E career showcased a "you can't hurt me" style of no-selling the opponent's attacks a'la Bruiser Brody (whom he once faced), indicating a strong CON at that point.

Or damage reduction.

[ranagrande]

I would make the Undertaker a Ranger 1/Crusader 1/Warblade 1/Monk 2/Reaping Mauler 5/Tattooed Monk 10

Paul Bearer would be his cohort, a Bard/Marshal/Evangelist.

[Averis Vol]

I'm not sure what you guys are all talking about, their obviously both bards with really high ranks in perform (Acting) :smalltongue:

[justiceforall]

I'm not sure what you guys are all talking about, their obviously both bards with really high ranks in perform (Acting)

Someone already made that joke:


You could also have the Smark's version of the duo as moderate- to high-level Experts.

[Averis Vol]

Someone already made that joke:

Weird, I took that as a legitimate idea. Oh well, I'll go hang my head in shame over there then.

[ben-zayb]

I'd agree with the Undead Ghost, but tack on an evolved undead template for fast healing (he sits right back up after an attack). Probably with the Magical Training feat too, for lightning prestidigitation (it never hurt anyone, didn't it?). Add on Marshal so he gets to add his Cha to combat maneuvers like grappling (see below why)

His MO is to possess body via Malevolence with minor Disguise ranks to look like his original self, which gives him a corporeal body. In case the body possessed is weak, he still gets to add his Cha to grapple etc.

[justiceforall]

If you're going undead, surely a lich or anything else with a phylactery (the urn) is the way to go?

[Squirrel_Dude]

If you're going undead, surely a lich or anything else with a phylactery (the urn) is the way to go?Lich might work. I was thinking Necropolitan, but I like the thinking with the phylactery.

[WbtE]

Weird, I took that as a legitimate idea. Oh well, I'll go hang my head in shame over there then.

A "smark" is a smart mark - a fan who appreciates wrestling for its technical aspects. Contrast with a mark, who is more interested in the fiction presented. The terms come from the wrestling's carnival origins. :smallsmile:

[Squirrel_Dude]

A "smark" is a smart mark - a fan who appreciates wrestling for its technical aspects. Contrast with a mark, who is more interested in the fiction presented. The terms come from the wrestling's carnival origins. :smallsmile:That's not quite it, as I understand it.

The term "smart" doesn't mean an intelligent fan, or one predisposed to a certain style. It simply means that you are aware that wrestling is fake (sorry if I ruined anyone's holidays with that knowledge).

A Mark, to quote wikipedia, is "a person who enjoys professional wrestling as if it were unstaged. Derived from the carnival term." So they act as though it was real, perhaps even believing that it is. See: the 10 year olds who cried with Hulk Hogan turned heel when he joined the NWO.

So smarks are just fans with inside knowledge of the business, or who understand that it's real, but appreciate the story being told, the technical skill of the people in the ring, and are interested in what goes on backstage.