A strange relationship situation, needing advice.

[Briandude777]

This some teenage stuff, so.. yeah. All right, let's clear the air; I am single, and the girl I like is not. We became friends in early April of this year, and have been talking ever since. She set me up with some of her friends, and that didn't work out. One was a liar, the other one dumped me for her abusive ex, but I digress. Her and I have been texting (figuratively) 24/7, and talking whenever we got the chance. She told me that she had a giant crush on me when we first met and that she still likes me. I (in my clouded judgement) said that I really like her, and she said "me too :)". Now.. let's "stat up" her boyfriend and I, par sey. I talked her out of suicide, and cutting herself, along with helping her cope with depression and just making her happy. Her boyfriend and her rarely talk, but (him, her, other mutual friends and I) hang out for a few hours each week. Her boyfriend will.. like dry hump her infront of us all, and I fear for her safety when they are alone. He underage drinks, his friends used to bully her and he's just generally a douchebag. From those traits mentioned, it shows Him << Me. She has been in some cruddy relationships - the only reason she's with him is because he does not physically abuse her like her other exes did. She won't break up with him, because it's too close to Christmas, but is that just a way to stall? I mean, if it's just a matter of time before she actually gets raped, then I'm not going to hold off on it. (Leeroy Jenkins) But really, any help is appreciated..

[Jay R]

You have documented that he is rude to her, not that he does anything illegal to her. You have nothing to act on.

You can't be more than a friend to her; she has a boyfriend.

[Grinner]

You have documented that he is rude to her, not that he does anything illegal to her. You have nothing to act on.

And if he did, what would Brian do? Take this information to the appropriate authorities? Drag her into the mess that would follow? A friend might do that, supporting her along the way, but like you said, it seems that he wants to be more than that.




More to the point, JayR is right. There's very little you can do but be a friend to her. This isn't about you; this is about her and her decisions. You can talk to her, but she has to make the choice, not you.

[Creed]

This basically summed up my experience with a related issue about 5 years ago:
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_JvaoyCwbcLI/TNlA8Y8foFI/AAAAAAAAAro/sS3CWMspdFo/s1600/back_to_the_future_george_and_biff.jpg


Take a wild guess which one the guy who's posting on a RPG forum is.:smalltongue:

As someone who isn't exactly an expert, best thing I can say to do is just wait that stuff out. Be supportive and stuff. There's always the old trope that All Girls Want Bad Boys (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/AllGirlsWantBadBoys), but just get ready to latch on when and if you start dating. Emotionally investing in someone while they recover from a break-up can be a fairly good move.

Best of luck.:smallsmile:

[Hadrian_Emrys]

Christmas is just about a week away. Tell her that what you want is to celebrate the coming of the new year with her in an official context. That gives her roughly a week to break things off with him after the holiday passes.

If she can't summon the willpower needed to do it in that time, you help her out by flatly stating that you will be stepping back because "you see that she's not serious about you and you will not allow yourself to be strung along". Much like dealing with a drug addict, sometimes the person in question needs to experience acute loss in order for their eyes to open.

[Force]

I would urge you to seriously consider if the sort of person who will leave someone for someone else is the sort of person you want to date. The experiences in that vein I have seen around me have been universally negative. And dating someone with psychological issues does take a toll on you as well. Please consider the healthiness of a relationship before you embark on it. Love does not necessarily conquer all. In addition, consider the possibility that you are approaching this from the view of someone who is a White Knight (http://www.doctornerdlove.com/2012/01/white-knight-syndrome/).

Secondly, please consider that your point of view is most likely biased. As someone with an interest in a woman, you are likely (just by nature) to view her current boyfriend in a bad light. While it is illegal, underage drinking is extremely common; if you happen to be in college or a senior in HS, I wouldn't necessarily pay it much mind as something to make a moral judgement. Can you describe his "douchebag" traits accurately? Is this your perception, or is clearly her perception as well? Has she stated that his friends bullied her, or are you assessing that? And finally, does she object to him being sexually aggressive, or are you observing that?

What I'm trying to get at is-- this person may not be the best fit for you, and that you may be seeing her boyfriend as someone other than who he is, simply because he's competition.

[Alad]

Poster above me speaks much truth. at the end of the day from your perspective it sounds like he's awful. but at the end of the day you are probably the most biased source around.

[truemane]

Every way of being has a pay-off and a cost. If she's with him, then the pay-off, for her, is greater than the cost.

The best thing you can so is be a friend, not with the expectation of any return, not the hope of being more someday, but just be a friend, in the moment, be there for her as a friend would.

Anything else is going to put strain on her. It's stressful for women to have guy friends who are subtly/not-so-subtly always hinting at wanting more. If she's in a tough spot, the last thing she needs is that kind of hassle.

And someone who cares for her wouldn't do that.

[Briandude777]

I agree, I am biased, but when he (against her will, and she tells him to stop) pulls her on his lap, trying to hump her, or when he calls her best friend a slut to both of their faces, and has people he calls "friends" that bullied her? Yeah, I'm biased as hell but I have some truth. On the topic of "If she leaves him for you, is that the type of person to date", I answer that with a yes. They are rarely in touch, and.. well that stuff happens. Lastly, she told me that his friends bullied her.

[Alad]

Every way of being has a pay-off and a cost. If she's with him, then the pay-off, for her, is greater than the cost.

The best thing you can so is be a friend, not with the expectation of any return, not the hope of being more someday, but just be a friend, in the moment, be there for her as a friend would.

Anything else is going to put strain on her. It's stressful for women to have guy friends who are subtly/not-so-subtly always hinting at wanting more. If she's in a tough spot, the last thing she needs is that kind of hassle.

And someone who cares for her wouldn't do that.


Except she likes him? Eh. more I hear the more it does sound a bit of a toxic relationship but I am really hesitant to advise much on the basis of a couple of paragraphs.

[Briandude777]

She only stays with him because he is not physically abusive; he's the first non-physically abusive boyfriend that she has had, so believes him a one-up on her others exes. But the problems presented are worse in a way, because he could get drunk and.. surprise.

[Kalmageddon]

One important detail: has she ever explicitly and clearly expressed being genuinely displeased with her boyfriend and seriously wanting to break up with him?
Or are you just "deducing" things?

Because otherwise, I'm sorry dude but him >> you as a boyfriend, in ther eyes, which is all that matters.

[Briandude777]

She said that she was going to break up with him after Christmas, but (being so close to it), he might try something "special" for it.

[Evandar]

You obviously have more information than anyone on this thread is going to have , but I think worrying that he is going to rape or otherwise physically abuse her could potentially be a bit of a stretch, and is a very serious accusation. And nearly everyone I know was guilty of underage drinking.

The other posters are right on the money, methinks. Be supportive, let her know she can tell you if he does anything truly horrible.

You'll know if it's just a way to stall after Christmas, and you can deal with things appropriately then.

Edit: Something 'special' sounds a bit ominous, but I dunno. We don't have too much to go on, and advising action online without much information is way more irresponsible than advising caution.

[Crow]

Stay away from that one, bro. There are plenty of other girls out there. The common thread in all her relationships is her, and if she needs you so that she can be happy, she never truly will be.

Her relationships are her problem, not yours. Find another one. If things work out somewhere down the road where you guys can get together with less drama, go for it. But for now, stay away.

Flame away folks.

[Kalmageddon]

She said that she was going to break up with him after Christmas, but (being so close to it), he might try something "special" for it.

Why, does he knows she wants to leave him? Anyway, I think that if this girl actually felt threatened by him she wouldn't still hang out with him, so it's probably ok.
She's also in a relationship with him not only because he doesn't physically abuse her, but also because she likes him for more then one reason, so you shouldn't think she will really break up with him.

I'm getting the idea that this girl is basically making you feel like a White Knight and that you should probably take a step back and try to see things from a more complete and less biased prospective.

[Briandude777]

Points taken.

[Creed]

Stay away from that one, bro. There are plenty of other girls out there. The common thread in all her relationships is her, and if she needs you so that she can be happy, she never truly will be.

Her relationships are her problem, not yours. Find another one. If things work out somewhere down the road where you guys can get together with less drama, go for it. But for now, stay away.

Flame away folks.

That's a good point. I switch my vote, I'm with Crow on this one!:smallsmile:

[Mammal]

Issuing an ultimatum would be really, colossally unfair to her. I'm guessing that unless you have outright told her that you're romantically interested in her, she considers you a friend, and nothing more. If you're reporting accurately on her situation, the last thing she needs right now is to be blindsided by her good friend asking her out. Be there for her, but don't expect anything. You need to be her friend right now, not a boy who is interested in her.

Honestly, the best thing for her right now is probably to be single and spend time working on her. No matter how good you think you'd be for her, you shouldn't try to enter into a relationship with her for a while.

Also, if you genuinely think he might assault her, tell an adult. You can't go to the police on a hunch, but tell your parents, tell a teacher, tell a guidance counselor. If something does happen, you don't want to be the guy who didn't do anything to prevent it.

[bluewind95]

consider the possibility that you are approaching this from the view of someone who is a White Knight (http://www.doctornerdlove.com/2012/01/white-knight-syndrome/).

OMG I've known one of these creeps!

Anyways, I gotta agree with Force here. Some things you are saying feel dangerously like a white knight. Okay, so I'll grant this girl seems to be in a poor relationship, and that due to her brokenness and some of the things you're saying, it could be abusive.

However, I'm finding your attitude kind of creepy too. You are coming across as a person who is willing to help this woman out of an idea that she may come to you when she realizes how bad her current boyfriend is. You are coming across as a person who wants to rescue her not so much cos he wants to help her, but because he wants to be the knight in shining armor that delivers her from great evil only to be rewarded with her love. Kind of like in the fairy tales, where the beautiful princess, victim of so many circumstances, needs delivery from the horrors of her life, and she WILL marry the man who saved her and they will live happily ever after. I don't think you're quite understanding the real cost that the emotional troubles she has will have on you. I would question whether she is ready for a relationship at all. You've said you talked her out of self-harm. Evidently, she is trapped in an abusive relationship (which not only causes harm, but also tends to be more a more common occurrence with people that are already unwell mentally and other things you've said support this) Are you trained to really cope with this long-term? Are you prepared for the emotional drain she WILL be having on you? Are you ready to be the one she depends on, the one she will (willingly or not) manipulate/blackmail into giving more support, the one she could threaten with self-harm in order to get approval?

By all means, help her get out of that situation if it's possible. Read up on abusive relationships, and above all else, support her. But frankly... if she does go single... question yourself VERY carefully about making the move yourself. She may not be emotionally ready for a relationship until she deals with her issues. And when she does deal with them, it is possible she may not want you. Are you ready to respect this decision?

No real need to answer these questions here. But consider them anyways. Sometimes the best result isn't necessarily the one you wanted in the first place.

[Kalmageddon]

OMG I've known one of these creeps!

Anyways, I gotta agree with Force here. Some things you are saying feel dangerously like a white knight. Okay, so I'll grant this girl seems to be in a poor relationship, and that due to her brokenness and some of the things you're saying, it could be abusive.

However, I'm finding your attitude kind of creepy too. You are coming across as a person who is willing to help this woman out of an idea that she may come to you when she realizes how bad her current boyfriend is. You are coming across as a person who wants to rescue her not so much cos he wants to help her, but because he wants to be the knight in shining armor that delivers her from great evil only to be rewarded with her love. Kind of like in the fairy tales, where the beautiful princess, victim of so many circumstances, needs delivery from the horrors of her life, and she WILL marry the man who saved her and they will live happily ever after. I don't think you're quite understanding the real cost that the emotional troubles she has will have on you. I would question whether she is ready for a relationship at all. You've said you talked her out of self-harm. Evidently, she is trapped in an abusive relationship (which not only causes harm, but also tends to be more a more common occurrence with people that are already unwell mentally and other things you've said support this) Are you trained to really cope with this long-term? Are you prepared for the emotional drain she WILL be having on you? Are you ready to be the one she depends on, the one she will (willingly or not) manipulate/blackmail into giving more support, the one she could threaten with self-harm in order to get approval?

By all means, help her get out of that situation if it's possible. Read up on abusive relationships, and above all else, support her. But frankly... if she does go single... question yourself VERY carefully about making the move yourself. She may not be emotionally ready for a relationship until she deals with her issues. And when she does deal with them, it is possible she may not want you. Are you ready to respect this decision?

No real need to answer these questions here. But consider them anyways. Sometimes the best result isn't necessarily the one you wanted in the first place.

I find this to be a really mature viewpoint and I agree completly.

[Jay R]

A. You are not party to the boyfriend/girlfriend relationship, and have no position regarding it.

B. She has spoken against every boyfriend she's ever had.

C. The only ray of hope you've suggested is that she's only sticking with this one until Christmas because "he might try something 'special' for it." Do you really mean that she's considering accepting a present from somebody while planning to leave him? And that's the most positive thing you have?

I don't see anything here in your favor.

[warty goblin]

Stay away from that one, bro. There are plenty of other girls out there. The common thread in all her relationships is her, and if she needs you so that she can be happy, she never truly will be.

Her relationships are her problem, not yours. Find another one. If things work out somewhere down the road where you guys can get together with less drama, go for it. But for now, stay away.

Flame away folks.

Yeah I agree completely. Life is much improved by censuring obvious sources of unnecessary discomfort and conflict. As my sister says, "don't engage the crazy." Stay as a friend, or flee for the hills, but going for romance is just asking for bad drama. Bad drama is only good on DVD or an Eminem song, not in reality.

[Pyromancer999]

There is a thread for this sort of thing.

That said, don't get involved. It's obvious this girl has issues, and would also appear from what you've said that while she's giving you the hope that she'll leave her boyfriend for you, it's pretty obvious she will not. Back out of the situation and move on, find another girl.

[denthor]

This some teenage stuff, so.. yeah.

The following is not teenage stuff. This is your first mistake.


All right, let's clear the air; I am single, and the girl I like is not. We became friends in early April of this year, and have been talking ever since.

You are both single she is in a relationship single means never married.


I talked her out of suicide, and cutting herself, along with helping her cope with depression and just making her happy.

This is distrubing at best. She is no one you want to get to know beyond where you are at now. She needs help please urge her to seek it. This is not teenage stuff.




Her boyfriend and her rarely talk, but (him, her, other mutual friends and I) hang out for a few hours each week. Her boyfriend will.. like dry hump her infront of us all, and I fear for her safety when they are alone. He underage drinks, his friends used to bully her and he's just generally a douchebag.

I have a friend that was a punching bag for 22 years. Her boyfriend moved into her mother house. Sent her to her room while he slept with other women. Beat her with her mother knowledge. Drugs with the two of them played a big role.? She was very much ok with this. Unless your friend is making statements that she wants out assume she enjoys the dry hump in public. It makes other think she is worth something.
She is worth more to you but she does not understand this.


She won't break up with him, because it's too close to Christmas, but is that just a way to stall?

Yes this is a stall!!! She likes the relationship with the other man. Anytime anybody says I will start....next (set any date you like) Birthday, new years christmas, easter any major date that is longer than right now.


THEY DO NOT MEAN IT EVER!!!



I mean, if it's just a matter of time before she actually gets raped, then I'm not going to hold off on it. (Leeroy Jenkins) But really, any help is appreciated..


Do not do anything to her lover!!! She will turn around and blame you and make your life hell. Understand you are the bad guy in that situation and she calls the cops on the bad guy.


[
QUOTE]Quote Mammal

You need to be her friend right now, not a boy who is interested in her.Also, if you genuinely think he might assault her, tell an adult. You can't go to the police on a hunch, but tell your parents, tell a teacher, tell a guidance counselor. If something does happen, you don't want to be the guy who didn't do anything to prevent it.[/QUOTE]

If nothing I typed got into your thought process please take the only woman that has responded very seriously.

Many of us here can help each other avoid the pitfallls that we all have faced.

[AtlanteanTroll]

A. You are not party to the boyfriend/girlfriend relationship, and have no position regarding it.

B. She has spoken against every boyfriend she's ever had.

C. The only ray of hope you've suggested is that she's only sticking with this one until Christmas because "he might try something 'special' for it." Do you really mean that she's considering accepting a present from somebody while planning to leave him? And that's the most positive thing you have?

I don't see anything here in your favor.

The implied present was rape, as far as I can tell.

[Haruki-kun]

The only advice I can offer is that if you truly and honestly think he might hurt her or assault her in any way, you go to an adult. A teacher, your parents, her parents.... depending on the situation at hand.

In any other scenario I'd just stand with the people who have so far suggested that you stay away. If his crime is just being a general jerk, then that sucks, but it's not something you should get involved in. Some people dated jerks in high school.

Oh, and I back denthor on the following:


This is distrubing at best. She is no one you want to get to know beyond where you are at now. She needs help please urge her to seek it. This is not teenage stuff.

If she really needs psychological/psychiatric help, go to a professional.

[Serpentine]

OMG I've known one of these creeps!

Anyways, I gotta agree with Force here. Some things you are saying feel dangerously like a white knight. Okay, so I'll grant this girl seems to be in a poor relationship, and that due to her brokenness and some of the things you're saying, it could be abusive.

However, I'm finding your attitude kind of creepy too. You are coming across as a person who is willing to help this woman out of an idea that she may come to you when she realizes how bad her current boyfriend is. You are coming across as a person who wants to rescue her not so much cos he wants to help her, but because he wants to be the knight in shining armor that delivers her from great evil only to be rewarded with her love. Kind of like in the fairy tales, where the beautiful princess, victim of so many circumstances, needs delivery from the horrors of her life, and she WILL marry the man who saved her and they will live happily ever after. I don't think you're quite understanding the real cost that the emotional troubles she has will have on you. I would question whether she is ready for a relationship at all. You've said you talked her out of self-harm. Evidently, she is trapped in an abusive relationship (which not only causes harm, but also tends to be more a more common occurrence with people that are already unwell mentally and other things you've said support this) Are you trained to really cope with this long-term? Are you prepared for the emotional drain she WILL be having on you? Are you ready to be the one she depends on, the one she will (willingly or not) manipulate/blackmail into giving more support, the one she could threaten with self-harm in order to get approval?

By all means, help her get out of that situation if it's possible. Read up on abusive relationships, and above all else, support her. But frankly... if she does go single... question yourself VERY carefully about making the move yourself. She may not be emotionally ready for a relationship until she deals with her issues. And when she does deal with them, it is possible she may not want you. Are you ready to respect this decision?

No real need to answer these questions here. But consider them anyways. Sometimes the best result isn't necessarily the one you wanted in the first place.
What bluewind says ^. If you think she needs help, give her help as a friend because she needs it, not because you want her instead. If you weren't interested in her at all, would you still care? If not, you need to have a good hard look at yourself. If so, you need to act according to that assumption, because there are no guarantees, and as mentioned she may well not be in a good place for a relationship at all either way.

[grimbold]

Yeah, Brian. I'm sorry, you don't really have a shot. Surprisingly, girls actually just want guy friends sometimes...
I would know, I'm my high schools equivalent of the gay friend (I'm not actually gay, I just go out with girls who are a few years older than me, again, Serps you totally have a shot :smallwink:) sometimes you just need to be supportive and caring without the hope of getting any

yes it sucks
it really sucks
I've been there, done that
it sucks


one more time
it sucks

if she really needs help, like others have said, get someone who you trust who is a higher position of power than you to help her out, thats all I really can say...

[Briandude777]

Just giving everyone who helped an update: She's breaking up with him tomorrow (her words) because he won't stop humping her in public, and calling her best friend a slut. After she does that, she's going to date me. Thanks, everyone for your feedback. It means a lot.

[Hyena]

Well, that was an unexpected u-turn.

[Jay R]

Just giving everyone who helped an update: She's breaking up with him tomorrow (her words) because he won't stop humping her in public, and calling her best friend a slut. After she does that, she's going to date me. Thanks, everyone for your feedback. It means a lot.

Great! But until she breaks up with him, you're still not involved with her.

Also, get her something nice for Christmas.

[Kalmageddon]

Good luck.
In my experience people that jump out from a relationship directly into another usually do so only in retaliation or out of need for attention, so it rarely works.
It might for you though. And after all, you are teenagers, making mistakes is inevitable and healthy.

[dehro]

Good for you, I mean it.
Never forget the premises though. Being self harming and suicidal is not something you can suddenly flip a switch on. Chances are she's not healed completely, if at all... and you're going to have to be the person to deal with these things if you enter a relationship with her.
So yeah.. be a little wary. I don't know what year you're in but she's been with this guy for some time and had several other boyfriends... what gives? do these "relationships" all last a couple of weeks?
Starting early is all fine and dandy, but being unable to say no to anyone who looks your way (that's the impression of her you've conveyed) and being needy/thankful for it, are not trademarks of a good relationship or healthy perspective on relationships.
It is a bit perplexing that she seems unable to be by herself. Probably a sign of very very low self esteem and insecurity.
In other words, you might just be biting off more than you can chew.

[Crow]

Just giving everyone who helped an update: She's breaking up with him tomorrow (her words) because he won't stop humping her in public, and calling her best friend a slut. After she does that, she's going to date me. Thanks, everyone for your feedback. It means a lot.

Ha. Good luck. Be ready for some heartbreak though.

[SaturnGreed]

Just giving everyone who helped an update: She's breaking up with him tomorrow (her words) because he won't stop humping her in public, and calling her best friend a slut. After she does that, she's going to date me. Thanks, everyone for your feedback. It means a lot.

Now thats what im talking about. Way to go dude. Nice guy wins and it makes me feel good. Now to test my luck at the dating site i used which is http://www.freedatinghelper.com/reviews/blacktryst/ and see what will come my way.

[Serpentine]

Good for her, dumping him. I hope for both your sakes that she is in a good place to start a new relationship, and that she continues to grow into a stronger person.