Never rob a merchant

[Zweisteine]

How much security so standard D&D generally have? I ask because my last session, which lasted about five hours, was waste entirely negotiating a player's punishment for attempted theft.

Here's the story:

The party:
Elf Warblade (chaotic good), me
Halfling Swordsage (chaotic neutral) (first-time player)
Dragonborn Mongrelfolk Crusader (lawful good)

Session 1
They met up in the town next to the monastery the Elf was trained at. The other two characters were just passing through (the crusader might have been my fellow student, can't remember). We met up and decided to go on a quest to fulfill their lifelong goals (for me, to find Kamate; the sword of the Irpn Heart discipline; for the halfling, to gain wealth and power; I do not recall the crusader's motive, so I assume spreading good and eliminating the spawn of Tiamat).
We heard rumors of a sword in a near-ish town, so we signed up to guard a merchant heading that way.
Day 1: fought some goblins, easy win
Day 2: met some people the merchant didn't like, fought and killed them on a misunderstanding stemming from readied actions; got some good loot, but had to split it with the merchant. The Halfling peeked into some crates in the wagon while guarding the rear. Despite his high move silently roll, the merchant noticed and went to check. The Halfling bluffed his way out of trouble.

Session 2
Night 2:
DM says the night will pass without difficulty, pre-rolled no encounters. Halfling says he wants to try robbing the wagon again. DM say "are you really GOIG to try stealing?" with no particular emphasis (sounded like he was just asking for confirmation).
The Halfling opened a crate (full of wands!) while on watch (after slegerybodyw as sleeping) and the merchant caught him red-handed. Bluffs failed to help him at all. The merchant gave him three choices: Give the merchant all of the Halfling's non-vital gear (lose 400gp, left with armor and sword) and leave ("I'll kill you if I see you again"), be killed by the merchant, or make another suggestion. Not wanting to be killed, the halfling opted to give up his wealth.
The Halfling proceeded to walk out if sight and double back to hide until dawn. The merchant called out that he could still see him. That shout finally had a low enough listen DC that I woke up. Seeing me move, the halfling strted to run back, and was shot by the merchant, and left with 1 HP. I grabbed my sword and repeatedly disarmed the merchant, while thing to figure it what was GOIG on. The battle woke the Crusader (who has an enormous listen penalty), and he tried to talk as well. We convinced the merchant not to fight, and the halfling gave up and was manacled.

We then proceeded to negotiate for three or four hours. Somewhere in that time, the Halfling's player got bored and left the room, refusing to continue playing after he merchant knocked him out for being too loud.
During the discussion, mostly between the merchant and the crusader, we learned that the merchant had silent magical alarms on all of the storage in his wagon. Also implied was that the merchant was many levels higher than us (though I still think we could have defeated him relatively easily).

Negotiations ended with this agreement: Halfling gets a Mark of Justice against thieving, using his own money. He'd be left only with any discount the casting cleric would give (because the Mark was for a good cause). Sadly, the Halfling's player still wouldn't come back, so we went and played the OOTS game instead.

It seems to me a tad unfair that the merchant was effectively thief-proof, even if it does make sense that he would have such an alarm system. It seems a bit much to set against a new player who could barely be talked out of playing a kleptomaniac Halfling rogue. But then, I think I'm mostly just annoyed that we wasted four hours (out of the only six (1 for robbing and fighting, 4 for talking, 1 for OOTS game) available for at least a month, probably) on a conversation almost entirely between one player and the DM.

So, mostly, I just wanted to complain a bit about my wasted time, but I also want to hear our thoughts on this.

Thanks for listening/reading!

[Emperor Tippy]

If I was playing the merchant I would have just killed the Halfling in the first place before killing both of you in your sleep.

You all basically proved yourself to be dishonorable bandits who can't even remotely be trusted to keep their word or act in a respectable manner.

The reason for guards isn't to make sure that he isn't robbed, it's to keep him from having to expend valuable resources dealing with riff raff and trash.

If he is in trouble then he pulls out his wand of Arcane Thesis: Energy Admixture (all types), Easy Meta, Invisible, Co-operative, Energy Substitution (all of them, Fire last), Searing Spell, Selective (him), Maximized, Twinned, Widened, Quickened, Fireball that he has stored in a glove of the master strategist and hits everyone within an 80 foot radius of him for 900 damage.

[Grod_The_Giant]

It sounds like the guy just had alarm cast on his wagon. A first level spell seems like the bare minimum of security to me, especially if you're hauling around a fortune in magic items. (A whole crate of wands :smalleek:?)

That being said, I'm kind of disappointed in your GM for letting that drag on for multiple hours. I'd probably have gotten impatient and had the NPCs open fire long ago.

[Dalebert]

Security will be proportional to the value of their merchandise. Obviously a merchant hauling a cart of turnips is not likely to have magical protections but a merchant carrying magic items is going to have a lot.

[Grinner]

If he is in trouble then he pulls out his wand of Arcane Thesis: Energy Admixture (all types), Easy Meta, Invisible, Co-operative, Energy Substitution (all of them, Fire last), Searing Spell, Selective (him), Maximized, Twinned, Widened, Quickened, Fireball that he has stored in a glove of the master strategist and hits everyone within an 80 foot radius of him for 900 damage.

Do you have these things memorized, or do you just keep a huge journal of them next to your computer? :smallconfused:

Wait. A huge journal...Are you some kind of wizard?! :smalleek:

[Zweisteine]

Permanent silent alarm on the wagon, yes.


The merchant might have defeated us all, but only one of us acted at all untrustworthy. I stopped fighting when he said the halfling had robbed him, and the Crusader never did anything at all, really. He just got up and convinced the merchant not to kill the halfling, and got the halfling to surrender.

As for not being able to be trusted to keep our word/being "dishonorable bandits," we had done exactly what we were supposed to do: defend him. We killed the goblins that attacked him.

Also, he wasn't Evil, and killing people is not something most people consider as a first course of action (except adventurers). He didn't want to kill us, because we didn't actually seem evil at all (except for the stealing thing, I suppose).

And he's not an character optimizer, this merchant. He's a merchant. Merchants don't get those fancy wands.

[cakellene]

I know you said it's his first time playing, but very tempted to say to introduce halfling player to business end of the PHB. The DM especially deserves a whack too, for spending 4 hours on this, long after the first player got bored and left. I would think that would be a sign that maybe I should hurry this along.

[Grollub]

sounds to me like the gm was DM fiat'ing the whole thing...

he didnt want the halfling stealing.. and instead of just saying "hey .. your new to the game.. so its usually not an acceptable behavior/ or don't steal from him you are goin off story" he decided just to be a **** bout it.

[Grek]

This plot doesn't make sense. If he can afford to buy and sell hundreds of wands and get a magic wagon, why is this merchant hiring three sketchy looking adventurers to guard his stuff?

[Zweisteine]

To be fair, he didn't so much hire us as give us a ride in exchange for extra safety. We weren't getting paid besides shares of what loot we found. He just picked a up exause free guards are nice, and we needed a ride.

[(Un)Inspired]

Well maybe D and D isn't the right game for your halfling friend. There's a lot of potential frustration inherent in a game where you come to love you character and yet he could die, or get caught stealing or catch a scorching case of mummy rot.

You say that your friend could barely be talked out of playing a kleptomaniac halfling rogue but it sounds a hellova lot like he was playing a kleptomaniac halfling swordsage.

The best case scenario is always that all the players can get on the same page about the style of game that's going to be run. If someone is going to walk away however, it's better that they do it after one session rather than getting their character deeply entangled into some vast plot and then getting pouty and leaving.

[Yahzi]

Somewhere in that time, the Halfling's player got bored and left the room, refusing to continue playing
And yet you continued to argue on the Halfling's behalf? Why?

The DM was wrong to mislead you about the power of the merchant:

1) A crate full of wands on a wagon. Crates of wands (and other cargoes that can be carried by one person but are worth entire cities) are transported by flying carpets.
2) Hiring unknown persons without background checks (or even apparently alignment checks which is a 1st level spell). A crate full of wands should have its own guards.
3) Arguing with you over the penalty for stealing instead of just executing the thief. You had already established that this merchant was totally fine with murdering innocent people on a misunderstanding and taking their loot. If you rob from him, he's going to give you less consideration than he gave those guys.
4) Putting a first-time player in such an unstructured position. First-time players need a little more guidance.

The player was wrong:

1) Stealing twice? His 2nd plan was apparently... to roll better? Not to get information or figure out how he got caught the first time or to come up with a more elaborate plan, but just to roll better sneak dice?
2) Not accepting that actions have consequences.
3) Playing a halfling.

You were wrong:

1) To keep arguing for the halfling after the halfling left the room.
2) To expect the merchant to not blame you for your associate's actions (a man is known by the company he keeps, especially if he argues for hours to defend that company).
3) A LG character was OK with murdering people over a misunderstanding? His only problem with that situation was how to divide up the loot?
4) Playing in a party with a halfling.

Next time, form a party that has the same goals. At least for the first quest.