OOTS #936 - The Discussion Thread

[The Giant]

New comic is up.

And since everyone will begin speculating immediately…
No, this is not the last page in the book. It is pretty close, though.

[Silva Stormrage]

Okay, that was AMAZING

"I'm not a twin anymore", I didn't realize Elan could be that badass :smalltongue: Well worth the wait.

[TaiLiu]

Ah, the big drop. Always fun.

[LOTRfan]

Oh my. :smalleek:

It looks like staying up until three in the morning did have a reward, after all. I'll have to disagree with Tarkin on the quality of this ending.

[Nettlekid]

No, this is not the last page in the book. It is pretty close, though.

I was just about to ask that very question.

I love the sort of meta-characterization of Tarquin acting sort of like a reader of his own story, and so in a way acting like we would. Except we can appreciate the satisfied irony of a poor conclusion being a good conclusion.

[Luminous Umbra]

Sorry Tarquin, looks like we have to agree to disagree.

[Porthos]

No, it's a GREAT ending, Tarquin. :smallcool:

Though, admittedly not of the book. :smalltongue:

[Exediron]

Gotta love D&D falling damage :smallamused:

Tarquin's wrong of course - the decision is growth from Elan, and he did lose something: his naive belief that things might work out between him and his father.

[eulmanis12]

"hey tarquin, Catch!" Can't stop laughing

[Elhoim]

Awesome ending! :D

[Porthos]

Okay, that was AMAZING

"I'm not a twin anymore", I didn't realize Elan could be that badass :smalltongue: Well worth the wait.

Also, the call back to "You'll Live." (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0929.html). :smallcool:

[QTR]

Tarquin is wrong. That was a great ending for this arc :smallsmile:

[Mutant Sheep]

The last page has a "The Order of the Stick will Return". Which makes archive trawls confusing, sometimes.:smallbiggrin:

I especially love Haley SHOOTING A BOW WITH HER LEG, and Elan holding a lute in a threatening manner.:smallamused:

[joela]

RE: Tarquin. *facepalm*

[Silva Stormrage]

Also, the call back to "You'll Live." (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0929.html). :smallcool:

I just got that XD, very nice.

[DaggerPen]

"Don't worry. You'll live."

This is about everything I could have wanted from this ending. This is just perfect.

[Porthos]

I just got that XD, very nice.

I remembered it was a quote in the comic, but my "Late at night on the West Coast" brain was having trouble remembering just where it was for a moment. Glad I was able to remember it before anyone else posted the link tho. :smalltongue:

[Ridureyu]

Woah!


I LOVED THIS!!!!


IT WAS PERFECT!


So, anybody notice that Lauren was the "final boss" of this arc, not Tarquin?

[ben-zayb]

Sigh. Old Tarquin never learned anything from this.

That's the best Ending! Grats to those who called this scenario.

[Thokk_Smash]

Way to go, Elan!

Love how Haley shot her bow with her feet. :smallbiggrin:

[Math_Mage]

Get ditched.

[Akeaka]

Hah, that was a great ending. How's Tarquin getting home I wonder.

[zimmerwald1915]

"hey tarquin, Catch!" Can't stop laughing


I especially love Haley SHOOTING A BOW WITH HER LEG, and Elan holding a lute in a threatening manner.:smallamused:
There's a reason Haley has a fanclub, y'know. This is the second time now she's turned Tarquin's penchant for catching arrows against him :smallamused:

A magnificent first strip of the new year, Giant.

[RblDiver]

So, Belkar starts thinking of entities other than himself, and Elan stops being QUITE so naive. Hooray character development on both ends of the spectrum!

[Svata]

Just one awesome panel after another in this strip. Good job, Giant. Good job.

[Lemmy]

This Comic. Is. AWESOME!!!

I still can't believe how amazing this update is... Holy freaking ****!!!

Amazing dialogue! After all the trouble and frustration Tarquin caused to the OotS , I knew his defeat would be incredibly satisfying, but I still didn't quite expect this much satisfaction!!! Elan shattering Tarquin's illusion that he's the main antagonist of the story is just perfect!

I simply can't overstate how angrily frustrated I was when Tarquin popped into the ship, but this comic sure makes it all worth it.

[DougTheHead]

My favorite part of the comic was Tarquin mentioning how taking the villain prisoner is "popular these days," no doubt a reference to The Dark Knight/Skyfall/Star Trek Into Darkness/Avengers storylines that all have the heroes capture a charismatic villain so he can continue being entertaining behind bars before manipulating the heroes and destroying them from the inside (because being captured was PART OF THE PLAN ALL ALONG!). Good to know that Tarquin is dedicated to keeping up with the times.

[IamL]

That awesome moment when you're derping around the boards at 3:30 AM and you notice the new comic...
:smallbiggrin:
Seriously, Tarquin. Great ending.

I loved how Elan finally had enough guts to tell his dad "and you're not the real villain."

[Bulldog Psion]

The exhausting misery of being up all night working after being up all day working and all last night working, with the exception of a 2 hour nap, just paid off big time. :smallbiggrin:

[Copperdragon]

For a side villain it's a great ending, Elan has all the character growth he could get from this. Tarquin is ready to get killed later by Xykon at the final confrontation. Or live out his live as local despot.
This is about Elan, not the arc, not about him. Very well done.

And "You are not the real villain" must hurt... :smalltongue:

[Everyl]

Wow. Those are some harsh words from Elan to Tarquin. "You're not the real villain." I'm impressed.

[mindsword]

Bravo. Perfect.

And I think this tells us something interesting about Tarquin. He always knows what happens next, but now he doesn't. That's whats really making him worried now.

[turkishproverb]

Oh Giant, it's points like this that make me love you.

[factotum]

I loved how Elan finally had enough guts to tell his dad "and you're not the real villain."

That was my favourite part too...I bet that's why Tarquin was raging when he hit the ground; it wasn't that he'd just fallen 200 feet, or that Elan had denied him once again, it was that he'd been told he wasn't really that important. That must have smarted worse than the sand in his fall damage cuts!

[Ninjadeadbeard]

Too bad we're in a desert, cuz Tarquin needs some ice for that wicked burn!

[mistformsquirrl]

*snerk* "Don't worry, you'll live."

Perfect <_<

[TekHed]

Wow...GREAT ending. Might have been a cool actual ending for the book, but...as Elan pointed out, Tarquin has really just been a distraction/filler (albeit an amusing one for us) villain compared to the real threat of Xykon.

This is why I love this comic!

[ben-zayb]

There's a reason Haley has a fanclub, y'know. This is the second time now she's turned Tarquin's penchant for catching arrows against him :smallamused:

A magnificent first strip of the new year, Giant.Didn't realize that earlier... That Deflect Arrow sure is a b, and kudos to Haley for making use of that non-negative Int score!

In before speculations of Elan shifting to Neutral.:smallamused:

[Happy Gravity]

Serves him right.

"I don't know what happens next!" Heh.

[Phoniex]

YA! nice comic!

[Porthos]

I know that other people have already called this but:

http://fogsmoviereviews.files.wordpress.com/2011/11/20111126-170845.jpg?w=560
"Wait. Who kills Tarquin. Who kills Tarquin at the end. Someone's got to do it."
"Nobody. Nobody kills Tarquin. He lives."

:smallcool: :smallcool: :smallcool:

I must admit I really thought Tarquin was gonna bite it in this book, given that he practically begged to be killed here. But I must admit I find this pretty satisfying as well. :smalltongue:

[KingFlameHawk]

Awesome page as usual. Loved the growth by Elan. And yes T this is a great way to end the arc. (and yes I know it is not the last page). Also super smart of Haley to shoot T with two arrows when he is hanging on for his dear plot reverence.
I think I can hear some fear in T's voice when he says "I don't know what happens next!". He has lived for so long in control of his own personal story that now that he has lost control of it he can't be anything other than afraid.

[MoonCat]

This, this is beautiful.

This is telling a story and taking what has been done a million times, and not wittily subverting, nor parodying, nor inverting, but taking the rules and smashing them on the fourth wall while giving every person, every reader beyond it who has ever expected their life to act like a story a view of the shattered remains of a story that has surpassed them.

Had I not left my hats elsewhere, I would doff them to you, Giant. All at once, if I could.

[ben-zayb]

I know that other people have already called this but:

http://fogsmoviereviews.files.wordpress.com/2011/11/20111126-170845.jpg?w=560
"Wait. Who kills Tarquin. Who kills Tarquin at the end. Someone's got to do it."
"Nobody. Nobody kills Tarquin. He lives."

:smallcool: :smallcool: :smallcool:

I must admit I really thought Tarquin was gonna bite it in this book, given that he practically begged to be killed here. But I must admit I find this pretty satisfying as well. :smalltongue:Ironically, this chapter is sort of about Tarquin, just that it's how he doesn't get the ending he wants. He didn't even close this book, for what it's worth.

[Tundar]

It's far from terrible. It's magnificient!!
Yay Haley :smallcool:

[Pantler]

Finally. They finally dumped him. I mean, it's like attending a family meeting and praying for a phone call just so you can sneak away.

[RblDiver]

"Wait. Who kills Tarquin. Who kills Tarquin at the end. Someone's got to do it."
"Nobody. Nobody kills Tarquin. He lives."

:smallcool: :smallcool: :smallcool:

I must admit I really thought Tarquin was gonna bite it in this book, given that he practically begged to be killed here. But I must admit I find this pretty satisfying as well. :smalltongue:

Well, this isn't the last page of the book, the last page could be Tarquin being eaten by the giant worm. An ignoble death that noone knows about!

[WindStruck]

Haha, it's a terrible ending for Tarquin, but not so much for everyone else. :smalltongue:

[Coldwind]

Worst ending for Tarquin, because he is not the real villain.
End of debate.

I think also this will be the end of next book.

[HeeJay]

I see Tarquin got the chance to use his "Fighter's Feather Fall". :biggrin:

EDIT: Verbal component: "Don't worry. You'll live."

[Lombard]

Tarquin sure got less intriguing as the arc went on but I'm glad he lived. I think he has another part to play. Ohh how that "not the real villain" remark will eat at him. What will he do in reaction I wonder?

[KingFlameHawk]

Worst ending for Tarquin, because he is not the real villain.
End of debate.

I think also this will be the end of next book.

Giant said at the beginning of the forum that this is not the last page but close to it though.

[luagha]

Ah well. I thought it was going to be Belkar who did a double-dagger-toss to make Tarquin fall off the Mechane. But this is better! :)

[Agi Hammerthief]

totally satisfying resolution of that plotline

[Porthos]

Well, this isn't the last page of the book, the last page could be Tarquin being eaten by the giant worm. An ignoble death that noone knows about!

Yeah, but just think of the possibility of using that quote if you're ever reading this book to your kids. :smallcool: Say, in the middle of the arena arc when it looks like Roy is gonna die. Or when the pyramid explodes. If you're lucky, your kid might even respond with the "You mean Tarquin wins" line, or a variation thereof.

Basically, any excuse to whip out a Princess Bride quote is a good one for me. :smalltongue: :smallwink:

[thereaper]

Marvellous.

[Flame of Anor]

:vaarsuvius: Exxxcellent.


I love how blind Tarquin is to the fact that Elan really has grown. Immensely. I almost feel sorry for him, being so oblivious.

[ti'esar]

I was torn evenly between making my comment a variety of "Go Elan!" or "Good riddance." So instead I'll say that Haley using her foot to shoot her bow was really really awesome.

[rewinn]

Because someone has to say it:

Tarquin ex Machina!


... now back to the kudos. It really was a well-written scene!

[raquo]

I don't think we've seen Tarquin with a :eek: face for more than one panel before. Awesome.

[ThePhantasm]

Nice strip! Surprising too... I really thought Tarquin might die here. But the dialogue was great.

Also, my prediction that Haley would defeat Tarquin was right! Sort of... :smallredface:

[IamL]

So. Now that Tarquin has lost all of his assets (his Genre Savvyness applicability, his army, his high-level friends, Élan, etc.), I wonder what will happen? Tarquin's strength as a villain has always been his ability to utilize his resources effectively and in a genre-savvy way.

[Sith_Happens]

Wow, in 936 strips I don't think I've laughed nearly as hard as I did at that last panel.

[Seeen]

*goes to giantitp.com*
*new comic*
*INTERNAL FANFARE*

"I'm not a twin anymore." Touché, Elan.

He even repeated "You'll live" from when Tarquin stabbed him and Roy.

[Dr.Gunsforhands]

THIS IS THE BEST ENDING I'VE EVER SEEN TO ANYTHING EVER!!!

[NobodyWasTaken]

No, this is a beautiful ending.

Yes, that's it.

[dtilque]

Called it in the "Burnt Bridges" thread:



I think the scene will be resolved with Tarquin hanging off the edge by one hand and Elan above him holding T's knife.

Elan: "you still have most of your hit points, right?"
T: "Huh?"
E: "You'll live"
Chops off Tarquin's hand; T falls to the ground after exchanging pleasantries with Julio on the way down.

I'm not sure Elan has changed enough to do that, but it certainly would be an interesting conclusion.

OK, it's not exactly the way I foresaw it, but as close as I've ever gotten to predicting how this strip will unfold.

[Dandria]

Oh, thanks God it's finally out! The wait was killing me!

I honestly thought Tarquin was gonna die here, but I think I like this ending better:it showed us that Elan could loose some naivety without loosing his goodness. Also, that some threads can be left unresolved.

The not really important ones.

[Stealth]

Now there's an Ironic Echo (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/IronicEcho) for the ages, Giant, especially since it means that Elan cut Tarquin off simply by changing the narrative positions of all the players involved.

I wonder how the course of this fight is going to affect Tarquin's power balance ploy.

[i6uuaq]

I really love the line, "I DON'T KNOW WHAT HAPPENS NEXT." Deep down, Tarquin is a tremendously insecure individual trying to impose his version of order on the world around him.

[BeerMug Paladin]

Tarquin's always envisioned himself as the big bad in a story. And he's always happened to have success that would lead him to think he is.

Now he has direct evidence that he's not, and he doesn't strike me as the sort of character that would ignore evidence that was staring him in the face like that.

I also thought Tarquin would be defeated here, but this is an interesting way to be defeated. It's like his whole sense of identity is being challenged. And that's a far more satisfying end than his death would be.

I wonder if Sabine will find him all alone, wandering the desert miles away from his army, half-dead, and give him the rest of his ignoble ending scene.

[super dark33]

Now there's an Ironic Echo (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/IronicEcho) for the ages, Giant, especially since it means that Elan cut Tarquin off simply by changing the narrative positions of all the players involved.

I wonder how the course of this fight is going to affect Tarquin's power balance ploy.

I think "Stop Talking" is a stronger one.

[Lord Raziere]

I disagree, Tarquin, this is a terrific ending.

and oh how the mighty have fallen. reduced to trying to negotiate plots while hanging for dear life, too late Tarquin, too late. but then again, there was never any hope for you coming up with any of that on time, no? :smallbiggrin:

[10d10]

Yay! Tarquin finally got the message: he's not important to the story except for the development of Elan. Which, incidentally, is the one thing Tarquin got right: in trying so hard to make Elan fit the mold of his story, I'm hoping Tarquin completely derailed that path. Now Elan will hopefully be more careful of metagaming.

[SaintRidley]

Okay, that was AMAZING

"I'm not a twin anymore", I didn't realize Elan could be that badass :smalltongue: Well worth the wait.

I know. Best line of the book, easily.

[DaggerPen]

"I'm not a twin anymore" was a fantastic line, and also made me a little bit sad. Nale was thoroughly evil, but Elan's mourning of him really tugged at my heartstrings, and somehow that line just really hit me.

[The Pilgrim]

About time someone tell the old man the cold truth to the face.

[Oko and Qailee]

So I really wanted Tarquin to die, but this is crazy satisfying regardless.

Maybe the last page involves Laurins favor?

Man, this is the most "heartless" thing we've seen Elan do. Man Tarquin deserves this and more.

This is a great ending.

[Ridureyu]

More proof of how badly Tarquin misses the point: "You haven't lost anything!"

Yes, Elan did lose something. He lost his brother and his dad.

[CrispyCriminal]

It's not every day the morals of Stupid Good can defeat the machinations of evil in such a satisfying matter.

At least Elan's mother won't have to cry about half of her family dying too...though then again MIA isn't any more reassuring.

[JoseB]

Oh yes.... OH YESSSSSS... How deliciously cathartic! >:D

I love the smell of Elan rubbing Tarquin's face on his (Tarquin's) own irrelevance with respect to the main narrative >:D

Thanks, Giant. This comic page has been beyond enjoyable ^.^

[WindStruck]

More proof of how badly Tarquin misses the point: "You haven't lost anything!"

Yes, Elan did lose something. He lost his brother and his dad.

Well at least I think Nale got the point, but he didn't live long after that.

[Porthos]

More proof of how badly Tarquin misses the point: "You haven't lost anything!"

Yes, Elan did lose something. He lost his brother and his dad.

http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a35/BuckGodot/Icons/thumbsup_zps4d77a316.gif~original

[DaggerPen]

As an aside, how did Tarquin lose a chunk of cape? It's split from the harpoon initially, but after he falls like half of it is just gone.

[Michaeler]

Don't be silly, Tarquin, this is a perfect setup for you to become the ruined minor villain who comes back to take revenge at a critical point.

Probably get a humiliating death, but it's following story precedents.

Anyway, finally somebody told him his place in the story. Now I expect Laurin to pop in and point out that he won't make it home without her and hold him to some unreasonable promise.

[Dracon1us]

Awesome strip
Haley's "catch" is really a master storyteller move ... really really really great

I was thinking that my players would have killed Tarkie in that spot. Would be a more cathartic moment, and maybe a wiser one (if Laurie can scrye on T. she can save him, after all there's a debt to be repaid).

But this ending is really powerful and more painful for the fascist dictator we all love to despise. When he screams "I don't know what happens next" it's almost (almost) moving...you see an old man trapped in his own mind, alone, forced to witness the crumbling fall of all his elaborate buildings that sustained his world.

no sons, no legacy, no friend (Mal), no bigger statue, no legendary tales.

An old man wandering alone in a desert, with just his memory and his failures to keep him company

Bravo Rich, Bravo.

[Tom Lehmann]

Aww, no ring of Feather Fall... not only to cushion the fall, but to give yourself a last chance to try to scrabble back up onto the airship... what a shame, Tarquin! :smallamused:

[Cerlis]

oh

my

god.

The irony was so thick for the last All of that (+50% for the last half of the last all of it) that i think it would prevent a colossal ghost from getting through it.

[Killer Angel]

This is totally amazing and satisfying!

Eat some dust, Tarquin! :smallcool:

[Prowl]

I have to confess I'm shocked that Tarquin didn't have a form of feather fall available.

[Baeraad]

Oh, this was just wonderful. :D In fact, I have loved Tarquin's entire drawn-out Villainous Breakdown. Ever since #913, you can just see the cracks widening.

And I love how the ending is so perfect and satisfying on every level and wraps up everything that has happened in the book, and yet Tarquin thinks it's a pointless anticlimax - because for him anything that isn't his kind of order must per definition be chaos. (now there's a comment on generational arguments for you...)

Also, Haley is a badass.

[nonamearisto]

He lost his brother. That's something. I was really hoping for a parallel to Roy's fall, but Tarquin survived that fall... somehow.

[Jade_Tarem]

Ladies and Gentlemen, I give you Elan, proving that you don't need the Elemental Admixture feat to do cold damage with a burn.

[NENAD]

The paradoxical irony of the line "this is a terrible ending" is that it is that line which makes it a good ending.

Also, basically everything Tarquin said was wrong. Elan lost his father, but gained a better one. The growth from mindlessly following cliches to using them to help himself and his friends get what they want is explicitly highlighted and has a really badass delivery. And most of all, Tarquin was defeated the only way he could be: By giving him a terrible ending. This completely unresolved plot arc with his only remaining son is going to poison the rest of his reign, his own personal purgatory on the material plane.

[Yana]

Rich, even though you said this wasn't the last page of the arc, you did a fantastic job of setting this scene up and giving us a satisfactory resolution to Tarquin.

Thank you for the last four years of this story!

[CrispyCriminal]

He lost his brother. That's something. I was really hoping for a parallel to Roy's fall, but Tarquin survived that fall... somehow.

It's sand, not as hard as pavement. Sure the fall was likely much longer, but I think he exceeded the fall damage cap.

[hamishspence]

Ladies and Gentlemen, I give you Elan, proving that you don't need the Elemental Admixture feat to do cold damage with a burn.

Very well put.

[Obscure Blade]

"And you're not the real villain"; that must have stung! :smallamused:


As an aside, how did Tarquin lose a chunk of cape? It's split from the harpoon initially, but after he falls like half of it is just gone.Ripped away by the force of the impact, no doubt.

[rbetieh]

Haha, Tarquin tried to turn Roy into Nick Fury....good one :smallsmile:

[Wereboar_It]

Totally worth the long wait. Thanks Giant!

"Don't worry, you'll live" is a wonderful example of naive and good-hearted badassery.

AND character growth on Elan. He just realized that some people deserve nothing in life.

[Porthos]

He lost his brother. That's something. I was really hoping for a parallel to Roy's fall, but Tarquin survived that fall... somehow.

20d6 ain't that much to chew off for a barely wounded (presumably) martial character of Tarquin's level.

[Dorsidwarf]

A brilliant ending to Tarquin's importance.

[SowZ]

I feel like earlier in the comic, Elan would have been convinced by his dads arguments. Even if he didn't pull him up out of naivety, the 'this does not follow common story structure' would have swayed him. Earlier on, Elan was really silly and didn't take what he did seriously, so following Bardic Rules 101 is something he likely would have done without considering the negative ramifications. Either Elan has broadened his horizons in regards to unexpected plot twists that are against normal plot structure, OR, I think more likely, he tries to do what is actually best for the group and takes himself seriously.

He was probably just pissed, too.

[DaggerPen]

:elan::And then Tarquin hit the ground and died.
:roy:: Are you kidding me? Maximum falling damage is 20d6, that wouldn't even kill an uninjured medium level adventurer.
:elan:: Oh. Are you sure?
:roy:: I've become very familiar with the falling rules in my spare time.
:elan:: OK, well, then Tarquin hit the ground, and then got up and started yelling about unsatisfying plot resolutions.

[BeerMug Paladin]

As an aside, how did Tarquin lose a chunk of cape? It's split from the harpoon initially, but after he falls like half of it is just gone.
He's low on hit points. Clothing in OOTS often gets damaged when people are low on hit points, and gets fixed when they are healed.

[IamL]

Tarquin was a brilliant character, and seeing him unravel over the last few dozen comics was just beautiful, and built up flawlessly to this. The anticlimax that is a climax. Well done, Giant. Well done.

[IamL]

:elan::And then Tarquin hit the ground and died.
:roy:: Are you kidding me? Maximum falling damage is 20d6, that wouldn't even kill an uninjured medium level adventurer.
:elan:: Oh. Are you sure?
:roy:: I've become very familiar with the falling rules in my spare time.
:elan:: OK, well, then Tarquin hit the ground, and then got up and started yelling about unsatisfying plot resolutions.

This. The moment you wish this forum had a like button...

[RMS Oceanic]

I have to confess I'm shocked that Tarquin didn't have a form of feather fall available.

Like how Malack didn't have Word of Recall prepared? :smalltongue:

Remember that when Tarquin woke up this morning, he was expecting to crawl through a dungeon and fight a bunch of good guys. Taking 20d6 falling damage was probably so unlikely and a thing he could survive anyway, it probably didn't make much sense to use a magic item slot for Feather Fall.

I am immensely satisfied at this. The one plot thread I'd like to see wrapped up though is Ian now being framed, for with Tarquin alive I'm still expecting that to go ahead. It gives me an idea for a nice two-page strip like 422 (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0422.html): Two sending spells. One on behalf of Haley to Ian, warning him to skip town. One on behalf of Elan to his mother, telling her about Nale. You could even do it with almost no dialogue. It would be a fairly low-key ending and even bittersweet, but I think that works to reinforce that all of this was just a Sidequest.

[Michaeler]

I am reasonably certain Tarquin actually did have a source of Feather Fall available two rounds previously. Sadly he wasted her powers and now she's not there when he needs her.

[BeerMug Paladin]

I am reasonably certain Tarquin actually did have a source of Feather Fall available two rounds previously. Sadly he wasted her powers and now she's not there when he needs her.
I was about to say the same thing. Except that he initially had two sources.

Both ended up disappearing, though.

[Puppeteer]

Fantastic and cathartic ending.
But I must admit, I'm shocked as well that, considering how genre-savvy Tarquin is, and knowing how many times Disney's villains fall to their deaths, he didn't have a ring of feather fall lodged some place. :smallbiggrin:

[The Kind Knido]

Cue Laurin walking into the scene asking for her favour - Tarquin's Ring of Regeneration so that she may be able to leave the desert more easily on low PP.

And then Tarquin is picked up by slavers and never seen again.

[DaggerPen]

http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g68/Cats_Are_Aliens/Banners/Tarquin.png: Me, fall to my death? Please. Maximum falling damage is 20d6, and I'm a high level fighter. Besides, this story is nowhere near resolution! What type of sorry excuse for a narrative would kill off such an important character in the middle of a story, a high level fighter, and by falling, no less?

[Cizak]

Nice. Not that there's ever been a point where it wasn't, but consider this book so bought. Favorite arc.

Always nice when you come back after a while with no strip. Hope you were able to take some days off for yourself and your family, Giant.

[Shatteredtower]

This strip was beautiful for many reasons, one after the other. No further comment.

[Albion]

Well I guess in a twisted sort of way it is a bad ending in many ways... but otherwise it is an outstanding ending :smallsmile: Made my day worthwhile, thank you.

[Storm_Of_Snow]

Wonder if Tarquin would have been better off just trying to catch one arrow, take the damage off the second and regenerate it, or does he have to try and catch both of them?


Hah, that was a great ending. How's Tarquin getting home I wonder.
The fight with the Allosaurus took them at most a mile from the gate, where Tarquin left his army, and his portion of the Mechane's flight is probably about five miles (considering the maneuvering they did to stop him getting back on board during the Caster fight. :smallsmile:

If he can't walk that far to get home, something's wrong. And even then, chances are, someone like Kilkil will have a sending cast to contact him, and he'll tell them where he is to get a search party out to find him.

Short of Belkar still having a little of the spice around, "accidentally" tipping it over Tarquin and a purple worm disposing of him as already mentioned (my apologies, I can't remember who said it), he'll likely turn up at Kraagor's gate.

[Mastikator]

For once I disagree with Tarquin, that was a pretty good ending on this story arch.

[DaggerPen]

For once I disagree with Tarquin, that was a pretty good ending on this story arch.

For once? :smallconfused:

[St Fan]

Am I the only one who's thinking a better title for this comic would have been "Just Deserts"?

I'll take my coat...

[Ramien]

And Tarquin is wrong, as usual... He doesn't understand Elan, he doesn't understand the story, and he doesn't understand what makes for a truly satisfying ending.

Great job, Giant!

[IamL]

Wonder if Tarquin would have been better off just trying to catch one arrow, take the damage off the second and regenerate it, or does he have to try and catch both of them?


The fight with the Allosaurus took them at most a mile from the gate, where Tarquin left his army, and his portion of the Mechane's flight is probably about five miles (considering the maneuvering they did to stop him getting back on board during the Caster fight. :smallsmile:

If he can't walk that far to get home, something's wrong. And even then, chances are, someone like Kilkil will have a sending cast to contact him, and he'll tell them where he is to get a search party out to find him.

Short of Belkar still having a little of the spice around, "accidentally" tipping it over Tarquin and a purple worm disposing of him as already mentioned (my apologies, I can't remember who said it), he'll likely turn up at Kraagor's gate.
"The Battle of Four Armies."
(OotS, Tarquin, Kraagor's monsters, and Xykon/Redcloak)

[DaggerPen]

Am I the only one who's thinking a better title for this comic would have been "Just Deserts"?

I'll take my coat...

... actually, that actually would have been better. Ah well.

[SowZ]

... actually, that actually would have been better. Ah well.


Until I read your quote of this post, I did not get the pun and wondered what was so great about it. :smallfrown:

[Dr Mushroom]

That trick with the arrows was beautiful.

[Great Teacher]

You are all now aware that Spiky is still down in the desert, has not been confirmed dismissed in any panel, and is contracted to follow Durkon's orders until midnight (like kill all enemies, for instance). Debatably, that might be just enough time to close the distance between Spiky and Tarquin.

[andiemus]

Gotta love that Elan saw through what his father was missing in his whole opinion on their roles in the story. Elan doesn't have to be a hero because what Tarquin can't understand because of his massive ego is that he's not the villain.

[Morgan Wick]

I hate to say this, but damn I hope the rendering of the text eventually goes back to normal...

[Socratov]

I can't help but think that Elan has actually given Tarquin the thing he desires most. Since Tarquin is still alive he can come back, while the OotS deal swith Xykon and Redcloak. So when Xykon and Redcloak are finished Tarquin can swoop in and be the final boss he so dreams about.

[shadowpriest]

Absolutely gorgeous. My respect, Giant.

[Ridureyu]

I don't think that Tarquin really had a choice except to catch those arrows. Haley clearly rolled really high on a called shot aimed at his eyes.

[Nightcanon]

I don't think that Tarquin really had a choice except to catch those arrows. Haley clearly rolled really high on a called shot aimed at his eyes.

Presumably, hanging onto the side of an airship with both hands counts as being denied Dex bonus to AC, so one of those arrows is carrying sneak attack damage, too..

[afarrell]

I am amused that even after such a great end which clearly delineates Giant's views on it, there are still people whose first instinct is to look it up in TV Tropes:)

[RMS Oceanic]

Also a nice touch. I like when Tarquin is first pleading to Elan to pull him up, he doesn't have the :smalleek: face. I think he was so confident that this was just another trope he could work with he didn't feel in danger of falling.

[Rhyvurg]

The look of confusion and panic on Tarquin's face is perfect as his narrative-controlled world comes crashing down.

[SowZ]

Presumably, hanging onto the side of an airship with both hands counts as being denied Dex bonus to AC, so one of those arrows is carrying sneak attack damage, too..

Why just one? You aren't limited to one Sneak Attack per round in 3.5.

[Irenaeus]

That was very good.

[Dekinjein]

That was awesome. I'm speechless. and laughing at Tarquin.

[Mono Vertigo]

And how come Elan isn't a twin anymore?
Yessss, that's right. Because of that thing, funny how you could have avoided that.
I don't know what Tarquin's talking about, it's such a great ending on so many levels. :smallamused:

[Doxkid]

I believe the correct term for this is "Rekt". The Councilmen of First-Person-Scrub-Shooters will convene later to determine the severity of this condition.

Expect wild hooting and people repetitively dancing in place.

[Cerlis]

Why just one? You aren't limited to one Sneak Attack per round in 3.5.

not on a many shot, which is what she did.

But either way the act of shooting him in the eye would have done critical dmg.

not that rules dictate anything here, but if they did these ones would apply.

but basically treat it as a two pronged arrow for the sake of dmg.

[Sylthia]

Nice to wake up to. Thanks for preemptively answering our question.

[Planeswalker817]

Why just one? You aren't limited to one Sneak Attack per round in 3.5.

Aye, with a Manyshot attack, you are limited to precision-type damage (such as Sneak Attacks) on only one of the arrows.

[SowZ]

not on a many shot, which is what she did.

But either way the act of shooting him in the eye would have done critical dmg.

not that rules dictate anything here, but if they did these ones would apply.

but basically treat it as a two pronged arrow for the sake of dmg.

Oh, I assumed it was rapid shot. More optimal. The art is Manyshot, though. I assume she had to use a move action to get the bow in position, or else she is too sluggish at reloading to get iterative attacks with a broken arm. Otherwise, rapid shot with iterative attacks would be far better.

[ThirdEmperor]

My favorite part of all of that was the phrasing "I don't know what happens next." It's not a huge thing, but it makes Tarquin sound scared instead of just angry.

[The Giant]

I hate to say this, but damn I hope the rendering of the text eventually goes back to normal...

It actually can't go back, ever. Adobe Illustrator changed the way it renders type at some point between the old version I was using on my old computer and the new version I'm using on my laptop. Because of that change—and how much I didn't like it—I've been clinging to a woefully outdated version of Illustrator for 8 years or so. But my old computer died about two weeks ago, and no new computer will run the old version anymore. As a result, the font looks awful. It's going to be a nightmare when it's time to print it, since the balloons are sized to the old rendering.

I plan on completely changing the font when we switch over to the new book, because at least that way it won't look like this.

[Nightcanon]

Why just one? You aren't limited to one Sneak Attack per round in 3.5.

I'm assuming that Haley is pulling a Manyshot (two arrows on the string in panel 6) which iirc only applies precision damage once? Happy to be wrong, especially since two lots of (d8+8d6+minty-fresh burst) makes risking 20d6 falling damage a more attractive proposition.

Edit: Ninja'd in my own discussion! The shame!

[Heksefatter]

Tarquin: "Look, Elan, I think that I'm being very generous admitting that maybe I've partly contributed to the current climate of-"

Man, Tarkie is an ass. Of the highest caliber.

[alparon]

Well that was a very dissapointing end for my favorite character.

I would have expected so much more from Tarquin's story--Belkar's or Haley's death or at least Julio's, Elan losing a hand, team Tarquin defeating Team Evil that kind of stuff-- I mean he started out great but ended up as a petty villain... However, I think he was a much better villain than Xykon.

Maybe that's because I like genre savvy tyrants more than I like low intelligence high level undead sorcerers.

[Ridureyu]

So I guess you are upset because... where's the growth? Elan didn't lose anything. Nothing has changed?

[Shadic]

I love this.

Great comic as always, Rich.

[Cynric]

A very satisfying ending to the arc. In the sense that it was an unsatisfying ending.

As divisive as he was among the fans, I'm really going to miss Tarquin.

[Arrowstorm122]

Tarquin survived, I'd be surprised if he didn't come back somehow. Still, I was right that he'd not die by the end of this, so yay.

Is this the end of the book? I guess not since there wasn't a small black box saying "OOTS will return XMonth the Yth.

[Nightcanon]

.....
but basically treat it as a two pronged arrow for the sake of dmg.

Ah, is that the reasoning?!
I have to say I never really understood why only one of two simultaneous shots did sneak damage, when 4 or 5 successive attacks were allowed it (other than to avoid a situation where every bowshot above a certain level was a double-damaging manyshot)

[Seto]

I have to say, that's a great strip. I usually don't get emotionally very entangled in the story (though I enjoy it very much), but that line "I'm not a twin anymore"... Damn, that's intense.

Tarquin is/was a truly great character. And he did fill his purpose : thanks to him/because of him, Elan has lost some illusions and has grown a lot as a person and as a hero. The irony is, Tarquin is too self-absorbed to see it. I loved this character and I still do, and even now I kinda feel bad for him (I know this isn't the effect you're looking for at all, Giant). But he still deserves what happens to him, both morally (but that's not the point), and narratively (which is brilliant).

Kudos ! This has been my favorite book so far.

[SowZ]

I have to say, that's a great strip. I usually don't get emotionally very entangled in the story (though I enjoy it very much), but that line "I'm not a twin anymore"... Damn, that's intense.

Tarquin is/was a truly great character. And he did fill his purpose : thanks to him/because of him, Elan has lost some illusions and has grown a lot as a person and as a hero. The irony is, Tarquin is too self-absorbed to see it. I loved this character and I still do, and even now I kinda feel bad for him (I know this isn't the effect you're looking for at all, Giant). But he still deserves what happens to him, both morally (but that's not the point), and narratively (which is brilliant).

Kudos ! This has been my favorite book so far.

Yeah, I think the quality of the books has steadily increased over time.

[Psyren]

Fantastic. That is all.

And damn, Haley has great aim.

[BobVosh]

I thought it was actually a huge sign of Elan's character growth that he allowed him to plunge. For the first time I have to disagree with my favorite character.

[Ramien]

Well that was a very dissapointing end for my favorite character.

I would have expected so much more from Tarquin's story--Belkar's or Haley's death or at least Julio's, Elan losing a hand, team Tarquin defeating Team Evil that kind of stuff-- I mean he started out great but ended up as a petty villain... However, I think he was a much better villain than Xykon.

Maybe that's because I like genre savvy tyrants more than I like low intelligence high level undead sorcerers.

Except Xykon has shown to be very Genre-Savvy when he needs to be - he just doesn't let it interfere with his goals. There's a big difference between being genre savvy and letting the genre dictate your actions, which is why Xykon is the big bad (so far) and Tarquin is an also-ran.

If Tarquin was as genre savvy as he thinks he is, he would have known that the Order would return because heroes don't leave personal business unfinished. He wouldn't have spilled the whole of his plan to Elan so early on, no matter how cool it was at the time, because that gave Elan a major reason to try and do things a different way.

[alparon]

So I guess you are upset because... where's the growth? Elan didn't lose anything. Nothing has changed?

At least Elan could have lost something-something big that would change his personality from the loveable bard to brooding anti-hero. Or Tarquin and Elan could have ruled the world (and the gates) as father and son. Either would have worked.

Well I hope Tarquin would return with a bang; like the great elven massacre of the North of the Western Hemisphere; so that the order may come back for him when the whole thing with the secondary villain Xykon guy is done :smallbiggrin:

[Emulgator]

I hope Sabine calls in a few favors and finish him off, not unlike Redcloak summoning demons to destroy the Resistance. Seems like a good ending to the arc.

[theinsulabot]

Man...I hate to say it, but T was right

That ending was totally lame

[Iryanmadayana]

That last panel made me laugh uncontrollably. Tarquin couldn't be further from the truth. In most of what he is saying here, actually.

An incredibly satisfying finale. Just... wow.

[Shale]

That was ice cold. "I'm not a twin anymore", "you're not the real villain," and "you'll live"? Daaaaaaaaamn, Elan.

Anyway, he's gone he's gone Tarquin's finally gone the fight is over hooray

[SowZ]

At least Elan could have lost something-something big that would change his personality from the loveable bard to brooding anti-hero. Or Tarquin and Elan could have ruled the world (and the gates) as father and son. Either would have worked.

Well I hope Tarquin would return with a bang; like the great elven massacre of the North of the Western Hemisphere; so that the order may come back for him when the whole thing with the secondary villain Xykon guy is done :smallbiggrin:

That's the point. All those things would have meant Tarquin won. Even dying wouldn't beat him. This was the only way to defeat him. Anything less would have been dramatically unsatisfying.

[Niknokitueu]

Dear Rich,

I find I must fully disagree with Tarquin. This is a brilliant ending to the current book.

Oh, and a warning - I got told off for Lolling. Please stop making me laugh (!)

Have Fun!
Niknokitueu

[Adeptus]

A very nice conclusion, and good riddance!

[archaeo]

Well that was a very dissapointing end for my favorite character...I think he was a much better villain than Xykon.

Maybe that's because I like genre savvy tyrants more than I like low intelligence high level undead sorcerers.

Well, let's not jump to conclusions re: "end," here. Tarquin isn't dead yet. That said, bringing him back now will require some narrative jujitsu I can't really predict; if the Giant wants Tarquin in the story again, I have faith it'll be justified. Sort of depends on how the Giant decides to handle the inevitable loose ends that crop up after more than a decade of work on a single series.

As for the rest, man, there's no accounting for taste. For one thing, I think it's hard to be disappointed about the exit of an arc-long character; Tarquin was literally the last person in the world to realize he would be shuffling off stage. For another, I think Xykon has a sort of quintessential chaotic evilness that drives the story a lot better (and a lot less predictably) than a villain so caught up in stories.

But it's a silly disagreement. John Milton proved villains could be more fun than heroes with Paradise Lost, and while Tarquin and Xykon aren't exactly Satan, the Giant has more than confirmed the fact that evil can be pretty exciting and fun to read about.

(P.S. amazing strip Giant, you are just churning out pure gold out there. Sorry about your fonts.)

[ManuelSacha]

Hahahaha!
"Hey! Tarquin!! Catch."
Brilliant and badass.

IMHO, this is a beautiful ending, and frankly seeing Tarquin so raggedy and desperate... made me smile.

Elan's "I'm not a twin anymore" line, and its implications, made me shiver a little.

[Nohar]

Absolutly perfect.

[Ramien]

At least Elan could have lost something-something big that would change his personality from the loveable bard to brooding anti-hero. Or Tarquin and Elan could have ruled the world (and the gates) as father and son. Either would have worked.

Well I hope Tarquin would return with a bang; like the great elven massacre of the North of the Western Hemisphere; so that the order may come back for him when the whole thing with the secondary villain Xykon guy is done :smallbiggrin:

Elan's personality is great as it is; making him a brooding anti-hero would not only make him a much less interesting character, but it would also do some terrible things to his relationship to Haley - can you imagine the guilt she'd feel if she opened up to someone who was kind and pure, and then watch him drop down to 'her' level or worse?

And Roy and Elan were already likely to return so long as Tarquin's plan is going on - Tarquin doesn't need to do much else, and if he does try to massacre the elves or the like, then I hope he ends up dying in the attempt, because it just proves he can't learn when to drop what had already become a bad idea.

[tomaO2]

You know... he's never lied to Elan. He was surrendering. Honestly surrendering. Not one of those stupid pretend to surrender and then stab the hero, but actually giving up. Elan has NEVER failed to accept a surrender. I... I just don't like this ending.

Elan lives for narrative structure. Why save his brother but not save his father? Also, there is no reason in the world that Elan wouldn't be going after Tarquin after they defeat Xylon. I don't see anything wrong with Tarquin's analysis, he just needed to know that Roy had a storyline that needed to be finished FIRST.

I always felt that this should have been talked out. That they could have reasoned things. That Elan could have explained things in such a way that would have made being let go a reasonable choice.

[Greatmoustache]

Oh god yes!!
And it's SO MUCH better that this isn't the end of the book. Meaning that T-jerk didn't mean that much. :smallamused:

[Shale]

Elan did change - this is explicitly pointed out in the text. He used to be the guy who would pull the villain up and take him prisoner. Now he's the guy who drops his dad off an airship because hey, he'll live.

[Michaeler]

Elan did change - this is explicitly pointed out in the text. He used to be the guy who would pull the villain up and take him prisoner. Now he's the guy who drops his dad off an airship because hey, he'll live.

I agree. Elan has lost things and become darker. He's just not as shallow as his father expects and so he's still Elan, albeit a bit darker and a bit sadder.

[Turgon9357]

:vaarsuvius: Perfection.

Sure, Tarquin can go back to his empire scheme, but it will never be the same. He got to taste something better, but despite all his efforts, he couldn't have it. Managing an empire is probably going to get really boring. Maybe he'll slip up and ruin the whole thing, if we're lucky.

[Ramien]

You know... he's never lied to Elan. He was surrendering. Honestly surrendering. Not one of those stupid pretend to surrender and then stab the hero, but actually giving up. Elan has NEVER failed to accept a surrender. I... I just don't like this ending.

Because Tarquin wasn't surrendering. He was negotiating. He was willing to give himself up - if Elan were to give him some good 'interrogation' scenes.


Elan lives for narrative structure. Why save his brother but not save his father? Also, there is no reason in the world that Elan wouldn't be going after Tarquin after they defeat Xylon. I don't see anything wrong with Tarquin's analysis, he just needed to know that Roy had a storyline that needed to be finished FIRST.

Two reasons: First, Nale's life was at risk, Tarquin's wasn't (And throwing "you'll live" back in Tarquin's face was a bonus, story wise). Second, as Elan pointed out, he's not a twin anymore. That means he doesn't need to prove that he's the good one anymore, and gets to deliver a 20d6 smackdown to his old man. If Tarquin were truly at risk of dying at that moment, Elan may have acted differently.


I always felt that this should have been talked out. That they could have reasoned things. That Elan could have explained things in such a way that would have made being let go a reasonable choice.

Elan tried talking about it earlier. Tarquin's response was to threaten him with Nale's fate, then try to kill Roy twice, including stabbing Elan to try and do the job. Negotiations are no longer on the table.

[SowZ]

You know... he's never lied to Elan. He was surrendering. Honestly surrendering. Not one of those stupid pretend to surrender and then stab the hero, but actually giving up. Elan has NEVER failed to accept a surrender. I... I just don't like this ending.

Elan lives for narrative structure. Why save his brother but not save his father? Also, there is no reason in the world that Elan wouldn't be going after Tarquin after they defeat Xylon. I don't see anything wrong with Tarquin's analysis, he just needed to know that Roy had a storyline that needed to be finished FIRST.

I always felt that this should have been talked out. That they could have reasoned things. That Elan could have explained things in such a way that would have made being let go a reasonable choice.

He is a bit darker, but he also new Tarquin would live. It's not a total refusal of a surrender. But it makes more sense to let him fall and be out of their hair than try and keep him prisoner when they have bigger fish to fry. Also, if he had taken him prisoner, it is likely Julio would have killed him rather than risk two high level casters come for a rescue attempt. If anything, it is more kind to let him fall than risk him being executed by Scoundrel.

Besides, taking Tarquin in would be stupidity. Something Elan used to have in spades but has cast off a lot of.

[Kish]

You know... he's never lied to Elan. He was surrendering. Honestly surrendering. Not one of those stupid pretend to surrender and then stab the hero, but actually giving up.

I am rather astounded, even on this board, that anyone seriously thought Tarquin's willingness to be taken prisoner was synonymous with giving up.

(Without even getting into the "never lied to Elan" thing; the word games Tarquin plays to lie without lying have no moral significance, and Tarquin has certainly deceived Elan many times, for everything from leading Elan to believe he was a positive force on the continent to talking about how eager he was to help Elan stop Nale and then banding up with Nale to fight the Order.)


Elan has NEVER failed to accept a surrender.

And now he has.

I... I just don't like this ending.

Elan lives for narrative structure.

And now he doesn't anymore. Because he saw that living for narrative structure is incompatible with being actually Good. Your objection apparently is that Elan needs to still be the two-dimensional, never-growing joke character he was in the Dungeon of Dorukan. Tarquin didn't see the Dungeon of Dorukan, of course, but, like you, he doesn't understand why Elan has a problem with him causing suffering and misery, since that's what the villain is supposed to do, and it's not like "Good" and "Evil" denote anything more meaningful than a narrative role.


Why save his brother but not save his father? Also, there is no reason in the world that Elan wouldn't be going after Tarquin after they defeat Xylon. I don't see anything wrong with Tarquin's analysis, he just needed to know that Roy had a storyline that needed to be finished FIRST.

Tarquin doesn't see anything wrong with his analysis, either.

[Gwynfrid]

It actually can't go back, ever. Adobe Illustrator changed the way it renders type at some point between the old version I was using on my old computer and the new version I'm using on my laptop. Because of that change—and how much I didn't like it—I've been clinging to a woefully outdated version of Illustrator for 8 years or so. But my old computer died about two weeks ago, and no new computer will run the old version anymore. As a result, the font looks awful. It's going to be a nightmare when it's time to print it, since the balloons are sized to the old rendering.

I plan on completely changing the font when we switch over to the new book, because at least that way it won't look like this.

I looked at it twice, and I can't find a difference between the type a few strips back and the type as it is now. :smallconfused:

Anyway, this was a great strip, a great ending, with great lines. I especially loved the way Haley makes the winning last shot at Tarquin, after having been essentially a victim for most of the fight thus far. Go girl!

[Storm_Of_Snow]

"The Battle of Four Armies."
(OotS, Tarquin, Kraagor's monsters, and Xykon/Redcloak)

And maybe some representatives of Azure City - if it's only O-Chul and Lien, they can probably be included in the Order, but if Hinjo sends anyone else, I'd make them a separate group.


You are all now aware that Spiky is still down in the desert, has not been confirmed dismissed in any panel, and is contracted to follow Durkon's orders until midnight (like kill all enemies, for instance). Debatably, that might be just enough time to close the distance between Spiky and Tarquin.
#923, panel 4:
:roy: "Haley, I want you and V running interference. Durkon, have Spiky and the dominated soldiers cover us until we're clear, then release them."

Spiky's gone back to whichever plane he was called from.


You know... he's never lied to Elan. He was surrendering. Honestly surrendering. Not one of those stupid pretend to surrender and then stab the hero, but actually giving up. Elan has NEVER failed to accept a surrender. I... I just don't like this ending.

Elan lives for narrative structure. Why save his brother but not save his father? Also, there is no reason in the world that Elan wouldn't be going after Tarquin after they defeat Xylon. I don't see anything wrong with Tarquin's analysis, he just needed to know that Roy had a storyline that needed to be finished FIRST.

I always felt that this should have been talked out. That they could have reasoned things. That Elan could have explained things in such a way that would have made being let go a reasonable choice.
Tarquin wasn't surrendering - while he was attempt to cease martial combat, he was attempting to change it to psychological combat instead - "We could have some really intense interrogation scenes where I try and subtly manipulate you from inside my cell!"

And if they had imprisoned him, chances are tomorrow morning, following one sending and maybe a bit of scrying, Laurin and Tarquin's army wormhole aboard and try and kill everyone.

As for narrative structure, well, I think Elan himself said it best:
:elan: "The hero of any story can defy danger - but only a special hero can defy stories themselves."

[Neoriceisgood]

Man, OOTS never gets old. Really solid ending to this arc.

[cc_kizz]

Am I the only one who's thinking a better title for this comic would have been "Just Deserts"?

I'll take my coat...

I was afraid that the comic title referred to Julio…

Awesome, awesome story, Giant. This was truly an incredible read. I'm so proud of Elan's development. :)

(Edit: Removed double quote.)

[Traab]

"Sorry dad, in the end, you were just a side quest." Admit it, that would have made Tarquins head explode.

[Dracon1us]

http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g68/Cats_Are_Aliens/Banners/Tarquin.png: Me, fall to my death? Please. Maximum falling damage is 20d6, and I'm a high level fighter. Besides, this story is nowhere near resolution! What type of sorry excuse for a narrative would kill off such an important character in the middle of a story, a high level fighter, and by falling, no less?

muhahahhahhahahhhha

[Michaeler]

Given Tarquin's stated goal to murder everybody aboard the Mechane, would he have survived imprisonment as easily as he survived a fall?

[Akari Itagami]

Tarquin live! Good ending for Tarquin fans!

[Neoriceisgood]

Nice. Not that there's ever been a point where it wasn't, but consider this book so bought. Favorite arc.


Yeah I gotta say, I wasn't sure what to expect when this arc began but it honestly ended up as one of my favourites and most memorable throughout the entire comic's history.

A lot of character development for huge chunks of the order as well.

[Quartz]

Excellent.

[LuisDantas]

Eh. It is pretty funny to see Tarquin offering Elan the role of Wolverine and himself the role of Prof. Charles Xavier. :)

For all his shortcomings, the guy knows his narrative trends.

[isleofredemptio]

Thank GOD! Thank God, it's finally over! ... Dude, where's Steam when you need "Na Na Hey Hey Kiss Him Goodbye"?

[Toper]

A great comic! Tarquin and Elan are both so perfectly in-character, their dialogue is lovely. Also I like to think that in panel 7 Tarquin is startled by the sudden use of perspective and camera angle.

[Shale]

I love that Tarquin's idea of a good ending is one where he knows what happens next.

[hamishspence]

Eh. It is pretty funny to see Tarquin offering Elan the role of Wolverine and himself the role of Prof. Charles Xavier. :)

For all his shortcomings, the guy knows his narrative trends.

Isn't it Roy he's casting in that Xavier role?

"we'll put your buddy Greenhilt in charge of them all ... At the start of each quest, he can grumpily tell you that you're a loose cannon who doesn't play by the rules, and then everything pretty much revolves around you after that."

[Jaxzan Proditor]

Wow. What a great way to finish up this arc. I love how Elan can be really hurtful when he needs to be (although I notice that at first he looks worried for Tarquin, at first). I think Tarquin was wrong, that was a great ending! :smallsmile:

[Shale]

It's not a perfect fit, but it's more of a Tarquin:Xavier :: Roy:Cyclops :: Elan:Wolverine situation.

[Dracon1us]

You know... he's never lied to Elan. He was surrendering. Honestly surrendering. Not one of those stupid pretend to surrender and then stab the hero, but actually giving up. Elan has NEVER failed to accept a surrender. I... I just don't like this ending.

Elan lives for narrative structure. Why save his brother but not save his father? Also, there is no reason in the world that Elan wouldn't be going after Tarquin after they defeat Xylon. I don't see anything wrong with Tarquin's analysis, he just needed to know that Roy had a storyline that needed to be finished FIRST.

I always felt that this should have been talked out. That they could have reasoned things. That Elan could have explained things in such a way that would have made being let go a reasonable choice.

ehm
tarkie is fascist bastard that brings pain and suffering to others just to become a legend
I consider myself "good" but If I had a father like this, and found myself in the same position of Elan, I would have snapped his neck just like this.

“The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few”

[Leirus]

Wow. This comic is so incredibly rewarding. Amazing, amazing strip, I just lost the count of the number of references to other strips.

Also... I am quite sad for Elan. Tarquin may not see it that way, but he has lost a lot of things during this arc, his innocence being the first. Was letting Tarquin fall a neutral act? Back in the day he said indeed "I am the good twin, not the neutral twin (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0069.html)"

I kinda expected Tarquin to be dead at the end of this arc, but I am thinking this way we may yet get to see what was the favour Laurin will ask from him. I wonder if her part of the deal was fulfilled with her staying that long to support Tarquin.

[hamishspence]

It's not a perfect fit, but it's more of a Tarquin:Xavier :: Roy:Cyclops :: Elan:Wolverine situation.

True- I was thinking more of the movies- and maybe the early comics- where Cyclops is at most a "squad leader" not a "legion leader".

[Zhoug]

Hah, that was a great ending. How's Tarquin getting home I wonder.

"Fairly slowly" would be my first guess, but I expect a strategist of his calibre would probably have some means of communication with home base and /or troops stashed somewhere about his person

[Osiris]

On the contrary, my dear Tarquin, it was the BEST ENDING EVAR!

You totally deserved it. Brilliant move on Haley's part. Julio and Elan defying plot just to get T mad- burned!:smalltongue:

[SowZ]

True- I was thinking more of the movies- and maybe the early comics- where Cyclops is at most a "squad leader" not a "legion leader".

Of course, by the time he is more of a legion leader, he's gone completely nuts multiple times and is such an inconsistent character I wouldn't let him lead me in a paintball game, much less be a 'loose cannon' in his mercenary group. I think it is fair to put Scott as a squad leader, since the 'Head of the X-Men' Scott is so unrecognizable from the original character that they basically aren't even the same person.

Also, the vast majority of the time that Xavier is in charge Scott spends either A. as just a squad leader. B. quitting every five weeks. C. going nuts and shirking all responsibilities. D. serving under Storm.

[Wordplay]

'You didn't lose anything' ? :smallfurious:

Tarquin's inability to see just how much Elan has lost, how much that has cost him, and some of his growth as a result infuriates me in a way that his casual murder of innocents and filicide did not.

Enjoying the story, and the characterisation of Tarquin.

[Messenger]

Whoa. :smalleek:

Satisfaction. :smallamused:

It feels like I've been waiting forever for this update. Not that I'm saying the Giant shouldn't enjoy his holiday break, but we really were left on a cliffhanger.

All I can say at this point:

WHAT A LOSER. :smallannoyed:

Don't get me wrong, but I liked Tarquin when we first got to know him. He was the kind of villain you could respect: definitely Evil, but affable, suave, competent and- gasp!- made the most sense and use out of narrative convention.

The last few updates wherein he went directly against The Order, despite showing an accumulating number of flaws in his character, he was a menace. He was such an intelligent threat and a tangible danger. We were all at the edge of our seats.

But now? Begging for negotiations or help, halfheartedly admitting his errors, still doing his best to portray himself as not that bad, then ranting that he deserves better to fit his own narrative?

How the mighty have fallen.

As such, this is one satisfying conclusion to this arc. Giant, you couldn't have done better. :smallsmile:

At this point, I just wonder how much poetic justice is still in store for Tarky. I mean, maybe by the time The Order is done with Xykon and Elan comes back to deal with his dad's evil schemes, someone may have already beaten him to it, ruining Tarky's plans completely.

[Mr. Scaly]

Best. Ending. Ever!

[gorocz]

Well, that really shows me for presuming that breaking Haley's arm was to remove her from the fight :smallbiggrin:

[hamishspence]

Regarding the art of this comic- is this the first time in the OOTS online comic we've seen an airship from behind? The way the Mechane's drawn in the last panel, it looks much more three-dimensional than in the profile shots.

I like it- makes me think of the various pictures of the Mechane in Snips, Snails and Dragon Tails.

[Zhoug]

Poor Tarquin. He's so exceptionally good at recognising, shaping and manipulating narrative for his purposes - but his fatal flaw is that he has repeatedly failed to accept that this time the narrative is not about him. For Tarquin, the plot is a classic tale of his Hubris leading to his downfall.
Recognising that you're not the centre of the universe, and that you play a supporting role (at most) in other people's lives, is a test of maturity - and Tarquin has failed that test. His son, meanwhile, accepts his supporting role in the OOTS. Good on you, Elan!

[DigoDragon]

I killed one of my players in the same manner as Haley's attack. The expression on the player's face when he realized snatching the arrow meant he had let go of the hook he was holding onto... priceless. :smallbiggrin:

[Mauve Shirt]

I love it. I love Elan's speech. "Where's the development" It's right there, Tarquin. In the destruction of Elan's purity of heart.

[Palude]

I don't know if this has been said before, but I'm calling dibs if it wasn't: this is where Ian will show up again, and finish Tarquin off.
It is very befitting: Tarquin is alone, stranded in the endless desert, without any allies or troops near him, and badly hurt. Then the opportunistic Ian will show up and kill him. Thus ends this arc and the book, for real.

[Werewindlefr]

What bothers me, though, is that aside from the disappointment with regards to the narrative situation, he still gets to keep his empire, make millions of people suffer, and still have almost everything he mentioned after the rooftop duel (minus the part where Elan defeats him).
Also, while he isn't the leader of tactician of the group, it's implied that his genre savviness was a crucial element in Tarquin's team's success in securing 3 large Empires from themselves. He still lives.

He might not be the real villain, but he is still a major villain; I'm not sure denying him a more satisfying ending was worth the pain his survival and escape will cause.

It's right there, Tarquin. In the destruction of Elan's purity of heart.Isn't that purity of heart one of the biggest reasons why Haley loves him? Isn't that a major loss for Elan?

[Matt620]

Yay! I was worried something had happened to you, Mr. Burlew. Maybe it's just been one of those crazy holiday seasons.

As for the show: Tarquin is so Tarquin, it's hilarious, as expected. I fully expect Laurin and Miron to show up with their own form of "resolution"

[Messenger]

'You didn't lose anything' ? :smallfurious:

Tarquin's inability to see just how much Elan has lost, how much that has cost him, and some of his growth as a result infuriates me in a way that his casual murder of innocents and filicide did not.

Enjoying the story, and the characterisation of Tarquin.You said it!

I think it just shows how incapable Tarquin is at seeing things from other people's perspective. He's just so self-centered. He doesn't even realize that killing Nale isn't just Elan losing a brother but himself losing a son. Or, rather, he doesn't think killing Nale is losing a son, so neither should Elan see it as losing brother.

And even within his own evil schemes, he thinks it's all for himself! Miron and Laurin were right. (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0921.html)

And even if he avenged Malack's death, he hasn't really mourned or felt guilty for it. I mean, sure, Nale killed Malack, but it was Tarquin's plans that exposed him to that danger. Most people would've questioned themselves on that after losing a friend in such a way. No, not General Tarky.

Seeing Tarquin despondent and lost like that there as the end of this part of the storyline- good show, Giant. Good show.

[nachtkriecher]

Oh, good.

I've been worried that when Tarquin inevitably fell off the Mechane, he would use his awesome dodge ability to miss the ground, and thus learn how to fly :P

[Gusion]

I'm a little disappointed in Tarquin as a character. He went from being the definition of prepared and covering all contingencies to... this. And there isn't really any good reason for it. Nothing happened - that I can see - to cause this bipolar flip. Certainly pride goeth before the fall, I get all that. Still doesn't explain it.

And the "I don't know what happens next" part - but he does! He goes and places that bounty on Haley's father that he talked about less than 10 minutes ago.

I understand the story isn't about Tarquin. But I do think having some understanding of why he converted his epic levels to uselessness would better the story.

[Mauve Shirt]

What bothers me, though, is that aside from the disappointment with regards to the narrative situation, he still gets to keep his empire, make millions of people suffer, and still have almost everything he mentioned after the rooftop duel (minus the part where Elan defeats him).
Also, while he isn't the leader of tactician of the group, it's implied that his genre savviness was a crucial element in Tarquin's team's success in securing 3 large Empires from themselves. He still lives.

He might not be the real villain, but he is still a major villain; I'm not sure denying him a more satisfying ending was worth the pain his survival and escape will cause.

Don't worry. Sabine will kill him.



Isn't that purity of heart one of the biggest reasons why Haley loves him? Isn't that a major loss for Elan?

I think Haley won't have much of a problem with this development. Tarquin was kind of a douchenozzle. It probably won't change Elan's attitude toward most things that aren't his family.

[elros]

Werewindlefr wrote:
What bothers me, though, is that aside from the disappointment with regards to the narrative situation, he still gets to keep his empire, make millions of people suffer, and still have almost everything he mentioned after the rooftop duel (minus the part where Elan defeats him).
I'm pretty sure it will be Sabine that will finish off Tarquin. Not only has the Giant set up Sabine for that role, but it completely robs Tarquin of a satisfying conclusion to the "story." After all, Sabine is not a hero, so there is nothing inspiring about her defeating Tarquin.

All in all, I like how the Giant wrapped this up, and I'm just as happy that he pointed out this is not the end of the book.

[SmartAlec]

I'm a little disappointed in Tarquin as a character. He went from being the definition of prepared and covering all contingencies to... this. And there isn't really any good reason for it. Nothing happened - that I can see - to cause this bipolar flip.

He stopped being a character who enabled the story and instead became one who was actively fighting against it. All his contingency planning and smarts were based on his knowledge of narrative ("Bards should be ruling the world..."), but once he got that wrong, it all went wrong. Faulty information went in, faulty conclusions came out.

Example: he completely underestimated the Order. "How did you all get to such a high level without someone teaching you your place?"

[Shale]

I'm a little disappointed in Tarquin as a character. He went from being the definition of prepared and covering all contingencies to... this. And there isn't really any good reason for it. Nothing happened - that I can see - to cause this bipolar flip. Certainly pride goeth before the fall, I get all that. Still doesn't explain it.

He lost control of the story when Elan insisted on continuing as a subordinate to Roy. And Tarquin clearly does not handle losing control well -- all the more so when it's his grand plan for his life and legacy that we're talking about.

[Ghost Nappa]

New comic is up.

And since everyone will begin speculating immediately…
No, this is not the last page in the book. It is pretty close, though.

Totally worth the wait. :smallbiggrin:

[SowZ]

I'm pretty sure it will be Sabine that will finish off Tarquin. Not only has the Giant set up Sabine for that role, but it completely robs Tarquin of a satisfying conclusion to the "story." After all, Sabine is not a hero, so there is nothing inspiring about her defeating Tarquin.

All in all, I like how the Giant wrapped this up, and I'm just as happy that he pointed out this is not the end of the book.

Sabine cannot return to the material plane for the rest of the day. By then, unless something else got to him, he should be home and healed. Also, even if she's gained a few adventurer levels, she probably isn't capable of doing even 20 damage a round and probably has under 50 HP. 33 if shes out of the box.

I realize the comic follows narrative rules for this kind of thing, not numbers. But even within the story, its pretty clear that Sabine and Tarqy aren't even on the same playing field, combat wise. If she stands a chance, Tarquin must be a lot closer to death than I thought.

[Gusion]

Cue Laurin walking into the scene asking for her favour - Tarquin's Ring of Regeneration so that she may be able to leave the desert more easily on low PP.

Tarquin implied to have more than one when he offered one to Elan, so he would probably tell her okay, open a portal to the castle and I'll give you one.

It is just a favor after all.

[silvadel]

Tarquin got written out. He did it to himself when he took over the Linear Guild -- they were the B team and he got tainted.

Watch out Tarquin -- now that you are not part of the story, just anyone could overthrow you and it doesn't even have to be anyone special. Your plot armor has dissolved.

[gerryq]

I was quite surprised that Tarquin didn't die from the fall, because he acted like he thought it would actually kill him. It seems that he really would have preferred to be attempting to manipulate Elan from inside a cell than have Elan escape in the airship.

[Ramien]

Isn't that purity of heart one of the biggest reasons why Haley loves him? Isn't that a major loss for Elan?

I don't think Elan's really lost his purity yet. He didn't kill Tarquin in cold blood, after all. He knew Tarquin would be able to survive the fall, especially with his ring of regeneration. Has he lost some of his naivety? Sure. But not his purity yet.

[drazen]

Elan lost plenty today, Tarkie. He lost his brother and his cleric friend is now an undead abomination. He also lost his childishness and grew up a bit.

And the ending isnt terrible, Tarkie. Other than the fact that you usually don't see the villain hit the ground, so he can return later. You just got a Saturday morning cartoon villain ending, is all.

"You'll live" was the perfect callback. Finally, something worth the 25 strips of the interminable battle with half of Team Tarquin.

So how much XP does the order get for beating three much higher level adventurers while almost out of juice? Julio helped a little, but he only bought them time.

[SowZ]

I don't think Elan's really lost his purity yet. He didn't kill Tarquin in cold blood, after all. He knew Tarquin would be able to survive the fall, especially with his ring of regeneration. Has he lost some of his naivety? Sure. But not his purity yet.

Also, taking him as prisoner could have easily resulted in Tarquin's death. If I was Julio, and Elan took him prisoner, I'd say 'sorry kid' and finish him off then and there, disintegrating the body after asking the elf if he knows Trap the Soul.

[CoffeeIncluded]

This was so freaking satisfying to read.

Though I'm sure we will return to the western continent at some point--want to bet Tarquin is nothing but a raving gibbering lunatic inside and out by then?

[HandofShadows]

OWNED! :smallcool::smallbiggrin: And done with words. Elan you deserve a LOT of respect for what you have done.

[LuPuWei]

I like this one.

And thanks, G, for not killing off Tarquin cheaply. Its probably what he deserves but I like the character too much (as in the character, not necessarily what he stands for...)

[Albonor]

Sir, Giant, Rich,

I love you. Your work makes everything bad a bit better and a good day great!

[Neoriceisgood]

I killed one of my players in the same manner as Haley's attack. The expression on the player's face when he realized snatching the arrow meant he had let go of the hook he was holding onto... priceless. :smallbiggrin:

Heheheh, nice.

[Lvl45DM!]

It shouldnt be possible to have it be such a perfect ending with such a perfect punchline.

[Systole]

No, this is not the last page in the book. It is pretty close, though.

One of the strips which Mr. Giant references will no doubt be Laurin pulling in her favor (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0924.html), which she mentioned could be done quickly. I'm curious as to what it is.

I'm also happy that Tarquin survived the arc thus far, because from the moment he killed Nale, my money was on Sabine being the one to off him.

[Gift Jeraff]

Ha! Where is your feather fall/dimension door item now?!


:elan::And then Tarquin hit the ground and died.
:roy:: Are you kidding me? Maximum falling damage is 20d6, that wouldn't even kill an uninjured medium level adventurer.
:elan:: Oh. Are you sure?
:roy:: I've become very familiar with the falling rules in my spare time.
:elan:: OK, well, then Tarquin hit the ground, and then got up and started yelling about unsatisfying plot resolutions.
I've been thinking of that scene after every time someone mentioned Tarquin falling in the last 2 discussion threads.


Well that was a very dissapointing end for my favorite character.

I would have expected so much more from Tarquin's story--Belkar's or Haley's death or at least Julio's, Elan losing a hand, team Tarquin defeating Team Evil that kind of stuff-- I mean he started out great but ended up as a petty villain... However, I think he was a much better villain than Xykon.

Maybe that's because I like genre savvy tyrants more than I like low intelligence high level undead sorcerers.
I might sound like an ass (or Eric Cartman (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=48H34ukFe8g)), but I have to say seeing posts like this from Tarquin fans is absolutely...delicious. :smallamused:

[Snails]

I might sound like an ass (or Eric Cartman (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=48H34ukFe8g)), but I have to say seeing posts like this from Tarquin fans is absolutely...delicious. :smallamused:

Right there with you.

Giant, this is the most awesome terrible ending EVAR! Woo hoo!

[Kish]

I'm a little disappointed in Tarquin as a character. He went from being the definition of prepared and covering all contingencies to... this.

He was never the definition of prepared and covering all contingencies; that was a fan-conception of him. He was always this. There was no bipolar flip. You are correct that nothing happened to change him; you are incorrect that he changed. Like so many of Tarquin's fans, you confused "has an obsession with narrative that caused him to literally memorize the Evil Overlord's List, and is lucky enough to live in a world where expecting the world to behave like a story makes him effective and crazy rather than just crazy, though the fact that he doesn't recognize what kind of story he's in was always going to bite him, to cause him to very confidently put his foot down somewhere where the floor isn't" with "is the ideal evil overlord and perfectly understands how his world works." Tarquin's fundamentally misunderstood Elan and what kind of story he's in since his first appearance. He just had to be a lot more obvious about what he is to overcome his son's stupidity. If Elan actually was the brilliant, competent adventurer Tarquin thinks he is, Tarquin would have been reduced to raging impotently at his inability to force Elan to play his way a long time ago.


And the "I don't know what happens next" part - but he does! He goes and places that bounty on Haley's father that he talked about less than 10 minutes ago.

You mean, the one he already placed? He didn't say "I will place this unless you do X for me." He said he'd placed it, and now they could deal with it. Presumably, he was planning for Elan to go off and destroy Zyklon (recruiting new redshirts first if he really needed them), and Haley to go and rescue her father or die trying, depending on how grim the Grand Story of Tarquin and his Son was (with Tarquin, of course, hoping for maximally grim).

Well, that really shows me for presuming that breaking Haley's arm was to remove her from the fight :smallbiggrin:
Correction: It shows you for presuming that Rich writing Tarquin breaking Haley's arm was because Rich wanted Haley removed from the fight.

For Tarquin, I'm sure breaking Haley's arm was precisely to remove her from the fight. Tarquin just didn't get what he wanted.

To respond to another subthread here, Elan's heart is still purer than anyone else in the comic except perhaps Celia. He could have killed Tarquin and still remained, at least in my opinion, very comfortably within the parameters of the Good alignment; as always, he was far more merciful than he needed to be.

That's not to say he hasn't learned a lot of painful things, about his family and about the problems with devotion to narrative. But he has not "lost his purity of heart."

[Seto]

I might sound like an ass (or Eric Cartman (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=48H34ukFe8g)), but I have to say seeing posts like this from Tarquin fans is absolutely...delicious. :smallamused:

I'm a Tarquin fan and I think this ending was really fitting.

[Ninja Dragon]

This reminds me of what happened to Dellyn Goblinslayer on Goblins.

Priceless.

[Traab]

This reminds me of what happened to Dellyn Goblinslayer on Goblins.

Priceless.

Only instead of, "You are just a random encounter" its, "You were just a side quest."

[Mogotoo]

Maybe the last page involves Laurins favor?That's what I'm thinking. I'm imagining two endings:

Laurin's favour is for Tarquin to die/walk away from tyranny and leave their group forever, presumably as punishment for his behaviour. I'm imagining this as a way to get rid of Tarquin from the narrative, although that might be considered a satisfying ending, something that Burlew seems to be avoiding with Tarquin's defeat-by-anticlimax.

Alternatively, Tarquin could come back. If he does, I hope it's for the main plot and he's not going to whine over and over again about how no one's following his story. That was fine here, when he was the intended villain of the week with no one to overshadow him. He was the top dog, in his own kingdom. It will just bug me if it continues in the dwarven mountains.

[Scarlet Knight]

I don't think Elan's really lost his purity yet. He didn't kill Tarquin in cold blood, after all. He knew Tarquin would be able to survive the fall, especially with his ring of regeneration. Has he lost some of his naivety? Sure. But not his purity yet.

"I won't kill you; but that doesn't mean I have to save you."

[Ghost Nappa]

It looks like Tarquin....

got his just deserts (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0833.html).

Get it?! Because he's in the middle of the desert and there's nothing around him except desert in the last panel, and the whole "just desserts" thing, and oh I'll shut up now.

[Khay]

Maybe not the end of the book quite yet, but definitely a fitting way to move towards that ending. I'm not normally a Haley fanboy, but this is just awesome. :smallbiggrin:


(...) But my old computer died about two weeks ago, and no new computer will run the old version anymore.

I hesistate to ask (and I've probably been ninja'd to hell and back while my WLAN was deliberating whether it wants to work today :smallsigh:), but won't it work even in a virtual machine? Setting that up might require some effort if we're talking Mac-world here, but it might be worth a try...

[Kish]

Tarquin is not a genie. Laurin's favor is something it makes sense for her to consider balanced with "participate in a fight you don't think anyone in the party should bother with, and teleport away if it looks like you might lose," not "die" or "leave the group."

And if Tarquin is capable of accepting that he's not the main character* of the story he's in without having a complete nervous breakdown, then I've misjudged Tarquin badly in a way I don't think I have.

*With, of course, lip service to the idea that the main character is the hero, not the villain...but if he ever really understood and accepted that people would be reading Elan's story for Elan rather than for Tarquin, that would break him just as thoroughly as would accepting that it's actually the story of Roy and Xykon, not of Elan and Tarquin.

[AutomatedTeller]

That was excellent.

Haley uses Tarquin's abilities against him and manages a double-shot with a broken arm, showing why she is a hero :)

Tarquin stays completely in character, starting to negotiate when in a losing position and still, simply doesn't get it. He accuses Elan of having no growth, but misses that this arc was all about Elan's growth - Elan even tells him how he's grown and Tarquin misses it. I think that was a great ending for the arc - it's not for Tarquin, cause he's completely missed that he's not the villain (even though Elan just told him he's not)

Guess no feather fall for Tarquin - he survived because he's higher level than Roy was and the sand is slightly softer? Or was it because Roy was more injured when he fell?

btw - notice that when Tarquin finally was defeated, Roy wasn't around?

oh - I had completely missed the flashback with "you'll live, too"

[Reverent-One]

Oh, that was great, I was laughing all the way through, whether it was Haley being awesome, Tarquin's bargaining, Elan's lines, or "I don't know what happens next!".

I was thinking Tarquin was going to meet his end by his rage getting him killed, but this, this was a more amazing Tarquin-ish ending for him. Glad he showed enough reason to try to bargain his way rather than trying unendingly to attack again and again.


And if Tarquin is capable of accepting that he's not the main character* of the story he's in without having a complete nervous breakdown, then I've misjudged Tarquin badly in a way I don't think I have.

*With, of course, lip service to the idea that the main character is the hero, not the villain...but if he ever really understood and accepted that people would be reading Elan's story for Elan rather than for Tarquin, that would break him just as thoroughly as would accepting that it's actually the story of Roy and Xykon, not of Elan and Tarquin.

I'd doubt a nervous breakdown, if for no other reason that it's easy to for someone to tell themselves that they're right and someone else (in this case, Elan) is wrong.

[The Smallest]

Laurin's favour is for Tarquin to die/walk away from tyranny and leave their group forever, presumably as punishment for his behaviour.

I personally don't think this would happen. A punishment would be separate from any favors owed to anyone if the whole team agreed on kicking Tarquin out of their group. If he did get kicked out, Laurin would still be able to collect on her favor at a later date. However, Tarquin will likely be allowed to stay in the group as it was he who assembled them for the second time and seems, so far, to be the most formidable of all of them. The former may mean that the other members see him as the person in charge, while the former means that he may be too great an asset to lose. Coupled with the fact that Tarquin seems to have been the one who formulated the plan to eventually gain control of the desert, it is highly unlikely that Tarquin would be forced to leave the group against his will.

[Kish]

Guess no feather fall for Tarquin - he survived because he's higher level than Roy was and the sand is slightly softer? Or was it because Roy was more injured when he fell?
Partly the "higher level" thing, but mostly the "Roy was more injured" thing; if you recall, when Roy was falling, one of the strategies he said he could use to survive the fall was "drink a healing potion and hope for low damage, but Elan drank my last healing potion."

Falling damage caps out at 20d6. Both Tarquin and Roy likely achieved terminal velocity before hitting and thus took 20d6 damage--the dice would need to be unkind for that to kill an uninjured fighter of Roy's level, and it may well be completely impossible for that to be enough damage to kill an uninjured fighter of Tarquin's level.