OOTS characters as Magic Cards

[Zordrath]

Yeah, I'm probably not the first one with that idea :smalltongue: Still, I thought it might be fun to see what everyone's favorite characters might do in everyone's favorite card game, and with the current arc coming to a close I started with some of its villains. Let me know what you think!

http://f40.img-up.net/Tarquin39f6f.jpghttp://g02.img-up.net/LaurinShat9448.jpghttp://r67.img-up.net/Malack3f710.jpg

With Tarquin, I wanted to focus on his ability to predict stories and twist them to his own ends, which in this case means knowing and manipulating what you'll draw next. If you can guess what card comes next, he'll provide you not only with card advantage, but also bolster your army like a General should. Even better, he can help you turn that guess into a sure thing - but only while you're in a position of power and have life to spare. Once your resources are depleted or your enemies have knocked you down, you're left guessing blindly AND revealing your next draw every upkeep. I don't know what happens next! This is a terrible ending! :smallamused: I wasn't quite sure which combat stats to give him, at first he had 5/3 and got first strike when you guessed the card, but in the comic he fights very defensively and doesn't actually strike first. So he ended up with more defensive stats and only grants temporary offense to himself and your army when the card is right.

We don't know much about Laurin except her MO in combat, so I focussed on that. She can come into play with a ridiculous amount of power if you have the mana and immediately start blasting your enemy's most powerful permanents without tapping or expending much mana. However, every time she does this she loses a lot of energy and is soon left defenseless. I considered also giving her the ability to counter spells, but I didn't want to overload the card and it wouldn't fit the colors I chose for her.

Malack was also rather straightforward - he's a complex character, but his most significant action was turning Durkon into a vampire so that's what his card does. My first idea was just letting him kill with an ability similiar to Laurin, but I thought Deathtouch might be more interesting to play. It also fits the comic, since he incapacitated both Belkar and Durkon at close range and then drained them. Your new vampire comes in weakened thrall form, but you can tap Malack to remove the -1/-1 counters and turn him into a full vampire. Protection from white and red represents his protection from sunlight.

Overall, I had surprising difficulty assigning the appropriate colors for each character. Obviously they're all villains and all have at least some black in them, but apart from that it's not all that clear-cut, as the lively forum debate on all three of them can attest :smalltongue: Red and black is Tarquin's color scheme and red fits with his obvious enjoyment of battle, but you could also consider him part white for his focus on order over chaos, or even blue for his knowledge of stories. Laurin claims selfless motivations for evil deeds, so I pegged her as black and white, though she could have also been blue for her magic and counterspelling. Lastly, Malack as a servant of a death god was the most obvious choice for mono black, but he too could have an element of white for his loyalty to a higher power.

I'm looking forwards to your thoughts, and feel free to post your own card interpretations of OOTS characters!

[Jaxzan Proditor]

Very nice! I can see that you put a lot of effort into those cards. :smallsmile: I think that Malak and Tarquin should probably have a higher mana cost.

Edit: Actually, now that I look at them a little close, Tarquin's cost seems fine. I would either make Malak a little less powerful or raise his cost. His second ability is especially powerful, almost to the point of being broken.

[Aeriander]

This is immensely entertaining. I'm not a magic player but I find the cards fascinating, and what you made fits each character perfectly.

[factotum]

I'd say Tarquin is maybe a bit strong? As I recall, the guys at WotC try to ensure that a character who's depicted as a single human doesn't go much higher than 2/2--3/5 is more the ballpark of angels, giants, treefolk, and other such non-human creatures. The only single human 3/5 I can find is Ith, High Arcanist. We've also just gone through a massive arc where Tarquin has shown he isn't quite as much in control as he likes to think he is, so the second ability is a bit off, IMHO.

[Aeriander]

I'd say Tarquin is maybe a bit strong? As I recall, the guys at WotC try to ensure that a character who's depicted as a single human doesn't go much higher than 2/2--3/5 is more the ballpark of angels, giants, treefolk, and other such non-human creatures. The only single human 3/5 I can find is Ith, High Arcanist. We've also just gone through a massive arc where Tarquin has shown he isn't quite as much in control as he likes to think he is, so the second ability is a bit off, IMHO.

He is an epic level character. Just because this paticular scenario eluded him doesn't mean he is not effective at what he does.

[Gorthaur]

Wow, haven't used this account in a while. This topic brings tears of joy to my heart, because I was honestly thinking about figuring out a way to play D&D with Alignment replaced by your colors. And I think there's infinite methods of CARDing these guys, and it's loads and loads of fun.

Hrm, why don't I give it a shot... Forgive my formatting, I've been out of the game for a while.

Red is chaos, passion, and fire. Of those, passion is kind of fitting for Tarquin, but the others don't feel that way. Black is ambition, hate, cruelty, capitalism and honestly if I come up with more that'll feel entirely too obvious. Tarquin is primarily black, but I think with a smidgeon of white- yes, white. White is Order, Law, Obedience, and goodness kind of, which fits the Lawful nature of Tarquin. However, he's more evil than not, so yeah.

The problem is, the chaotic ability he has -is- definitely a red ability. That means that for it to work if you made him 1WBB (as I would, since he's costed pretty aggressively), we'd have to change it up slightly. I'd give him equipment personally so here we go...

I -really- love his P/T, by the way- he is a defensive fighter but still has quite a bit of nasty to him.

I would do it something like this.

General Tarquin
1WBB
Legendary Human Warrior Lord
3/5
During your draw step, you may forgo drawing a card and instead search your library for an artifact and put it into your hand.
1WB: Tarquin gains protection from a color of your choice until the end of turn.
1: Tarquin becomes the color of your choice until the end of turn.

This fits with his "I'm always prepared" thing. It is a nasty bit of work, since there's some gamebreaking artifacts and equipment you could find. He feels like he should have something more aggressive (I do like that about your version) but I'm thinking he's okay as he's costed. And white has an "equipment cares" piece of the color pie, so that fits too. Changing colors is usually blue, but it's mostly flavor and eh. Gaining protection (at a pretty heftyish cost, no less) is pretty good but not brutal as there are answers.

Now, lets go with Laurin.

Psychic powers are blue. I think everyone in Tarquin's group probably qualifies as WB (with the possible exception of Malack), so to distinguish her I'd make her blue. Also, I think every psychic has a creature-type of Wizard (although I'd have to check and this is the wife's comp, so no apprentice searches for me!) but that's not really relevant since they won't be tribal.

You nailed the ability, though. That is the epitome of a Black ability, and really rocks. But hrm, how to represent that Psions are better at the start of... nevermind, got it, based on cards in hand. Okay.

Laurin Shattersmith
X/3
3UB
Legendary Human Psion
X is equal to the number of cards in your hand.
Shroud
2UB: Draw a card.
T: Laurin deals her power in damage to target creature.

Enables her to nastily snipe through people, avoids getting hit with spells due to her propensity for counterspells (mechanically, Shroud), and even has an overcosted card drawing engine attached to her to improve her power slightly.

Malack... well, cleric vampires have lots of strengths and powers so it's hard as hell to figure it out (I like how you did sun immunity! Goodness, that is elegant). I'd probably end up dropping it and doing something weirder, since vampires in Magic almost always got stronger when killing things. On the other hand, Malack tends to grab Thralls, so there's that. Hrm.

Honestly, since he has a ludicrously high ECL just by raw non-class levels there's a part of me that'd make him kind of an endgame finisher nasty critter. Here's a quick shot at it.

Malack
3BBB
Legendary Lizard Vampire Cleric
8/5
Wither (This creature deals damage to other creatures in the form of -1/-1 counters)
Whenever a creature with -1/-1 counters is put in the graveyard, return it to play at the end of turn under your control. It is a Black Vampire in addition to its other types and colors.
When Malack dies, all vampires return to the control of their owner.
BBB, Pay 2 life: Regenerate Malack.

There. Six mana is a bit overkill but he finishes games pretty solidly. I think, anyway.

Wow, this is fun. For the record, your interpretations are equally valid (if not moreso) since color, like alignment, is a spectrum, and again, these guys qualify for infinite cards of value.

[marq]

Black is ambition, hate, cruelty, capitalism ...

Black is capitalism? Huh? :smallconfused:

[TroubleBrewing]

I always had Tarquin pegged as UW more than BW, to be honest. Islands and Plains are plenty capable of evil.

[Gorthaur]

Yep, black is capitalism. And that's not bad.


Many humans share some global beliefs (the taking of a human life is wrong, for example). Some of white’s tenets line up with some of these universal human beliefs. Therefore white is sometimes seen as the color of “good.” Ah, but white is neither inherently good nor evil. White, as well as every other color in Magic, will do things that can be labeled both “good” and “evil,” and even that might not be consistent from person to person. Preservation of life is very white. Most of you would probably classify that as “good.” Fascism is also very white. Most of you would probably classify that as “evil.”

I mention this because I believe it’s important to separate the white-black conflict from good versus evil. Morality versus amorality. Light versus dark. Purity versus corruption. The white/black conflict takes on many shades, but "good versus evil" is far too subjective to use properly. Let’s take one of the elements of the white/black conflict, the rights of the group versus the rights of the self. This conflict pits socialism versus capitalism. Capitalism is the black side of the argument. Is capitalism inherently evil? I don’t think so. (Although I know there are those that would disagree with me.) I’ll talk more about black (including its “good” side) when we get to Black Week.

Source (https://www.wizards.com/Magic/Magazine/Article.aspx?x=mtgcom/daily/mr57)


...many of the things black embodies can be used for good. For example, black is the color that stresses the importance of the individual. This is a fundamental part of things like capitalism and the American Constitution. Selfishness has its good uses. Sometimes, people really should put themselves first.

Source (http://www.wizards.com/Magic/Magazine/Article.aspx?x=mtgcom/daily/mr109)

I always found that fascinating, idly. We knew since Kamigawa (when they really emphasized this) that White can absolutely be EVIL, and all five colors can be antagonists... Black is the individual putting himself before others. Black is Ayn Rand. Black -also- happens to have zombies, vampires, and demons, which works when you realize it is basically Profit Motive- the Color. White, on the other hand, can go evil if you look at it like the bad guy (or girl, its been a long time) of Bioshock 2.

The reason I'd go with WBB as a base cost for damn near everyone in Team Tarquin is that White/Black tends to be all about making others pay for a small group of elites who benefit.


The key is making each half refocus how it thinks and meeting halfway. The way this is done is by focusing on the needs of a small insular group. The White half thinks of the group as its community. The Black half uses its selfish means to advance the group as an extension of itself. This allows both halves to treat the group with foremost importance.

Source (http://www.wizards.com/magic/magazine/Article.aspx?x=mtgcom/daily/mr221)

(Sorry if I'm too wordy or quotey, I have just been fascinated with the color pie since Ice Age, when I learned how to play by throwing ten scaled wyrms in a deck and wondering why I lost all the time)

EDIT: Yeah, blue white works wonders for just about everyone. The only thing is that I don't know how blue Tarquin is. Yeah, he's all about preplanning and artifacts but he isn't an intellectual- he knows stories. I'd peg him honestly as White Black, with possibilities of a slight splash of red (hell maybe WBBR as a casting cost? No clue). Blue is an equally valid interpretation though, but discussing colors is more or less my favorite part of magic and there's never a right answer.

For instance, Miko is straight up White (although her hatred of 'unnatural abominations' could indicate some green). Xykon is Black Red (but you could argue blue), and Redcloak is Black (with a strong possibility of Blue and White).

[marq]

Yep, black is capitalism. And that's not bad.

...yeah, all that is the least accurate thing I've ever read, for several reasons. If you're basing your knowledge of Magic's colors on that, I'd suggest reading someone else for a while.


I always found that fascinating, idly. We knew since Kamigawa (when they really emphasized this) that White can absolutely be EVIL, and all five colors can be antagonists...

They did that in "The Dark" first, prior to Ice Age (which you said you started with, so you might have missed it).

[TroubleBrewing]

I really don't see Tarquin being Red at all. I mean, he gets mad occasionally, and enjoys violence, but he doesn't lose control of his emotions in any of his appearances save the last one.

[Ron Miel]

{Scrubbed}

[Deathmachine]

{Scrubbed}

[Jaxzan Proditor]

I wonder how well the Ravnica guilds map to the Alignment system. Or the Shards.

[marq]

He got several sources from WotC themselves, while you got "several reasons". Why not share YOUR sources with us?

You misquoted my post as being by "TroubleBrewing," fyi.

We're discussing it in PM. Would you like to hear it here as well? I'm happy to post my explanation.

[ReaderAt2046]

I did a big chunk of the Order cast as Magic cards here (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=15655456&postcount=65), here (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=15929970&postcount=73), here (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=15985529&postcount=77), and here (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=16466991&postcount=133). Thoughts?

[Gorthaur]

I'm skipping Roy, because there's a lot of directions you could go with it.

Elan is random. I'm going more with early Elan rather than Dashing Swordsman, because pun-quips are neat but hard to translate mechanically, also probably not as fun to play.

Elan
Legendary Human Bard
2/4
2RR
Whenever you flip a coin, if the result is heads, Elan deals 1 damage to target player. If the result is tails, both players choose and discard a card.
Creatures you control have Haste.
R: Flip a coin. If the result is heads, creatures you control receive +1/+1 until end of turn. If the result is tails, deal 1 damage to target creature you control.

Fits the randomness theme, the fact that he hindered his allies as much as he hurt his foes, and having him in the battle slowly destroys the sanity of both players (but can hurt the foe more). He had to have a method of constant coin flips, though.

The reason I would go with coin flips is that mechanically, they aren't that fun and reduce the game to more random chance than people like... which fits, because Elan is -annoying-. Even to the players of the game.

Elan is Red. He is Good, but also very Red. (I could argue Red/White but won't)

For Haley, I am focusing more on her love of clan and Elan- Red in her is not chaos and randomness, but passion. She doesn't like Rules and thus isn't white, but is selfish enough to care about HER and HERS, and thats basically it- ergo, Black Red. I know, nobody likes to admit it, but Chaotic Good (but utterly selfish and clannish) is pretty Black/Red. (Although, as mentioned, there's shades there- red white also fits)

Haley Starshine
Legendary "Human" Rogue (am I referencing forum memes right?)
2BR
2/3
First Strike
Ninjutsu 1BR (1BR, Return an unblocked attacker you control to hand: Put this card into play from your hand tapped and attacking.) Whenever Haley Starshine deals combat damage to a player, you may gain control of target artifact that player controls. If the artifact is Equipment, you may attach it to Haley Starshine.

Emphasis on thievery- Ninjutsu makes it possible to sneak her down and use her ability. Theft is black, red and blue, but stealing loot seems to fit her well.

I've gotta nab the wife from work, but thoughts on others-

Belkar- doublestrike? Definitely Black Red, probably Green as well but I hate tricolor since it feels like a cop-out.

Durkon- White.

V- Oh god I don't want to do this. Probably Red and Blue, with black for darth V and minus some red for post-darth v.

Roy... Blue? He does tend to be a thinky guy, almost more than V. White too since Lawful Good is his modus operandi... but I don't know, honestly. How would you make Roy even decent, let alone functional? "Protection from Wizards"? Shroud? Doublestrike or something like that? Ugh. This is why I'd tap out. :P




I did a big chunk of the Order cast as Magic cards here (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=15655456&postcount=65), here (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=15929970&postcount=73), here (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=15985529&postcount=77), and here (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=16466991&postcount=133). Thoughts?



Yeah yours are better. I would give Roy vigilance and make him blue, not red, but eh. Haley works for the archery thing, and is much more elegant than mine. Elan is good and simpler. V and Belkar rock.

[Squirrel_Token]

Count me in the camp that doesn't see Tarquin as red at all--he's said several times that he can't work with a "loose cannon," ie Nale and Thog. I'll say he's straight black--not because he's evil, but because he's so focused on himself. White is the color most-closely associated with order, but black would likely be second in that respect, and all of his order is entirely self-serving a la black, rather than white which is more order in the name of the greater good for the group. Let's try:

General Tarquin
3BB
Legendary Creature-Human Warrior
4/4
1BB, put a -1/-1 counter on General Tarquin: Choose one- Gain control of target creature for as long as you control Tarquin; or, Look at the top 5 cards of your library. Put one of those into your hand and the rest in your graveyard; or, Tarquin gains hexproof until end of turn.

I like the idea of Tarquin leveraging his resources into a number of different answers for problems that present themselves--either pay off an annoying creature to join your side, or buy an answer from your library, and in a pinch, he can always snatch some arrows out of the air to protect himself :smalltongue:

FWIW, I think Malack is also straight black (again not just because he's evil or a vampire but because wholely-devoted to death and the god of death, which is very black), and I think Laurin is blue (most psychic magic, ie psionic blast, in magic is depicted as blue. I don't think she has to be black just because she's evil).

[Zordrath]

I didn't mean to break any rules, but putting comic pictures onto the cards may have been a bit shortsighted, taking any artwork from Rich is indeed prohibited by the rules. I'll reupload these cards without artwork in a minute.

Thanks to everyone who has commented so far, I'm glad you like the cards :smallbiggrin:

I originally had Tarquin cost five mana and Malack six, but then I figured I'd rather err on the side of making sure they're super-playable for my first batch. Couldn't hurt to up the cost slightly though, or in the case of Malack putting some costs on his abilities.

I think you guys are right about Tarquin being more white than red, I wasn't fully comfortable with red myself. I think I'll keep Laurin in B/W though, that way you could also play the entire team in a dual-colored deck, which is pretty cool.

Gorthaur, that's some badass ideas :smallbiggrin: That Tarquin is even more broken than mine in the right deck, and the ultra-prepared artifact tutor is definitely a very valid interpretation of him, the way he flaunts his magic equipment all the time. I also really like giving Laurin shroud, that's a very elegant way of incorporating her counterspelling. If you make her blue, cards in hand is also a pretty cool way to define her power. Your Malack is rather similiar to mine I think, except he withers where mine deathtouches. I like the regeneration though, I think that's something mine could use as well, considering he's intended to fight a lot to get his thralls.

Updated versions of Team Tarquin in the spoiler:

http://u23.img-up.net/Tarquin283f8.jpghttp://m50.img-up.net/LaurinShatee8a.jpghttp://t56.img-up.net/Malack2fa7a.jpg

I really like this version of Laurin, though she's very wordy now. Malack is less complex, but has gotten stronger and in turn more mana intensive. I'm rather happy with the new B/W Tarquin, he's essentially very similiar in function but hopefully feels less red.

I actually did some of the OOTSers before making this thread, I just figured I'd start with Team Tarquin because their arc is about to end. There's quite a bit of overlap with Gorthaur's suggestions. Here are the members I have already:

http://d36.img-up.net/BelkarBittb3b1.jpghttp://l56.img-up.net/ElantheBar2409.jpghttp://x56.img-up.net/DurkonThuna54e.jpg

Note that these are our heroes pre-character development, that is Elan is a pure Bard, Belkar is still pure Evil and Rage and Durkon is no vampire. I gave them an unifying mechanic, Player Character, that distinguishes them from any other creature and makes them especially effective against regular monsters. It also plays into the theme of player-centered morality that this world has going for it.

Belkar was fairly straightforward, how can I pack as much combat damage as possible on a single creature? And he's red and black because he's driven by passion and greed.

Elan is just purely random and probably not a card anyone would play, but then Roy didn't know what he was in for when he took him on an adventure either... :smalltongue: I think Elan definitely needs to be both red and white, he's got a pure heart but he's also very driven by impulse, especially in the beginning. After the recent strip he may have moved towards pure white, but this is still Dungeon of Dorukan Elan.

Durkon is the quintessential cleric who heals and revives your player characters, and steadfastly stands guard against any threat. With him I felt mono-color white was the most appropriate, since he's the very definition of Lawful Good, even moreso than Roy.

Looking forward to your feedback :smallsmile:

[FlawedParadigm]

I'd cast Tarquin as BW; malevolent but with a strong belief in order and law...so long as it's his law. That's even pretty close to the Orzhov guild.

I don't really see any reason Laurin wouldn't be U or UB based on her appearances so far. Although WB is too low a base cost for a 1/4. Sure, she is just a vanilla 1/4 at that point, but still.

Malack...hrm. Pro White and Red feels a little too strong for his protection from sunlight. I might go with "Protection from Red and White instants and sorceries" or "If Malack would be destroyed by a spell or ability that targets Vampires, instead regenerate him." Since Innistrad block, there are a few Vampire-specific cards. Or even "Damage from noncreature sources that would be dealt to Malack is reduced to 0."

[Roland St. Jude]

Sheriff: Please avoid use of Rich's artwork and other Forum Rules violations.

[Zordrath]

Updated the first post with artwork-free versions of the cards. Thanks for keeping the thread open, Roland :smallsmile:

[FlawedParadigm]

Belkar's probably a bit strong; a three power Double Striker for four mana is unprecedented itself, let alone the "additional combat phase." I think that the flavour you were going for was if Belkar gets to kill a creature, he's inspired to kill more creatures. I don't think your Player Character ability word is meant to work with activated abilities, but...let me try fixes.

1) Bump to five mana and try "Whenever Belkar blocks becomes blocked by a nonlegendary creature, untap it. If it is the first combat phase of your turn, there is an additional combat phase after this one, followed by an additional main phase." You can just use Belkar's first name after his full name has been used once on the card (attacks each turn if able) under current templating rules, and there are reasons that you're always better off adding an additional main phase after additional combat steps. I think pretty much every card that makes additional combat phases already does this. Also, under this wording, the opponent doesn't automatically lose the game if they're at six life or less and control no nonlegendary creatures that can deal with the Belkster.

2) Change the ability to "BR, T: Belkar fights target nonlegendary creature. If that creature is destroyed this way, untap Belkar." or "BR, T: Destroy target nonlegendary creature. If that creature is Human, untap Belkar." The first ability is weaker, but the untap condition is looser in general. The latter is a reference to the fact that Humans are almost certainly one of his favoured enemies. I suppose you could say Human or Goblin but the reasons for that might be confusing to anyone who doesn't actually read the strip (HEATHENS!) I like the flavour on this option because it means Belkar can fight or kill creatures directly, and under circumstances that would untap him, he could still take part in the "main" combat. The idea of Belkar doing "extracurricular" killing amuses me.

3) Perhaps "Whenever Belkar blocks or becomes blocked by a nonlegendary creature, he gains Deathtouch until end of turn." That might still be better at five mana, or with Belkar being 2/2 Double Strike, but the implication being he'd never die to a mook in a fight, only figures of importance. This is really close to the strip since as I recall the only times Belkar was ever in serious personal danger were Miko and Malack. With Deathtouch and First or Double Strike, he could only lose actual combats to creatures with Protection from Black or Red, an ability that prevents all combat damage dealt to them, or that would reduce his power to 0 through some means.

Elan's ability would need some kind of reworking; dice are not supported outside of Unglued and Unhinged, currently. The first thing that comes to mind that includes an element of guaranteed randomness would be "Whenever Elan the Bard blocks or becomes blocked by a nonlegendary creature, draw two cards, then discard a card at random. Elan gets +x/+x until end of turn, where X is that card's converted mana cost." I set it up as "draw two, discard one" because if I go one/one, then if your hand is empty, there's nothing random about what you'll discard; it'll be the only card in your hand. With Scry and other mechanics, you could consistently know the top card of your library. Although it might be fun to build a deck around that as well, so you could go one/one if you wanted.

Durkon's pretty close to fine; I'd just change the templating on the last ability to "At the beginning of your upkeep, you may pay 2WW. If you do..." et cetera. That prevents unnecessary memory issues with the "next upkeep." I might have said that about Elan's second ability but really I thought it's cool enough to let slide.

(Please don't take my overly nitpicky criticisms as a bad thing; I'm just super particular when it comes to Magic. I've played twenty years and used to be a Magic writer. The cards are very flavourful and cool. I'm just fussy about templating/power level issues.)

[Jallorn]

1) Bump to five mana and try "Whenever Belkar blocks becomes blocked by a nonlegendary creature, untap it. If it is the first combat phase of your turn, there is an additional combat phase after this one, followed by an additional main phase." You can just use Belkar's first name after his full name has been used once on the card (attacks each turn if able) under current templating rules, and there are reasons that you're always better off adding an additional main phase after additional combat steps. I think pretty much every card that makes additional combat phases already does this. Also, under this wording, the opponent doesn't automatically lose the game if they're at six life or less and control no nonlegendary creatures that can deal with the Belkster.

I agree that infinite Combat Phases is too powerful, and there's a lot of good ideas in here, but I'm going to nitpick two points: First, you don't need an extra main phase. I've never seen a single card that gives an extra main phase (though that doesn't mean they're not out there, I don't know every card in the game) and of the cards I've seen that give an extra combat phase, none of them mention an extra main phase. The reason for this is that the extra combat phase immediately follows the first one, and precedes the second main phase.

Secondly, I'm pretty sure cards only drop titles, so you would still refer to him as Belkar Bitterleaf, not Belkar. There aren't any Magic cards that have a first and last name I can think of though, so I can't find any evidence for my theory.


Giving some thought to Roy, because he seems to be the most challenging, I think we can definitely say he is White. Possibly I could see Red, since he does identify somewhat as rebelling from his father, and he was cited in the afterlife as having some Chaotic tendancies that could have landed him in the Neutral Good afterlife. However, his Lawfulness and willingness to respect most authority figures make me want to leave it out of his Mana cost, and simply give him an activated ability with Red in it. In fact, I like that idea for Blue as well, since that is also a color one could attach to him, but not one that really defines him.

I have a number of idea for what abilities he might have, but there's just no way they're all going to fit on him. One idea is to play up his meatshield-ness, giving him a big butt and the ability to force creatures to block him/block multiple creatures.

I think I'd do something along the lines of: R:Target creature must block Roy Greenhilt this turn if able. 1U:Roy Greenhilt may block one additional creature this turn.

Toss in Vigilance, and I think you've got a solid wall/distractor who's just begging for nice equipment. Heck, go ahead and make his sword a legendary artifact equipment while you're at it and have it give him an extra bonus it doesn't give other creatures.

Let's see.... hrmmm, I'm not really sure what to do as far as power/toughness/cost though. I think he should probably be able to toe to toe with belkar. How about: 3/6 with a mana cost of 3WW? I dunno.

[Rabbit]

My only criticism with Tarkie is that Red is generally chaos and impulse, and while Tarquin has been known to act rashly, it is rare and has always been in the name of a higher purpose; I would consider him to be almost the textbook definition of a Black/White character, with his obsession of order through tyranny; remember White isn't necessarily 'good', just lawful. I think he should cost more mana, as well; his drawbacks are negligible and still even beneficial in certain circumstances. Compare with Hill Giant, who is a 3/3 for the same mana cost (albeit without needing both black and red) and has no abilities whatsoever. Perhaps bump Tarquin up cost by one or two, and give him the Persist (return him to play with a -1/-1 counter if he is destroyed, but the ability cannot trigger if there is a -1/-1 counter on him) ability? I know it's old, but it really, really fits with his character.

I don't think we know enough about Laurin to determine where she falls between Black and White, but I would almost definitely think, as a psion, she'd be partly Blue. Maybe consider giving her the Flash ability (allowing you to play her from your hand at instant speed, and then theoretically immediately using her ability for her to act as an almost removal spell) to represent her ability to rapidly wormhole places. I would suggest possibly even working in a way to allow her to return your hand, but that might be too complicated or too much. Maybe lower her toughness, too; she's high level, but I can't imagine she should be virtually as durable as Tarquin. For purely flavour reasons, since psions operate off of power points, I might call her counters "power counters" instead of "energy counters", but that's not as important.

Malack seems pretty okay. I agree with some earlier posters that he's a little on the strong side; I think that could be fixed simply by lowering his power to two or even one since he already has Deathtouch anyway.





Here's a go:

Captain Julio Scoundrel
Legendary Creature - Human Pirate
3RR
2/2
Double strike, Flash
Split second
Exalted (Whenever a creature you control attacks, it gets +1/+1 so long as it is the only creature attacking)
If Julio Scoundrel was played outside of your Main Phase, it is indestructible until end of turn.
1R: Return Captain Julio Scoundrel to your hand or shuffle it into your library. You may not activate this ability if Julio Scoundrel is enchanted or has any -1/-1 counters on it.
"It doesn't matter if you win or lose... as long as you look cool doing it!"





I'm iffy on this one, because while I feel the abilities capture the good Captain well, 3RR is expensive for a Flash card; the odds of actually having that much mana just sitting around seem low. At least with my playstyle.

I gave Julio a low power and toughness because at the end of the day, he is not particularly strong. It his quick wit and cunning that wins him the day (not to mention knowing when the story is on his side and being ready to leave on a dime if it is not), not any particular measure of physical strength or endurance. He himself admits his Dexterity and Strength scores are average at best (which, as an NPC, is arguably even below average compared with a PC) and he didn't even make Top Twenty swordsmen, never mind Top Ten.

I gave Julio the Double Strike ability because it represents his ability to strike quickly and easily vanquish inconsequential foes without bringing harm to himself, as a pirate should, but also to allow him the ability to deal damage to stronger opponents, such as opposing Legendary Creatures - even if it might cost him dearly, as anything with stats exceeding his own will take him with it. I also thought it was the most efficient way of incorporating his Dashing Swordsmen class; think of the extra strike as the benefit of his puns.

What Julio's card focuses on, however, is his ability to arrive whenever it is dramatically appropriate, and ensure he has his say before the plot resumes. Flash allows him to show up whenever and on a moment's notice; Split Second ensures nothing will interrupt his glorious arrival. His first special ability means that if he does show up as drama demands (eg, as opposed to being played normally and predictably), he will be able to survive virtually anything as he pulls off whatever crazy hijinks he need to that turn, whether it be striking an unsuspecting foe or single-handedly fending off a sea monster. His last ability represents his knowledge that sometimes, a hero simply isn't needed, and if he overstays his welcome or his part becomes stale, defeat will surely follow shortly thereafter. A truly dashing hero knows how to make a dramatic entrance - and also knows how to make a quick exit. I put the restraints on it to limit its potential, as well as eliminate one of the more common reasons people use these abilities - to remove malevolent Enchantments; if he Julio departs, it will be strictly because drama demands it.

Although Julio's themes center around speed and getting in the first punch (especially with Double Strike and Flash), I intentionally chose not to give him the Haste special ability both because it might warrant raising his mana cost further and I didn't want that, but mostly because I didn't want to give him anything that might encourage players to use him outside of as a surprise twist; Julio never simply walked into the Empire of Blood, after all. He came crashing in and ruined Tarquin's plans at the perfect moment.

[Jallorn]

Alright, now I'm going to take a crack at the Greenhilt Sword.

Greenhilt Sword
Legendary Artifact
3W
Equip 3W
Equipped creature gets +3/+1
If Equipped creature is named Roy Greenhilt or Horace Greenhilt, it gets First Strike


I dunno, kinda boring, but I can't think of much else.

[marq]

EXPLOSIVE RUNES
Enchantment
U

If any player picks up Explosive Runes, sacrifice it to deal 3 damage to that player.

"I prepared explosive runes this morning."

---------------

Pet peeve of mine: instead of asking you what a card does, your opponent picks that card up to read it.

[FlawedParadigm]

I agree that infinite Combat Phases is too powerful, and there's a lot of good ideas in here, but I'm going to nitpick two points: First, you don't need an extra main phase. I've never seen a single card that gives an extra main phase (though that doesn't mean they're not out there, I don't know every card in the game) and of the cards I've seen that give an extra combat phase, none of them mention an extra main phase. The reason for this is that the extra combat phase immediately follows the first one, and precedes the second main phase.

http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Search/Default.aspx?name=+[additional]+[main]+[phase]||text=+[additional]+[main]+[phase]

That's about half of all the cards that grant additional combat phases.


Secondly, I'm pretty sure cards only drop titles, so you would still refer to him as Belkar Bitterleaf, not Belkar. There aren't any Magic cards that have a first and last name I can think of though, so I can't find any evidence for my theory.

Hm. I specifically recall around when they implemented the change that it was specifically "only a Legend's first name needs to be repeated once the full name is used once on the card" because it was done so that Legends could have wordier abilities. I don't remember when that change was implemented. I want to say Kamigawa Block, but I can't recall. I'm almost certain it was a Mark Rosewater article, but frankly I don't care enough to dig it up.


Giving some thought to Roy, because he seems to be the most challenging, I think we can definitely say he is White. Possibly I could see Red, since he does identify somewhat as rebelling from his father, and he was cited in the afterlife as having some Chaotic tendancies that could have landed him in the Neutral Good afterlife. However, his Lawfulness and willingness to respect most authority figures make me want to leave it out of his Mana cost, and simply give him an activated ability with Red in it. In fact, I like that idea for Blue as well, since that is also a color one could attach to him, but not one that really defines him.

I could argue for a White/Green Roy, although due in part to the fact that other than Belkar, he's the only one I could argue Green at all for. He's not nature oriented, but he is oriented around leadership, the pack, personal growth, with a bit of aggressive, simple solutions (battering into submission) that is also part of Green. Belkar's slowly getting Green, but I could just as easily argue Red for him, or even all three. V is Blue/Red, although trying to reign in the overly emotional and rash Red parts. Haley would likely be mono-Red.


I have a number of idea for what abilities he might have, but there's just no way they're all going to fit on him. One idea is to play up his meatshield-ness, giving him a big butt and the ability to force creatures to block him/block multiple creatures.

I think I'd do something along the lines of: R:Target creature must block Roy Greenhilt this turn if able. 1U:Roy Greenhilt may block one additional creature this turn.

Blocking multiple creatures is almost exclusively White. "Must block" could be Green or Red. (See: "Provoke" mechanic in particular.)


Toss in Vigilance, and I think you've got a solid wall/distractor who's just begging for nice equipment. Heck, go ahead and make his sword a legendary artifact equipment while you're at it and have it give him an extra bonus it doesn't give other creatures.

Let's see.... hrmmm, I'm not really sure what to do as far as power/toughness/cost though. I think he should probably be able to toe to toe with belkar. How about: 3/6 with a mana cost of 3WW? I dunno.

Hrm.

Roy Greenhilt 2WG
Legendary Creature - Human Warrior
Vigilance
For each creature Roy Greenhilt is blocking, he gets +0/+1 until end of turn.
G: Untap target nonlegendary creature an opponent controls. That creature blocks Roy this turn if able.
1W: Roy may block an additional creature this turn.
4/4

This isn't too far off the power level of Loxodon Hierarch or similar cards, but enough to be worth the Legendary. The idea being he can taunt creatures into focusing on him, and still have energy to guard his team. Furthermore, when the pressure's on and he really has to defend something, he only gets harder to handle.

Speaking of...
The Greenhilt Blade 2
Legendary Artefact - Equipment
Equipped creature gets +2/+1 and has "whenever this creature blocks or is blocked by a Vampire, Skeleton, Spirit, or Zombie, destroy that creature at the end of combat."
If the equipped creature is named Roy Greenhilt, it gains First Strike and an additional +1/+1.
Equip: 3

I had fun with this; that should cover all the undead types in Magic (although, strictly speaking, not all spirits are undead in Magic, but I digress) and the total bonuses on Roy are...+5. So for nine mana altogether, he ends up 6/5 First Strike, Vigilance, and if any undead actually survive combat with him, they're destroyed at the end of it anyhow. I almost also made it auto-equip to Roy when he enters the battlefield, but I think I was running out of text space anyhow and it's already pretty darned good. I costed/balanced it so that you could likely play and equip it to Roy the turn after playing Roy himself.

[Jallorn]

http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Search/Default.aspx?name=+[additional]+[main]+[phase]||text=+[additional]+[main]+[phase]

That's about half of all the cards that grant additional combat phases.



Hm. I specifically recall around when they implemented the change that it was specifically "only a Legend's first name needs to be repeated once the full name is used once on the card" because it was done so that Legends could have wordier abilities. I don't remember when that change was implemented. I want to say Kamigawa Block, but I can't recall. I'm almost certain it was a Mark Rosewater article, but frankly I don't care enough to dig it up.



I could argue for a White/Green Roy, although due in part to the fact that other than Belkar, he's the only one I could argue Green at all for. He's not nature oriented, but he is oriented around leadership, the pack, personal growth, with a bit of aggressive, simple solutions (battering into submission) that is also part of Green. Belkar's slowly getting Green, but I could just as easily argue Red for him, or even all three. V is Blue/Red, although trying to reign in the overly emotional and rash Red parts. Haley would likely be mono-Red.



Blocking multiple creatures is almost exclusively White. "Must block" could be Green or Red. (See: "Provoke" mechanic in particular.)



Hrm.

Roy Greenhilt 2WG
Legendary Creature - Human Warrior
Vigilance
For each creature Roy Greenhilt is blocking, he gets +0/+1 until end of turn.
G: Untap target nonlegendary creature an opponent controls. That creature blocks Roy this turn if able.
1W: Roy may block an additional creature this turn.
4/4

This isn't too far off the power level of Loxodon Hierarch or similar cards, but enough to be worth the Legendary. The idea being he can taunt creatures into focusing on him, and still have energy to guard his team. Furthermore, when the pressure's on and he really has to defend something, he only gets harder to handle.

Speaking of...
The Greenhilt Blade 2
Legendary Artefact - Equipment
Equipped creature gets +2/+1 and has "whenever this creature blocks or is blocked by a Vampire, Skeleton, Spirit, or Zombie, destroy that creature at the end of combat."
If the equipped creature is named Roy Greenhilt, it gains First Strike and an additional +1/+1.
Equip: 3

I had fun with this; that should cover all the undead types in Magic (although, strictly speaking, not all spirits are undead in Magic, but I digress) and the total bonuses on Roy are...+5. So for ten mana altogether, he ends up 6/5 First Strike, Vigilance, and if any undead actually survive combat with him, they're destroyed at the end of it anyhow. I almost also made it auto-equip to Roy when he enters the battlefield, but I think I was running out of text space anyhow and it's already pretty darned good. I costed/balanced it so that you could likely play and equip it to Roy the turn after playing Roy himself.

Consider, though, cards like Aurelia. The cards you linked are all sorcery speed activatable only during a Main Phase, wheras Belkar's ability is activatable only during combat, like Aurelia's.

As for Roy, I think his intelligence is important enough to who he is as a character that he should have a Blue ability. I would say that the qualities you list for Roy being Green don't really feel sufficient to justify him being Green. "The pack," can be grouped under, "community," which is very much White, and it isn't unheard of for White to batter things into submission (though more often through overwhelming numbers than brute force, but still.) Personal growth isn't necessarily something that I would consider something Roy strives for any more than anyone else in the comic, and leadership, again, falls under White quite satisfactorily. I really don't see Roy as a Green character.

Also, I think that having a White ability cost Blue works in the sense that that is what Roy does: he is a Fighter with a lot of Int, and he uses that Int to plan his fights, but ultimately he doesn't have any sort of feat that allows him to turn his knowledge into power, he just does it, if that makes sense. The gist of what I'm trying to say here is that he uses his Int to be a better Fighter, so using Blue to do something White makes thematic sense to me.

Oh, also, you forgot to include Horace on the sword. If he ends up as a card, he's going to want to get a bonus from his sword too, after all.

[Math_Mage]

...yeah, all that is the least accurate thing I've ever read, for several reasons. If you're basing your knowledge of Magic's colors on that, I'd suggest reading someone else for a while.
Yep, you're absolutely right, the head designer knows nothing about the game.

[Storm_Of_Snow]

I'd have said Tarquin would have been better as black and white (maybe BBW), and maybe Laurin would work better with the planeswalker-type abilities, starting with a very high loyalty/counters, but having no ability that adds any, so she has a finite amount of power.

As for the rest: I'd personally put Roy as green and white, and Elan as green and red (emotional and instictive). I'd put Haley as blue and black though (self over the group, although not so much recently, plus the freeze ability is blue, and I'd probably give her reach and some ability to steal artifacts from the opponent (but not artifact creatures), either from play or maybe even the deck.

Celia would be mono-blue, with flying, 0 power (she doesn't attack anyone), the taunt ability (must block), and an ignores damage ability (maybe "gains protection from colour of your choice until end of turn").

V, especially before the Darth V arc, would probably be a simple rename of Jaya Ballard from Time Spiral block. ("Of course you should fight it with fire. You should fight everything with fire.")


EXPLOSIVE RUNES
Enchantment
U

If any player picks up Explosive Runes, sacrifice it to deal 3 damage to that player.

"I prepared explosive runes this morning."

---------------

Pet peeve of mine: instead of asking you what a card does, your opponent picks that card up to read it.
It would have to be an "Un-" set card, but to be honest, I could see that actually appearing in the future. They have done cards like Letter Bomb, Volrath's Motion Sensor and so on.

[FlawedParadigm]

As for Roy, I think his intelligence is important enough to who he is as a character that he should have a Blue ability. I would say that the qualities you list for Roy being Green don't really feel sufficient to justify him being Green. "The pack," can be grouped under, "community," which is very much White, and it isn't unheard of for White to batter things into submission (though more often through overwhelming numbers than brute force, but still.) Personal growth isn't necessarily something that I would consider something Roy strives for any more than anyone else in the comic, and leadership, again, falls under White quite satisfactorily. I really don't see Roy as a Green character.

Uh, Roy's personality is almost exactly in line with Kamahl once he went mono-Green. If Roy is almost exactly like a mono-Green character, I'm sure he could manage to be White/Green. "Pack" and "community" are not interchangeable; there's a vast difference in scale. Green cares about small, tightly-knit packs (like the Order) whereas White functions more on a city/society level. Roy cares about both. Roy's especially smart, but being that he has absolutely no magical ability at all, he would be a hard sell for Blue. Every colour has smart characters, even Red and Green. Furthermore, Roy's been about personal growth since OtOotPCs. It was specifically that and honour that Eugene used to convince Roy to care about Xykon in the first place.


Also, I think that having a White ability cost Blue works in the sense that that is what Roy does: he is a Fighter with a lot of Int, and he uses that Int to plan his fights, but ultimately he doesn't have any sort of feat that allows him to turn his knowledge into power, he just does it, if that makes sense. The gist of what I'm trying to say here is that he uses his Int to be a better Fighter, so using Blue to do something White makes thematic sense to me.

To me that sounds more like "a basketball is a ball so it's perfectly fine to use in place of a golf ball." Again, every colour has smart characters. Just being smart does not make you Blue.


Oh, also, you forgot to include Horace on the sword. If he ends up as a card, he's going to want to get a bonus from his sword too, after all.

No, I didn't "forget." I simply don't see Horace as a card. He's dead. Not undead. Not alive. He's in the afterlife and doesn't interfere with the living at all. He has never been seen outside of the afterlife in the main comic. If one were designing an entire OotS card game including the past, present, and future, he might fit that, but I don't see the point in adding a simply dead character to a different game. "Corpse" is not a creature type in Magic. If you make a version of The Greenhilt Blade, you can have it apply to Horace or Julia or Eric if you like. I chose not to do so.

[factotum]

V, especially before the Darth V arc, would probably be a simple rename of Jaya Ballard from Time Spiral block. ("Of course you should fight it with fire. You should fight everything with fire.")


Although the flavour text quoted comes from "Sizzle", not the actual Jaya Ballard card...just in case anyone is confused there. :smallwink:

[Storm_Of_Snow]

Uh, Roy's personality is almost exactly in line with Kamahl once he went mono-Green. If Roy is almost exactly like a mono-Green character, I'm sure he could manage to be White/Green. "Pack" and "community" are not interchangeable; there's a vast difference in scale. Green cares about small, tightly-knit packs (like the Order) whereas White functions more on a city/society level. Roy cares about both. Roy's especially smart, but being that he has absolutely no magical ability at all, he would be a hard sell for Blue. Every colour has smart characters, even Red and Green. Furthermore, Roy's been about personal growth since OtOotPCs. It was specifically that and honour that Eugene used to convince Roy to care about Xykon in the first place.

I'd agree - Eugene's certainly blue (possibly edging to black by being self-centred, but I don't think he quite makes it into full selfishness), Julia's likely blue/red, Horace might be white and Sara could be red/white.


Although the flavour text quoted comes from "Sizzle", not the actual Jaya Ballard card...just in case anyone is confused there. :smallwink:
Well, she doesn't have any flavour text on her own card, mainly because it's full of her rules as a proto-planeswalker - her other abilities are Red Elemental Blast (counters/destroys blue spells, which would cover V against Samantha whilst everyone else set up the Tetherball special), and Inferno, which gives the other Jaya quote:

"Some have said there is no subtlety to destruction. You know what? They're dead." - which kind of links with V's observations about social situation and detonations.

And to correct myself having done it originally from memory without checking, the Sizzle quote is actually "Of course you should fight fire with fire. You should fight everything with fire."

[FlawedParadigm]

I'm not sure Julia qualifies for "Red" so much as "teenager." If I absolutely had to make a card for her right now, it would be Blue or Blue/Green (she does care for her family even if she doesn't always get along with them, and she seems to be rather popular, although I don't know if she necessarily looks after all her friends, but I suspect she's popular for more than just her looks and she's probably not entirely opposite of Roy.)

Sara's definitely White. So far as I can tell, her only Red/impulsive act was marrying Eugene. Otherwise she was the one always trying to establish order and keep Eugene focused on family and make sure the kids were taken care of. She was the nurturer. She's like Julia though where I'd still want a little more information before I decided if/what other colours she might be.

[Zordrath]

I'd have said Tarquin would have been better as black and white (maybe BBW), and maybe Laurin would work better with the planeswalker-type abilities, starting with a very high loyalty/counters, but having no ability that adds any, so she has a finite amount of power.
I posted a B/W version of Tarquin along with the Order, I agree he feels much better that way :smallsmile: I also just thought about letting him give your creatures lifelink, which is white/black and fits him directing his team towards the accumulation of resources rather than in direct battle (he hasn't actually been very effective as a battle general yet). It also gives him synergy with himself.

I love Julio as a massive surprise twist who always comes crashing in to the rescue out of nowhere, that's a really cool design for him. I think if you trimmed him a bit you could get him down to 4 mana, maybe by removing Exalted or the indestructible clause. Exalted especially may fit his training of Elan and his love for the dramatic, but it's not essential to what this card does. Indestructible plays more into the card's role, but he already has a failsafe with the ability to return to your hand.

The Greenhilt blade has to be nasty against those Undead, I think that's a cool effect for it :smallbiggrin:

Updated Order:

http://j71.img-up.net/BelkarBittf6d5.jpghttp://d88.img-up.net/ElantheBar822c.jpghttp://f45.img-up.net/DurkonThuncdbb.jpg

I completely missed the fact that Belkar could grant infinite combat phases, the intent was always to create just one more like other such cards. However, I liked the Deathtouch idea even more, that's such a nasty combo with Double Strike and fits his comic portrayal really well - unstoppable against lesser threats, but not much good so far against larger villains.

Elan draws one card and discards one at random - it's true that with no cards in your hand this means the discard in your hand is no longer random, but the card you draw in the first place still is. And I think it would be really out of place for someone as clueless as Elan to actually generate card advantage, i.e. more knowledge. Sometimes he'll stumble upon something useful with Bardic Lore, but just as often he'll discard just what you need.

Durkon wasn't changed, he's just here for completion's sake with the rest of the Order:

http://g80.img-up.net/Vaarsuviuse379.jpghttp://a31.img-up.net/RoyGreenhi648f.jpghttp://z42.img-up.net/HaleyStars629e.jpg

Vaarsuvius has to be Red and Blue, I think. He's all about acquiring magical knowledge and power, which screams blue, but his primary means of applying that is blasting things to bits. He can rest to restock his spellbook and then cast them either for mana, or for free when in combat. That last part is not quite how it works in DnD of course, but it makes for a good mechanic here I think.

Roy is your tribal leader for legendary creatures, he buffs them in combat and can prevent all damage. Since he's the one always on guard, he also has vigilance. I'm not 100% happy with him though. For one, this is clearly post-character development Roy, in the beginning he wasn't quite such a selfless leader. He's also quite similiar to Durkon, but then again they are the most alike among our heroes.

Haley is a sneaky thief and archer, she can go in, steal an artifact with Haste, then get out of danger with a jump and a volley of arrows before anyone can deal damage to her. If you don't block her, she'll just leave you with four damage to the face. First Strike is mainly because she's an archer and haste is simply to facilitate constant jumps to your hand and back to the battlefield. Though I may cut the first strike since she already has a way of keeping herself safe, what do you guys think?

[Lummox JR]

Belkar- doublestrike? Definitely Black Red, probably Green as well but I hate tricolor since it feels like a cop-out.

I couldn't disagree more about Belkar being black; he has no characteristics that scream of it other than evil, which is by no means exclusive to black. Ambition is not in his nature and he's neither undead nor fond of them. If anything his brand of chaotic evil is really way more red. Belkar's definitely red-green.

Building on your ideas and some others in this thread, here's my take on the Order:

Roy Greenhilt
2WW
Legendary Creature - Human Warrior
2/2
First strike, vigilance
Roy can block any number of creatures, and can act as multiple blockers. He gains +0/+2 this turn for each additional creature he blocks.
When Roy attacks or blocks, you may assign combat damage to Roy instead of any other creatures in combat you control.

Haley Starshine
3UG
Legendary Creature - Human Rogue
2/1
First strike, flash, haste, reach
When Haley deals combat damage, she may instead gain control of an artifact the opposing player controls. If it is equipment, she may equip it for no cost immediately.
"Sneak attack!"

(I went with blue-green because archery is way more of a green thing, and artifact theft is very blue.)

Elan the Bard
1RW
Legendary Creature - Human Bard
0/1
When Elan takes damage, flip a coin. If heads, that damage is dealt to the source (or source's controller, if source cannot take damage) instead.
When Elan attacks, flip a coin. If heads, creatures you control get +1/+1 until end of turn. If tails, Elan deals 1 damage to target creature you control.
"I'm helping!"

Belkar Bitterleaf
2GR
Legendary Creature - Halfling Ranger
1/1
Double-strike, haste
Cats you control have double-strike and haste.
Belkar may mount one mono-colored green creature at any time. Belkar's mount has +2/+0 and is under his control. Damage done to Belkar is dealt to his mount instead.
"I am a sexy shoeless god of war!"

Durkon Thundershield
1WWW
Legendary Creature - Dwarf Cleric
1/4
W: Prevent 1 point of damage to target creature.
1: Target black creature gains -1/-1 until end of turn.
1W, tap: All creatures you control gain protection from black until end of turn.

Vaarsuvius
3UR
Legendary Creature - Elf Wizard
3/2
Flying
3R, tap: Deal 5 damage, split among any number of target creatures.
2U: Counter target instant or sorcery spell and copy it. You may choose new targets for the copy.
"I prepared explosive runes this morning."

And these would be any artifacts I can think of:

Greenhilt Blade
4
Artifact
Equipped creature gains +1/+0 and does double damage to black.
Equip 2 (equip only as a sorcery)

Ring of Jumping
1
Artifact
Equipped creature gains Reach.
Equip 0 (equip only as a sorcery)

Lead Sheet
3
Artifact
1: Prevent a player from looking at your hand or deck.

And just for a fun stab at some villains:

Lord Xykon
2BBB
Legendary Creature - Lich
4/1
Lord Xykon may be cast from your graveyard.
B, sacrifice creatures: Return a creature or artifact with converted mana cost X from your graveyard to the battlefield, where X is the total converted mana cost of the sacrifice.

Redcloak
2RR
Legendary Creature - Goblin Wizard
2/1
Other goblins you control gain +0/+1 and protection from goblins.
2U: Copy another goblin's ability that was just activated or triggered. You may choose new targets for the copy.
1, tap: Untap target goblin.

I couldn't think of much for the Monster in the Dark, since we don't know his abilities yet other than befriending Xykon's prisoners.

[Rakoa]

I'd probably boost up Xykon a bit. Something like you have with being cast from the Graveyard, maybe a bit more toughness (he's only died once in the entire comic, he seems pretty durable to me) and an ability that allows Red instants to be cast using Black mana instead of Red.

[marq]

Yep, you're absolutely right, the head designer knows nothing about the game.

Nope, not even taking the bait here. Nice try, though.

[Rakoa]

Nope, not even taking the bait here. Nice try, though.

It isn't bait. It's a good point, albeit a sarcastic one. If your only defense is to not respond, well, it isn't a very good one. :smallwink:

[marq]

It isn't bait. It's a good point, albeit a sarcastic one. If your only defense is to not respond, well, it isn't a very good one. :smallwink:

Is there any reason to get drawn into an argument that starts off sarcastically?

[Rakoa]

Is there any reason to get drawn into an argument that starts off sarcastically?

I do see your point, but these forums are a very, very sarcastic place, my friend. Once you get past that, it's a lovely place!

[FlawedParadigm]

@Zordrath: I think Roy could do without First Strike, actually. He's already completely loaded for four mana with everything else, and he's got a giant honking greatsword. He's probably up against Durkon as the slowest member of the order. Plus, he's a tactical planner; Belkar rushes in heedless and Haley has range, but Roy generally thinks things through. It doesn't suit him, in my book (which is why I put it on the Blade instead; it's both a lighter weapon than he started with and after his first dose of character development.)

My only question on Haley is; do you want the ability to always do four damage, or damage equal to her power? The latter gives incentive to equip or enchant her, and if you're planning on making the Icy Burst Bow...

Xykon, hm. That's a tough pickle. Phylactery Lich is actually a pretty damned good representation of him (not surprisingly), as is Dralnu, Lich Lord. Hrrm. What to do, what to do...

Xykon, Grim Necromancer 3BB
Legendary Creature - Skeleton Wizard
Sacrifice a creature: Until end of turn, Black, Blue, and Red instants and sorceries in your graveyard gain Flashback costs equal to their casting costs.
Sacrifice a creature: Xykon, Grim Necromancer gains Indestructible until end of turn.
"Sacrificing minions: is there any problem it can't solve?"
4/3

Redcloak, Dark High Priest 1RWB
Legendary Creature - Goblin Cleric
Goblin spells cost you 1 less to cast.
Other Goblins you control get +1/+1.
Whenever another Goblin you control dies, destroy target nonland permanent an opponent controls.
T: Return a card named Xykon, Grim Necromancer from your graveyard to the battlefield.
3/5

[Gorthaur]

I love all the responses in this topic. I absolutely love different interpretations- I argue Belkar is black due to self interest and general murderhobo tendencies, but Green is also good since he avoids rational thought at all possible. Maybe I'm projecting because I dislike Green, but there you go. >_>

I don't think I could do a better Roy, to be honest. I'd maybe give him the ability to tap a creature with an activated ability for W, to represent the MurderWizard feat he took in the afterlife, but that's pretty sweet. Magic does have to tend to have a problem with good melee creature abilities that fit a warrior or paladin type, and you sidestepped it neatly. (I like Vigilance, kind of fits that a fighter can do what he wants all day without worrying about tapping).

Xykon... Xykon is a toughie and I honestly could see him working as a Planeswalker since he's got so many damned variable abilities. God I hate mages. Let me see though... Ignore formatting because I don't know the templating :(

Xykon the Sorcerer
3BBBB
4/7
Legendary Zombie Spellshaper
Indestructible
2BBB: Xykon the Sorcerer returns to the battlefield. Play this ability only during your upkeep phase and only if Xykon the Sorcerer is in the Graveyard.
3B, T, Discard a card from your hand: Until end of turn, all creatures in your graveyard have Unearth. The cost for Unearth is their casting cost.

He has a sort of Yawgmoth's Will for creatures, since Animate Dead is kind of his signature spell- the others just make him more capable of murder. He's tough to kill (7 toughness is a lot, and he can return and is indestructible), but not impossible to deal with. And he can return himself or others from the dead.

Redcloak... not touching that with a ten foot pole. I will say he strikes me as Blue Black, but Goblins are traditionally red (Right-Eye is definitely red), but he plans stuff out too effectively. I don't know.

[FlawedParadigm]

I actually wanted to do Redcloak as WUB, but then giving him Goblin-specific abilities would have been generally terrible for anything but flavour. However, I felt he needed to have Goblin-specific abilities, so I swapped the U for R even though R is a bit out of character, it works a lot better for Goblins.

[Lummox JR]

I love all the responses in this topic. I absolutely love different interpretations- I argue Belkar is black due to self interest and general murderhobo tendencies, but Green is also good since he avoids rational thought at all possible. Maybe I'm projecting because I dislike Green, but there you go. >_>

The murderhobo thing is definitely red. As for the self-interest, you have a point but I think it's iffy compared to his green tendencies--and on the color wheel, self-interest is blue-adjacent, so it's totally discordant with his other attributes which otherwise line up nicely (instinct, impulse, chaos). As far as defining characteristics, I'd have to put Belkar's impulsive murdering first, his rapport with animals second, and his selfishness third. The ranger stuff just doesn't have an opportunity to come out much in dungeons. So I'd say he's red-green at least, and also black if you really, really want to stretch for a tricolor alignment. Maybe more interesting would be making him 1RR G/B with a hybrid cost; I could see that, but frankly I don't think Belkar comes across as a team player for a red-black deck.

I threw the ability to mount an animal, especially one an opponent controls, into my concept for his card because he's demonstrated that so beautifully in the comic. Also it fits with his tendency to hide behind others in battle; he's weak but has a good way to stay covered.

[factotum]

I'd probably boost up Xykon a bit. Something like you have with being cast from the Graveyard, maybe a bit more toughness (he's only died once in the entire comic, he seems pretty durable to me)

Given that he definitely has the ability to regenerate once killed, surely Regeneration would be a perfect fit? Still means he gets taken out by Wrath of God, Damnation, or quite a bit of other board removal, but making him indestructible would be taking it a bit too far.

[Mike Havran]

I really like this thread. My suggestions are here, some are very close to those alread suggested

Roy Greenhilt
Roy Greenhilt
2WG
Legendary Creature - Human Warrior
4/4
Vigilance

When an opponent casts an instant or sorcery spell during his turn, Roy Greenhilt gets +1/+0 and First Strike until the end of the turn.

XWW T - If another creature you control would die this turn from combat damage, prevent that damage. Deal X damage to an attacking creature your opponent controls.

Oh, I'm sorry ... is NOW a good time for battering things into submission?

Haley Starshine
Haley Starshine
2RR
Legendary Creature - Human Rogue
3/2
First Strike, Flash

R Deal 1 point of damage to a target tapped creature

When Haley Starshine deals damage to an opponent, you may gain control of an equipment that opponent controls.

Sneak Attack, bitch!

Elan the Bard
Elan the Bard
1WR
Legendary Creature - Human Bard
1/2

T All players reveal a card from their hand at random. Card(s) with the highest non-zero converted mana cost among them is/are discarded.

W T Untap another creature you control.

1R T All creatures you control get +1/+1 until the end of turn

I'm on an adventure!!

Durkon Thundershield
Durkon Thundershield
2WW
Legendary Creature - Dwarf Cleric
2/5

1W T target creature gains protection from a color of your choice until the end of the turn.

WWW T Put a nonblack creature from your graveyard on the battlefield tapped.

Think of all this as a game... a game of Tag. And Durkon is Base.
Roy Greenhilt

Vaarsuvius
Vaarsuvius
2UR
Legendary Creature - Elf Wizard
1/2

R If you casted an instant or sorcery spell this turn, Vaarsuvius deals 1 damage to target creature or plainswalker.

U T Vaarsuvius gains hexproof until the end of the turn.

XUR T You may cast an instant or sorcery spell from your graveyard with converted mana cost X as if it had flashback.

Oh yeah. Wizard.
Haley Starshine

Belkar Bitterleaf
Belkar Bitterleaf
2GRR
Legendary Creature - Halfling Ranger
2/2

Double Strike, Haste, Unleash

When Belkar Bitterleaf enters the battlefield, put a 2/2 White Cat token on the battlefield under your control.

When a Human leaves the battlefield, put a +1/+1 counter on Belkar Bitterleaf.

GG T remove a +1/+1 counter from Belkar Bitterleaf. Gain control of target Green creature until the end of the turn. Untap that creature. It gains Haste until the end of the turn.

Flee! Flee before me, worms!!

[ChristianSt]

http://g80.img-up.net/Vaarsuviuse379.jpg

I think this card might be way too good. It basically draws two cards each turn (and some of the best of your deck, too!). And with some possibilities it is just crazy good (especially Ancestral Visions - CMC 0: Draw three cards. The suspend-drawback doesn't matter.), and you can just tutor for counterspells, too - so your opponent should be pretty much on the losing side after you untap with it. [The first time I would grab 2 counters, after that just counter + random card draw, until I just win somehow - unless I need an answer first for something, than I search for that first.]
On top of it, if you can block with it and use the tap-ability you can cast a spell without your opponent knowing what it is (since you can just tutor in response of the trigger) - same applies for attacks if you can untap it (which you can tutor for beforehand if you want! - but since it has only 1 power that isn't really a problem).


I also think that the OP's Tarquin is too strong. It basically draws an additional card a turn and pumps your team for 1.5 life per turn - before the trigger resolves I can just rearrange the top three cards of my library (and put them back in the order A, B, C), then saying A for Tarquin (triggering the pump), drawing B and next turn I reveal C with Tarquin - needing to pay life only each other turn.
I think to fix it some of the following should happen:

Limit the ability to sorcery speed (so at least you are somewhat screwed if your opponent kills Tarquin).
Only rearranging two cards (if that seems too weak, I would change that to Scry 2).
Adding other costs to that ability.
Not drawing the revealed card (but maybe only reveal it if your guess is correct - seems a better flavor fit imo too, since we don't know what tricks Tarquin has exactly prepared)

[Zordrath]

@Zordrath: I think Roy could do without First Strike, actually. He's already completely loaded for four mana with everything else, and he's got a giant honking greatsword. He's probably up against Durkon as the slowest member of the order. Plus, he's a tactical planner; Belkar rushes in heedless and Haley has range, but Roy generally thinks things through. It doesn't suit him, in my book (which is why I put it on the Blade instead; it's both a lighter weapon than he started with and after his first dose of character development.)
True, he could probably do without First Strike. And good idea for Haley! With her frequent bouncing I doubt you'll enchant her all that much, but she should definitely benefit from Elan's bard song and Roy's leadership.


I think this card might be way too good. It basically draws two cards each turn (and some of the best of your deck, too!). And with some possibilities it is just crazy good (especially Ancestral Visions - CMC 0: Draw three cards. The suspend-drawback doesn't matter.), and you can just tutor for counterspells, too - so your opponent should be pretty much on the losing side after you untap with it. [The first time I would grab 2 counters, after that just counter + random card draw, until I just win somehow - unless I need an answer first for something, than I search for that first.]
On top of it, if you can block with it and use the tap-ability you can cast a spell without your opponent knowing what it is (since you can just tutor in response of the trigger) - same applies for attacks if you can untap it (which you can tutor for beforehand if you want! - but since it has only 1 power that isn't really a problem).
Hm, I hadn't considered the way you could stack the tap and block ability, that certainly is a bit extreme. Maybe it would be better if you had to choose whether to tap him during your upkeep? Or maybe you can only cast the second ability while V is untapped, which would fit the concept of him resting and then blasting when that's done.

Tarquin has changed a bit since the OP, though he's still powerful:


http://u23.img-up.net/Tarquin283f8.jpg

Allowing him to only rearrange two cards at a time is probably the easiest solution, that way you have to pay life every turn if you want the effect to continue.

I agree with Gorthaur that Epic-level casters are our best bet for integrating Planeswalkers. Obviously there's no such things in DnD, but epic casters come closest. Thus, my take on Team Evil:

http://j81.img-up.net/Redcloakad84.jpghttp://e21.img-up.net/Xykon15b6.jpghttp://t54.img-up.net/TheMonsterc047.jpg

Redcloak has to be red in the context of Magic in my opinion, because almost all Goblins are. He simply couldn't lead a deck of them if he weren't red. As a card, he only starts to rise above an ordinary Goblin by seeing others of his kind die, and gets more and more determined as this happens.

Xykon is just Xykon :smallamused: His first ability is his favorite gun against mages, Energy Drain. His second expresses both his penchant for sacrificing minions and his sorcerous powers of casting the same spell over and over. The third combines destruction and necromancy into a disgusting package. He has no traditional ultimate ability, but using his middle ability and then his third ability twice certainly counts.

The MITD is simply weird. It has tremendous powers, but you have to unlock them by influencing it with other creatures. Red, like the demon roaches, triggers earthquakes and destroys lands. Black causes it to eat creatures. White allows it to protect creatures or itself, and blue allows it so send other creatures away from danger. Green is a bit iffy, but we know it IS physically strong, so I picked an effect that fit the color.

[dtilque]

Kurald Galain did Elan a while back. ETA: Actually, he did more, but the page on crystalshard does not seem to be there any more.


http://i230.photobucket.com/albums/ee259/Kurald_Galain/ElantheBard.jpg

[FlawedParadigm]

Oh sweet mother of sorrow _please_ tell me you intended for the "white" ability of MitD to only last until end of turn. :p

[The Grim Author]

Is there any reason to get drawn into an argument that starts off sarcastically?

No, but there's good reason to elaborate on your reasons when others have to resort to sarcasm to get you to respond. It says that the people might not be taking your argument (which, from what I can tell, amounts to "I'm right, and anyone who disagrees with me is wrong") seriously.

Also, note that my perception is only based on what I've seen in this thread. You might have excellent reasons for believing what you do, but if you don't elaborate on them, they may as well be tautological to any observer.

[Storm_Of_Snow]

I'm not sure Julia qualifies for "Red" so much as "teenager." If I absolutely had to make a card for her right now, it would be Blue or Blue/Green (she does care for her family even if she doesn't always get along with them, and she seems to be rather popular, although I don't know if she necessarily looks after all her friends, but I suspect she's popular for more than just her looks and she's probably not entirely opposite of Roy.)

Sara's definitely White. So far as I can tell, her only Red/impulsive act was marrying Eugene. Otherwise she was the one always trying to establish order and keep Eugene focused on family and make sure the kids were taken care of. She was the nurturer. She's like Julia though where I'd still want a little more information before I decided if/what other colours she might be.
Julia - bratty, emotive... sounds red to me. And red and green are allied colours. Plus some characters in magic have migrated colours as they've evolved through different stories/blocks (Glissa was green in Mirrodin, and black in New Phyrexia), so there's nothing to say she couldn't potentially shift to white-blue later in her life, if the story ever goes that far along.

Which is why I suggested straight red for V before Darth V - post arc, V may well be blue/red.

As for Sara, remember that when she met Eugene, she was in a bar, drunk, and looking for anyone to jump into bed with (I don't have Origin and Start to hand at this exact moment, but "Yeah, you'll do" is the relevant quote, I believe). As for keeping order, remember Boros is the police/army in Ravnica and they're red/white.


I couldn't disagree more about Belkar being black; he has no characteristics that scream of it other than evil, which is by no means exclusive to black. Ambition is not in his nature and he's neither undead nor fond of them. If anything his brand of chaotic evil is really way more red. Belkar's definitely red-green.

Selfishness? Disregard for others (eg, how he treated Jenny even after his fever-dream epiphany)? That's black in a nutshell - after all, only one person can rule.



Building on your ideas and some others in this thread, here's my take on the Order:

...
Vaarsuvius
3UR
Legendary Creature - Elf Wizard
3/2
Flying
3R, tap: Deal 5 damage, split among any number of target creatures.
2U: Counter target instant or sorcery spell and copy it. You may choose new targets for the copy.
"I prepared explosive runes this morning."

Counter and copy's probably too powerful - a straight counter (with a tap) would be better IMO.



And these would be any artifacts I can think of:

Greenhilt Blade
4
Artifact
Equipped creature gains +1/+0 and does double damage to black.
Equip 2 (equip only as a sorcery)

I'd say deathtouch to black rather than double damage (and probably only if it's come back from the graveyard to represent it being reforged with starmetal).

Maybe something like (but less wordy):
Reforged: If Greenhilt Blade was returned to play from your graveyard, place a Starmetal token on it.
As long as a Starmetal token is on it and it is equipped, Greenhilt Blade gains deathtouch when used against black creatures.

And it should be a Legendary artifact.



Ring of Jumping
1
Artifact
Equipped creature gains Reach.
Equip 0 (equip only as a sorcery)

I'd change it to flying until the end of turn rather than reach (reach really represents bows and the like, rather than someone jumping into combat, which is what Belkar does).

And some characters I've not seen done yet:

O-Chul
3WW
Legendary Creature - Human Paladin
2/4
2W, Tap: O-Chul inflicts damage equal to his power to target black creature. (Smite Evil)
1W: Prevent all combat damage inflicted to O-Chul this turn.
"I go nonetheless."

Lien
2W
Legendary Creature - Human Paladin
2/2
2W, Tap: Lien inflicts damage equal to her power to target black creature.
"Homestyle hobgoblin fillets coming up."

Razor
2UW
Legendary Creature - Celestial Shark
2/2
Islandwalk
Mount: When Razor enters play, attach to a single target legendary creature you control. Both creatures attack and block as one creature, adding their power and toughness, but are considered separate targets otherwise.
Razor and character attached to may not attack if target opponent does not control an island.
2U/W: Exile Razor. Play this ability only as a sorcery.
2U/W: Return Razor to play from Exile. Razor and attached creature may not attack this turn. Play this ability only as a sorcery.

[Khay]

O-Chul
3WW
Legendary Creature - Human Paladin
2/4
2W, Tap: O-Chul inflicts damage equal to his power to target black creature. (Smite Evil)
1W: Prevent all combat damage inflicted to O-Chul this turn.
"I go nonetheless."

Lien
2W
Legendary Creature - Human Paladin
2/2
2W, Tap: Lien inflicts damage equal to her power to target black creature.
"Homestyle hobgoblin fillets coming up."

Razor
2UW
Legendary Creature - Celestial Shark
2/2
Islandwalk
Mount: When Razor enters play, attach to a single target legendary creature you control. Both creatures attack and block as one creature, adding their power and toughness, but are considered separate targets otherwise.
Razor and character attached to may not attack if target opponent does not control an island.
2U/W: Exile Razor. Play this ability only as a sorcery.
2U/W: Return Razor to play from Exile. Razor and attached creature may not attack this turn. Play this ability only as a sorcery.

Those are awesome! I'd replace O-Chul's second ability with some straight-up regeneration or toughness-boosting, though; he doesn't evade damage, he just tanks it. And maybe give Lien First Strike because of the spear thing.

Speaking of Azure City...

Lord Shojo
1WR
Legendary Creature - Human Advisor
0/1

2W, T: Put two Coercion counters on target creature. You gain control of it for as long as it has a Coercion counter on it. It gains "At the beginning of your end step, remove a Coercion counter from this permanent."
2R, T: Tap target creature you control and target creature you don't control. The creature you control deals damage equal to its power to the other; then, if the other creature is still on the battlefield, it deals damage equal to its power to the creature you control.

"The last thing I want is to be like Shojo, twisting legal authority into coercion." - Roy Greenhilt

Shojo was interesting because his behaviour isn't so easy to peg down in colours. There's no way he's just White. Deception and manipulation is normally Black or Blue, I think, but those colour combinations would imply Lawfulness. I ended up going for Red mostly because that's a clearly Chaotic colour. He's absolutely not a combatant, but his manipulations can deal a lot of damage as long as he's not caught off-guard.

[FlawedParadigm]

Well, like I already said, I'm not sure Julia counts as "Red" so much as "teenager." By your definition, every teenager would be Red. Even Xykon was emotive as a teenager. I just don't see the qualities in Julia you're calling Red as lasting long into adulthood.

I also already said Sara was only impulsive as concerns Eugene. It would be nice if someone's going to debate something with me if they'd actually read the things I type. Repeating oneself in a text format where someone can read and re-read all they need to seems a bit daft.

Also, I'm confused as to why you're applying "Smite Evil" strictly to Black creatures when there's evil in all colours. Heck, Black's outright had protagonists a few times. Yes, the highest percentage of evil creatures are in Black, almost assuredly. Still, that feels a bit off. It makes me wish "undead" were a supertype, so it could be "target Demon, Devil, or Undead." Sure, there's evil outside those types too but they're pretty much guaranteed to be evil.

Lastly, I'd think O-Chul would manage at least a six toughness. I pictured him as having a kind of Veteran Bodyguard/Opal, Konda's Yojimbo ability, but you're free to your interpretation. I just feel four toughness is too low.

[Storm_Of_Snow]

Well, like I already said, I'm not sure Julia counts as "Red" so much as "teenager." By your definition, every teenager would be Red. Even Xykon was emotive as a teenager. I just don't see the qualities in Julia you're calling Red as lasting long into adulthood.

Not every teenager - young Eugene's easily blue, for example. Roy's green-white, Pompey's probably blue-black, maybe mono-black, and teen-Xykon's black.

As for why I think she's at least partly-red:
Taking the opportunity to insult Roy when Nale's forcing her to Send to him ("This is all your fault. I'm telling Dad. Loser."), then letting Sabine and Pompey blindside him in revenge for the lecture he just gave her during the rescue, rather than having one last attempt to get him to realise they're there.

Playing off her looks and phsyical assets to try and get people to do what she wants.

And of course: "I'm True Neutral, I go both ways." Whilst red's probably the closest colour to D&D chaotic, and blue and green probably the closest to neutral on either axis, I feel she's more emotional and doing things because they appeal to her than dispassionate and doing things because it's intuitive/logical to do so (and yes, the Vulcan's are blue, there's some very old Mark Rosewater articles on the MTG website where he goes over the individual colours and places various characters from other universes in them).

In MTG, mage does not automatically equal blue - Jaya's mono-red for example. In fact, about the only colour that doesn't have mages is green, and that's because they turn into druids and shamans.

And that last takes us into a very important part of Julia's life - why did she choose to study magic? Did she have a genuine desire to do it and studys hard (blue), or is she just being daddy's girl and doing it because she's expected to do so and scrapes through her course because she's mostly partying and talking about boys and clothes (red). Plus her parents fawned over her in the wake of Eric's death, which could well put her into spoiled brat territory, which I'd put as on the borders of black and red.



I also already said Sara was only impulsive as concerns Eugene. It would be nice if someone's going to debate something with me if they'd actually read the things I type. Repeating oneself in a text format where someone can read and re-read all they need to seems a bit daft.

I guess it depends on whether you think Sara just went out that one night, got drunk and impulsively took Eugene home, or did the same thing on many, many nights, with many different partners. Personally, given the comment of "Yeah, you'll do.", I go with the latter interpretation.

Very seriously with the latter interpretation.

I'd also point out the Oracle's comments concerning Sara and what she was doing after she'd died, plus her self image.

Basically, she was a good-time, live for the moment, kind of person, with enough self-control that she could settle down with Eugene and put up with him, rather than just kick him out of her bed the following morning, although she'd not always be able to keep her emotions in check - if that's not red-white, then I really don't know what is.



Also, I'm confused as to why you're applying "Smite Evil" strictly to Black creatures when there's evil in all colours. Heck, Black's outright had protagonists a few times. Yes, the highest percentage of evil creatures are in Black, almost assuredly. Still, that feels a bit off. It makes me wish "undead" were a supertype, so it could be "target Demon, Devil, or Undead." Sure, there's evil outside those types too but they're pretty much guaranteed to be evil.

Mainly because of undead - I agree that if there were an undead supertype, it would have been easier.

Plus while I agree utterly that black isn't necessarily evil by default, and that there is the potential for good and evil in all colours, black is the colour most likely to be evil - plus the paladins are white, black's white's enemy, and most existing "paladin" types in MTG have some anti-black in them.

As for O-Chul at 6 toughness, that's putting him into dragon and wurm territory - I don't think he's that tough (and as a 5-drop with double white already, at 6 toughness he'd be nearly impossible to get into play, you'd have to be looking at something like 8 with triple white).

Even 4's at angel levels, which is hitting the point where you'd deal with him with a destroy or bounce effect, rather than letting him affect combats.

Khay, I did think of regenerate, but that's more green and black than white, while prevent is white (and blue). Plus, IMO, regenerate is more getting knocked down, then getting back up good as new, and to me, O-Chul doesn't get knocked down, he endures, he just takes your best shot and stands there, no matter how much it actually hurt him and what new scar he'll carry tomorrow.

[xroads]

Here is my stab at this..

Name: Redcloak
Type: Legendary Goblin Priest
Cost: 3 Black, XX Any

Description:

Redcloak enters the battlefield with X devil tokens (2/1 & haste).
For the Dark One (1 Black) - Sacrifice a goblin, all black permanents you control gain a +1/+1 til the end of the turn.
Dark Legacy (1 Black) - If Redcloak dies, Redcloak becomes an artifact. This artifact remains in play and for 1 Black, can be assigned to any goblin permanent you control. Artifact grants wielder +1/+1 and For the Dark One cost and ability.


Damage/Health: 2/2

[orrion]

Vampire Durkon!

Durkon the Unbound
BBW2
Legendary Creature - Vampire Cleric
3/2

Creatures blocking or blocked by Durkon the Unbound receive a permanent -1/-1 counter. Durkon the Unbound receives a permanent +0/+1 counter for each creature blocking or being blocked.
{b}: Put a -1/-1 counter on target creature without flying. Durkon the Unbound receives +0/+1 for each counter until end of turn.
{b}{w}, Remove two +0/+1 counters from Durkon the Unbound: Prevent 1 damage to target creature.

"GIVE ME MY STAFF."

[Mike Havran]

Here are some suggestions for villains

Xykon
Xykon
2BBB
Legendary Creature - Lich Sorcerer
4/5

BB, Sacrifice another creature you control. Choose one: Deal damage equal to the sacrificed creature's power to target creature or player, or gain life equal to sacrificed creature's toughness, or untap one land and draw a card.

BBB Put Xykon from your graveyard on top of your library.

Sacrificing minions - is there any problem it CAN'T solve?

Redcloak
Redcloak
2RB
Legendary Creature - Goblin Cleric
3/4

Goblin creatures you control have Haste.

1R Put two 1/1 Red Goblin tokens on the battlefield.

1B Exile a target creature card from a graveyard. Put a 2/2 Black zombie creature token on the battlefield under your control.

Order every hobgoblin, zombie, ghoul or whatever else we have to charge that breach in the wall, and not to stop until they can feel the ocean spray on their faces. We're going to win this war NOW.

Tarquin
Tarquin
1WBB
Legendary Creature - Human Warlord
2/5

Protection from Blue

1W Attacking creatures you control get +1/+0 and have vigilance.

BBB T Choose two colors. Until your next turn, your opponent loses 1 life for every spell of the chosen color he casts. Activate this ability only as a sorcery.

Their every move makes my victory more complete

Malack
Malack
2BBB
Legendary Creature - Vampire Cleric
4/6

Wither, protection from Red and White

Put any creature killed by Malack on the battlefield under your control with one -1/-1 counter on it. In addition to its color and type, it's also a Black Vampire.

BBB T Target Vampire gets Protection from Red and White.

Laurin Shattersmith
Laurin Shattersmith
XUB
Legendary Creature - Human Psion
1/3

Laurin Shattersmith enters the battlefield with X power counters on her.

U, remove X power counters from Laurin Shattersmith. Tap X target creatures. They don't untap during your opponent's next upkeep.

U T, remove X power counters from Laurin Shattersmith. Counter target spell unless its caster pays X.

B, sacrifice another creature. Put X power counters on Laurin Shattersmith, where X is the sacrificed creature's converted mana cost.

Miron Shewdenker
Miron Shewdenker
2WB
Legendary Creature - Human Sorcerer
1/3

Pay 2 life: Put Miron Shewdenker from the battlefield to your hand

WB T Exile target creature. Whenever Miron Shewdenker leaves the battlefield, all creatures exiled by him return on the battlefield under their owner's control.

XWB T Put a creature exiled by Miron Shedenker with converted mana cost X on the battlefield under your control.

I wrote you that ransom letter 'cause I figured if he was willing to pay to hold him, you might be willing to pay more to free him.

[orrion]

Malack/Durkon's staff.

Vampiric Staff
4X
Legendary Artifact

Shroud

Vampiric Staff enters play with X Charge counters.

2, Remove a Charge counter from Vampiric Staff: Target creature gains protection from the color of your choice until end of turn.

Tap, X: Put X Charge counters on Vampiric Staff. Vampiric Staff does not untap during your next untap phase.

Remove all Charge counters on Vampiric Staff: Target creature put into the graveyard from play this turn returns to play under your control.

[xroads]

Name: Snarl
Type: Monster
Cost: 4 Red, 4 Any

Description:

Hexproof

When attacking an opponent with Snarl, Snarl will randomly attack either the opponent or one of the opponent's creatures.

If killed or exiled, Snarl instead becomes a land that grants 1 Any Color when tapped.

Quote: "You're playing with something even the gods feared!" ~Azure Paladin

Damage/Health: 20/20

[Lummox JR]

Selfishness? Disregard for others (eg, how he treated Jenny even after his fever-dream epiphany)? That's black in a nutshell - after all, only one person can rule.

But Belkar's disregard is out of apathy, and his selfishness has way more to do with wanting to kill without thinking things through. Belkar's never shown any real interest in ruling; he wants to deliver death. If he has any black attributes, they come in the form of amorality above all others.

My point is though, he's absolutely more green than black, and more red than both. I could see a case being made for allowing green/black hybrid as a cost, but like I said, he's not really the type I'd expect to see playing in a red-black deck alongside all the usual counterparts there. Way less Radkos, way more Gruul. He's more in keeping with Theros' satyrs or Innistrad's werewolves than he is with Innistrad's vampires, for instance. I don't see Belkar's personality fitting in in a deck without green mana, but I do see him fitting in one without black.


Counter and copy's probably too powerful - a straight counter (with a tap) would be better IMO.

A straight counter isn't as much in V's nature though; to me (s)he's more of the kind to strategize an enemy's spell against them. I made the cost 2U, which makes it less cheap to activate than similar instants, but an added tap would probably be enough to make it even more expensive. I'd also be happy with 1UR+tap.

[Jaxzan Proditor]

When attacking an opponent with Snarl, Snarl will randomly attack either the opponent or one of the opponent's creatures.

What exactly do you mean by this line? It is not possible to actually attack an opponent's creature, rather it is their choice to block your attacking creature. Are trying to say that The Snarl would have an ability similar to Provoke (http://wiki.mtgsalvation.com/article/Provoke)? And how does this work in a game with more than one opponent?

[The Extinguisher]

Why can't Bear be RBG? Three colours is perfectly valid.

Also, a lot of these abilities are probably unnessicarily complicated or way to powerful. Often both.
This seems fun though. Ill probably make some when I get home tonight.

[xroads]

What exactly do you mean by this line? It is not possible to actually attack an opponent's creature, rather it is their choice to block your attacking creature. Are trying to say that The Snarl would have an ability similar to Provoke (http://wiki.mtgsalvation.com/article/Provoke)? And how does this work in a game with more than one opponent?

I only play Magic occasionally, so I'm not as familiar with all of the abilities. I do know certain Green sorcery cards will allow you target an opponents creature. And I seem to vaguely recall their being a Red goblin creature ("Test Pilot?"), that randomly attacked creatures.

In anycase, yes, I was giving the Snarl the ability to attack creatures as well as players. I figured that represented the Snarl's chaotic and uncontrollable nature failry well. Since card rules can overrule the main rules, I figured it wouldn't be a problem granting the Snarl this ability. :smallsmile:

[Jaxzan Proditor]

Creatures can target other creatures, but not specifically attack them. Test Pilot deals damage to creatures, which is not the same thing as actually attacking them. I would make it be more like "Tap: The snarl deals 8 to a random creature or player" but even that isn't perfect.

[orrion]

Why can't Bear be RBG? Three colours is perfectly valid.

Also, a lot of these abilities are probably unnessicarily complicated or way to powerful. Often both.
This seems fun though. Ill probably make some when I get home tonight.

Eh, they're legendary cards, mostly. Those tend to be powerful. That said I usually to balance any cards I make up somehow.

[Kish]

I have a question.

Why are multiple people giving Malack protection from red and white? He conspicuously was not protected from Durkon's positive energy attacks (an ability that removes protection from black would be more understandable). Unless the idea is that the sun is red and white.

[Zordrath]

That was my original idea, it's supposed to represent his protection from the sun. It's a bit iffy, but it was the best representation of his sun protection I could come up with that also translates into meaningul Magic Card power.


Oh sweet mother of sorrow _please_ tell me you intended for the "white" ability of MitD to only last until end of turn. :p
Do you want to see Mr. Stiffly die after just one turn of safe protection, you monster? :smalltongue: The main problem here was actually the amount of text, the card is probably unprintable as it is :smallredface:

[marq]

No, but there's good reason to elaborate on your reasons when others have to resort to sarcasm to get you to respond. It says that the people might not be taking your argument (which, from what I can tell, amounts to "I'm right, and anyone who disagrees with me is wrong") seriously.

I think that was the first response to what I had posted, so it seems like a leap to go to "have to resort to sarcasm." You should probably first try asking politely. ;)


Also, note that my perception is only based on what I've seen in this thread. You might have excellent reasons for believing what you do, but if you don't elaborate on them, they may as well be tautological to any observer.

I mean, I'm happy to do so. Gorthaur and I have done so in PMs for a couple days. MathMage and I solved our diferences in PMs as well. It just doesn't seem like a good idea to engage sarcasm before a conversation...if you're interested though, I can go into it.

[CombatOwl]

Black is capitalism? Huh? :smallconfused:

Sure, it involves reviving zombie corporations and making monstrosities too-big-to-die.

[Math_Mage]

*shrug* I don't think sarcasm is some extremely insulting form of discourse to be 'resorted to' in the first place, and certainly wasn't expecting that to become a topic of discussion.


That was my original idea, it's supposed to represent his protection from the sun. It's a bit iffy, but it was the best representation of his sun protection I could come up with that also translates into meaningul Magic Card power.
But his protection from the sun isn't meaningful in terms of Magic card power. A more accurate translation of the ability might be, "Malack is immune to spells that target Vampires."

[Agnostik]

I'd say Tarquin is maybe a bit strong? As I recall, the guys at WotC try to ensure that a character who's depicted as a single human doesn't go much higher than 2/2--3/5 is more the ballpark of angels, giants, treefolk, and other such non-human creatures. The only single human 3/5 I can find is Ith, High Arcanist.
Jor Kadeen, the Prevailer disagrees with your analysis.

The idea is fun though. I quickly whipped up a Crystal.

http://i.imgur.com/X6NLN2C.jpg

(edited)

[Math_Mage]

Jor Kadeen, the Prevailer disagrees with your analysis.

The idea is fun though. I quickly whipped up a Crystal.

Nitpick: "If you lose" should probably be "If it's tails."

[Agnostik]

Nitpick: "If you lose" should probably be "If it's tails."Nope. It should be "lose the flip" though. They use a win/lose wording these days, check Creepy Doll (http://magiccards.info/isd/en/220.html) for instance.

[orrion]

Nitpick: "If you lose" should probably be "If it's tails."

Further nitpick:

I hate all these coin flip abilities.

[Agnostik]

Further nitpick:

I hate all these coin flip abilities.
Yeah, but it's still probably the most obvious way to show unpredictability and/or stupidity on a card. *shrugs*

EDIT: should probably change first strike to deathtouch. Makes a lot more sense, and adds some "black" to the card that is otherwise purely red, ability-wise.

[FlawedParadigm]

As for O-Chul at 6 toughness, that's putting him into dragon and wurm territory - I don't think he's that tough (and as a 5-drop with double white already, at 6 toughness he'd be nearly impossible to get into play, you'd have to be looking at something like 8 with triple white).

O-Chul has taken a Meteor Swarm (on top of other damage!) to the face and kept moving. Consider that Roy, who's probably higher level albeit lower con, still blacked out a moment when he was first hit by Swarm, meaning he only barely survived that himself. Also, they've done 10 toughness at 4 mana before. 6 toughness would not make him eight mana. http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=indomitable%20ancients Mind you, that shared a format with http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=244674

The closest thing Magic has to Meteor Swarm is either Shivan Meteor or Comet Storm. I'm fairly sure he's about as tough as a wurm or dragon. Or if you're uncomfortable with high toughness, a damage prevention or redirecting ability of some kind might be in order. It's your card, do whatever.

As for me...

O-Chul, the Survivor 3WW
Legendary Creature - Human Samurai
Bushido 2
WW, T: Redirect to O-Chul, the Survivor all damage that would be dealt to you this turn.
2WW, Discard a card: O-Chul gets +0/+X until end of turn, where X is your life total.
"Because then was not the time for action. Now, is."
2/6

[Math_Mage]

As for O-Chul at 6 toughness, that's putting him into dragon and wurm territory - I don't think he's that tough (and as a 5-drop with double white already, at 6 toughness he'd be nearly impossible to get into play, you'd have to be looking at something like 8 with triple white).
O-Chul's CON is 25, per W&XP commentary. That's equivalent to (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/dragonTrue.htm) a wyrm black dragon, an ancient blue dragon, or an old red dragon. So, yes, he is actually that tough.

[Storm_Of_Snow]

But Belkar's disregard is out of apathy, and his selfishness has way more to do with wanting to kill without thinking things through. Belkar's never shown any real interest in ruling; he wants to deliver death. If he has any black attributes, they come in the form of amorality above all others.
I'm thinking more of the additional materials here - but his disregard/ apathy is essentially a lack of empathy, as is his selfishness.

Empathy as a trait is massively in green (understanding and being in balance with the environment). And a lack of empathy is generally what classifies serial killers (which Belkar is pretty much a borderline case of being), so there's no chance of green IMO.

His chaotic and hedonistic aspects (not thinking things through, no real desire for power, doing things - as described in Goldenleaf - for "lulz", plus the hookers and to an extent, the gourmet cooking) would push him towards red, but I feel he's still very solidly in black.

Maybe now, with Mr Scruffy and Bloodfeast, he's starting to become more empathic and less black, but I don't think he'll make it all the way to green before the end of the year. And I guess we could always have a red-black pre-vision quest Belkar and a red-green post-vision one.



My point is though, he's absolutely more green than black, and more red than both. I could see a case being made for allowing green/black hybrid as a cost, but like I said, he's not really the type I'd expect to see playing in a red-black deck alongside all the usual counterparts there. Way less Radkos, way more Gruul. He's more in keeping with Theros' satyrs or Innistrad's werewolves than he is with Innistrad's vampires, for instance. I don't see Belkar's personality fitting in in a deck without green mana, but I do see him fitting in one without black.

The Ravnica guilds, whilst useful to reference, aren't the only way to play those colour pairs - Rakdos to me is more red with a black splash.



A straight counter isn't as much in V's nature though; to me (s)he's more of the kind to strategize an enemy's spell against them. I made the cost 2U, which makes it less cheap to activate than similar instants, but an added tap would probably be enough to make it even more expensive. I'd also be happy with 1UR+tap.
I'm thinking straight counter because the D&D rules are a straight counter - if the player wants to get trickier (multiple Resiliant Spheres to disable alt-V in 4th Dimension for example), then they should work for it, rather than have the answer handed to them on a plate.


O-Chul's CON is 25, per W&XP commentary. That's equivalent to (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/dragonTrue.htm) a wyrm black dragon, an ancient blue dragon, or an old red dragon. So, yes, he is actually that tough.
But O-Chul's also still only human, and not covered in dragon's scales as armour (and some of the toughness value represents armour/tough hide).

Plus, he might have taken Meteor Swarms to the face without flinching, but he also got cherry tapped to unconciousness by a ray of frost (ok, and being dropped into acid, impaled on spikes, bitten by a shark twice and falling about 20 feet out of the shark tank). And there's some dragons down at 4 anyway.

Anyway, a couple more cards for the list:

Sapphire Throne Of Azure City
6
Legendary Artifact
55WW, Tap: Return to play all creatures with the type Human Paladin from your graveyard. Each creature returned to play becomes the type Spirit Paladin, and has the rule "If this creature is removed from play, remove it from the game.".
If Sapphire Throne Of Azure City leaves play, remove it and all creatures returned to play with Sapphire Throne Of Azure City from the game.
"The throne, the platform, even the entire castle were built around that single sapphire."

Sapphire Guard
1W
Creature - Human Paladin
2/1
3W, Tap: Sapphire Guard inflicts damage equal to their power to target black creature.

[Math_Mage]

But O-Chul's also still only human, and not covered in dragon's scales as armour (and some of the toughness value represents armour/tough hide).
Fair point, dragons have DR O-Chul doesn't have. But I think "only human" is frankly a silly characterization, based on premises for character creation in M:tG that don't and shouldn't apply to OotS other media in general.

[Toon Fighter]

A few of my ideas:

Xykon the lich - 4RBB

Legendary creature - Lich Sorcerer

Deathtouch, flying

2R,tap, sac another creature: Xykon deals 3 damage to target creature or player
1B, exile target creature card from a graveyard: Put a 2/2 black zombie token on the battlefield tapped

5/7
__________________

Saphire Guard Paladin - 1WW

Creature - Human Paladin

When this enters the battlefield, put a 2/3 White Horse creature token on the battlefield. If this creature. would be destroyed, you may sacrifice the token to regenerate this creature.

3/2
______________

Saphire Guard Martyr - WW

Creature - Human Paladin

When this creature dies, put a 2/2 white spirit with flying on the battlefield

2/2
_______________

Lien, Paladin of the Oceans - 2WU

Legendary Creature - Human Paladin

First Strike
When Lien enters the battlefield, put a 3/3 Legendary Shark creature token with Islandwalk called Razor on the battlefield. If Lien would be destroyed, you may sacrifice Razor to have her regenerated. If Lien leaves the battlefield, exile Razor.

3/2
_________________

Hinjo, Chief of the Sapphire Guard - 2WW

Legendary Creature - Human Paladin

Vigilance
Other Paladin creatures you control have +1/+1 and vigilance.
2W, tap: Put a 2/2 paladin creature token on the battlefield

3/2
_________________

O-chul, Paladin of the Saphire Guard - 3WW

Legendary Creature - Human Paladin
Vigilance
WW, tap: prevent all damage that would be dealt to O-chul this turn
3/6
________________

Hinjo with Argent - 1WWW

Legendary Creature - Human Paladin

First Strike
When Hinko enters the battlefield, put a 2/4 Legendary Wolf creature token with First Strike called Argent on the battlefield. If Hinjo would be destroyed, you may sacrifice Argent to have him regenerated. If Hinjo leaves the battlefield, exile Argent.

2/3

[xroads]

Creatures can target other creatures, but not specifically attack them. Test Pilot deals damage to creatures, which is not the same thing as actually attacking them. I would make it be more like "Tap: The snarl deals 8 to a random creature or player" but even that isn't perfect.

Fair enough. And I realized that there is no game mechanic for intercepting or blocking attacks against targeted creatures. So the ability I gave Snarl would give it an unfair advantage.

I guess I'll have to think of some other way of representing the chaotic and uncontrollable nature of the Snarl.

Maybe something similiar to the Test Pilot. Only instead: "During its 'controller's' attack phase, Snarl does an automatic 8 pts of damage to a random creature or player."

[illyahr]

I would remove Malack's Deathtouch and instead give him Wither so he deals damage to creatures in the form of -1/-1 counters. This plays to his Energy Drain ability.

[Prospekt]

Had a bit of an idea with Durkon. Also, it's been several months since I've played MtG, so forgive me if my wording is off or terrible.


Durkon Thundershield - 3WW
Legendary Creature - Dwarf Cleric
2/5
Vigilance, Lifelink
XW: Remove X amount of -1/-1 counters from target creature.
X1W, tap: X black creatures your opponent controls cannot attack or block until end of turn.
1BB: Regenerate and Transform Durkon Thundershield.

/

Durkon?
Legendary Creature - Vampire Cleric
4/5
Wither
XB: X target black creatures you control gain +1/+1 until the end of turn.
2B: Durkon? gains Hexproof until the end of turn.

Whenever Durkon? would be sent to the graveyard, exile him instead.

[ooOoo]

Kurald Galain did Elan a while back. ETA: Actually, he did more, but the page on crystalshard does not seem to be there any more.

Those are great!
http://i230.photobucket.com/albums/ee259/Kurald_Galain/RoyGreenhilt.jpg

http://i230.photobucket.com/albums/ee259/Kurald_Galain/HaleyStarshine.jpg

http://i230.photobucket.com/albums/ee259/Kurald_Galain/DurkonThundershield.jpg

http://i230.photobucket.com/albums/ee259/Kurald_Galain/BelkarBitterleaf.jpg

[FlawedParadigm]

Malack, the Malefactor 2BB
Legendary Creature - Vampire Cleric
Wither
Whenever a creature dealt damage by Malack, the Malefactor dies this turn, put a 2/2 black Thrall creature token with Wither onto the battlefield.
Tap an untapped Thrall you control: Regenerate Malack.
"Then there can only ever be conflict between us now." - Malack, to Durkon Thundershield
2/5

Tsukiko, Necrotic Theurge 1BB
Legendary Creature - Human Cleric Wizard
B, T: Exile target creature card in a graveyard. Put a 2/2 black Wight creature token with Wither onto the battlefield.
1B, T: Put two Spell counters on Tsukiko, Necrotic Theurge.
1B, remove a counter from Tsukiko: Put a +1/+1 counter on target Wight, or a -1/-1 counter on target nonblack creature.
"I would love to help you, except that I have no interest in helping you."
1/3

[Ben Kenobi]

As for Roy, I think his intelligence is important enough to who he is as a character that he should have a Blue ability. I would say that the qualities you list for Roy being Green don't really feel sufficient to justify him being Green. "The pack," can be grouped under, "community," which is very much White, and it isn't unheard of for White to batter things into submission (though more often through overwhelming numbers than brute force, but still.) Personal growth isn't necessarily something that I would consider something Roy strives for any more than anyone else in the comic, and leadership, again, falls under White quite satisfactorily. I really don't see Roy as a Green character.


Roy is white, because he's very Lawful and tries to be. Remember what the Deva said - "chaotic means to effect Lawful ends". Roy isn't chaotic because of emotion or passion - Roy is chaotic because he seeks natural ends, natural means of control.

Roy tears up the contract. Why? Because he desires natural affection. He desires that the group operate out of mutual desires and shared goals. This is all white - but tearing up the contract is green.

Why did Roy go to fighter school? His father is pure blue. He desires knowledge - and understanding at the cost to his family. What does Roy desire? "Our family's icon is the GREEN hilt sword. The idea that the family has a tradition and that there is a natural progression from father, and son, and that there is a connection between the grandfather and grandson through the sword and tradition as a fighter? That's extremely Green.

Look at the difference between Roy and Miko. Miko doesn't have a good understanding of human desires and goals. Roy wants to stop for food and rest and lodging. Miko, again, is pure white. Roy is Green White.

Makes perfect sense to me.

[Ben Kenobi]

Durkon - White. I don't think there's much debate about it. The man left his home, the man submitted to a white authority upon recognition of white authority based solely on his alignment and trust in Thor. Remember his reasoning for why the group was hindered, and how we ought to submit.

The man, facing death, bargained with Malack to save the live of a fellow companion that he was entrusted to his care.

Doesn't get much more white than Durkon.

[Ben Kenobi]

Elan.

White, remember what Haley says:

"Elan is a good man and I'm trying to get to the point where I can trust him".

Red, in his passion and his random character and lack of focus.

[Ben Kenobi]

Haley.

Black - she seeks money and seeks to profit and have a good life for her close family. She has issues with trusting others, and openness with others. She always has a plan even if those close to her are unaware as to what those plans are. She's willing to break the law and bend rules where she thinks they are unnecessary to her wellbeing.

Red -

Again, the Passion side of things. The desire to fight and defeat others. This is what she shares with Elan even if she has a dark side that Elan doesn't. Remember what she said about, 'not being raised this way'. Her red side comes from this core passion and willing to fight and protect those she cares about.

[HylianKnight]

I always had Tarquin pegged as UW more than BW, to be honest. Islands and Plains are plenty capable of evil.

What is Blue about Tarquin? He's not interested or motivated by his intellect or a desire/quest for knowledge. What he is is selfish, entirely concerned about securing the best position for himself in the world at ALL costs. That's the definition of Black. Definitely White too though, his defining character trait being his ironclad belief in the narrative order of the world, and his villainous breakdown is a direct result of the story not progressing in accordance with his orderly view.

[Ben Kenobi]

Suvi -

Blue. No question about it. Her mate says she 'wanted arcane knowledge more than any kind of life with him.' That's Blue - to the rejection of White and Green - the opposite of Roy. Very, very strong blue. Belief in self-improvement. Belief in the logical and understanding trapping of the universe which can be controlled with sufficient knowledge. What causes her enormous fear - failure of her magic and drives her to study to the point of breakdown. How does she correct herself after her breakdown? She vows better tactics, she sees her failure as very, very, red and rash. That's a very blue response. "I lacked sufficient planning", again, blue.

Black. Charges money with Miko. Conflict with Miko. Look at how she responds to, 'not consorting with Demons or the laws of the universe. See how she matches up with Hailey there? ;)

She's Dimir and quite so.

[Ben Kenobi]

Belkar Bitterleaf.

Red - Rages, went to Barbarian school. Doesn't really think things through. Likes to fight. "I am a sexy, shoeless, God of war."

Green - Ranger. Has ability to consort and talk with animals. I don't really see much black about Belkar. Killing and eating things is more a part of nature, look at what he does with every Kobold.

So I think there's that. Roy and Belkar have a very different Green understanding.

Suvi and Hailey have Black together.

Roy and Durkon and Elan are all somewhat White.

Elan, Hailey and Belkar are all somewhat Red. I think that's a good balance. Every one in the group have something in common.

[HylianKnight]

Elan.

White, remember what Haley says:

"Elan is a good man and I'm trying to get to the point where I can trust him".

Red, in his passion and his random character and lack of focus.

Being good isn't a trait of White, that would be morality and order. Durkon and Roy would be example of white characters. I'd say Elan, who seeks to be nothing but himself and what he was meant to do, is Green (maybe GR to account for his impulsiveness) .

[Ben Kenobi]

Tarquin.

Black, I can see the argument for. His motivation is clear - staying at the top of the heap.

Believes in an orderly society only for his own selfishness. Remember, black prefers order, white prefers order as a benefit to society in general. Tarquin's not in it for 'the benefit of others'. Why did he stage the games, "so that people whine less while we are crushing them underfoot and give a little happiness to their meaningless lives, while killing the uppity ones. Extremely black, and well written.

Malack.

Also black. Willing to sacrifice the lives of others to his God and to Nergal.

White - willing to overlook the Order when it would ultimately not benefit him, but would benefit the Order. Malack was a fantastic villian. It's a shame that he died, because he believed and acted in ways that Tarquin never would. Remember, Tarquin's care for the group is because his son is a part of it. What did Malack have to gain, except for having a fellow cleric and working with him? Malack's a very different sort of white - but he ultimately believes in an order involved in the universe. If there's any Orzhov, it's Malack. Also explains his blindness to Nale.

[Ben Kenobi]

Being good isn't a trait of White, that would be morality and order. Durkon and Roy would be example of white characters. I'd say Elan, who seeks to be nothing but himself and what he was meant to do, is Green (maybe GR to account for his impulsiveness) .

That's not what Elan is about. Remember what Elan says about his family? "My family is messed up, screwed up and there's nothing I can do about it." He knows that about his family and wants to improve from what he is. That's not a very 'green' notion. Becoming a better person through improving one's character, is a very white notion. Looking up to Roy because he believes Roy is a good leader and he should follow the leader and work towards the benefit of the community first? That's white again.

What's Elan's number one goal in life? Remember his 'Happy Place?' Where his father and mother were remarried to each other.

THAT's why he's white. Elan believes that the community should come first. And that's the white that Hailey has difficulty understanding. The red they share. Hailey is Black to Elan's white. It also explains why Elan looks up to Roy.

[Toon Fighter]

In my sketchbook, I had actually pegged a version of Elan as GW, but now I don't remember why I did that. I agree that he is more at home in RW. Just for reference, my old Elan:

Elan, The Bard - GW

Legendary Creature - Human Bard

W,tap: Creatures you control get +1/+1 until the end of turn

G, tap: put a 1/1 creature puppet token on the battlefield.

1/2

[Storm_Of_Snow]

A few of my ideas:

Xykon the lich - 4RBB

Legendary creature - Lich Sorcerer

Deathtouch, flying

2R,tap, sac another creature: Xykon deals 3 damage to target creature or player
1B, exile target creature card from a graveyard: Put a 2/2 black zombie token on the battlefield tapped

5/7
__________________

Saphire Guard Paladin - 1WW

Creature - Human Paladin

When this enters the battlefield, put a 2/3 White Horse creature token on the battlefield. If this creature. would be destroyed, you may sacrifice the token to regenerate this creature.

3/2
______________

Saphire Guard Martyr - WW

Creature - Human Paladin

When this creature dies, put a 2/2 white spirit with flying on the battlefield

2/2
_______________

Lien, Paladin of the Oceans - 2WU

Legendary Creature - Human Paladin

First Strike
When Lien enters the battlefield, put a 3/3 Legendary Shark creature token with Islandwalk called Razor on the battlefield. If Lien would be destroyed, you may sacrifice Razor to have her regenerated. If Lien leaves the battlefield, exile Razor.

3/2
_________________

Hinjo, Chief of the Sapphire Guard - 2WW

Legendary Creature - Human Paladin

Vigilance
Other Paladin creatures you control have +1/+1 and vigilance.
2W, tap: Put a 2/2 paladin creature token on the battlefield

3/2
_________________

O-chul, Paladin of the Saphire Guard - 3WW

Legendary Creature - Human Paladin
Vigilance
WW, tap: prevent all damage that would be dealt to O-chul this turn
3/6
________________

Hinjo with Argent - 1WWW

Legendary Creature - Human Paladin

First Strike
When Hinko enters the battlefield, put a 2/4 Legendary Wolf creature token with First Strike called Argent on the battlefield. If Hinjo would be destroyed, you may sacrifice Argent to have him regenerated. If Hinjo leaves the battlefield, exile Argent.

2/3
In virtually every case, we've seen the paladin, then their celestial mount comes in later. They can also be called and returned to the celestial plane as necessary (Hinjo sends Argent there to remove poison during the Battle of Azure City, although he somehow winds up with Thor and Odin), so, IMO, an enters play token doesn't really fit (and sacrifice to regenerate is more black than white, plus it doesn't represent the mounts at all), while a sorcery speed exile and return does.


Elan.

White, remember what Haley says:

"Elan is a good man and I'm trying to get to the point where I can trust him".

Red, in his passion and his random character and lack of focus.

Just as black is not necessarily evil, white is not necessarily good.

I agree with HylianKnight, he's at least partially green (he's probably the most empathic person in the Order, which, as I said about Belkar, is squarely in green's remit - green is also community focused, although it goes more on pack mentality than civilised order, and if you look at Roy as the alpha male of the group, then Elan may well be following him, and Hinjo when Roy was dead, as part of that almost instinctual behaviour).

If white's any alignment at all, I'd suggest it tends towards Lawful (IMO, Azorius (blue-white) and Boros (red-white) would likely be Lawful Neutral, but that's from the way they're presented, not that those colour pairs are automatically those alignments).

Haley - no, red-blue (mainly because that's where her mechanics lie), not black.

V - as I said earlier, before Darth V, V is red - V blasts things until they go away. As of the current arc, yes, V's moving more to blue, but he/she's still very red. And Mage does not automatically equal blue.

[FlawedParadigm]

(Also, as a side note, Paladin is not a supported creature type in Magic; most cards with Paladin in the name are Knights, but Wizards also, last I checked - about four years ago - wrote an article about how they only like doing "Knight" for creatures shown to be mounted. Since we haven't seen O-Chul's mount yet, I went for "Soldier" since he said he was a Fighter for twelve years before becoming a Paladin. I'm not sure if anyone else wants to adhere to Knight/Soldier for their Paladins, but if I do any more Sapphire Guard, I will.)

[xroads]

He knows that about his family and wants to improve from what he is. That's not a very 'green' notion. Becoming a better person through improving one's character, is a very white notion.


Green is all about growth. Quite literally in some cases (ex. "Rampant Growth"). So on this basis I can easily see Elan fitting into the green camp.



THAT's why he's white. Elan believes that the community should come first. And that's the white that Hailey has difficulty understanding. The red they share. Hailey is Black to Elan's white. It also explains why Elan looks up to Roy.

Maybe. But if memory serves, a prerequisite for being a bard is you have to fall on the chaotic side of the alignment axis. Chaos is very much the antithesis of white.

Personally, I believe Elan falls in the blue camp. He uses a lot of illusions and distractions, which sounds a lot like blue.

[Zordrath]

Knights in Magic are usually mounted, but they don't have to be. Two recent examples who fight on foot are Fiendslayer Paladin (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=370786) and Accorder Paladin (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=213818). Considering how much emphasis is placed on their Paladin class in the story, I think we'd be doing ourselves a disservice if we labelled characters like O-Chul as just soldiers, because Azure City is just begging for some Knight Tribal interactions.

Also noteworthy: While Paladin is not a creature type in Magic, Samurai very much is since Kamigawa block.

[Carl]

Despite having no clues as to the rules of these card games, (they're interesting but it's not like anyone near me plays or you can play it on computer so *shrug*), i've got to admit it's still fun to read, even if a few of the rules being referenced are gobbledy **** to me.

Thanks for the smile everyone i guess.

[Toon Fighter]

@ Storm of Snow: Then what would your suggestion be to represent a paladin? Just something like:

Paladin on Horse - 1WW

Creature - Human Knight

Vigilance

3/2

Or something like:

Lien, Paladin of the Oceans - 2WU

Legendary Creature - Human Knight

First Strike

WU, tap: Put a 3/3 Legendary Shark creature token with Islandwalk called Razor on the battlefield.

2/2

Hmmm... I actually like this idea better. The fact that the token is legendary means you can't have multiple Razors on the battlefield. And, being repeatable means Razor can 'die' and Lien can summon him again.

[orrion]

Despite having no clues as to the rules of these card games, (they're interesting but it's not like anyone near me plays or you can play it on computer so *shrug*), i've got to admit it's still fun to read, even if a few of the rules being referenced are gobbledy **** to me.

Thanks for the smile everyone i guess.

Actually, you can play it on the computer.

Steam/Playstation/Xbox has Duels of the Planeswalkers, which is ok except that you don't have a lot of freedom. There's no option to create your own deck, for example. Sony has MTG: Tactics. It's a different spin and you pay for packs. Interesting, but not totally like the card game. WoTC has Magic Online, which is exactly like the card game last I checked. You can buy packs, play in tournaments, etc. If Magic Online were a monthly fee, I'd have been playing it forever. Unfortunately, they chose to go with making you pay real life prices for almost everything, and that just utterly killed it for me.

There used to be a free program around that had every card, too. There was also an old program called Shandalar. That was the best computer version of Magic I'd ever seen. Unfortunately I lost my copy and it's pretty much impossible to find anymore.

[FlawedParadigm]

Knights in Magic are usually mounted, but they don't have to be. Two recent examples who fight on foot are Fiendslayer Paladin (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=370786) and Accorder Paladin (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=213818). Considering how much emphasis is placed on their Paladin class in the story, I think we'd be doing ourselves a disservice if we labelled characters like O-Chul as just soldiers, because Azure City is just begging for some Knight Tribal interactions.

Also noteworthy: While Paladin is not a creature type in Magic, Samurai very much is since Kamigawa block.

Trrrrrrrrue, although every printed non-Changeling Samurai has Bushido, but that's an easy fix. Lemme go alter my O-Chul.

Miko, Myopic Justice 3WR
Legendary Creature - Human Samurai
Bushido 3
Miko, Myopic Justice attacks each turn if able.
Whenever Miko blocks or is blocked by a creature which does not share a colour with her, she deals 2 damage to that creature's controller.
Whenever Miko blocks or is blocked by a creature which shares a colour with her, put a -1/-1 counter on her.
3/4

The idea here is that Miko is extremely powerful when facing foes which do not share her paradigm, but if she attacks someone she shouldn't, she "falls" and becomes weaker. Her Mark of Injustice, I suppose.

[Toon Fighter]

bushido means she gets +3/+3 when blocking or being blocked, right? I'd give Miko First Strike, since she always attacks first and asks questions later. Also, add a 'Must attack each turn if able', and reduce the -1/-1 counters to just one.

[xroads]

Suvi -
Blue. No question about it. Her mate says she 'wanted arcane knowledge more than any kind of life with him.' ... That's a very blue response. "I lacked sufficient planning", again, blue.


I can see that. She is definitely a fan of of the pursuit of knowledge.

But what about red? She's an evoker by specialization. Has proven to have little patience with things such as "justice" (ex. disintegrating the villian Elan once arrested because she had no time for a trial). And has commented that the she finds bigger and biggers explosions tend to solve more problems.

Albiet, she may be less red now since the big revelation about her tragic use of Familicide.

Edit: After five years, I finally graduated from Pixie in the Playground with this post! :smallbiggrin:

[Mike Havran]

I think Miko's sanity slippage can be emulated with counters. Something like

Miko Miyazaki
WW
Legendary Creature - Human Paladin
4/3

Vigilance

For every nonblack creature killed by Miko Miyazaki, put an insanity counter on her.

When Miko Miyazaki has 4 insanity counters on her, sacrifice her and two another nonland permanents.

[Carl]

Actually, you can play it on the computer.

Steam/Playstation/Xbox has Duels of the Planeswalkers, which is ok except that you don't have a lot of freedom. There's no option to create your own deck, for example. Sony has MTG: Tactics. It's a different spin and you pay for packs. Interesting, but not totally like the card game. WoTC has Magic Online, which is exactly like the card game last I checked. You can buy packs, play in tournaments, etc. If Magic Online were a monthly fee, I'd have been playing it forever. Unfortunately, they chose to go with making you pay real life prices for almost everything, and that just utterly killed it for me.

There used to be a free program around that had every card, too. There was also an old program called Shandalar. That was the best computer version of Magic I'd ever seen. Unfortunately I lost my copy and it's pretty much impossible to find anymore.

Cheer's, i might have to take a look see then :). I just assumed since i'd never heard anything of note about such a game it didn't exist.

[FlawedParadigm]

Not entiiiiiiirely true on Duels of the Planeswalkers. You can't necessarily make your own decks, but the PC (Steam) version _can_ be modded. I design decks for modders to make. I keep them at about the same power level as DotP decks, but they generally have stronger themes and have more synergy.

[FlawedParadigm]

bushido means she gets +3/+3 when blocking or being blocked, right? I'd give Miko First Strike, since she always attacks first and asks questions later. Also, add a 'Must attack each turn if able', and reduce the -1/-1 counters to just one.

Yes, Bushido is +x/+x during creature-to-creature combat. I was considering First Strike but she starts as a 6/7 for 5 in creature combat, which is already well above the curve. You *might* be able to kill her with a gang block the turn after she comes out, and there's certain 7+ power creatures for <=6 mana, usually with fairly large drawbacks, but in general she would be immensely strong against a deck that couldn't kill her directly with a spell.

Must attack each turn...hm. Maybe. It takes away the strategic element of trying to use her only against certain colours, but it does fit the character; she never refrained from attacking anyone that (she perceived) she had a legitimate reason to attack, up to and including her liege lord. But yeah, definitely if I do that, it'd drop to one -1/-1 counter because you're no longer in control of whether she starts to Fall or not. Which also pretty much fits since not even after murdering Shojo could Hinjo convince her to settle down. I'll think on it, but the outlook is good for you.

[The Extinguisher]

FlawedParadigm, I like the Miko, though I'd argue against her being red. Just because she's a little impulsish and a lot crazy doesn't mean she's red. Her character is white to the core. The good and the bad.

(Also it makes her a little stronger, so I'd probably bump the Bushido down to 2 and maybe she gets first strike or some other white ability when combatting a nonwhite creature.)

[Breccia]

What the hell, the delivery truck isn't here yet. I'll throw in a few that are probably not very well balanced but whatever, this thread seems like a lot of fun.

Mark of Justice
Enchant Creature, 1WW
When Mark of Justice comes into play, name one of the following actions: attacking, blocking, or activating an ability with tap in the cost.
If the enchanted creature performs the named action, Mark of Justice's text becomes "Enchanted creature is 0/2"

Visions of the Oracle
Sorcery, 3UU
Put aside the top three cards in your deck, then look at the next five. Put those five cards in any order, and put them back on top of your deck. Then, shuffle the other three cards and put them on top of your deck.

Each other player may sacrifice an artifact to do the same thing.

The Trees Are Attacking
Instant, 1GX
X target forests you control become 2/2 green treefolk creatures with haste and non-basic landwalk until the end of the turn.

Pickpocket
Instant, R
Pick a card at random from target opponent's hand. If it is an artifact with casting cost 2 or less, put it into play under your control. Otherwise, draw a card.

Bolster Undead
Instant, XB
X target black creatures cannot be the target of white spells or effects until the end of the turn.

Starmetal
5
Sacrifice Starmetal: put a hardened counter on target artifact, which does not have a hardened counter. An artifact creature with a hardened counter gets +2/+2. Any creature that is equipped with a hardened artifact gets +2/+2.

Attack of Opportunity
Instant, 1R
As part of the casting cost, tap one untapped creature without Guardian you control.
Attack of Opportunity does X damage to target attacking creature, where X is the power of the creature tapped to cast it.

Banana-nut Muffin
Sorcery, G
Destroy target dragon.

Master Plan
Sorcery, 2UU
You may not cast Master Plan while your life total is below 10.
Search your library for the card of your choice and remove both it and this spell from the game. Put the searched card under Master Plan face-down. Shuffle your library afterwards.
U: Put the removed card under Master Plan into your hand. You can only play this ability if your life total is five or less.
(spells or effects that look at face-down cards in play cannot be used to reveal the card under Master Plan)

Blood-soaked Arena
Legendary Land
Blood-soaked Arena comes into play tapped.
5, tap, sacrifice Blood-soaked Arena: Each player chooses a creature they control and taps it. Each chosen creature then does damage equal to its power that creature's controller's choice of the other creatures tapped due to this effect. The damage is all dealt simultaneously.
At the end of this ability, each creature tapped by this effect that is still in play gets a +1/+1 counter on it for each creature tapped by this effect that was sent to the graveyard.

Smite Evil
Sorcery, W
Do 4 damage to target black or red creature.

Soul Splice
Enchant creature, 2BB
As part of the casting cost, remove three creature cards in your graveyard from the game.
Can only be cast on creatures you control.
Put three +1/+1 counters on enchanted creature when Soul Splice comes into play.
Remove all +1/+1 counters from the enchanted creature when Soul Splice leaves play.
Remove a +1/+1 counter from enchanted creature: Untap enchanted creature.

[Math_Mage]

V - as I said earlier, before Darth V, V is red - V blasts things until they go away. As of the current arc, yes, V's moving more to blue, but he/she's still very red. And Mage does not automatically equal blue.
I would contend that V was at least somewhat blue even before then--she may blast things until they go away, but she also talks at things until they fall asleep. Red is otherwise a good fit, as you say.

[Toon Fighter]

What the hell, the delivery truck isn't here yet. I'll throw in a few that are probably not very well balanced but whatever, this thread seems like a lot of fun.

Mark of Justice
Enchant Creature, 1WW
When Mark of Justice comes into play, name one of the following actions: attacking, blocking, or activating an ability with tap in the cost.
If the enchanted creature performs the named action, Mark of Justice's text becomes "Enchanted creature is 0/2"

Is very weak. Pacifism and darksteel mutation (I'm not sure on the name, a new card on commander's decklists) are way better, and for 1W. I'd change it to:
Mark of Justice - W
(text, same as above)
"Enchanted creature is a 0/1 and loses all powers and abilities"

Visions of the Oracle
Sorcery, 3UU
Put aside the top three cards in your deck, then look at the next five. Put those five cards in any order, and put them back on top of your deck. Then, shuffle the other three cards and put them on top of your deck.

Each other player may sacrifice an artifact to do the same thing.

Nice and flavorful, but also very weak. Index costs U, is better, and is still unplayable. I'd change it to:
Visions of the Oracle - UU

Sorcery

Draw a card. Then, Scry 5. Each other player may sac an artifact and do the same thing.

The Trees Are Attacking
Instant, 1GX
X target forests you control become 2/2 green treefolk creatures with haste and non-basic landwalk until the end of the turn.

Like it a lot :)
Pickpocket
Instant, R
Pick a card at random from target opponent's hand. If it is an artifact with casting cost 2 or less, put it into play under your control. Otherwise, draw a card.

Don't know if this is any good, but I like it as well

Bolster Undead
Instant, XB
X target black creatures cannot be the target of white spells or effects until the end of the turn.

A bit weak. I'd change it to Protection from white or give fear to the black creatures

Starmetal
5
Sacrifice Starmetal: put a hardened counter on target artifact, which does not have a hardened counter. An artifact creature with a hardened counter gets +2/+2. Any creature that is equipped with a hardened artifact gets +2/+2.

Cool, but weak. 5 to give 2 +1/+1 counters to a creature is weak. I'd lower the cost to 3, maybe, or give +3/+3. Or, just tap the starmetal and don't sacrifice it

Attack of Opportunity
Instant, 1R
As part of the casting cost, tap one untapped creature without Guardian you control.
Attack of Opportunity does X damage to target attacking creature, where X is the power of the creature tapped to cast it.

Like it, but feels more white to me

Banana-nut Muffin
Sorcery, G
Destroy target dragon.

lol

Master Plan
Sorcery, 2UU
You may not cast Master Plan while your life total is below 10.
Search your library for the card of your choice and remove both it and this spell from the game. Put the searched card under Master Plan face-down. Shuffle your library afterwards.
U: Put the removed card under Master Plan into your hand. You can only play this ability if your life total is five or less.
(spells or effects that look at face-down cards in play cannot be used to reveal the card under Master Plan)

cool, but very weak. A simple diabolic tutor is a LOT better at 2BB. You should be able to cast the chosen card without paying its cost or searching for 2-3 cards in the library for it to be worth it

Blood-soaked Arena
Legendary Land
Blood-soaked Arena comes into play tapped.
5, tap, sacrifice Blood-soaked Arena: Each player chooses a creature they control and taps it. Each chosen creature then does damage equal to its power that creature's controller's choice of the other creatures tapped due to this effect. The damage is all dealt simultaneously.
At the end of this ability, each creature tapped by this effect that is still in play gets a +1/+1 counter on it for each creature tapped by this effect that was sent to the graveyard.

I can't really understand this card, can you reword it better?

Smite Evil
Sorcery, W
Do 4 damage to target black or red creature.

Cool card

Soul Splice
Enchant creature, 2BB
As part of the casting cost, remove three creature cards in your graveyard from the game.
Can only be cast on creatures you control.
Put three +1/+1 counters on enchanted creature when Soul Splice comes into play.
Remove all +1/+1 counters from the enchanted creature when Soul Splice leaves play.
Remove a +1/+1 counter from enchanted creature: Untap enchanted creature.

Again, flavorful, if weak. Maybe give the creature fear...
Or, give it the ability:
Remove a +1/+1 counter from the enchanted creature: The enchanted creature gets hexproof until the end of turn

Really cool and flavorful cards, if a bit weak. My suggestion:

Control Weather - 3UR

Enchantment

At the beggining of your upkeep, put concentration counter on Control Weather

1UR: Add or remove a concentration counter from Control Weather. Any player may activate this ability.

Remove 3 concentration counters from Control Weather: Control Weather gives 5 damage to each green creature. Draw 3 cards.

[FlawedParadigm]

FlawedParadigm, I like the Miko, though I'd argue against her being red. Just because she's a little impulsish and a lot crazy doesn't mean she's red. Her character is white to the core. The good and the bad.

(Also it makes her a little stronger, so I'd probably bump the Bushido down to 2 and maybe she gets first strike or some other white ability when combatting a nonwhite creature.)

I debated on this myself, but my decision wasn't based on her being chaotic or impulsive, but that absolutely every decision she ever made on panel was based on emotion rather than logic. She was passionate, dedicated, but utterly immune to almost any kind of logical aspect. Roy even lampshaded it in their throne room duel. I ruled her part Red because she's the antithesis of logic and reason.

But I am going to go back and edit in the "attacks each turn if able" and make her "fall" mechanic more gradual, because the first makes complete sense and the second is only fair if I apply the first.

[Agnostik]

Since I consider Bozzok to be one of the blandest OOTS characters, I couldn't resist. :smallamused:

http://i.imgur.com/iXcOsB2.jpg

[orrion]

More random cards!

Sneak Attack
R
Instant

Buyback 1R

You may only play Sneak Attack during your combat phase after blockers have been declared.

Target creature you control outside of combat deals damage equal to its power to target blocking creature.

"Words that mean so much to me personally." - Haley Starshine

Eye of Fear and Flame
2BR
Creature - Skeleton Eye

1B: Target creature you control gains Fear until end of turn. Play this ability only once per turn.
1R, T: Eye of Fear and Flame deals 2 damage to target creature.

"That's the last straw!"
2/2

Evasion
W
Instant

Target creature gains Indestructible until end of turn.

"When did I learn Evasion?" - Belkar Bitterleaf

Turn Undead
3WW
Sorcery

Deal 4 damage to all Skeletons, Zombies, and Vampires. This damage cannot be prevented, and creatures affected may not regenerate this turn.

View From Above
3WB
Enchantment

WBX: Scry X cards of target player's library.

"There's power to spare."

Gouda
2
Equipment

Equip 1

If equipped creature is a Goblin, it gains +1/+2.

Weapon Shrinkage
1U
Enchant Creature

Enchanted creature's power is reduced by half, rounded up.

"Wawawawa."

Bluff
2R
Instant

Target opponent skips their next combat phase.

"You don't see or hear us." - Haley Starshine

Weary/Rested

Weary
U
Sorcery

Target creature doesn't untap during its controller's next untap phase.

Rested
U
Sorcery

Untap target creature.

Elan's Invisibility.
1G
Enchantment

Enchanted creature loses all listed and bestowed abilities and effects.

"You can't see me!" Elan the Bard

Charisma
1G
Enchantment

Enchanted creature gains Taunt.
Enchanted creature may block while tapped.

Secret Door
3U
Artifact

1U, T: Target creature becomes unblockable until end of turn.

"Perhaps they polymorphed into boxes, Mistress?"

[ryuplaneswalker]

Some notes from things that have been said through the thread


Humans are rarely larger than 2/2

Not true at all, Normal Humans are rarely larger than 2/2, Legendary Caster humans are normally 2/2 at base, The Original Red Khamahl is a 6/1. Incidentally it means he matches the Godlike Dragons that Ruled Dominara in physical power.



Three Color cards are reserved for legendaries

This used to be true, but the Shards of Alara block broke that barrier so 3 color cards are quite normal these days.


All the various discussion on colors

First, all colors are capable of good or evil that is not a negotiable thing, interestingly enough the most frowned upon block in the game lore wise showed this off, as it had an artifact that amplified the internal nature of the person who held it, and it did get handed to someone of each color.

Also Tarquin in pure magic terms is White/Black, Willfull abuse of the law for ones profit Is the entire point of Black/White combinations (http://wiki.mtgsalvation.com/article/Orzhov_Syndicate)

[orrion]

This used to be true, but the Shards of Alara block broke that barrier so 3 color cards are quite normal these days.

God, Elspeth's 3 color deck in Duels of the Planeswalkers (pretty sure it's based off Shards of Alara cards) pisses me off so much. It's a fun idea but actually getting access to the 3 colors is a nightmare because there's no dual lands of any sort and the deck has very little drawing power.

[ryuplaneswalker]

God, Elspeth's 3 color deck in Duels of the Planeswalkers (pretty sure it's based off Shards of Alara cards) pisses me off so much. It's a fun idea but actually getting access to the 3 colors is a nightmare because there's no dual lands of any sort and the deck has very little drawing power.

Well you see that is just WOTC being derp and not including the needed lands to support a 3 color deck. Like you know.

the lands printed in alara specifically for esper decks.

[Storm_Of_Snow]

I think Miko's sanity slippage can be emulated with counters. Something like

Miko Miyazaki
WW
Legendary Creature - Human Paladin
4/3

Vigilance

For every nonblack creature killed by Miko Miyazaki, put an insanity counter on her.

When Miko Miyazaki has 4 insanity counters on her, sacrifice her and two another nonland permanents.
If you're going to go that way with Miko, I'd suggest making her a flip or transform card - personally, I was thinking of just having a paladin and a fallen version of Miko.



Visions of the Oracle
Sorcery, 3UU
Put aside the top three cards in your deck, then look at the next five. Put those five cards in any order, and put them back on top of your deck. Then, shuffle the other three cards and put them on top of your deck.

Each other player may sacrifice an artifact to do the same thing.

There's already the scry mechanic which allows you to do most of that.



The Trees Are Attacking
Instant, 1GX
X target forests you control become 2/2 green treefolk creatures with haste and non-basic landwalk until the end of the turn.

Again, land animation is something that already exists in various sets.



Banana-nut Muffin
Sorcery, G
Destroy target dragon.

Brilliant. I think it'd have to be limited though, so something like:

Banana-nut Muffin
Sorcery, G
You may only include a single Banana-nut Muffin in your deck.
Destroy target dragon.



Blood-soaked Arena
Legendary Land
Blood-soaked Arena comes into play tapped.
5, tap, sacrifice Blood-soaked Arena: Each player chooses a creature they control and taps it. Each chosen creature then does damage equal to its power that creature's controller's choice of the other creatures tapped due to this effect. The damage is all dealt simultaneously.
At the end of this ability, each creature tapped by this effect that is still in play gets a +1/+1 counter on it for each creature tapped by this effect that was sent to the graveyard.

Again, another card that exists in various forms already.

Soul Splice
Enchant creature, 2BB
As part of the casting cost, remove three creature cards in your graveyard from the game.
Can only be cast on creatures you control.
Put three +1/+1 counters on enchanted creature when Soul Splice comes into play.
Remove all +1/+1 counters from the enchanted creature when Soul Splice leaves play.
Remove a +1/+1 counter from enchanted creature: Untap enchanted creature.[/QUOTE]
Hmm.

I'd make the soul splices more like enchantments personally, and do one for each of the souls spliced on to V.

Alternatively, do Darth V with all three splices as a planeswalker.

[Agnostik]

Too broken? :smalltongue:

http://i.imgur.com/Jd4asxE.jpg

[Bulldog Psion]

Too broken? :smalltongue:

http://i.imgur.com/Jd4asxE.jpg

I like it. The only thing it's missing is the flavor text "WWTD?" :smallbiggrin:

[ryuplaneswalker]

Soul Splice
Enchant creature, 2BB
As part of the casting cost, remove three creature cards in your graveyard from the game.
Can only be cast on creatures you control.
Put three +1/+1 counters on enchanted creature when Soul Splice comes into play.
Remove all +1/+1 counters from the enchanted creature when Soul Splice leaves play.
Remove a +1/+1 counter from enchanted creature: Untap enchanted creature.
Hmm. honestly I don't think that quite fits for what soul splice does.

Soul Splice, 5

Enchantment Aura - Enchant Creature

Inprint - when this permanent comes into play, remove any number of creature cards from your graveyard and attach them to this card

If Soul Splice has a white card attached, enchanted creature gains Vigilance
If Soul Splice has a blue card attached, enchanted creature gains Flying
If Soul Splice has a black card attached, enchanted creature gains deathtouch
If Soul Splice has a Red card attached, enchanted creature gains first strike
If Soul Splice has a Green card attached, enchanted creature gains trample

When the enchanted creature takes damage, remove one attached card at random and return it to it's owner's graveyard

[FlawedParadigm]

Jacinda, Paladin Catgirl 1WW
Legendary Creature - Human Cat Knight
Double Strike, Protection from Black and Red, Vigilance
T: Put a Catgirl Popularity counter on Jacinda, Paladin Catgirl.
As long as Jacinda has three or more Catgirl Popularity counters on her, she gains Indestructible.
2/2

[/joke]

[Toon Fighter]

My version:
Soul Splice, 2/W 2/R 2/U 2/B 2/G

Enchantment Aura - Enchant Creature

Inprint - when this permanent comes into play, remove any number of creature cards from your graveyard and attach them to this card.

Enchanted creature gets +1/+1 for each creature card attached to this card.

If Soul Splice has a white card attached, enchanted creature gains Vigilance
If Soul Splice has a blue card attached, enchanted creature gains Flying
If Soul Splice has a black card attached, enchanted creature gains deathtouch
If Soul Splice has a Red card attached, enchanted creature gains first strike
If Soul Splice has a Green card attached, enchanted creature gains trample

When the enchanted creature is a target of a spell or ability, counter that spell or ability and remove one attached card at random and return it to it's owner's graveyard instead.

[xroads]

How about....


Name: Soul Splice
Type: Enchantment, Enchant Creature
Cost: 2 Blk, 2 Blu

Description:
Pull 3 wizard type creatures from your graveyard. Attach to creature of your choice. Enchanted creature now gains whatever abilities are described on the wizard cards

Whenever enchanted creature takes damage, return one wizard to the graveyard. When all of the wizards are gone, put Soul Splice in graveyard.

[thatonesungod]

hello everyone, im new to this forum and have made a magic set composed of the characters and jokes from the first 120 strips and am currently working on more, criticism is apreciated

But I did not yet cast a spell 0
instant
Counter target spell that targets a spell you control
But I did not yet cast a spell cant be countered

Pickpocket R
Instant,
Pick a card at random from target opponent's hand. If it is an artifact with casting cost 2 or less, put it into play under your control. Otherwise, draw a card.


Unholy blight 2B
Enchantment-aura
Enchant creature
If enchanted creature isn’t black, it can’t attack or block and activated abilities cant be activated

Fireball
Reprint

Evan’s Spiked tentacles of forced intrusion


Trigak, the chimera 1RRWW
Double strike, Flying,
3/5

Mind Flayer 2UU
Whenever Mind flayer deals combat damage to a player chose one- that player discards 2 cards, or that player puts the top 4 cards of their library into their graveyard.
2/2

An unprecedented amount of traps 3B
Instant
Destroy target attacking creature

Omen of Eugene 1W
Instant
Put an omen counter on target creature, then draw a card
When a creature with an omen counter dies, Gain 4 life

Flump 1W
Reach
Whenever Flump blocks a creature, you gain 4 life
0/1

Talisman of Dorukan 4
Artifact
Gain control of target creature for as long as you control talisman of Dorukan

Act of betrayal
Reprint

Nale, The betrayer 3R
Legendary Creature-Human
Morph 5R
First Strike
When you flip Nale, Nale deals 4 damage to target creature
2/3

Sabine, Devilshifter 3BR
Legendary Creature-Shapeshifter
This creature is all creature types
Flying, Wither
RR: Sabine becomes a copy of target creature and gains this ability
2/3

Hylilga Firehelm 3R
Legendary creature- Dwarf Cleric
Protection from Red
Tap: prevent the next 1 damage that would be dealt to target creature

Yikyik 2R
Legendary creature-Kobold Warrior
Haste, first strike
3/2

Thog 4R
Legendary creature-Orc Warrior
Trample
4/4

Zz’dtri 4B
Legendary creature-Elf Wizard
Hexproof
2, Tap: counter target Spell
1/2

Celia, Air guardian 2U
Legendary creature-Elemental
Flying
3: return target creature from the battlefield to its owner’s hand, then draw a card
2/2

W.W.T.D. 3W
Sorcery
Reveal the top 4 cards of your library, put one of those cards in your hand and the rest on top of your library in any order.

Explosive runes 2U
Enchantment
Whenever a creature attacks you or a planeswalker you control, you may deal 2 damage to target creature or player.

Barbecue(d) Hydra. 3G
When barbecued hydra leaves the battlefield you gain five life
3/5

Xykon, The Lich 5B
Legendary creature-Skeleton Wizard
When Xykon enters the battlefield put a phylateracy counter n target artifact, as long as an artifact has a phylateracy counter on it, it is indestructible.
When Xykon leaves the battlefield, as long as an artifact you control has a phylateracy counter on it, return Xykon to the battlefield under your control at the beginning of your next end step.
4/4

Redcloak, That Goblin 3RB
Legendary creature-Goblin cleric
Goblin creatures you control get +2/+2 and haste and first strike
Tap: put 2 1/1 goblin creature tokens onto the battlefield under your control.
Tap: Put target creature from your graveyard onto the battlefield under your control, it gains haste, exile it at the beginning of your next end step
1/1

The monster in the dark 9B
Legendary creature-Shapeshifter
1: Return the monster in the dark to your hand, then search your deck for a creature, reveal it, then put it into play under your control, it gains haste until end of turn
1/1

Roy Greenhilt 3W
Legendary creature-Human Warrior
Roy may block an infinite number of creatures.
Roy gets +1/+1 for each creature he blocks
Whenever a creature you control would be dealt damage, you may have that damage be dealt to Roy instead
1/4

Haley Starshine 2BW
Legendary Creature-human rogue archer
First strike, flash, reach
When Haley deals combat damage, she may instead gain control of an artifact the opposing player controls. If it is equipment, she may equip it for no cost immediately.
2/2

Elan, Bard BW
Legendary creature-Human Advisor
At the beginning of your turn you may choose one, Creatures you control get +1/+1 and haste until end of turn or Target Opponent discards 2 cards, If you do Elan deals 1 damage to you
1/1

Durkon Thundershield 2W
Legendary creature-Dwarf Cleric
W, Tap: Gain 2 life or prevent the next 2 damage that would be dealt to creatures you control
3/3

Belkar Bitterleaf 1B
Legendary Creature-Warrior Berserker
Haste, Double strike
Whenever Belkar deals combat damage to a player, put a -1/-1 counter on target creature you control.
2/2

Vaarsuvius, Wizard. 5B
Legendary Creature-Elf Wizard
2R: Vaarsuvius deals 3 damage to target creature or player
2U: tap up to 3 target creatures
1/1

i know some of the colors for the order dont map but i did it so they can all be in the same deck and i will do it for all copies of the order i print, so dont complain

Edit: forgot one, thor's might: white giant growth:durkon:

[FlawedParadigm]

Well, since it seems to be the popular thing to do...

Soul Splice 2BB
Enchantment - Aura
Enchant creature you control
Imprint - When Soul Splice enters the battlefield, you may exile up to three creature cards in your graveyard.
Enchanted creature has all abilities of creature cards exiled by Soul Splice.
Whenever enchanted creature would be destroyed, regenerate it and return a card exiled by Soul Splice to its owner's graveyard.
When there are no cards exiled by Soul Splice, exile Soul Splice.

[ryuplaneswalker]

I still think all you folks doing black soul splices be wrong :smalltongue:

The IFCC as a whole used it, and they are not all black inherent.

[thatonesungod]

the next set is out, tell me what you think

Small Town
Land-Town
Tap: add 2 mana to your mana pool, activate this ability only if you control no legendary creatures.
Don’t haggle lower than 70% it cuts too deep into our profit margins

Roleplaying Xp 2
Instant
Put a +1/+1 counter on target creature for Each creature you control with power greater than that creature

Elanicus 1U
Legendary Creature-Human Wizard
17: you win the game
1/1

Bag of tricks
Not sure what to put here

Amulet of Natural Armor 3
Artifact-Equipment
Equip 3
Equipped creature gets +0/+3
It be sendin me AC inta tha stratosphere

Ring of jumping 2
Equip 0
Equipped creature gains reach

Umbrella of eternal darkness 5
Artifact-Equipment
Equip 0
Equipped creature gains shroud

Blackwing 1BU
Creature-Bird
Whenever Blackwing deals combat damage to a player, you may treat it as having another creature have dealt that damage.
1/1

Tetherball Special
Copy of goblin grenade, without the goblin clause

Samantha 2RU
Legendary creature-Human Sorcerer
Flying
Whenever Samantha Deals combat damage to a player, deal 2 damage to each creature that player controls
2/2

Father of the bandits 3RR
Double strike, Haste, Unblockable
Whenever a creature you control is destroyed, put a +1/+1 counter on father of the bandits.
1/1

Thor’s Beer 3
Tap, exile Thor’s Beer: gain 10 life.

Hex Hag 3G
Legendary Creature-Zombie
Creatures you control get +3/+3 as long as your life total is divisible by 6
1/1

Baleful Polymorph 2G
Enchantment-aura
Enchant creature
Enchanted creature is a 0/1 lizard creature and looses all abilities.

Magic darkness 4B
Enchantment
Creatures your opponents control cant attack unless they have vigilance or haste or hexproof or trample or intimidate.

Young Adult Black Dragon 4B
Creature-Dragon
Flying
5/5

Cure Various Wounds 1W
Sorcery
Prevent the next 4 damage that would be dealt to you or creature you control this turn

Perilous path of crushing doom, Mythic
Land-path
Tap: Deal 4 damage to target creature
Perilous path of crushing doom doesn’t untap during your untap step
RRRR: untap Perilous path of crushing doom

Feed it minions 2B
Sorcery
As an additional cost to cast this, sacrifice a creature
Tap target creature, it doesn’t untap.

Lead sheet 5
Artifact
you have hexproof

Displacer Beast 3B
Creatrure-Beast
Hexproof.
When displacer beast comes into play put 2 1/1 displacer creature tokens with, hexproof and defender into play
3/3

Spiked chain Ogre 3G
Creature-Ogre
Double strike, Defender
3/3

Disguise self 2U
Enchantment-Aura
Enchant creature
Enchanted creature has hexproof and Unblockable

Cease and desist 3W
Enchantment
Creatures, Players, and graveyards cant be the target of spells or abilities

Dwarf Bomber BR
Creature-Dwarf
When dwarf Bomber enters or leaves play, it deals 3 damage to target creature or player
2/2

Shadowdancer 2BR
Creature-Human Rogue
Ninjitsu BR, Unblockable
Whenever Shadowdancer deals combat damage to a player, exile a creature, then return it to play under its owners control
2/2

Miko Myakuzi 3BU
Legendary creature-Human Knight
Hexproof, first strike, protection from black
Whenever Miko deals combat damage to a player, her controller discards a card unless you control another knight creature.
3/3

Lord Shojo 3W
Legendary Creature-Human Advisor
When lord Shojo enters play put a 1/1 cat creature token onto the battlefield under your control.
As long as you control a cat, lord Shojo gets +2/+2 and is indestructible.
1/1

Azure city guard 1W
Creature-Human Soldier
2/2

Windstriker 3W
Legendary Creature-Horse
Soulbond
As long as Windstriker is bonded both creatures get +2/+2
2/2

O’Chul Doorman 1W
Creature-Human Knight
2/2

Starmetal Greenhilt Sword 3
Legendary Artifact - Equipment
Equipped creature gets +2/+1 and has "whenever this creature blocks or is blocked by a Vampire, Skeleton, Spirit, or Zombie, destroy that creature at the end of combat."
If the equipped creature is named Roy Greenhilt, it gains First Strike and an additional +1/+1.
Equip: 3

Zombie dragon 3B
Creature-Dragon zombie
Flying
4/4

Flying zombie 2B
Creature-Zombie
Flying
2/2

Ghoul 3B
Creature-Zombie
Creatures dealt damage by Ghoul don’t untap during their controllers next untap step
2/2

Zombie Warrior B
Creature-zombie
2/2

Hobgoblin soldier R
2/2

Xykon, Lich Lord 4B
Legendary Creature-Skeleton Wizard
Creatures you control get +1/+1 and wither
2: exile a creature from a graveyard, put a 2/2 zombie onto the battlefield under your control
3/3

Redcloak, Hobgoblin leader 3RB
Legendary Creature-Goblin Cleric
Goblin Creatures you control get +1/+1 and haste
RR: regenerate target creature
R, Tap: put a 1/1 goblin creature token onto the battlefield under your control
2/2

Roy, Lich Slayer 3W
Legendary creature-Human Warrior
Protection from Black
3/3

Haley, Crack Shot 3R
Legendary Creature-Human Rogue Archer
Ninjitsu 1R
Whenever Haley Deals combat damage to a player, draw a card
1,R, Tap: Haley Deals 2 damage to target creature or player
3/3

Elan, Master of the Lute 2R
Legendary Creature-Human
Whenever a creature you control attacks, it gets +1/+0 for each other attacking creature
Defender
1/3

Belkar, Justicar? 2R
Legendary creature-Warrior
Whenever Belkar attacks or blocks, Reveal the top card of your deck, if it’s a land, sacrifice Belkar, then draw a card.
5/5
Vaarsuvius, Wizard Master 4R
Legendary Creature-Elf Wizard
4R: Vaarsuvius deals 5 damage to target creature or player
1/2

Durkon, Friend of Paladins 2W
Legendary Creature-Dwarf Cleric
Tap: Gain 3 life or prevent the next 3 damage that would be dealt to creatures you control
3/3

[Draxonicar]

I still think all you folks doing black soul splices be wrong :smalltongue:

The IFCC as a whole used it, and they are not all black inherent.

The IFCC may not be, but Parasitism is a core concept of the black color, which soul splice most certainly is.

[Kish]

...Three archfiends whose sole interest is the triumph of evil over good are not all at least partly black?

If you can find me three official demon cards in the entirety of Magic that aren't either black or red (red being a really inappropriate color for the IFCC), I'll be marginally less boggled by that claim.

[The Extinguisher]

...Three archfiends whose sole interest is the triumph of evil over good are not all at least partly black?

If you can find me three official demon cards in the entirety of Magic that aren't either black or red (red being a really inappropriate color for the IFCC), I'll be marginally less boggled by that claim.

I can't even find three demons who aren't black but allowed to be red. Demons in magic are black.

But yeah, the IFCC are way black anyway.

[xroads]

I still think all you folks doing black soul splices be wrong :smalltongue:

The IFCC as a whole used it, and they are not all black inherent.

As mentioned by others, I've only ever seen black use demons.

Another way of looking at though is the IFCC is self-serving and willing to make sacrifices for their cause. In that light, they can easily be black.

[Kish]

I could see the IFCC stretching as far as black/white/blue (selfless devotion to the concept of unity for the greater evil; incredibly cerebral, detached approach). But there's no ambiguity that their core is black.

[thatonesungod]

Third set is out, this one is war and xps reminder, no cards are final and i am accepting suggestions for cards and fixes, sets Dungeon crawlin fools and no cure for the paladin blues above, without further ado:

Personification of Self Loathing 2B
Enchantment Creature-Spirit
Bestow 4B
Intimidate, Shroud
Enchanted creature has +2/+2 intimidate and shroud
2/2

Ninja Waitress 3U
Creature-Human Ninja
Ninjitsu 1
Whenever ninja waitress deals combat damage to a player, you gain 2 life
1/1

Sunken Valley
Land-Valley
Tap: Scry 3 then put the top card of your library into your graveyard.

Goblin Dan’s Hydra
Creature-Hydra
Double strike
Tap: you gain 2 life
2/5

Kobold Oracle of sunken Valley WUBRG
Legendary Creature-Dragon
Tap: scry five then put the top card or your library int your graveyard, then draw a card, then put the top card of your library into your graveyard.
Kobold Oracle doesn’t untap during your untap step
4: untap Kobold Oracle, activate this ability only during your opponents end step
1/5

Fiendish Centipede 1RB
Creature-Fiend
Unleash
3/3

Leeky Windstaff XGGG
Legendary Creature-Gnome Druid
When Leeky Windstaff comes into play X forests become 2/2 creatures as long as you control Leeky, they are still lands.
3/3

Pompey 2UB
Legendary creature-Elf Human Wizard
Tap: put a 2/2 Fiend creature token onto the battlefield under your control
1/1

YokYok 1R
Legendary Creature-Dragon Warrior
First strike
3/3

Sabine Demon Advisor 3BR
Legendary Creature-Shapeshifter
This creature is all creature types
Flying, Wither
RR: Sabine becomes a copy of target creature and gains this ability
3/3

Nale, Disguised Evil 3BB
Legendary Creature-Human Rogue
When Nale Enters the battlefield he becomes a copy of target creature, if a creature is destroyed this way Exile it then return it to play under its owners control the turn after Nale attacks
2/2

Thog, Terrible Terror 3RR
Legendary Creature-Orc Warrior
Haste
4/4

Charm Person
Mind control reprint

Sangwaan, 3U
Creature-Human Knight Prophet
Tap Scry 2
1/1

Titanium Elemental 5
Artifact Creature-Elemental
6/6

Azure city Soldier 1W
Creature-Human Soldier
2/2

Death Knight 3B
Creature-Skeleton Knight
First Strike
RR: Death Knight Deals 2 damage to target creature
3/3

Paladin of the Sapphire Guard 1WU
Creature-Human Knight
Vigilance
2/2

O’Chul, The Survivor 3W
Legendary creature-Human Knight
Vigilance
Prevent all damage that would be dealt to O’Chul by any source
2/6

Soon, Sapphire Paladin 4UW
Legendary Creature-Human Spirit Knight
Flying, Vigilance
Other knight creatures you control get +1/+1
4/4

Fiendephant 4R
Creature-Fiend Elephant
Trample
4/4

Argent, War Dog 3WW
Legendary Creature-Beast
Soulbond
As long as Argent is bonded both creatures get +3/+3
2/2

Hobgoblin Legionnaire R
Creature-Goblin
2/2

Hobgoblin Ninja 2RR
Creature-Goblin Ninja
Ninjitsu 3
Whenever Hobgoblin Ninja deals combat damage to a player, untap a creature you control.

Chlorine Elemental 4G
Creature-Elemental
Deathtouch, Flying
3/3

Sapphire Guard Ghost 2U
Creature-Human Knight
Flying, Vigilance
2/2

Kazumi Kato 3W
Legendary Creature-Human Soldier
Kazumi gets +1/+1 as long as you control another soldier
3/3

Daigo 2W
Legendary Creature-Human Soldier
Daigo gets +1/+1 as long as you control another soldier
3/3

Lien, Paladin of the Oceans 2UU
Legendary Creature-Human Knight
Vigilance, Islandwalk
3/3

Captain Axe 2U
Creature-Human Soldier
First Strike
3/3

Hinjo, Lord of Azure City 3W
Legendary Creature-Human Knight
Vigilance
Other knight creatures you control get +1/+1
3/3

Fiendish Octopus
Red copy of the octopus from theros with monstrous, not the kracken

Celestial lion Illusion 3WU
Creature-Cat illusion
4/4 trample illusion ability

Tsusukio, Thaumturge. 3BB
Legendary Creature-Human Necromancer
BBB, Tap: put a 2/2 zombie creature token with wither onto the battlefield under your control
2/2

Cloister 4U
Legendary Enchantment
Permanents you control have hexproof

Xykon, Conqueror 4B
Legendary Creature-Skeleton Wizard
4: exile 2 creatures from a graveyard, then put 2 2/2 zombie creature tokens into play under your control
4: deal 4 damage to target creature or player
3/3

Redcloak, Hobgoblin Supreme Leader 4R
Legendary Creature-Goblin Cleric
Other Goblin Creatures you control get +1/+1 haste and first strike
Tap: put 2 1/1 goblin creature tokens onto the battlefield under your control
3B tap: Return target Goblin Creature from your graveyard to the battlefield under your control.
2/2

Redcloak’s Emissary RRR
Creature-Goblin Cleric
Tap: deal 2 damage to target non-red creature
Tap: regenerate target goblin
2/2

Monster In the Dark 4B
Legendary creature-Beast
Trample
When Monster in the dark enters the battlefield, exile target creature your opponent controls
1B, return a creature exiled by monster in the dark to the battlefield under its owners control: Exile target Creature your opponent controls
5/5

Roy, Blue Martyr 1UW
Legendary Creature-Human Warrior
When Roy leaves the battlefield, put a +1/+1 counter on each creature you control
U/W: Roy fights Target Creature an opponent controls
3/3

Durkon, Thor’s Hammer 1WW
Legendary Creature-Dwarf Cleric
Tap: Gain 3 life or prevent the next 3 damage that would be dealt to creatures you control
Tap: destroy target black creature
3/3

Haley, The Blue Arrow 3U
Legendary Creature-Human Rogue Archer
Tap: Haley deals X damage to target creature, where X is its power
Whenever Haley destroys a creature, put X +1/+1 counters on Haley, where X is the destroyed creatures power
2/3

Elan, Dashing Swordsman 1U
Legendary Creature-Human Pirate
Flash
When Elan enters the battlefield, he fights target creature
As long as it is your opponent’s turn, Elan is indestructible
U: return Elan to your hand, use this ability only during your upkeep
3/3

Captain Julio Scoundrel 2RR
Legendary Creature - Human Pirate
Double strike, Flash, Split second
If Julio Scoundrel was played outside of your Main Phase or in response to another spell, it is indestructible until end of turn.
1R: Return Captain Julio Scoundrel to your hand or shuffle it into your library. If Julio scoundrel is enchanted, you may only return him to your library
2/2

Vaarsuvius, Defender of the Wall 3UU
Legendary Creature-Elf Wizard
1U: Target creature gets +2/+2 until end of turn
1U: Vaarsuvius deals 1 damage to target creature, tap that creature
2/2

Belkar, Destroyer of Undead 1W
Legendary Creature-Warrior
Whenever Belkar Deals Combat damage to a creature, if either player controls a nonbasic land, sacrifice him
WWWW: destroy Belkar, only an opponent may activate this ability
If you don’t control any other creatures, sacrifice Belkar
6/6

[Duck999]

I did not read all those cards, but the titles are not all that good. Example; Haley, Blue Arrow
Where did that title come from?

[orrion]

I did not read all those cards, but the titles are not all that good. Example; Haley, Blue Arrow
Where did that title come from?

Likely from the idea that her bow now fires arrows that have a chance to freeze the target.

[ryuplaneswalker]

In regards to the Colors of the IFCC

Yes "Demons" in MTG are all black, but that is a settings choice, it is not true of demons in DnDJin-Gitaxias (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=214349) would most likely be called a Demon* in a DnD sense.

Honestly I think the fact IFCC is willing to work together proves one of them is not black, in MTG terms "black" evil is usually incredibly short sighted and requires an outside force to not descend into comic book villainy, and someone has to be holding the group together towards the goal of cooperation.

As far as I can peg them from what little we have seen

Lee - White/Blue and seems to be the "leader" of the IFCC of sorts, or atleast the person that keeps them on task, he was the first to speak when they arrived to speak with V, and was the one who gave Sabine her orders.

Neero - this is where I am going to get in lots of trouble, but I would peg neero as mono-black, because "meh whatever so long as I get something out of it" is a neutral stance in DnD terms, as he would not care about the scales of law/chaos so long as he got something out of his current job.

Cedrik - This guy is most likely Red/Green Chaotic Evil, as red/green evil is purely about the chaos and does not care about personal gain and just wants to stir things up

Also I was going to make a comment about who the IFCC donated to the soul splice, but I mixed up Lee and Cedrik's colors for a moment. Apparently Cedrik donated the (presumably) Lawful Evil Tyrant to the splice, I am now very interested in the story in how he ended up in Chaotic Evil hell.

*the Praetor creature type seems to donate a high level demon as the non phyrexian praetor cards are both black and were worshiped as "Dark gods

[ChristianSt]

the next set is out, tell me what you think

Small Town
Land-Town
Tap: add 3 mana of any color to your mana pool, activate this ability only if you control no legendary creatures.
Don’t haggle lower than 70% it cuts too deep into our profit margins

That is one of the brokenest cards I have ever seen. It is imo way better than the Moxen, maybe even better than any of the Power 9.


Ring of jumping 2
Equip 0
Equipped creature gains reach

Maybe more of a "Magic-flavor" thing, but imo a Ring of Jumping in Magic should give the ability to jump - which is a nickname of given a creature Flying until end of turn [there is even the card "Jump" which does exactly do that]. So I would change it "Equipped creature has "1: This gains Flying until end of turn." (Still probably a bit weak)


Baleful Polymorph 2G
Enchantment-aura
Enchant creature
Enchanted creature is a 0/1 lizard creature and looses all abilities.

Doesn't seem green to me, I would make it a blue spell.


Magic darkness 4B
Enchantment
Creatures you control have hexproof
Creatures your opponents control cant attack unless they have haste.

I think the effect is too powerful, outside of red haste is quite rare, so I think it is more powerful than Moat (and that doesn't grant Hexproof and is symmetric)


Perilous path of crushing doom
Land-path
Tap: Deal 4 damage to target creature
Perilous path of crushing doom doesn’t untap during your untap step
RRRR: untap Perilous path of crushing doom

Seems to powerful to me, and is way out of limit of the Color Pie imo. While colorless can deal damage to creatures, it is massively overcosted. Just compare it to Flamecast Wheel, an Artifact for 1 with "5,T, Sac: Deals 3 damage to target creature.", which was printed in Theros. With the Untap-ability it can get pretty ridiculous, too. And on top of it is has the problem that lands generally should have abilities to make mana.


Lead sheet 3
Artifact
Creatures and libraries you control have hexproof

I think you are doing way too much hexproof stuff. Since hexproof is a keyword it appeared 54 times until now (and that includes all mentions of the word, so some of it only works until end of turn or with other limitations or even only cares about hexproof without having/granting it). I'm not sure exactly was what the first time (Scars of Mirrodin? so about 3 years ago? So probably more than 2000 cards). And that includes even some older cards with changed Oracle wording. And giving libraries hexproof doesn't do anything, since there isn't any spell that targets libraries (you could change it to "You have hexproof" - but that alone is is probably too good for 3 mana)


Displacer Beast 3B
Creatrure-Beast
Hexproof.
When displacer beast comes into play put 3 2/2 displacer creature tokens with, hexproof and defender into play
3/3

There is a 3G 3/3 with hexproof. Adding 6 power on top of that seems kinda broken (ok, the tokens have defender, but imo still way to good)


Disguise self 2B
Enchantment-Aura
Enchant creature
Enchanted creature has hexproof and Unblockable

I really don't know how that is a black card. Should be blue.


Dwarf Bomber 2BR
Creature-Dwarf
When dwarf Bomber enters or leaves play, it deals 3 damage to target creature or player
2/2
And I thought Murderous Redcap was a good card.


Belkar, Justicar? 4R
Legendary creature-Warrior
Whenever Belkar attacks or blocks, Reveal the top card of your deck, if it’s a land, sacrifice Belkar, then draw a card.
5/5

A 5/5 for 5 with a drawback? That is probably the worst creature that would be printed in the last 5 years. Ok, that is exaggeration - but I think most cards are rather on the weak side, and this is the prime example.

Also your Ninjutsu costs should imo include colored mana.



Goblin Dan’s Hydra
Creature-Hydra
Double strike
Tap: you gain 2 life
2/5

The "T: Gain 2 life" is imo really strange. I think I would do something like "RG,T: Put a token into play that is a copy of this." (also the card is missing its mana costs, I would probably put it at 3RG with that ability, otherwise 2RG is fine).


Sunken Valley
Land-Valley
Tap: Scry 3 then put the top card of your library into your graveyard.

Kobold Oracle of sunken Valley WUBRG
Legendary Creature-Dragon
Tap: scry five then put the top card or your library int your graveyard, then draw a card, then put the top card of your library into your graveyard.
Kobold Oracle doesn’t untap during your untap step
4: untap Kobold Oracle, activate this ability only during your opponents end step
1/5
This Scry/Mill combination is just strange imo. It basically is better version of Scy and much more complicated with little gain. I also don't know why you need to restrict the untap ability to your opponents end step.

Leeky Windstaff XG
Legendary Creature-Gnome Druid
When Leeky Windstaff comes into play X forests become 2/2 creatures as long as you control Leeky, they are still lands.
3/3
This is at least a 3/3 for G (since you can cast it for X=0), which is just way too good. Either you need to add some more mana or at least limit it to X>=3 or something like that.


Nale, Disguised Evil 3BB
Legendary Creature-Human Rogue
When Nale Enters the battlefield he becomes a copy of target creature, if a creature is destroyed this way Exile it then return it to play under its owners control the turn after Nale attacks
2/2
I'm not sure what you want it to do (possible some sort of Duplicant), but as it is worded it is just a overcosted mono-black Clone. (Maybe you probably want something like the already existing card Evil Twin)

Monster In the Dark 4B
Legendary creature-Beast
Trample
When Monster in the dark enters the battlefield, exile target creature
1B, return a creature exiled by monster in the dark to the battlefield under its owners control: Exile target Creature
5/5

First of all this feels more like a white card. And than it is most likely be used to exile your own creatures repeatable to abuse comes/leaves play abilities. (So maybe limit it to opponents creatures.)


Roy, Blue Martyr 1UW
Legendary Creature-Human Warrior
When Roy leaves the battlefield, put a +1/+1 counter on each creature you control
U/W: Roy fights Target Creature an opponent controls
3/3
I think it could work as a WG creature, but fighting in UW is definitely outside the Color Pie

Elan, Dashing Swordsman 1U
Legendary Creature-Human Pirate
Flash
When Elan enters the battlefield, he fights target creature
As long as it is your opponent’s turn, Elan is indestructible
U: return Elan to your hand, use this ability only during your upkeep
3/3
That is way too good and outside the Color Pie. This is repeatable creature kill in a color that can't kill creatures and a undercosted aggressive creature in a color that has the worst creatures ever. (I'm not even sure if blue has a bear! [2/2 for 1U])

Vaarsuvius, Defender of the Wall 3UU
Legendary Creature-Elf Wizard
1U: Target creature gets +2/+2 until end of turn
1U: Vaarsuvius deals 1 damage to target creature, tap that creature
2/2
The activated abilities are just outside of blue. I think the card would be fine if the first would cost 1G and the second 1R (or maybe RU)

1

All in all: I think some cards have just the wrong colors (at least from a Magic perspective). I have the feeling that most cards are a bit weak, but there are some cards that are just over the top - and some pretty clearly. As I said, Small Town could probably be the brokenest card in Magic, and you don't want a card that has a chance to win that title.

1

To the IFCC colors: I don't really want to think about them individually right now, but a Magic card that represents them should imo be UB [B just because the creatures they represent are black in Magic - and you should have a strong theme/reason to change that. U because their scheming]

[FlawedParadigm]

I was hoping for feedback on my Soul Splice. I thought it was pretty close to the actual deal really. Or at least as close as Magic gets. I was going to up it to six mana and add the exiled creatures' P/T too but I'm already not sure if the current text would fit without microprint, which they generally avoid these days.

[Cerussite]

I want to chime in too!

Snarl, World-Eater 4RRB

Legendary Creature - Horror

Trample.
When Snarl, World-Eater leaves play, each player exiles his hand, his graveyard and all permanents under his control. Each player draws seven cards from his library. Shuffle Snarl, World-Eater back into its owner's library.

"The world we live in is merely the padlock on the jailhouse door of reality" - Vaarsuvius, elven wizard

5/4
---
Familicide 4BBB
Sorcery
Pick a creature. Destroy all creatures that share a type with the chosen creature (except for the chosen creature). Destroy all creatures that share a type with any creature destroyed by the previous effect (except for the chosen creature).
---

[orrion]

Familicide 4BBB
Sorcery
Pick a creature. Destroy all creatures that share a type with the chosen creature (except for the chosen creature). Destroy all creatures that share a type with any creature destroyed by the previous effect (except for the chosen creature).
---

Seems a little too expensive. Extinction - destroy all creatures of 1 type - is only 4B, and in general the secondary effect is either going to be moot screw the guy casting it. You don't see a lot of decks where there's "Human Wizard" and then "Zombie Wizard" and then "Zombie Minotaur." Cards like that are usually to counter theme decks like Soldier decks or Sliver decks.

[Jaxzan Proditor]

You could make it so that way it exiles every card of a certain creature type: on the battlefield, in players' hands, in their libraries, and in their graveyards. But then it probably costs far too little!

[ryuplaneswalker]

Seems a little too expensive. Extinction - destroy all creatures of 1 type - is only 4B, and in general the secondary effect is either going to be moot screw the guy casting it. You don't see a lot of decks where there's "Human Wizard" and then "Zombie Wizard" and then "Zombie Minotaur." Cards like that are usually to counter theme decks like Soldier decks or Sliver decks.

It is actually more common than you think outside of tribal where you get decks built around effects and the strength of the card.

There is also things like limted where a removal card that can hit an extra two or three cards can be a game altering move.

[orrion]

More cards!

Talisman of Dorukan
4
Artifact

When Talisman of Dorukan enters play, name a card set (IE: Tempest).

Creatures from that set cannot attack you, and spells from that set may not be cast on you.

5: Return Talisman of Dorukan to owner's hand.

"A mighty relic."

Xykon's Method
3BU
Enchantment

Cumulative Upkeep: Sacrifice a creature.

3B: Deal damage equal to the number of creatures sacrificed this turn to target opponent and all creatures that opponent controls.

3U: Draw cards equal to the number of creatures sacrificed this turn.

BX: Destroy target artifact or enchantment with converted mana cost equal to X.

UX: Return target creature with converted mana cost equal to X to its owner's hand.

Ring of Wizardry
5
Artifact

Ring of Wizardry enters play with four Spell counters on it.

4, T: Remove a Spell counter from Ring of Wizardry and search your library for an instant or sorcery card and put that card into your hand. Shuffle your library.

8, Sacrifice Ring of Wizardry: Search target opponent's library for an instant or sorcery card, and then shuffle their library. Until end of turn, you may play that card without paying its mana cost.

When Ring of Wizardry has 0 Spell counters on it, sacrifice it.

Pried from Xykon's charred finger bone.

Ancient Black Dragon
5BB
Creature - Dragon Sorcerer

Flying, Fear

BB: Ancient Black Dragon gains Hexproof until end of turn.

When Ancient Black Dragon attacks, destroy target Aura.

7/6

"Let's see what happens when I turn the magic off."

Heroic Sacrifice
2W
Instant

Sacrifice target creature you control: Return target creature put into your graveyard this turn into play.

Invisibility Sphere
1U
Enchantment - Aura

1U, T enchanted creature: Target creature is unblockable this turn.

Explosive Runes
2RR
Enchantment

Explosive Runes deals 1 damage to each creature that attacks you.

I prepared explosive runes this morning.

Dorukan's Gate
7
Legendary Artifact Creature - Guardian Gate

Defender, Reach, Hexproof

When Dorukan's Gate comes into play, sacrifice 2 creatures and 2 lands.

WRU: Destroy target creature. If target creature is black, exile it instead.

2W: Gain 1 life.
2U: Draw 2 cards, then discard a card.
R: Dorukan's Gate gains +1/+0 until end of turn.

0/8

"I've never heard of any gate." - Monster in the Darkness.

[Cerussite]

More cards!

Talisman of Dorukan
4
Artifact

When Talisman of Dorukan enters play, name a card set (IE: Tempest).

Creatures from that set cannot attack you, and spells from that set may not be cast on you.

5: Return Talisman of Dorukan to owner's hand.

"A mighty relic."

I especially like this one!

Continuing:

Fyron's Crown
0
Artifact - Equipment
Equipped creature becomes black.
Equip 1.
This crown is not magic, but it makes its owner look REALLY badass
---
Miron Shewdanker
1(R/B)(R/B)
Legendary Creature - Human Sorcerer

If Miron Shewdanker would take lethal damage, you may choose to pay RB. If you do, exile Miron Shewdanker. On your next upkeep phase, put Miron Shewdanker back in play.

2/2
---
Plane Shift
3WW
Sorcery
Choose one: exile target creature; or put target exiled creature back in play tapped.
---
Phylactery
2BB
Enchantment
Enchanted creature has: "If this creature would be sent to a graveyard, put it back into play with X-1 -1/-0 counters and Y-1 -0/-1 counters, where X is this creature's power and Y is this creature's toughness.
1, tap: Remove a counter from this creature."

[ryuplaneswalker]

Actually I just had a thought on Famlicide, the wording on this is a nightmere but I think it fits the full effect that we saw in the comic.


Famlicide 3B

Exile target creature.

Whenever a creature is exiled from anywhere with this card, exile all creature cards on the battlefield, then search all players hand's, graveyards and libraries and exile any creature cards that share a type with that creature.


If I remember the rules right..this should cause a cascade that removes any "relatives" of the original card, and their "relatives" and so forth until you run out of cards that share creature types.

No one in their right mind would ever PLAY this card though as due to its complexity it would be a PITA to actually use however in a multiplayer game or commander game, it should cause a nice domino effect that ends with a lot of peoples creatures removed, especially if you put a changeling in your deck.

[Cerussite]

Seems a little too expensive. Extinction - destroy all creatures of 1 type - is only 4B, and in general the secondary effect is either going to be moot screw the guy casting it. You don't see a lot of decks where there's "Human Wizard" and then "Zombie Wizard" and then "Zombie Minotaur." Cards like that are usually to counter theme decks like Soldier decks or Sliver decks.

Familicide is strictly better than extinction: most of the time, you'll be getting rid of two types straight out, and maybe more. It's probably not worth the extra cost in the end - and indeed, that matches its usage in the comic.

[Breccia]

What the hell, here's a few more. They all have Morph, because they all represent things that came up rather suddenly. Like my previous cards, their powers are based on their appearance in the strip more than any specific M:tG utility, so they're likely not 100% balanced.

Mistreated Flumph
Creature - Flumph 1W
1/2
Morph: WW. When you pay the Morph cost, prevent the next four damage to target creature or player this turn.
Tap: Prevent the next 3 damage dealt this turn to target creature with flying.

Runes of Double Fantasy
Creature - Legendary Wall 2U
0/7 Defender (like all walls)
You may choose not to untap Runes of Double Fantasy during your untap phase.
Morph: XUU. When you pay the Morph cost during an opponent's attack phase, but before blockers are declared, tap Runes of Double Fantasy and up to X target creatures attacking you. These creatures are removed from the attack, and do not untap in their controller's untap phase, until Runes of Double Fantasy leaves play or becomes untapped.

Elven Liberation Soldiers
Creature -- Elf Soldier 2G
1/3 First Strike
Morph: 2GG. When you pay the Morph cost, all your white, blue and green creatures get +1/+1 until the end of the turn.
If Elven Liberation Soldiers attacks and is not blocked, you may choose to turn it face-down at the end of the turn.

Explosive Runes
Creature -- Wall R
0/1 Defender (like all walls)
Morph: R
When Explosive Runes is assigned as a blocker, it does 3 damage to each creature it blocks, then is immediately put in the graveyard.
If any spell or effect controlled by an opponent allows them to look at Explosive Runes while it is in your hand, or face-down in play, Explosive Runes does 4 damage to them and then is immediately put in the graveyard.

Zombie Dragon Head
Creature -- Zombie Dragon 1B
1/2
Morph: Remove a dragon card in your graveyard from the game. When you pay the Morph cost, Zombie Dragon Head does 4 damage to target creature without flying.
(Note: this card is intentionally added as a possible target for Familicide spells earlier in the thread)

Piston Pit Trap
Artifact Creature 4
2/4 Defender Reach
All Rogues have protection from Piston Pit Traps.
Morph: 3. When you pay the Morph cost, target creature blocked by Piston Pit Trap is returned to its owner's hand.
3,tap: Turn Piston Pit Trap face-down.

[factotum]

Famlicide 3B

Exile target creature.

Whenever a creature is exiled from anywhere with this card, exile all creature cards on the battlefield, then search all players hand's, graveyards and libraries and exile any creature cards that share a type with that creature.


It's not legal--other player's hands and libraries are hidden zones and you're not permitted to see them; knowing everything in their library would be a huge advantage for you. You can get *them* to search their hands and libraries, but they're not actually required to find anything when they do so, so there would be no advantage whatsoever to actually casting this spell.

[Jordan Cat]

It's not legal--other player's hands and libraries are hidden zones and you're not permitted to see them; knowing everything in their library would be a huge advantage for you. You can get *them* to search their hands and libraries, but they're not actually required to find anything when they do so, so there would be no advantage whatsoever to actually casting this spell.


All of these cards let you either search an opponents Library or Hand....

http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Search/Default.aspx?text=+%5Bsearch%5D+%5Btarget%5D+%5Bpl ayer's%5D+%5Blibrary%5D+%5Bexile%5D

[ryuplaneswalker]

All of these cards let you either search an opponents Library or Hand....

http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Search/Default.aspx?text=+%5Bsearch%5D+%5Btarget%5D+%5Bpl ayer's%5D+%5Blibrary%5D+%5Bexile%5D

that list misses Bribery and Acquire for some reason.

[ti'esar]

As far as that debate earlier about the IFCC's colors goes, I think it's a moot point. They seem very likely to be "cardless characters" to me.

[Jordan Cat]

that list misses Bribery and Acquire for some reason.

Ah, I added Exile in the search by mistake, Bribery let's you play it so I would assume that's why.

[The Grim Author]

that list misses Bribery and Acquire for some reason.

It also misses Quash (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=74500).

[thatonesungod]

That is one of the brokenest cards I have ever seen. It is imo way better than the Moxen, maybe even better than any of the Power 9.

This is quite true, and i agree, i will change it


Maybe more of a "Magic-flavor" thing, but imo a Ring of Jumping in Magic should give the ability to jump - which is a nickname of given a creature Flying until end of turn [there is even the card "Jump" which does exactly do that]. So I would change it "Equipped creature has "1: This gains Flying until end of turn." (Still probably a bit weak)

Personally i saw the ring of jumping as reach cause it allowed roy to get to the dragon, but then when he fell off he died, and while belkar had it he never used it to get past anyone


Doesn't seem green to me, I would make it a blue spell.

its green because the primary creature who cast's it(the green hag person) is green


I think the effect is too powerful, outside of red haste is quite rare, so I think it is more powerful than Moat (and that doesn't grant Hexproof and is symmetric)

You are right, i will change it


Seems to powerful to me, and is way out of limit of the Color Pie imo. While colorless can deal damage to creatures, it is massively overcosted. Just compare it to Flamecast Wheel, an Artifact for 1 with "5,T, Sac: Deals 3 damage to target creature.", which was printed in Theros. With the Untap-ability it can get pretty ridiculous, too. And on top of it is has the problem that lands generally should have abilities to make mana.

Personally i like path of crushing doom as a mythic bomb


I think you are doing way too much hexproof stuff. Since hexproof is a keyword it appeared 54 times until now (and that includes all mentions of the word, so some of it only works until end of turn or with other limitations or even only cares about hexproof without having/granting it). I'm not sure exactly was what the first time (Scars of Mirrodin? so about 3 years ago? So probably more than 2000 cards). And that includes even some older cards with changed Oracle wording. And giving libraries hexproof doesn't do anything, since there isn't any spell that targets libraries (you could change it to "You have hexproof" - but that alone is is probably too good for 3 mana)

This is true, i will change it, but i havent used hexproof THAT much


There is a 3G 3/3 with hexproof. Adding 6 power on top of that seems kinda broken (ok, the tokens have defender, but imo still way to good)

ur right about this, ill probably reduce the amount of tokens or their power


I really don't know how that is a black card. Should be blue.

ur right, its black because i am unable to type correctly


And I thought Murderous Redcap was a good card.

yea i should probs reduce the mana cost, maybe BR


A 5/5 for 5 with a drawback? That is probably the worst creature that would be printed in the last 5 years. Ok, that is exaggeration - but I think most cards are rather on the weak side, and this is the prime example.

true, he should cost less, but azure city belkar is going to be way harder to play


Also your Ninjutsu costs should imo include colored mana.

what does that have to do with belkar


The "T: Gain 2 life" is imo really strange. I think I would do something like "RG,T: Put a token into play that is a copy of this." (also the card is missing its mana costs, I would probably put it at 3RG with that ability, otherwise 2RG is fine).

ur missing the point, the point is that hydra is taken captive and everyone eats it


This Scry/Mill combination is just strange imo. It basically is better version of Scy and much more complicated with little gain. I also don't know why you need to restrict the untap ability to your opponents end step.

Its an oracle, u dont need to understand it


This is at least a 3/3 for G (since you can cast it for X=0), which is just way too good. Either you need to add some more mana or at least limit it to X>=3 or something like that.

Yup, i should increase the mana cost


I'm not sure what you want it to do (possible some sort of Duplicant), but as it is worded it is just a overcosted mono-black Clone. (Maybe you probably want something like the already existing card Evil Twin)

Im about as sure as you are, the cards wording was because of the whole nale swaps with elan, arc


First of all this feels more like a white card. And than it is most likely be used to exile your own creatures repeatable to abuse comes/leaves play abilities. (So maybe limit it to opponents creatures.)

im going to limit it to opponents creatures but at this point the mitd is undeniably black


I think it could work as a WG creature, but fighting in UW is definitely outside the Color Pie

Ur missing the point for these creatures, the order of the stick is fighting for the azure city here, which i percieve as highly blue, and ad to that the fact that i want all the oots in every set to be playable in a 2 color deck


That is way too good and outside the Color Pie. This is repeatable creature kill in a color that can't kill creatures and a undercosted aggressive creature in a color that has the worst creatures ever. (I'm not even sure if blue has a bear! [2/2 for 1U])

The dashing swordsman is supposed to be overpowered per this arc


The activated abilities are just outside of blue. I think the card would be fine if the first would cost 1G and the second 1R (or maybe RU)

see roy comment

1

All in all: I think some cards have just the wrong colors (at least from a Magic perspective). I have the feeling that most cards are a bit weak, but there are some cards that are just over the top - and some pretty clearly. As I said, Small Town could probably be the brokenest card in Magic, and you don't want a card that has a chance to win that title.[/QUOTE]

I agree with u on a bunch of things and appreciate the chriticism

[thatonesungod]

Likely from the idea that her bow now fires arrows that have a chance to freeze the target.

Actually it was because she was fighting for the AZURE "blue" city

[SowZ]

Wow, haven't used this account in a while. This topic brings tears of joy to my heart, because I was honestly thinking about figuring out a way to play D&D with Alignment replaced by your colors. And I think there's infinite methods of CARDing these guys, and it's loads and loads of fun.

Hrm, why don't I give it a shot... Forgive my formatting, I've been out of the game for a while.

Red is chaos, passion, and fire. Of those, passion is kind of fitting for Tarquin, but the others don't feel that way. Black is ambition, hate, cruelty, capitalism and honestly if I come up with more that'll feel entirely too obvious. Tarquin is primarily black, but I think with a smidgeon of white- yes, white. White is Order, Law, Obedience, and goodness kind of, which fits the Lawful nature of Tarquin. However, he's more evil than not, so yeah.

The problem is, the chaotic ability he has -is- definitely a red ability. That means that for it to work if you made him 1WBB (as I would, since he's costed pretty aggressively), we'd have to change it up slightly. I'd give him equipment personally so here we go...

I -really- love his P/T, by the way- he is a defensive fighter but still has quite a bit of nasty to him.

I would do it something like this.

General Tarquin
1WBB
Legendary Human Warrior Lord
3/5
During your draw step, you may forgo drawing a card and instead search your library for an artifact and put it into your hand.
1WB: Tarquin gains protection from a color of your choice until the end of turn.
1: Tarquin becomes the color of your choice until the end of turn.

This fits with his "I'm always prepared" thing. It is a nasty bit of work, since there's some gamebreaking artifacts and equipment you could find. He feels like he should have something more aggressive (I do like that about your version) but I'm thinking he's okay as he's costed. And white has an "equipment cares" piece of the color pie, so that fits too. Changing colors is usually blue, but it's mostly flavor and eh. Gaining protection (at a pretty heftyish cost, no less) is pretty good but not brutal as there are answers.

Now, lets go with Laurin.

Psychic powers are blue. I think everyone in Tarquin's group probably qualifies as WB (with the possible exception of Malack), so to distinguish her I'd make her blue. Also, I think every psychic has a creature-type of Wizard (although I'd have to check and this is the wife's comp, so no apprentice searches for me!) but that's not really relevant since they won't be tribal.

You nailed the ability, though. That is the epitome of a Black ability, and really rocks. But hrm, how to represent that Psions are better at the start of... nevermind, got it, based on cards in hand. Okay.

Laurin Shattersmith
X/3
3UB
Legendary Human Psion
X is equal to the number of cards in your hand.
Shroud
2UB: Draw a card.
T: Laurin deals her power in damage to target creature.

Enables her to nastily snipe through people, avoids getting hit with spells due to her propensity for counterspells (mechanically, Shroud), and even has an overcosted card drawing engine attached to her to improve her power slightly.

Malack... well, cleric vampires have lots of strengths and powers so it's hard as hell to figure it out (I like how you did sun immunity! Goodness, that is elegant). I'd probably end up dropping it and doing something weirder, since vampires in Magic almost always got stronger when killing things. On the other hand, Malack tends to grab Thralls, so there's that. Hrm.

Honestly, since he has a ludicrously high ECL just by raw non-class levels there's a part of me that'd make him kind of an endgame finisher nasty critter. Here's a quick shot at it.

Malack
3BBB
Legendary Lizard Vampire Cleric
8/5
Wither (This creature deals damage to other creatures in the form of -1/-1 counters)
Whenever a creature with -1/-1 counters is put in the graveyard, return it to play at the end of turn under your control. It is a Black Vampire in addition to its other types and colors.
When Malack dies, all vampires return to the control of their owner.
BBB, Pay 2 life: Regenerate Malack.

There. Six mana is a bit overkill but he finishes games pretty solidly. I think, anyway.

Wow, this is fun. For the record, your interpretations are equally valid (if not moreso) since color, like alignment, is a spectrum, and again, these guys qualify for infinite cards of value.

Put the artifact on top of your library, not in your hand. That way you are sacrificing card advantage. Fetch abilities are really powerful. It should also tap him, I think. This could lead to some pretty unstoppable combos. Especially since he can't really be killed by 'target' cards.

[Loreweaver15]

Factotum--Black rather explicitly has effects that let you search your opponent's hand/library for cards and get rid of them, forever. Memoricide and Thought Hemorrhage are two very iconic examples from recent years.

Now, one of the things I think a lot of people are missing as far as classification goes is that every healthy mortal soul consists of elements of all five colors of mana; your casting costs is just the color or colors you align with most strongly. I actually did a bit of a writeup on the colors a bit ago, give me a second to find it:

White is the color of holy magic, of law, order, and religion, of duty and, to some extent, loyalty. White is also the color of tyranny, of oppression, of dictatorship; White seeks to impose its own moral framework on the universe, which can be good or evil, depending. At its best, White is selfless, inclusive, loyal, and hopeful, the color of healing and structure; at its worst, White is judgmental, oppressive, and constricting, the color of blind obedience. White is the color of both Paladins and Dictators. Most overtly religious concepts align White.

White's allied colors are Green and Blue. White gets along with Green because of its nurturing nature and emphasis on another kind of order (the natural kind) while Blue's orderly thought processes attract it to a long-standing alliance. White rejects Red's chaos and impulsivity, as well as Black's individualism and idealization of the self.

Good White characters in popular fiction include Captain America and Nick Fury from Marvel's super hero roster, as well as Kirk from Star Trek and Shepherd Book from Firefly. Evil White characters in popular fiction include Dolores Umbridge from Harry Potter and the Operative from Firefly.

Politically, the most White ideologies are liberalism and socialism.



Blue is the color of intellect, of science and experimentation, of the mind, of pure thought. Blue seeks above all other things to understand, and through that understanding glimpse the true nature of things. At its best, Blue is inquisitive, curious, and celebratory of the glory of knowledge; at its worst, Blue is withdrawn, misanthropic, and detached from emotion. Blue is, obviously, the color of science, as well as the common concept of the wizard. Most studious personalities align Blue or partly Blue. Elemental water or ice, or magickal powers over those, will also align a character Blue.

Blue's allied colors are White and Black. Blue gets along well with White’s devotion to reasonable and orderly conduct, and Black’s devotion to control over oneself and influence over one’s surrounding personalities. Blue rejects Red's chaos and passion, and Green's refusal to alter the natural order of things when improvements should be obvious.

Good Blue characters from popular fiction include Spock from Star Trek and Tony Stark from Marvel's roster (who aligns secondarily Red). Evil Blue characters from popular fiction include the Auditors from Discworld (who align White as well) and...well, pretty much ANY evil Mad Scientist character, take your pick.

Blue, like Green, is barely political in any way, and aligns most closely with philosophical ideas such as the Determinism/Free Will dichotomy (and which side of that divide the Blue character falls on may determine whether their secondary color is White/Green--for Determinism--or Black/Red, for Free Will).



Black is about the self. Self-empowerment, self-actualization; Black is the color of individualism and self-determination, and actively rejects others' restrictions on its own potential. Black is a color of extremes; naturally, it must be said that Black is a tightrope walk over an abyss of greed and corruption; Black lends itself naturally to megalomania or outright villainy, and the vast majority of Black-aligned characters in popular fiction are villains. However, a Black character who maintains a moral compass (generally, by applying that attitude towards being allowed to achieve to everyone they meet) and masters his or her own impulses is unfailingly reliable and undyingly loyal, and befriending a Good-aligned Black character means you have an ally who will, quite literally, do almost anything for you. Black is the color of merchants, but Black is often tagged onto another color as a modifier for the outlook on life that that person has. Death magic and necromancy are Black.

Black's allied colors are Blue and Red. Black gets along well with Blue's rationality and pragmatism, and with Red's passion and joy in life, but rejects White's imposed order and Green's sublimation to a different kind of order--the natural.

Good Black characters from popular fiction include Severus Snape and Horace Slughorn from Harry Potter, Death and his family from the Discworld series, Harvey Specter from Suits, and Malcolm Reynolds from Firefly. Evil Black characters are too numerous to truly cover, but Voldemort from Harry Potter and Khan from Star Trek (both versions of the character) are good examples, especially the latter for his nuance and complexity.

Politically, the most Black ideologies are conservatism and capitalism.



Red is about passion and chaos. Red is the spirit of the flame, those who burn hot, and quick, who throw themselves into everything they do with wild abandon. At its best, Red is a celebration of life and love, of the senses, of everything positive in life; at its worst, Red is heedlessly or gleefully destructive, caring only about the joy of the moment with no regard for others or even the self. Red (with a little Blue) is the artist and the thief. Fire magic is, inherently, a Red modifier to a character.

Red's allied colors are Green and Black. Red gets along well with Black's emphasis on freedom and with Green's devotion to the natural flow of life, and rejects White and Blue's impositions of order upon its wonderful, wild existence.

Good Red characters in popular fiction include Tony Stark (he is VERY evenly divided between Blue and Red) of Marvel fame, Eren Jaeger of Attack on Titan, and Sirius Black and Rubeus Hagrid of Harry Potter (the latter of whom has an equal Green alignment). Evil Red characters in popular fiction include Majin Buu of Dragon Ball and Bellatrix Lestrange of Harry Potter (who dips into Black).

Politically, the only truly Red ideology is anarchy.



Green is on the surface about peace and harmony, and underneath that, about the natural order of things. Green is a believer in life's beauty; Green is about the birdsong, the earth between your toes, living in harmony with those around you, but it is not often tolerant of those who differ from its own value set. At its best, Green is healing, nurturing, and harmonious; at its worst, Green is stagnant and xenophobic, tearing down anything that alters what it regards as natural and beautiful. Green is, naturally, the color of environmentalism, of zookeepers and farmers and those who care for flora and fauna. Nature magic is inherently Green.

Green's allied colors are White and Red. Green gets along well with Red's devotion to what comes naturally, and with White's devotion to peace and order; Green rejects Blue's cold rationality and Black's devotion to personal greatness over common harmony.

Good Green characters in popular fiction include Inara from Firefly, Legolas from the Lord of the Rings, and the Hulk half of the Hulk/Banner persona (representing instinct and raw ferocity over the very Blue scientist Bruce Banner). Evil Green characters in popular fiction include Poison Ivy from Batman and Cell from Dragon Ball (who also aligns Blue).

Green, like Blue, has very little to do with politics, as that's largely a construction of society; Green tends towards environmental activism.


By this scale, Tarquin aligns very White, and is a very good example of how Black and White are philosophies that can fall on either side of the Good/Evil alignment dichotomy. For the Order, Roy aligns anywhere on the Bant shard that you like to place him, I'm open to that debate; Vaarsuvius is Blue, with shades of Red or Black depending on the point in the story; Belkar Red and Black; Haley is a prime example of a character who aligns wholly or partially Black being absolutely one of the good guys; Durkon is White, and Durkula is Black inherently due to being a vampire; and Elan is Red, with the potential for a bit of Green. I'd also like to point out that the process of becoming a Paladin appears to remove all traces of Black from your alignment; you lose your sense of fear and self-preservation over any concerns of the safety of others.

[Cerussite]

Factotum--Black rather explicitly has effects that let you search your opponent's hand/library for cards and get rid of them, forever. Memoricide and Thought Hemorrhage are two very iconic examples from recent years.

Now, one of the things I think a lot of people are missing as far as classification goes is that every healthy mortal soul consists of elements of all five colors of mana; your casting costs is just the color or colors you align with most strongly. I actually did a bit of a writeup on the colors a bit ago, give me a second to find it:

White is the color of holy magic, of law, order, and religion, of duty and, to some extent, loyalty. White is also the color of tyranny, of oppression, of dictatorship; White seeks to impose its own moral framework on the universe, which can be good or evil, depending. At its best, White is selfless, inclusive, loyal, and hopeful, the color of healing and structure; at its worst, White is judgmental, oppressive, and constricting, the color of blind obedience. White is the color of both Paladins and Dictators. Most overtly religious concepts align White.

...

Politically, the most White ideologies are liberalism and socialism.


Your associations of political ideologies with colors don't make much sense to me.

Liberalism as an ideology of individual liberties leans much more over the black side of the spectrum (the good kind). The opposite would apply to conservatism, given its emphasis on the maintenance of the current order of things.

[Loreweaver15]

It's different aspects of those ideologies you should be focusing on. Liberalism aims to afford protections across the board; whole groups of people gain rights together, etc. Conservatism, on the other hand, aims to promote individual liberty and protection; you have the right, etc. Liberals believe everyone has the right to be protected equally; conservatives believe everyone has the right to be left alone equally. All politicians that we currently have in the states are hard to judge on these scales, though, because even ignoring issues of corruption the liberal/conservative divide is not the Democrat/Republican divide anymore at all.

On that note, the socialism/capitalism divide is, by the word of the creators of Magic, a White/Black one, which falls very much in line with liberalism/collectivism being White and conservatism/individualism being Black.

And that is all I'll say about that, I think, lest we get into real-world political discussion. Suffice it to say that these are not perfect examples, because confining real-world ideological differences into a five-category structure is hardly going to align everything exactly one to one :P

[Cerussite]

It's different aspects of those ideologies you should be focusing on. Liberalism aims to afford protections across the board; whole groups of people gain rights together, etc. Conservatism, on the other hand, aims to promote individual liberty and protection; you have the right, etc. Liberals believe everyone has the right to be protected equally; conservatives believe everyone has the right to be left alone equally. All politicians that we currently have in the states are hard to judge on these scales, though, because even ignoring issues of corruption the liberal/conservative divide is not the Democrat/Republican divide anymore at all.

On that note, the socialism/capitalism divide is, by the word of the creators of Magic, a White/Black one, which falls very much in line with liberalism/collectivism being White and conservatism/individualism being Black.

And that is all I'll say about that, I think, lest we get into real-world political discussion. Suffice it to say that these are not perfect examples, because confining real-world ideological differences into a five-category structure is hardly going to align everything exactly one to one :P

Wait what? At least in my country, the conservatives are mostly people who want to go back to a military government, while the liberals fight for less government interference in everyone's lives (contrasting to the mild socialists in power), pretty much reversed in regards to what you said. Maybe it's different where you're from.

[Loreweaver15]

Yeah, around here, conservatism is small-government and liberalism is big-government. Guess it's just a nomenclature difference--that's really interesting, actually! Maybe in future versions I should call them AMERICAN liberalism and conservatism.

[orrion]

It's not legal--other player's hands and libraries are hidden zones and you're not permitted to see them; knowing everything in their library would be a huge advantage for you. You can get *them* to search their hands and libraries, but they're not actually required to find anything when they do so, so there would be no advantage whatsoever to actually casting this spell.

Have you ever played Magic? Seriously, cards that let you see the opponent's hand and libraries are all over the place.

Peek (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=130903). Look at their hand and draw a card.

Lobotomy (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=23170). Look at their hand, choose a card, and remove all copies of it from their hand, graveyard, and library.

Duress (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=370577). Look at their hand and choose a noncreature, nonland card. They discard it.

And a ton of other examples.

[Cerussite]

Yeah, around here, conservatism is small-government and liberalism is big-government. Guess it's just a nomenclature difference--that's really interesting, actually! Maybe in future versions I should call them AMERICAN liberalism and conservatism.

More specifically, I was thinking in terms of classical liberalism (Locke, Adam Smith, et al), which, as defenders of free market theories and individualism, would stand squarely in the middle of Black.

Anyway, more cards :D

Sabine, Seductive Succubus
3RB
Legendary Creature - Demon Shapeshifter

Flying, First Strike, Protection from Blue and Green.
BB: Target nonblack creature has -1/-1 until end of turn.
R: Sabine, Seductive Succubus is the type of your choice until end of turn.

Morph (2RB): You may cast this as a 2/2 creature face-down for (3). Turn it face-up by paying its morph cost.

5/5

[Carl]

Ok after everything i picked up Duels of the Planeswalkers a few days ago, a nice cheap way of getting myself introduced to the game. Rather loving it tbh. Sadly my homebrewer juices are already a running, probably not a good idea really so instead of trying to dive straight into a full expansive sized project, (despite many idea's regarding that), i'll throw out a few for this thread.

Miko Miyazaki WWWWRRR
Legendary Creature - Human Knight

Doublestrike, Deathtouch, Vigilance, Trample

Miko must attack if able, Must Block if Able, and Must be Blocked by all Able Enemies

Miko Deals Double Damage to players

3/2


A fairly expensive and fragile platform that will draw a lot of fire weather you or your opponent wishes her to or not, but is quite capable of dealing a lot of damage on the way down, and if you can buff her toughness enough to get her through that first turn or so she'll probably win you the game outright with her sheer amount of destruction.

[SowZ]

Ok after everything i picked up Duels of the Planeswalkers a few days ago, a nice cheap way of getting myself introduced to the game. Rather loving it tbh. Sadly my homebrewer juices are already a running, probably not a good idea really so instead of trying to dive straight into a full expansive sized project, (despite many idea's regarding that), i'll throw out a few for this thread.

Miko Miyazaki WWWWRRR
Legendary Creature - Human Knight

Doublestrike, Deathtouch, Vigilance, Trample

Miko must attack if able, Must Block if Able, and Must be Blocked by all Able Enemies

Miko Deals Double Damage to players

3/2


A fairly expensive and fragile platform that will draw a lot of fire weather you or your opponent wishes her to or not, but is quite capable of dealing a lot of damage on the way down, and if you can buff her toughness enough to get her through that first turn or so she'll probably win you the game outright with her sheer amount of destruction.

Awkward mana cost. But a +2 power boost and she's dealing 20 trample damage. A little much. Also death touch isn't necessary mechanically or thematically. I like the must attack, though, that's a nice touch.


Yeah, around here, conservatism is small-government and liberalism is big-government. Guess it's just a nomenclature difference--that's really interesting, actually! Maybe in future versions I should call them AMERICAN liberalism and conservatism.

Ehh, not really. Both parties are for increasing government in some areas and shrinking it in others. (I'll avoid examples.) There stopped being a big-government small government divide long ago, and both believe in a strong centralized govt.

[Loreweaver15]

I love the way Morph plays with Sabine, a LOT. However, she is, perhaps, a bit heavy on the power/toughness end of things? Sabine strikes me more as a 3/3 with Wither, especially with THAT mana cost. Perhaps make her shapeshifting ability cost one colorless instead of one red, as well.

Also, my magic judge friend would be ashamed of me if I didn't rewrite that to fit the way text is done. So, my proposal:

Sabine, Seductive Succubus
3RB
Legendary Creature - Demon Shapeshifter

Flying, first strike, wither, protection from blue and from green.
BB: Target nonblack creature gets -1/-1 until end of turn.
1: Sabine, Seductive Succubus becomes the creature type of your choice until end of turn.

Morph (2RB): You may cast this as a 2/2 creature face-down for (3). Turn it face-up at any time by paying its morph cost.

3/3

[SowZ]

I love the way Morph plays with Sabine, a LOT. However, she is, perhaps, a bit heavy on the power/toughness end of things? Sabine strikes me more as a 3/3 with Wither, especially with THAT mana cost. Perhaps make her shapeshifting ability cost one colorless instead of one red, as well.

Also, my magic judge friend would be ashamed of me if I didn't rewrite that to fit the way text is done. So, my proposal:

Sabine, Seductive Succubus
3RB
Legendary Creature - Demon Shapeshifter

Flying, first strike, wither, protection from blue and from green.
BB: Target nonblack creature gets -1/-1 until end of turn.
1: Sabine, Seductive Succubus becomes the creature type of your choice until end of turn.

Morph (2RB): You may cast this as a 2/2 creature face-down for (3). Turn it face-up at any time by paying its morph cost.

3/3

She uses hand to hand attacks and isn't particularly fast. She shouldn't get first strike, especially since first strike+wither is so OP.

[Loreweaver15]

She uses hand to hand attacks and isn't particularly fast. She shouldn't get first strike, especially since first strike+wither is so OP.

Good point! Let's just replace First Strike with Wither completely.

Also, can I point out that the OP's version of Malack is actually insanely weak?

[Carl]

Awkward mana cost. But a +2 power boost and she's dealing 20 trample damage. A little much. Also death touch isn't necessary mechanically or thematically. I like the must attack, though, that's a nice touch.

Maybe i'm misunderstanding how trample work's, (or maybe Duels treat's it differently), but trample damage is only dealt if it's overflow, and since she will regularly have multiple creatures blocking her she's not likely to have much if any overflow available to throw down, in fact without serious toughness boosting she probably won't survive the first round of combat, but she's guaranteed to take a lot of creatures down with her all the same and maybe do some player damage on top.

Deathtouch alongside doublstrike is meant to represent her tendency towards "destroy all, and their little dog's too". Whilst there are certainly more destructive enemies and heroes and events in OOTS's run none of the martial types and few of the caster types really embody pure destruction the way miko did.

[Cerussite]

She uses hand to hand attacks and isn't particularly fast. She shouldn't get first strike, especially since first strike+wither is so OP.

First strike was just my way of putting her roguish sneak attack there.

[Loreweaver15]

The problem with that is that when Deathtouch and Trample coincide, the game treats 1 damage as enough to kill each defending creature--so she assigns 1 to each blocker, and then the rest to the defending player, which includes the entire second strike.

So, basically:

3/2 Miko attacks, is blocked by two 5/5s

assigns 1 damage w/first strike to 5/5 A

assigns 1 damage w/first strike to 5/5 B

assigns 1 damage to defending player, doubled to 2

5/5s die before they get to deal damage; during regular damage phase, Miko deals 3 damage to defending player, which is doubled to 6.

[marq]

Maybe i'm misunderstanding how trample work's, (or maybe Duels treat's it differently), but trample damage is only dealt if it's overflow, and since she will regularly have multiple creatures blocking her she's not likely to have much if any overflow available to throw down...

Unless the rules changed at some point, you are misunderstanding how trample works.

If a creature is blocked by three creatures, the attacker decides how the attacking creature's damage is dealt.* If they choose, they can deal all damage to one blocker, and the trample damage goes through while the other two defenders are untouched.

So if a 5/5 is blocked by a 2/2 and a 1/4 creature, they can deal five points of damage to the 2/2 (and three trample to the defending player), or four points to the 1/4 (and one trample damage), or any combination up to five points of damage.

They don't have to deal damage to each defender (unless the rules changed at some point, which is possible).

*Unless one of the defender's has banding, in which case the defender decides.

[Carl]

Again maybe my experience with duels is to blame as i've only faced a mixture of red, black, white, and red+white decks so far but i've found it rare to get to the point of being able to play a 7 mana card against an opponent and them not have 4 or more creatures in play unless i'm already winning so hard i don't need a 7 mana card to win, (this goes double for white heavy deck's since there are so many ways of turning low cost low stat cards into high stat cards due to various buffs which can apply as you bring one or more other cards into play or get them killed). The expectation is that yes she'll get a whole initial damage round to wipe out 3 creatures. Followed by a second round in which she wipes out some more, but unless the remaining card is a meager 1 power she's going to get wiped out in turn, at best she'll get a little overflow.

EDIT: Just seen marq's reply, that's a fair point, i don't think duels actually lets you do that. Need to think on this some more then.

[Cerussite]

Awkward mana cost. But a +2 power boost and she's dealing 20 trample damage. A little much. Also death touch isn't necessary mechanically or thematically. I like the must attack, though, that's a nice touch.

This is how I'd do Miko:

Miko Miyazaki, First of the Sapphire Guard 2WR
Legendary Creature - Human Knight

Double Strike, Vigilance, Trample

Miko Miyazaki, First of the Sapphire Guard attacks each turn if able and must be blocked by all able creatures.

At your end phase, if Miko Miyazaki, First of the Sapphire Guard, dealt damage to a player this turn, transform Miko Miyazaki, First of the Sapphire Guard.

5/4
--- (Other side)
Miko Miyazaki, Fallen Paladin
Legendary Creature - Human Knight

Double Strike, Vigilance.

Miko Miyazaki, Fallen Paladin attacks each turn if able, must block if able, and must be blocked by all able creatures.

"Redemption requires more than simply the execution of your duty"

2/3

[marq]

Again maybe my experience with duels is to blame as i've only faced a mixture of red, black, white, and red+white decks so far but i've found it rare to get to the point of being able to play a 7 mana card against an opponent and them not have 4 or more creatures in play unless i'm already winning so hard i don't need a 7 mana card to win, (this goes double for white heavy deck's since there are so many ways of turning low cost low stat cards into high stat cards due to various buffs which can apply as you bring one or more other cards into play or get them killed). The expectation is that yes she'll get a whole initial damage round to wipe out 3 creatures. Followed by a second round in which she wipes out some more, but unless the remaining card is a meager 1 power she's going to get wiped out in turn, at best she'll get a little overflow.

Realistically, at least if you're playing against me, you'll never get to use her.

Seven mana, four white and four red, you'll have lost or won long before you could afford that.

She'll have summoning sickness, so she can't even attack until her second turn in play, and since she MUST block, something I have in play will kill her before she can attack.

Her low toughness means that even if I can't attack or kill you before she's out, I'll have SOMETHING that would be able to kill her before she posed a problem.

I think she's just too expensive and fragile to be a big problem, even with all those abilities.

[Loreweaver15]

Marq: A creature with Trample must deal lethal damage to ALL blocking creatures before trample damage can be assigned to the defending player.

[marq]

Marq: A creature with Trample must deal lethal damage to ALL blocking creatures before trample damage can be assigned to the defending player.

I was just looking it up, and yup, that's correct. At some point after I stopped following the game, they changed it.

SIDE QUESTION: Do they even HAVE banding anymore, in any set?

[Toon Fighter]

banding hasn't been seen in any form in years, I think

[marq]

Ah, what the heck:

ROYROY
3WG
3/3
T: Counter target creature ability that targets a creature you control.


HALEYHALEY
2GR
3/2
First strike
Haley may block creatures with flying.
T: Deal 1 damage to target creature. If target creature is destroyed, untap Haley.

ELANELAN
UW
2/2
Banding
At the start of your turn, choose one of the following:
While Elan is untapped, creatures you control have protection from red; While Elan...creatures you control have +1/+1;
While Elan...creatures you control have vigilance.

BELKARBELKAR
BBR
5/2
Haste
Belkar cannot be countered.

DURKONDURKON
W
1/1
Prevent all combat damage that would be dealt to Durkon.
Pay 5 life: Redirect to Durkon all damage dealt to any creature or player.

VV
4UR
2/1
U: V cannot be the target of spells or effects until end of turn.
R: V deals 1 damage to target creature or player.
UU, Tap: Counter target spell.
RR, Tap: V deals 3 damage to target creature or player.
UURR, Tap: Deal 2 damage to all creatures and players, or return all creatures to their owners hands.


I attempted to make them all fit a five color deck, so they all require two different kinds of mana. If I designed an entire set for OOTS, I would probably make all Order cards a blend of all five colors, to represent that. They all also cost a different amount of mana (1-6 each), so theoretically you could play a different one each turn. Unfortunately, that doesn't quite work out since the five color requirements don't fit right. If I keep playing with this idea, I'd fix that.

[Cerussite]

banding hasn't been seen in any form in years, I think
Amen to that.

[marq]

banding hasn't been seen in any form in years, I think

How unfortunate. I loved banding decks. No one understood what the heck I was doing!

[Loreweaver15]

Banding is a fundamentally flawed, broken, and overcomplicated nightmare that neither players nor developers want back, ever, so no, it's not returned since about 1996 :P
EDIT: Blast, ninja'd by your love of banding. My apologies!

[Cerussite]

No one understood what the heck I was doing!

And THAT's why they nuked it.

[marq]

Banding is a fundamentally flawed, broken, and overcomplicated nightmare that neither players nor developers want back, ever, so no, it's not returned since about 1996 :P
EDIT: Blast, ninja'd by your love of banding. My apologies!

My love of banding is only exceeded by my love of my Sliver deck.

Glorious, five color, twenty one Revised dual lands to make the whole thing work Sliver deck.


And THAT's why they nuked it.

I should clarify: only unintelligent players didn't understand what I was doing.

Gameplay mechanics and balance aside, banding wasn't all THAT hard to understand. Certainly no harder than instants/interrupts, or targeting mechanics. (I should add, though, that a lot of people I played with at first were...not the brightest bulbs in the lamp.)

[Loreweaver15]

Do you still have those Revised duals? They bottom out at sixty bucks each, now, for the least-used of them.

[marq]

Do you still have those Revised duals? They bottom out at sixty bucks each, now, for the least-used of them.

Yup. My sliver deck is worth a LOT of money, I think. But I'm not sure I could ever bear to part with it. Building it was a labor of love.

[Loreweaver15]

From the things you've said, I'm gonna guess you're from the Tempest Sliver block. Sliver Queen is a fifty dollar card, as well :D

[Toon Fighter]

some old order cards I had made - 3 versions for each character!:

Elan

Dashing Swordsman - 2R

Elan, the Dashing Swordsman enters the battlefield with 3 pun counters
Remove a pun counter from Elan: Elan receives +2/+0 until the end of turn
Remove a pun counter from Elan: Elan can't be blocked until the end of turn

2/1

Puppet Show Master - 1RU

Whenever you cast a spell, you may pay U. If you do, put a 0/1 puppet creature token on the battlefield.
R, sacrifice Elan, the Puppet Show Master: Elan deals 1 damage to target creature or player.

1/2

Bard - 1WR

Other creatures you control get +1/+1

2/3
_______________
Haley

Rogue - 2B

Whenever Haley causes combat damage to a player, that player discards a card.

2/2

Archer - 2R

1R, tap: Haley deals 3 damage to target creature.
1R, tap: Haley deals 1 damage to up to 3 target creatures.

3/1

Rogue Archer - 1RB

RB, tap: Haley deals 2 damage to target player. That player discards a card.

2/2
_____________
Durkon

Cleric - 1WW

Lifelink
1W, tap: Destroy target Zombie.

2/3

Healer - 1WW

1W, tap: Prevent all damage that would be dealt to target creature until the end of turn.
1W, tap: Another target creature gets +2/+2 until the end of turn.

2/2

Reviving - 1WB

1WB, pay 3 life, tap: Return target creature from a graveyard to the battlefield tapped.

1/3
__________
Roy

Leader - 2W

Other creatures you control get +1/+1
Vigilance

2/2

Smart Fighter - 1WU

First Strike, Vigilance
Protection from Red

2/2

Undead Killer - 1WG

Protection from black
tap: Destroy target Zombie, Skeleton or Vampire

3/3
_________________
Belkar

Ranger - 2G

Forestwalk
Trample

3/2

Barbarian - GBR

R G/B: Belkar gets +3/-1 until the end of turn.

3/3

Death's Lil'Helper - 2B

Deathtouch
tap: Destroy target creature with converted mana cost 3 or less.

1/2
____________
Vaarsuvius

Elven wizard - 1GU

tap: Creatures you control get +2/+2 until the end of turn.
tap: Draw a card

2/1

Party Wizard - 1UR

When Vaarsuvius enters the battlefield, put a 1/1 bird creature token with flying under your control.
2RU: Vaarsuvius deals 1 damage to target creature. Draw a card.

1/1

Soul Spliced - RUB

Flying
Soul Spliced Vaarsuvius enters the battlefield with a contract counter.
If Vaarsuvius would leave the battlefield, if he has a contract counter, remove the counter from Vaarsuvius, and target opponent gains control of her.
tap: Destroy target creature. Use this ability only if Vaarsuvius has a contract counter on her.
tap: Draw 2 cards. Use this ability only if Vaarsuvius has a contract counter on her.
tap: Vaarsuvius deals 4 damage to target player. Use this ability only if Vaarsuvius has a contract counter on her.

3/3

[orrion]

Gameplay mechanics and balance aside, banding wasn't all THAT hard to understand. Certainly no harder than instants/interrupts, or targeting mechanics. (I should add, though, that a lot of people I played with at first were...not the brightest bulbs in the lamp.)

What I can't understand with the various terms is why they keep consolidating terms recently (Lifelink, Exile, Deathtouch, etc) but don't bring back Bury. Is Bury really that difficult?

Also, I too have a Sliver deck, though mine incorporates some of the Slivers from the later release like the Sliver Overlord. I don't have as many dual lands, but I have things like City of Brass and Thran Quarry and Reflecting Pool to access all the colors.

If I was remaking it I'd include a few of the newer slivers. For instance, the new first strike Sliver only costs R whereas Talon Sliver is 1W.

[Loreweaver15]

Well, 'Bury' originally covered two distinct events that were later properly codified--sacrificing one of your own permanents, and destroying a permanent that could not be regenerated afterwards. Both needed clarification, and both needed their own terminology.

As for me, Sliver EDH is likely one of my next projects, to add to my already expansive EDH library.

[SowZ]

Maybe i'm misunderstanding how trample work's, (or maybe Duels treat's it differently), but trample damage is only dealt if it's overflow, and since she will regularly have multiple creatures blocking her she's not likely to have much if any overflow available to throw down, in fact without serious toughness boosting she probably won't survive the first round of combat, but she's guaranteed to take a lot of creatures down with her all the same and maybe do some player damage on top.

Deathtouch alongside doublstrike is meant to represent her tendency towards "destroy all, and their little dog's too". Whilst there are certainly more destructive enemies and heroes and events in OOTS's run none of the martial types and few of the caster types really embody pure destruction the way miko did.

Doublestrike represents that effectively enough. If Miko only hits you once and you are still standing, you won't die later from it. Anyway, the thing is Doublestrike+Double damage to players means quadruple damage to players. It's a bit much.

[marq]

From the things you've said, I'm gonna guess you're from the Tempest Sliver block. Sliver Queen is a fifty dollar card, as well :D

Hate revealing how old I am, but I'm from Alpha.

I played religiously through Alliance, and then took some time off. Came back right as Exodus was out, and played religiously through the Urza's block again.

So I actually MISSED the debut of Slivers. But hearing about them was actually what brought me back.

I don't buy much anymore, but I do pick up playsets of new slivers whenever they come out. Got the Sliver Queen and Overlord and a lot of support cards for my babies.

[orrion]

Well, 'Bury' originally covered two distinct events that were later properly codified--sacrificing one of your own permanents, and destroying a permanent that could not be regenerated afterwards. Both needed clarification, and both needed their own terminology.

As for me, Sliver EDH is likely one of my next projects, to add to my already expansive EDH library.

Well, both of those just mean "Cannot prevent this card from going to the graveyard."

At this point the term would be for the second one, though, since sacrifice is almost always referred to as such now.


Hate revealing how old I am, but I'm from Alpha.

I played religiously through Alliance, and then took some time off. Came back right as Exodus was out, and played religiously through the Urza's block again.

So I actually MISSED the debut of Slivers. But hearing about them was actually what brought me back.

I don't buy much anymore, but I do pick up playsets of new slivers whenever they come out. Got the Sliver Queen and Overlord and a lot of support cards for my babies.

I particularly like the Bonescythe (double-strike) and Megantic Slivers. However, my favorite Sliver of all time remains Crystalline Sliver. "Hi, I have a small army creatures you can't target with spells or abilities, and I'll sacrifice them to do various stuff to you if you try a mass kill."

[marq]

I particularly like the Bonescythe (double-strike) and Megantic Slivers. However, my favorite Sliver of all time remains Crystalline Sliver. "Hi, I have a small army creatures you can't target with spells or abilities, and I'll sacrifice them to do various stuff to you if you try a mass kill."

Do you remember, I think...6th Edition, when damage went on the stack??

OPPONENT: Ok, I'll attack with my Grizzly Bears (a 2/2).

ME: I spend 1 mana (Heartstone) to create a Sliver with my Queen. It's a 5/5 (4 Muscle Slivers in play). It blocks.

OPPONENT: Ok, Giant Growth on my Bears, they're a 5/5, both will die.

ME: Ok, damage goes on the stack. Before it resolves, I spend 1 mana and sacrifice my sliver token to draw a card/deal 2 damage/make you discard (and if it was a real Sliver, return it to my hand). That resolves, and now your bears take 5 damage and die.

OPPONENT: I quit. Let's play YuGiOh.

I don't know when they changed that back (I heard they did), but it was seriously the most unfair deck I could have made at the time. Even IF the opponent was prepared for it.

[Jaxzan Proditor]

I think they changed it back during the Magic 2010 Core Set, so around 5 years ago, and 4 years after 6th Edition.
I'm relatively new to Magic. I've only been playing for three years.

[Loreweaver15]

6th edition came out in 1998-2000ish, actually :P

Anyways, there ARE distinctions between sacrifice and destroy. For example, an indestructible creature can just take a Terror to the face and ignore it, but 'target creature's controller sacrifices it' gets aro7und that just as surely as getting -13/-13.

[Jaxzan Proditor]

Oops, I totally confused it with 9th in my post. :smallredface:

[orrion]

S'more stuff.

Surprise Round
4UU
Instant

You may only play Surprise Round on your opponent's turn, and only if your life total becomes 0 or lower.

Your life total becomes what it was during your last turn. Return the game to your last End Phase.

Skip your opponent's next turn.

Surprise.

Paladin of the Sapphire Guard
1WU
Creature - Human Paladin

Exalted.

When Paladin of the Sapphire Guard comes into play, you may return target red or black creature to its owners' hand.

2/2

We will gladly lay down our lives for the cause.

Army of Goblins
XRR
Sorcery

Put X 1/1 Goblin tokens into play. If X is 5 or greater, the tokens become 2/2 and have Haste.

We're winning this war NOW." -Redcloak

Symbol of Pain
2B
Enchantment

Creatures attacking you receive -1/-0 until end of turn.

Forget/Remember

Forget
B
Sorcery

Target opponent reveals her hand. Choose a creature card. That player discards that card.

Remember
U
Sorcery

Search your library for a creature with the same name as a creature already in your hand. Reveal it, put that card into your hand and shuffle your library.

Thor's Might
1WG
Instant

Target creature gets +3/+5 until end of turn.

"Now who's the short one?" - Durkon Thundershield

Crushing Despair
2U
Enchantment - Aura

Enchanted creature gets -3/-0 and loses all abilities.

Just Deserts
1BW
Instant

Target creature card put into your graveyard this turn deals damage equal to its power to the creature that destroyed it.

Phylactery
5
Artifact

Phylactery comes into play with 2 Soul counters on it.

When a creature dies, remove a Soul counter from Phylactery. Return that creature to play under your control with a Soul counter on it.

4, T: Put a creature with a Soul counter into its owner's graveyard, and put a Soul counter on Phylactery.

If Phylactery is put into the graveyard from play, put all creatures with a Soul counter into their owners' graveyards.

"His what?" - Monster in the Darkness

Town Inn
Land

T: Add GG to your mana pool. This mana may only be used to cast creature spells.

Gang Up
1G
Enchantment - Aura

If enchanted creature is blocked by 3 or more creatures, remove it from combat.

"I'll take it." - Roy Greenhilt

Multi-Class
4
Artifact

2, T: Assign an ability to target creature as long as Multi-Class remains tapped.

If target creature is blue, it gains Lifelink.
If target creature is green, it gains Deathtouch.
If target creature is white, it gains Trample.
If target creature is black, it gains Double Strike.
If target creature is Red, it gains Unblockable.

Multi-Class does not untap during your untap phase.

3: Untap Multi-Class.

Needlessly complicated.

[Loreweaver15]

Surprise Round doesn't work as written, for multiple reasons. Here's how it would have to work:

Surprise Round

4UU

Instant

You may only cast Surprise Round on an opponent's turn.

If your life total would be reduced to 0 or less, instead, end the turn. Your life total becomes the life total you had at the beginning of your last End Step. You get an additional turn after this one. End the turn.


As you have it, you'd have to cast it while your health was 0 or less, which is only possible in very, very specific situations (Platinum Angel, Phyrexian Unlife, etc). In Magic, under the current rules, you functionally cease to exist when your life total hits 0; anything you control is wiped from the game, and no leaves-the-battlefield triggers or anything else you control resolves. The way I rewrote it, there's still some templating issues with backing up your life total, but it's far more in line with the way the game works.

[Cerussite]

Vaarsuvius, Spliced Wizard
XUBB

Legendary Creature, Elven Wizard

Imprint: When Vaarsuvius, Spliced Wizard comes into play, you may exile up to three non-land cards from your graveyard whose combined converted mana cost does not exceed X.

Vaarsuvius, Spliced Wizard has the highest power/toughness among all of the exiled creatures and posesses all of their abilities. Treat any exiled enchantments in this manner as being in play while they are exiled.

Tap: Cast target exiled instant/sorcery. Send any spells cast in this manner to your graveyard.

Whenever Vaarsuvius, Spliced Wizard takes damage, send one of the exiled cards to the graveyard.

3/2

[Loreweaver15]

Vaarsuvius, Spliced Wizard
XUBB

Legendary Creature, Elven Wizard

Imprint: When Vaarsuvius, Spliced Wizard comes into play, you may exile up to three non-land cards from your graveyard whose combined converted mana cost does not exceed X.

Vaarsuvius, Spliced Wizard has the highest power/toughness among all of the exiled creatures and posesses all of their abilities. Treat any exiled enchantments in this manner as being in play while they are exiled.

Tap: Cast target exiled instant/sorcery. Send any spells cast in this manner to your graveyard.

Whenever Vaarsuvius, Spliced Wizard takes damage, send one of the exiled cards to the graveyard.

3/2

Interesting ideas, but let's start by templating it.

Vaarsuvius, Spliced Wizard
XUBB

Legendary Creature--Elf Wizard

Imprint--When Vaarsuvius, Spliced Wizard enters the battlefield, you may exile up to three non-land cards from your graveyard whose combined converted mana cost is less than or equal to X.

If there are any creature cards imprinted on Vaarsuvius, its power and toughness are equal to the highest power and highest toughness among the imprinted creatures and gains all activated and triggered abilities of all creatures imprinted on it. Put any noncreature enchantments imprinted on Vaarsuvius onto the battlefield.

Tap: You may cast an instant or sorcery spell imprinted on Vaarsuvius.

Whenever a source deals damage to Vaarsuvius, choose an imprinted card and put it into its owner's graveyard.

3/2

First change: Elf is a common creature type, so V is an Elf Wizard. Generally, adjectives are not used in creature types.

Next, we reworded the abilities significantly to make it work. Imprinted cards must be referred to specifically, or else V could cast any exiled instant or sorcery, period. I am unsure how to properly word the combined CMC clause, but that looks about right for now. Honestly, the splice ability as you've set it up is flavorful but SUPER complicated, requiring all sorts of very specific wording. Finally, you have to state that cards put stuff back into its owner's graveyard--except when you say something is casting an exiled card, because part of the process of casting an exiled card is putting that card into a graveyard. However, if V was casting COPIES of the imprinted cards, they'd stay RIGHT where they are.

[Cerussite]

Interesting ideas, but let's start by templating it.


Thanks, that looks a bunch clearer.



Vaarsuvius, Spliced Wizard
XUBB

Legendary Creature--Elf Wizard

Imprint--When Vaarsuvius, Spliced Wizard enters the battlefield, you may exile up to three non-land cards from your graveyard whose combined converted mana cost is less than or equal to X.

If there are any creature cards imprinted on Vaarsuvius, its power and toughness are equal to the highest power and highest toughness among the imprinted creatures and gains all activated and triggered abilities of all creatures imprinted on it. Put any noncreature enchantments imprinted on Vaarsuvius onto the battlefield.

Tap: You may cast an instant or sorcery spell imprinted on Vaarsuvius.

Whenever a source deals damage to Vaarsuvius, choose an imprinted card and put it into its owner's graveyard.

3/2


A minor nitpick: can an imprinted card NOT be exiled? The way you've worded the clause for noncreature enchantments sounds a bit weird to me.



First change: Elf is a common creature type, so V is an Elf Wizard. Generally, adjectives are not used in creature types.

Next, we reworded the abilities significantly to make it work. Imprinted cards must be referred to specifically, or else V could cast any exiled instant or sorcery, period. I am unsure how to properly word the combined CMC clause, but that looks about right for now.

It kind of annoys me that Wizards prefers to use the wordier 'less than or equal to' instead of the 'does not exceed' I'm more used to seeing in maths.


Finally, you have to state that cards put stuff back into its owner's graveyard--except when you say something is casting an exiled card, because part of the process of casting an exiled card is putting that card into a graveyard. However, if V was casting COPIES of the imprinted cards, they'd stay RIGHT where they are.

Right. Vaarsuvius isn't Isochron Scepter. In the end, I'm not even sure these abilities wouldn't fit in the card text box itself ><

[Loreweaver15]

Here's a potential 'Walker card:

The Dark One

3RRB

Planeswalker--The Dark One

+2: Put X 1/1 red and black Goblin creature tokens into play, where X is the number of Goblins you control.

0: Goblins you control get +1/+1 until end of turn.

-10: You get an emblem with "Goblins you control get +3/+3, first strike, trample, and haste."

6 loyalty

EDIT: Yes, an imprinted card is exiled and 'attached' to the permanent that imprinted it--but is thereafter referred to as an imprinted card for the purposes of specificity, because there are OTHER exiled cards. It IS still an exiled card, however.

EDIT AGAIN: The clause about noncreature enchantments is because of cards like Boon Satyr (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=373509), which would only fulfill the 'creature abilities and p/t' clause while imprinted and would become irrelevant when put onto the battlefield by the 'put all enchantments onto the battlefield' clause.

Like I said, SUPRAR COMPLICATED.

[Agnostik]

My version of the Oracle

http://i.imgur.com/snbRr52.jpg

[SowZ]

Here's a potential 'Walker card:

The Dark One

3RRB

Planeswalker--The Dark One

+2: Put X 1/1 red and black Goblin creature tokens into play, where X is the number of Goblins you control.

0: Goblins you control get +1/+1 until end of turn.

-10: You get an emblem with "Goblins you control get +3/+3, first strike, trample, and haste."

6 loyalty

EDIT: Yes, an imprinted card is exiled and 'attached' to the permanent that imprinted it--but is thereafter referred to as an imprinted card for the purposes of specificity, because there are OTHER exiled cards. It IS still an exiled card, however.

EDIT AGAIN: The clause about noncreature enchantments is because of cards like Boon Satyr (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=373509), which would only fulfill the 'creature abilities and p/t' clause while imprinted and would become irrelevant when put onto the battlefield by the 'put all enchantments onto the battlefield' clause.

Like I said, SUPRAR COMPLICATED.

You shouldn't have the goblins double each turn with a plus ability.

[Loreweaver15]

Hrm. I thought I'd costed that higher. Ah well, switch the two abilities.

[Carl]

@Marq: Other's pointed it out earlier but none of the decks in Duels is really tournament grade. Here's (http://www.wizards.com/magic/digital/duelsoftheplaneswalkers.aspx?x=mtg/digital/d14/decklists) a list fo the decks and their card's, Acyren's Glory and Hunters Strength are the deck's i'd been able to play with upto that point, with the formor being the one i'd been thinking of Miko inn terms of. Simply having her arrive on the battlefield is likliy to buff something, other stuff could apply situational buffs once she's on the battlefield, and once she leaves she could apply further buff's. The decks just really weak in terms of non-creature capabilities.

@SowZ: there's plenty of other stuff in OOTS that could justify doublestrike though, whereas pairing it with deathtouch really drives home her pure destruction.

That said now i'm less asleep i'd agree double player damage and trample is unnecessary with the must be blocked clause, i put those in before thinking of the latter as a way to really push players to block her with as many creatures as possible.

How about:

Miko Miyazaki 1WWWRR
Legendary Creature - Human Knight

Doublestrike, Deathtouch, Vigilance

Miko must attack if able, Must Block if Able, and Must be Blocked.

Miko can only be Blocked by 3 or more creatures, (if less than this are available, ignore her Must be Blocked rule).

3/2

Achieves roughly the same destructive capability without going overboard on players and is still prone to the same tendency of getting herself killed, but is a bit easier to get into play and thus a little less likely to be rendered moot on arrival.


Also:

Malack BBBBBBB

Legendary Creature - Lizard Vampire

First Strike

XB, Tap: Destroy target creature with converted Mana cost X or lower, cast as sorcery.

BBBB, Tap: Deal 2 Damage to one to three creatures, cast as sorcery

2: Regenerate Malack

4/5

Basically Firststrike for his signature Quickened inflict, his spells are Harm, Flamestrike, and his Vampire mistform + Fast heal trick. I decided not to represent his thralling ability as it's probably too much text. Overall he's tough and packs some nice punches as well as being tough to get rid of, but for his cost he's a bit weak without plenty of mana to fling about.

[thatonesungod]

Malack BBBBBBB

Legendary Creature - Lizard Vampire

First Strike

XB, Tap: Destroy target creature with converted Mana cost X or lower, cast as sorcery.

BBBB, Tap: Deal 2 Damage to one to three creatures, cast as sorcery

2, Instant: Regenerate Malack, then Tap Malack if he is not already tapped.

4/5



The tap him if he isnt tapped is entirely unnecessary because regenerate rule: keep alive, remove from combat, tap
so he will always be tapped, also all abilities are instants unless marked otherwise and yours should be instants because they involve tapping him. if they were actual spells maybe sorcery but those abilities dont need to be sorcery speed

[Carl]

I'd forgotten the regenerate rule has that tap clause in it, thank's. My current unlocked deck's only have regenerate on one creature and i've never had to use it.

Thanks for clarifying all abilities are instant's, i have gt the downloadable pdf from the wotc website on hand but i remember and learn rules better from use and duels doesn't clarify that point. I made them cast as sorcery's mainly for thematic reason's tbh, thematically i'd expect D&D spells to be cast at the same time as Magic Sorcery's.

[Loreweaver15]

Well, that may be, but there are certain play accommodations that must be made to make a card playable. Sorcery-speed abilities are inherently weak, and must be amped up in power to make them worthwhile.

[thatonesungod]

Well, that may be, but there are certain play accommodations that must be made to make a card playable. Sorcery-speed abilities are inherently weak, and must be amped up in power to make them worthwhile.

Agree with this guy, you should boost the power or lower the mana cost if they are sorcery speed, besides a recent example

V: Cone of cold
Laurin: instant speed fire shield

Also, coming soon, im going to change every card in theros to an oots version, possibly changing some effects, so look foward to that

[orrion]

@Marq: Other's pointed it out earlier but none of the decks in Duels is really tournament grade. Here's (http://www.wizards.com/magic/digital/duelsoftheplaneswalkers.aspx?x=mtg/digital/d14/decklists) a list fo the decks and their card's, Acyren's Glory and Hunters Strength are the deck's i'd been able to play with upto that point, with the formor being the one i'd been thinking of Miko inn terms of. Simply having her arrive on the battlefield is likliy to buff something, other stuff could apply situational buffs once she's on the battlefield, and once she leaves she could apply further buff's. The decks just really weak in terms of non-creature capabilities.

Most of them are very weak in one way or another. Hall of Champions can't really get mana and things cost too much, the Sliver deck can't handle flyers very well (recurring theme in a lot of the decks), Chant of the Dul Maya or whatever can't get rid of creatures at all except by Annihilation cards (and has Rampant Growth instead of Nature's Lore which is damned stupid for a mono deck), and the elf deck, again, can't get rid of creatures and has no flying defense.

It's a fun game to play, but you sort of have to game every match by choosing opponents with weaknesses to your deck or they can stomp you more often than not, and I usually have to mulligan like crazy before I get a usable hand.


Out of curiosity, what's being used to post the cards themselves? I'm using Magic Card Maker but can't figure out how to export the card. I guess typing them out works just as well though.

[Carl]

@Loreweaver: Care to explain why sorcery speed is so disadvantageous? Outside of wanting to use an ability mid combat i'm not sure i see the issue.

@Orrion: Yeah flyer defense is awful, though outside of the first couple of worlds, (which have about half their encounters consisting of specialized encounters that rely on getting exactly the right card order to beat due to some inherent trick that none of the decks have the tools to counter), i haven't found myself having to restart much. Also are you looking at the same chant deck as me? It's packed with non-Annihilator high power creatures. In fact i'm finding it to be the strongest of the decks so far as it's got the most ability to actually get it's tricks into play.

[Loreweaver15]

@Loreweaver: Care to explain why sorcery speed is so disadvantageous? Outside of wanting to use an ability mid combat i'm not sure i see the issue.

In Magic, options are the name of the game, and options you can use in response to your opponent doing anything--casting a spell, casting a counterspell, moving from phase to phase, doing things at ANY point during an opponent's turn--are much, much more powerful than stuff that can only happen during your own main phases.

[Carl]

I meant in the case of these specific abilities, not in general. I understand in general why it might be an issue, but there are only a small range of a specific situations where these two would be useful outside your own turn, and i'm not convinced abut the balance aspects of letting you use them in the relevant situations in the opponent's turn. Mostly due to how using it in your opponents turn means you get a full set of mana to press the advantage. You effectively don't leave yourself vulnerable in during your opportunity to exploit the weakness you've created, in effect you prepay the cost of creating the hole which you can then exploit which has potential logarithmic power consequences. That's especially a worry for the second ability given how it would interact with Red's seeming tendency towards low toughness to mana ratio's.

[Loreweaver15]

You've got that exactly backwards, I'm afraid. Creature destruction abilities are exceptionally useful, even ones as horribly weak as you've set up, because they can interrupt combos and winnow out your opponent's field, and not just during combat. As sorceries, however, they're functionally useless, because you'd have to commit the mana during your own main phases, leaving YOUR OPPONENT with a clear field where he or she doesn't need to worry about you doing anything. Magic already builds around those logarithmic power consequences; making your card useless because you don't like those is a statement, but doesn't change the fact that your card is already a much weaker version of a barely-used card. (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=39863)

About the only other solutions I can proffer are to eliminate the extra black mana symbols in the casting cost, and then give him lifelink so his second ability isn't utter garbage.

[Carl]

Again i'm not really sure i understand your point here, (i'm not saying your wrong i'm just trying to understand the how in detail ok :smallwink:), if your opponent does nothing they end up weaker. They actually have to respond to the creature you just nixed being gone or get hammered in your next combat by your superior creature combat power.

Again maybe it's down to the difference Duel's and the more serious deck's, i don't have the reference to make a proper comparison there, but in duels if you take down a significant chunk of an enemies combat power in one round, (be it one big creature or several smaller ones), and they can't imminently replace it before your reinforcements hit the field , (which is what casting on the enemy turn equates to), you'll roll right over them because even if you take heavy losses, the result will always leave you with more combat power than the enemy. It might take another several turns to cut through the rest of their creatures with yours, but it barely matter's, unless they get really lucky on the draw you'll wear them down and kill them eventually.

I mean in Duels that card you linked would be broken as all hell, destroying any creature regardless of cost at will every turn is just way too powerful from my PoV, doing that should always take significant investment appropriate to the scale of the threat. A creature a turn for free just strikes me as way overpowered, not especially weak.

p.s. i just realized whilst doing the comparison i forgot to add protection from white and black to Malack, (Death Ward and Protection from Sunlight)

[orrion]

Hey look I figured it out. Themed cards, based on actions/events in the comic:

http://forum.mtgcardmaker.com/mcmaker/createcard.php?name=Generosity&color=Green&mana_r=0&mana_u=0&mana_g=1&mana_b=0&mana_w=0&mana_colorless=1&picture=&supertype=&cardtype=Instant&subtype=&expansion=Alpha&rarity=Common&cardtext=Choose+a+creature+card+in+your+hand+or+gr aveyard.+Target+creature+gains+%2BX%2F%2BX+until+e nd+of+turn%2C+where+X+is+the+converted+mana+cost+o f+the+chosen+card.&power=0&toughness=0&artist=Rich+Burlew&bottom=%E2%84%A2+%26+%C2%A9+1993-2013+Wizards+of+the+Coast+LLC&set1=&set2=&setname=No+Cure http://forum.mtgcardmaker.com/mcmaker/createcard.php?name=Boon&color=Blue&mana_r=0&mana_u=1&mana_g=0&mana_b=0&mana_w=0&mana_colorless=1&picture=&supertype=&cardtype=Instant&subtype=&expansion=Alpha&rarity=Common&cardtext=Choose+a+creature+you+control.+Draw+cards +equal+to+half+that+creature%27s+converted+mana+co st%2C+rounded+down.&power=0&toughness=0&artist=Rich+Burlew&bottom=%E2%84%A2+%26+%C2%A9+1993-2013+Wizards+of+the+Coast+LLC&set1=&set2=&setname=No+Cure http://forum.mtgcardmaker.com/mcmaker/createcard.php?name=Intolerance&color=Red&mana_r=1&mana_u=0&mana_g=0&mana_b=0&mana_w=0&mana_colorless=1&picture=&supertype=&cardtype=Instant&subtype=&expansion=Alpha&rarity=Common&cardtext=Choose+a+creature+you+control.+Deal+damag e+to+target+creature+or+player+equal+to+half+that+ creature%27s+converted+mana+cost%2C+rounded+down.&power=0&toughness=0&artist=Rich+Burlew&bottom=%E2%84%A2+%26+%C2%A9+1993-2013+Wizards+of+the+Coast+LLC&set1=&set2=&setname=No+Cure http://forum.mtgcardmaker.com/mcmaker/createcard.php?name=Mercy&color=White&mana_r=0&mana_u=0&mana_g=0&mana_b=0&mana_w=1&mana_colorless=1&picture=&supertype=&cardtype=Instant&subtype=&expansion=Alpha&rarity=Common&cardtext=Counter+target+spell+that+would+destroy+a +creature+you+control.&power=0&toughness=0&artist=Rich+Burlew&bottom=%E2%84%A2+%26+%C2%A9+1993-2013+Wizards+of+the+Coast+LLC&set1=&set2=&setname= http://forum.mtgcardmaker.com/mcmaker/createcard.php?name=Disfavor&color=Black&mana_r=0&mana_u=0&mana_g=0&mana_b=1&mana_w=0&mana_colorless=1&picture=&supertype=&cardtype=Instant&subtype=&expansion=Alpha&rarity=Common&cardtext=Sacrifice+a+creature+that+was+blocked+thi s+turn.+It+deals+damage+equal+to+its+toughness+to+ target+player.&power=0&toughness=0&artist=Rich+Burlew&bottom=%E2%84%A2+%26+%C2%A9+1993-2013+Wizards+of+the+Coast+LLC&set1=&set2=&setname=No+Cure

http://forum.mtgcardmaker.com/mcmaker/createcard.php?name=Keep+the+Spoils&color=Blue&mana_r=0&mana_u=3&mana_g=0&mana_b=0&mana_w=0&mana_colorless=4&picture=&supertype=&cardtype=Sorcery&subtype=&expansion=Alpha&rarity=Rare&cardtext=Return+up+to+three+instant+or+sorcery+car ds+from+your+graveyard+to+your+hand.+Untap+up+to+7 +lands.&power=0&toughness=0&artist=Rich+Burlew&bottom=%E2%84%A2+%26+%C2%A9+1993-2013+Wizards+of+the+Coast+LLC&set1=&set2=&setname=No+Cure http://forum.mtgcardmaker.com/mcmaker/createcard.php?name=Reap+the+Spoils&color=Black&mana_r=0&mana_u=0&mana_g=0&mana_b=3&mana_w=0&mana_colorless=4&picture=&supertype=&cardtype=Sorcery&subtype=&expansion=Alpha&rarity=Rare&cardtext=Return+up+to+3+creature+cards+from+any+gr aveyards+to+play+under+your+control.&power=0&toughness=0&artist=Rich+Burlew&bottom=%E2%84%A2+%26+%C2%A9+1993-2013+Wizards+of+the+Coast+LLC&set1=&set2=&setname=No+Cure http://forum.mtgcardmaker.com/mcmaker/createcard.php?name=Save+the+Spoils&color=White&mana_r=0&mana_u=0&mana_g=0&mana_b=0&mana_w=3&mana_colorless=3&picture=&supertype=&cardtype=Sorcery&subtype=&expansion=Alpha&rarity=Rare&cardtext=Choose+up+to+3+Enchantment+or+Artifact+ca rds+in+any+graveyard+and+return+them+to+play+under +your+control.&power=0&toughness=0&artist=Rich+Burlew&bottom=%E2%84%A2+%26+%C2%A9+1993-2013+Wizards+of+the+Coast+LLC&set1=&set2=&setname=No+Cure http://forum.mtgcardmaker.com/mcmaker/createcard.php?name=Spend+the+Spoils&color=Green&mana_r=0&mana_u=0&mana_g=3&mana_b=0&mana_w=0&mana_colorless=4&picture=&supertype=&cardtype=Sorcery&subtype=&expansion=Alpha&rarity=Rare&cardtext=Choose+up+to+three+creatures+in+any+grave yard+and+add+up+their+total+converted+mana+cost.+Y ou+may+distribute+that+many+%2B1%2F%2B1+counters+a mong+creatures+you+control.+Creatures+that+receive +a+%2B1%2F%2B1+counter+in+this+manner+have+Trample .&power=0&toughness=0&artist=Rich+Burlew&bottom=%E2%84%A2+%26+%C2%A9+1993-2013+Wizards+of+the+Coast+LLC&set1=&set2=&setname=No+Cure http://forum.mtgcardmaker.com/mcmaker/createcard.php?name=Use+the+Spoils&color=Red&mana_r=3&mana_u=0&mana_g=0&mana_b=0&mana_w=0&mana_colorless=4&picture=&supertype=&cardtype=Sorcery&subtype=&expansion=Alpha&rarity=Rare&cardtext=Choose+up+to+3+instant+or+sorcery+cards+i n+any+graveyard+and+add+up+their+total+converted+m ana+cost.+You+may+distribute+that+much+damage+any+ way+you+choose+among+opponents+and+creatures.&power=0&toughness=0&artist=Rich+Burlew&bottom=%E2%84%A2+%26+%C2%A9+1993-2013+Wizards+of+the+Coast+LLC&set1=&set2=&setname=No+Cure http://forum.mtgcardmaker.com/mcmaker/createcard.php?name=Starmetal&color=Gold&mana_r=0&mana_u=0&mana_g=0&mana_b=0&mana_w=0&mana_colorless=0&picture=&supertype=Legendary&cardtype=Artifact&subtype=&expansion=Alpha&rarity=Rare&cardtext=%7B5%7D%7Bt%7D%3A+Target+creature+gains+% 2B5%2F%2B5+until+end+of+turn.%0D%0A%7Br%7D%7Bu%7D% 7Bg%7D%7Bb%7D%7Bw%7D%3A+Target+creature+gains+%2B5 %2F%2B5.%0D%0A%0D%0AYou+can+just+say+%2B5%2F%2B5+s word.+We+do+that+all+the+time.&power=0&toughness=0&artist=Rich+Burlew&bottom=%E2%84%A2+%26+%C2%A9+1993-2013+Wizards+of+the+Coast+LLC&set1=&set2=&setname=No+Cure http://forum.mtgcardmaker.com/mcmaker/createcard.php?name=Tavern&color=White&mana_r=0&mana_u=0&mana_g=0&mana_b=0&mana_w=0&mana_colorless=0&picture=&supertype=&cardtype=Land&subtype=&expansion=Alpha&rarity=Uncommon&cardtext=%7B2%7D%7Bw%7D%7Bt%7D%3A+Put+a+2%2F3+Adve nturer+Token+with+Lifelink+into+play.&power=0&toughness=0&artist=Rich+Burlew&bottom=%E2%84%A2+%26+%C2%A9+1993-2013+Wizards+of+the+Coast+LLC&set1=&set2=&setname=No+Cure

Messed up the mana cost on Save the Spoils, I think. Oh well. Also, I love when Magic sets do stuff like this. Oh, and Starmetal is supposed to cost 5 mana.

[orrion]

I mean in Duels that card you linked would be broken as all hell, destroying any creature regardless of cost at will every turn is just way too powerful from my PoV, doing that should always take significant investment appropriate to the scale of the threat. A creature a turn for free just strikes me as way overpowered, not especially weak.

p.s. i just realized whilst doing the comparison i forgot to add protection from white and black to Malack, (Death Ward and Protection from Sunlight)

That Gorgon card is exceptionally weak first because it's 6 mana for a 5/5, second because it's vulnerable to every destruction card in the book, third because you can't attack with it and use the ability, and fourth because Black excels at creature destruction and that makes it pretty redundant in a mono-black deck (which is pretty much the only place you're gonna see it with the BBB in the casting cost).

[Cerussite]

Duel of Mages

3UU

Sorcery

Untap all lands. Starting with you, each player may cast a sorcery or an instant, even if he could not normally do so. Repeat this process until a player does not cast a sorcery or an instant. That player discards two cards. Tap all lands.

"I have in excess of twenty-five spells remaining, not including cantrips."

[orrion]

Duel of Mages

3UU

Instant

Untap all lands. Starting with you, each player may cast a sorcery or an instant, even if he could not normally do so. Repeat this process until a player does not cast a sorcery or an instant. That player discards his hand.

"I have in excess of twenty-five spells remaining, not including cantrips."

What happens if someone names Duel of Mages?

Edit: Oh, wait, you mean each player casts what they've got until they can't, and then their hand is gone?

I'm gonna say way too broken because it's too specific. Most decks - except the one you're designing around that card - are gonna be screwed out of their hand in short order.

[Qaanol]

http://forum.mtgcardmaker.com/mcmaker/createcard.php?name=Generosity&color=Green&mana_r=0&mana_u=0&mana_g=1&mana_b=0&mana_w=0&mana_colorless=1&picture=&supertype=&cardtype=Instant&subtype=&expansion=Alpha&rarity=Common&cardtext=Choose+a+creature+card+in+your+hand+or+gr aveyard.+Target+creature+gains+%2BX%2F%2BX+until+e nd+of+turn%2C+where+X+is+the+converted+mana+cost+o f+the+chosen+card.&power=0&toughness=0&artist=Rich+Burlew&bottom=%E2%84%A2+%26+%C2%A9+1993-2013+Wizards+of+the+Coast+LLC&set1=&set2=&setname=No+Cure
Reveal Draco (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=25797) from your hand: target creature gets +16/+16. For 2 mana. At instant speed.


http://forum.mtgcardmaker.com/mcmaker/createcard.php?name=Boon&color=Blue&mana_r=0&mana_u=1&mana_g=0&mana_b=0&mana_w=0&mana_colorless=1&picture=&supertype=&cardtype=Instant&subtype=&expansion=Alpha&rarity=Common&cardtext=Choose+a+creature+you+control.+Draw+cards +equal+to+half+that+creature%27s+converted+mana+co st%2C+rounded+down.&power=0&toughness=0&artist=Rich+Burlew&bottom=%E2%84%A2+%26+%C2%A9+1993-2013+Wizards+of+the+Coast+LLC&set1=&set2=&setname=No+Cure
Animate Dead (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=48) (or Exhume (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=5556)) on, let’s say Draco again: draw 8 cards for 2 mana, at instant speed.


http://forum.mtgcardmaker.com/mcmaker/createcard.php?name=Mercy&color=White&mana_r=0&mana_u=0&mana_g=0&mana_b=0&mana_w=1&mana_colorless=1&picture=&supertype=&cardtype=Instant&subtype=&expansion=Alpha&rarity=Common&cardtext=Counter+target+spell+that+would+destroy+a +creature+you+control.&power=0&toughness=0&artist=Rich+Burlew&bottom=%E2%84%A2+%26+%C2%A9+1993-2013+Wizards+of+the+Coast+LLC&set1=&set2=&setname=
I like this a lot. At first glance it looks like a nerfed single-target regeneration spell. But then you realize it can counter a board wipe. Still doesn’t do anything about exile/return to hand spells, so maybe, “Counter target spell that would remove a creature you control from the battlefield.” is more playable.


http://g80.img-up.net/Vaarsuviuse379.jpg

This is broken. I am not sure how, but I think it involves untapping, like with Twiddle, or Intruder Alarm (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=5174) or something. Definitely broken.

[orrion]

Reveal Draco (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=25797) from your hand: target creature gets +16/+16. For 2 mana. At instant speed.


Animate Dead (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=48) (or Exhume (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=5556)) on, let’s say Draco again: draw 8 cards for 2 mana, at instant speed.

Yeah, should probably nerf those by at least making them Sorcery cards. Whatever.



I like this a lot. At first glance it looks like a nerfed single-target regeneration spell. But then you realize it can counter a board wipe. Still doesn’t do anything about exile/return to hand spells, so maybe, “Counter target spell that would remove a creature you control from the battlefield.” is more playable.

I worded it like that so it could counter a board wipe. The lack of attention to Exile effects is probably a result of my having left the game before Exiling stuff became common as hell, so a rewording that reads "Counter target spell that would remove a creature you control from play" would be fine.



This is broken. I am not sure how, but I think it involves untapping, like with Twiddle, or Intruder Alarm (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=5174) or something. Definitely broken.

Well, the card is still subject to removal and the exiled cards stay exiled, so I'd laugh pretty hard if someone got 4 or 6 cards under that Vaarsuvius and then I killed it.

Oh, forgot this one, though I bet it already exists in some form.

http://forum.mtgcardmaker.com/mcmaker/createcard.php?name=Wizard+Outfit&color=Blue&mana_r=0&mana_u=2&mana_g=0&mana_b=0&mana_w=0&mana_colorless=1&picture=&supertype=&cardtype=Enchantment&subtype=Aura&expansion=Alpha&rarity=Uncommon&cardtext=Enchanted+creature+has+the+Wizard+type+in +addition+to+its+other+types.%0D%0A%0D%0AWhen+ench anted+creature+deals+combat+damage+to+a+player%2C+ draw+a+card.%0D%0A%0D%0A%0D%0AI+am+powerful+and+st uff!+-+Elan&power=0&toughness=0&artist=Rich+Burlew&bottom=%E2%84%A2+%26+%C2%A9+1993-2013+Wizards+of+the+Coast+LLC&set1=&set2=&setname=No+Cure

[ryuplaneswalker]

This is broken. I am not sure how, but I think it involves untapping, like with Twiddle, or Intruder Alarm (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=5174) or something. Definitely broken.

That is not even a part of it, throw any number of cards on him and he is a PITA in combat

[Loreweaver15]

Again i'm not really sure i understand your point here, (i'm not saying your wrong i'm just trying to understand the how in detail ok :smallwink:), if your opponent does nothing they end up weaker. They actually have to respond to the creature you just nixed being gone or get hammered in your next combat by your superior creature combat power.

Again maybe it's down to the difference Duel's and the more serious deck's, i don't have the reference to make a proper comparison there, but in duels if you take down a significant chunk of an enemies combat power in one round, (be it one big creature or several smaller ones), and they can't imminently replace it before your reinforcements hit the field , (which is what casting on the enemy turn equates to), you'll roll right over them because even if you take heavy losses, the result will always leave you with more combat power than the enemy. It might take another several turns to cut through the rest of their creatures with yours, but it barely matter's, unless they get really lucky on the draw you'll wear them down and kill them eventually.

I mean in Duels that card you linked would be broken as all hell, destroying any creature regardless of cost at will every turn is just way too powerful from my PoV, doing that should always take significant investment appropriate to the scale of the threat. A creature a turn for free just strikes me as way overpowered, not especially weak.

p.s. i just realized whilst doing the comparison i forgot to add protection from white and black to Malack, (Death Ward and Protection from Sunlight)

The first issue is this: Due to summoning sickness and the commonality of removal, creatures are (to use technical terminology) weak as hell. On top of that, the way high-end Magic play works, anything above about five or six mana is very rarely cast normally; it's generally cheated into play, so anything without a massively game-changing effect is (again with the technical jargon) weak as hell.

Also, people only untap on their own turns, so Visara only gets a creature whenever she untaps. I'd rather cast a bunch of Doom Blades or Abrupt Decays than one Visara, because she'll almost certainly get destroyed (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=369073) or exiled (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=179235) or put on top of my library (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=270962). Visara, at six mana, is generally (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=205030) not (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=214063) worth (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=215076) the (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=265150) effort (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=241832), even (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=239995) just (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=241830) in (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=24621) monoblack (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=74626), when compared to other badass creatures.

But yes, that card isn't in Duels of the Planeswalkers because that is intended as an introduction to the game, and at levels of play where she becomes easily understood and interacted with are levels of play where she's essentially irrelevant.

...I'm not sure I'm explaining this properly. Anyone care to assist?

[SowZ]

Again i'm not really sure i understand your point here, (i'm not saying your wrong i'm just trying to understand the how in detail ok :smallwink:), if your opponent does nothing they end up weaker. They actually have to respond to the creature you just nixed being gone or get hammered in your next combat by your superior creature combat power.

Again maybe it's down to the difference Duel's and the more serious deck's, i don't have the reference to make a proper comparison there, but in duels if you take down a significant chunk of an enemies combat power in one round, (be it one big creature or several smaller ones), and they can't imminently replace it before your reinforcements hit the field , (which is what casting on the enemy turn equates to), you'll roll right over them because even if you take heavy losses, the result will always leave you with more combat power than the enemy. It might take another several turns to cut through the rest of their creatures with yours, but it barely matter's, unless they get really lucky on the draw you'll wear them down and kill them eventually.

I mean in Duels that card you linked would be broken as all hell, destroying any creature regardless of cost at will every turn is just way too powerful from my PoV, doing that should always take significant investment appropriate to the scale of the threat. A creature a turn for free just strikes me as way overpowered, not especially weak.

p.s. i just realized whilst doing the comparison i forgot to add protection from white and black to Malack, (Death Ward and Protection from Sunlight)

Even on your own turn, you often can't play sorcery cards. You can't play them at the end of your turn, for example. You can't play after you declare attackers. If your opponent uses a spell or ability, you can't respond to it with a sorcery even on your own turn.

[ryuplaneswalker]

But yes, that card isn't in Duels of the Planeswalkers because that is intended as an introduction to the game, and at levels of play where she becomes easily understood and interacted with are levels of play where she's essentially irrelevant.

Actually something like Visara could be overpowered in DOTP games, as a repeatable Flier that can destroy target black creatures would be incredibly good in a limited environment.


Edit : And discussions like these are relevant in any card creation thread, as there are several formats and something that is incredibly powerful in one format will be woefully under powered in another.

[Cerussite]

What happens if someone names Duel of Mages?

Edit: Oh, wait, you mean each player casts what they've got until they can't, and then their hand is gone?

I'm gonna say way too broken because it's too specific. Most decks - except the one you're designing around that card - are gonna be screwed out of their hand in short order.

In retrospect, full discard was a silly choice. Maybe discarding one or two cards would have been a better choice.

[Loreweaver15]

Actually something like Visara could be overpowered in DOTP games, as a repeatable Flier that can destroy target black creatures would be incredibly good in a limited environment.


Edit : And discussions like these are relevant in any card creation thread, as there are several formats and something that is incredibly powerful in one format will be woefully under powered in another.

That's exactly my point. She's too powerful for a format like DOTP, but not powerful enough to actually be good in the real game. Fun general, though!

[Storm_Of_Snow]

My take on the soul splices:

++++++
Haerta Bloodsoak, Destroyer Of Hope
BBBBBB
Legendary Enchantment - Soul Splice
Cumulative Upkeep: BB (Put an age counter on Haerta Bloodsoak, then sacrifice it unless you pay the cumulative upkeep cost for each age counter on Haerta Bloodsoak).

BBB: Remove an age counter from Haerta Bloodsoak.
1BB, Tap: Return target non-artifact creature from your graveyard to play.
3BB, Tap: Remove target non-artifact creature from the game
XBBBB, Tap: Destroy target non-artifact creature, and X target non-artifact creatures that share a creature type with it. They cannot be regenerated.

When Haerta Bloodsoak would be put in your graveyard, remove her from the game.

"Destroy everyone who has ever slighted you."

++++++
Gononron, Terror of a Thousand Planes
UUUBBB
Legendary Enchantment - Soul Splice
Cumulative Upkeep: UB (Put an age counter on Gononron, then sacrifice it unless you pay the cumulative upkeep cost for each age counter on Gononron).

UUB: Remove an age counter from Gononron.
1UB, Tap: Put target creature into play from your hand.
3UB, Tap: Return target creature to it's owners hand.
XUUBB, Tap: X target creatures you control are unblockable until the end of turn.

When Gononron would be put in your graveyard, remove him from the game.

"Crush the world beneath your heel."

++++++
Jephton The Unholy, Spawn of Hatred
RRRBBB
Legendary Enchantment - Soul Splice
Cumulative Upkeep: RB (Put an age counter on Jephton The Unholy, then sacrifice it unless you pay the cumulative upkeep cost for each age counter on Jephton The Unholy).

RRB: Remove an age counter from Jephton The Unholy.
1RB, Tap: Reveal a card from your hand. Until the end of turn, you may play this card without paying it's mana cost.
3RB, Tap: Counter ability activated by target creature, then copy the effect. You may choose a new target for the effect.
XRRBB, Tap: Return X sorcery, enchantment or instant cards from your graveyard to your hand.

When Jephton The Unholy would be put in your graveyard, remove him from the game.

"Tear down creation just to see if you can."

[thatonesungod]

My take on the soul splices:

++++++
Haerta Bloodsoak, Destroyer Of Hope
BBBBBB
Legendary Enchantment - Soul Splice
Cumulative Upkeep: BB (Put an age counter on Haerta Bloodsoak, then sacrifice it unless you pay the cumulative upkeep cost for each age counter on Haerta Bloodsoak).

BBB: Remove an age counter from Haerta Bloodsoak.
1BB, Tap: Return target non-artifact creature from your graveyard to play.
3BB, Tap: Remove target non-artifact creature from the game
XBBBB, Tap: Destroy target non-artifact creature, and X target non-artifact creatures that share a creature type with it. They cannot be regenerated.

When Haerta Bloodsoak would be put in your graveyard, remove her from the game.

"Destroy everyone who has ever slighted you."

these are pretty good, but the cumulative upkeep cost is too high, make it 1 mana, or u are paying six mana on the third turn, or lower the cost to remove an age counter, otherwise they lose way too fast, vaarsuvius keeps control of them until she gets hit with a rock, so maybe add some effect for when you take damage, i dont know


++++++
Gononron, Terror of a Thousand Planes
UUUBBB
Legendary Enchantment - Soul Splice
Cumulative Upkeep: UB (Put an age counter on Gononron, then sacrifice it unless you pay the cumulative upkeep cost for each age counter on Gononron).

UUB: Remove an age counter from Gononron.
1UB, Tap: Put target creature into play from your hand.
3UB, Tap: Return target creature to it's owners hand.
XUUBB, Tap: X target creatures you control are unblockable until the end of turn.

When Gononron would be put in your graveyard, remove him from the game.

"Crush the world beneath your heel."

same as above


++++++
Jephton The Unholy, Spawn of Hatred
RRRBBB
Legendary Enchantment - Soul Splice
Cumulative Upkeep: RB (Put an age counter on Jephton The Unholy, then sacrifice it unless you pay the cumulative upkeep cost for each age counter on Jephton The Unholy).

RRB: Remove an age counter from Jephton The Unholy.
1RB, Tap: Reveal a card from your hand. Until the end of turn, you may play this card without paying it's mana cost.
3RB, Tap: Counter ability activated by target creature, then copy the effect. You may choose a new target for the effect.
XRRBB, Tap: Return X sorcery, enchantment or instant cards from your graveyard to your hand.

When Jephton The Unholy would be put in your graveyard, remove him from the game.

"Tear down creation just to see if you can."

the problem here is that jephons entire spheal is supposed to be spontaneus casting, the 3rd thing V cant do, so the card dosnt represent that very well

Altogether i do quite like them

[Loreweaver15]

On Haerta: Exile is not in Black's color pool in general or for creatures in particular.

On Ganonron: His first ability is not in the color pool (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=154003) of either Blue or Black (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=370687), and he in fact does nothing Black whatsoever.

On Jephton: His first ability is extremely broken, and while it's sort of Red, generally Red needs to exile that card as a cost. It'd have to be 'Exile a card at random from your hand: Until end of turn, you may play the exiled card without paying its mana cost', at which point it merely becomes extremely powerful rather than broken as all hell. His second ability is, again, sort of Red with the redirection, but countering activated abilities is a Blue ability. Finally, neither Red nor Black can interact with enchantments in any meaningful manner, and red gaining card advantage MUST MUST MUST have drawbacks (discard, random choices) or else it's just Blue.

He also, like Ganonron, does absolutely nothing that's Black.

Finally, as these are supposed to be attached to an entity, they should be Auras that enchant either a creature, a planeswalker, or a player. I actually think they're most interesting as Planeswalker auras. Due to the extreme power levels here, though, the cumulative upkeep costs are perfectly appropriate.

[Qaanol]

That is not even a part of it, throw any number of cards on him and he is a PITA in combat

Moreover, if you put Lure (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=226905) on it, you can cast lots of spells for free because:

509.4d An ability that reads "Whenever [this creature] becomes blocked by a creature, . . ." triggers once for each creature that blocks the named creature.

Also, with the proposed "Boon" card, in any halfway decent Artifact deck you'll be able to play Myr Enforcer (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=46015) on turn 1, and maybe even Mycosynth Golem (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=51136) (or Qumulox (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=47800) or Broodstar (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=46556)), at which point Boon becomes "Draw 3" or "Draw 5" (or "Draw 4" or "Draw 5") for 2 mana. (cf. Thoughtcast (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=46085) which becomes "Draw 2" for 1 mana.)

[orrion]

Also, with the proposed "Boon" card, in any halfway decent Artifact deck you'll be able to play Myr Enforcer (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=46015) on turn 1, and maybe even Mycosynth Golem (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=51136) (or Qumulox (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=47800) or Broodstar (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=46556)), at which point Boon becomes "Draw 3" or "Draw 5" (or "Draw 4" or "Draw 5") for 2 mana. (cf. Thoughtcast (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=46085) which becomes "Draw 2" for 1 mana.)

Meh. That's what restricting/banning it in formats other than type 2 is for (IE Tolarian Academy).

I mean, if you limit the current cards on the basis that there's some other card(s) out there it could be a powerful combo with, then you're gonna be screwed in creating cards.

[ryuplaneswalker]

That's exactly my point. She's too powerful for a format like DOTP, but not powerful enough to actually be good in the real game.

That is not a bad thing, she is Incredibly powerful in limited..and you get one of her to use, like she will win you games if you are smart enough to last long enough to draw her.

[Loreweaver15]

Orrion, here's the reason I think Magic has lasted while Yugioh is in a nonsensical death spiral: a superior design team.

When a card interacts with other cards to lock down a format or be outright broken enough to be banned, Wizards' design team treats that as a mistake to be avoided at all costs. Banning a card at all happens rarely; we've had exactly two cards come out since Mirrodin that are on the Legacy (http://www.wizards.com/Magic/TCG/Resources.aspx?x=judge/resources/sfrlegacy) banlist, for example, and fewer than ten cards from the last five years are currently on the Modern (http://www.wizards.com/Magic/TCG/Resources.aspx?x=judge/resources/sfrmodern) banlist, for what that's worth--not to mention that only three cards have been banned from any Standard format at all in the last five years. Magic's design team deliberately manages power levels to prevent the game from devolving into endless power creep.

Yugioh's, on the other hand, seems to treat the existence of a banlist as an excuse to throw out whatever they want and then ban things later. This has led to endless power creep and a fundamentally shallow and broken game.

So, uh, yeah, I'd say judging cards by what they can do to interact with other cards is the mark of a good design philosophy :P

Also, I didn't really make myself clear. Duels of the Planeswalkers is a very, very good introductory product; it's a great way to learn the game and get a feel for the mechanics, but the decks are built very, very poorly, and the cardbase is very carefully managed so that nothing truly powerful gets put in there--and thus new players have no sense of scale, or what some of the mechanics they're suggesting can do in the hands of somebody who really knows the game.

That's also not their fault. They're new. But it IS something I wish to hammer home, and I hope I haven't been mean in doing so.

[FlawedParadigm]

On Haerta: Exile is not in Black's color pool in general or for creatures in particular.

Sever the Bloodline would like a word with you. Outside. Same with Extirpate.

[orrion]

Sever the Bloodline would like a word with you. Outside. Same with Extirpate.

Oh good, now I don't have to change my made-up black card that exiles! There was much rejoicing.

I would say thet while there is "color pool" stuff, there are always exceptions. When I think "Trample" I think big nasty green creatures and the color I think is least likely to have that is blue cards, but I can go find a handful of blue cards with it. Likewise, blue is primarily the domain of counterspelling, but I can find counterspells in the other colors even if they are usually more restrictive.

[Loreweaver15]

Apologies, Black has ONE exile spell that is VERY flavorful and an exception to the rule; I also neglected to mention Memoricide effects like Extirpate, which are their own whole Thing entirely separate from 'exile target creature'. 'Exile target creature', as a Thing, belongs to White almost exclusively.

Now, on the subject of exceptions to the color pie: yes, but they have to be a) VERY flavorful and b) VERY unique. Some colors get things that other colors do not. Green does not do flying on monogreen cards, for example. It also does not do direct damage to anything but flying; the designers constantly regret printing Hornet Sting. Blue is primary in counterspelling; the only ways other colors get counterspells at all in current Magic is under very, very specific circumstances. For example, Green sort of gets to counter (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=23146) activated (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=46010) abilities (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=50189), sometimes; that hasn't shown up since Mirrodin, however, and was really just a nod to an old Ice Age card-slash-mechanic. Red sort of has Guttural Response (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=158773), which is an update of Pyroblast (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=159243), but again, we haven't seen it do that since Eventide. White's the closest--what with its grand total of two (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=366460) cards (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=175026) that have very odd counterspell effects--but that's it.

You may have noticed I'm not mentioning any of the (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=122287) off-color (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=126812) Planar Chaos (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=124080) counterspells (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=122324), and that's our next design lesson: In 99% of cases, Planar Chaos is cited by the head designer as an experiment with Things Colors Do Not Do, in nearly all cases )a few are updates of old colors into new colors that should Do The Thing, like Prodigal Pyromancer, hence the 99% instead of 100%). The color pie is what separates color identity, part of what makes Magic into a game of resource management instead of a game of Yugioh nonsense. The things a color can and cannot do are part of its identity and balance.

[Oko and Qailee]

Wow, No one did the most important OOTS character to date yet?


Wizard guy U1

2UU: Place target creature from hand onto the battlefield

1/1

I coulda been a baker, you know.

[DoctorWhooves]

Just browsed through this topic...

...That is a LOT of unbalanced cards and out-of-color effects.

[marq]

Apologies, Black has ONE exile spell that is VERY flavorful and an exception to the rule

There's more than that. ASHES TO ASHES from The Dark removed two creatures from the game. And PIT SPAWN from Exodus removed any creature it damaged from the game.

Unless you're going to say that stuff that old doesn't count, in which case, I will just disagree with you.


Now, on the subject of exceptions to the color pie: yes, but they have to be a) VERY flavorful and b) VERY unique. Some colors get things that other colors do not. Green does not do flying on monogreen cards, for example.

SCRYB SPRITES.


The color pie is what separates color identity, part of what makes Magic into a game of resource management instead of a game of Yugioh nonsense. The things a color can and cannot do are part of its identity and balance.

Yes, but there are always exceptions.

More importantly, that is why creating your own Magic cards for non-Magic things is always going to be wrong. These people on this thread are not Magic fans, they are OOTS fans. So they want a card that resembles the characters in the comic. "Who cares about something called 'plain walkers,' we want a Belkar card!" they say.

Realistically, these characters could be shoved into any color depending on interpretation. In Magic, the effects matter more than the name or picture on the card. In Make-your-own-OOTS card, the opposite is true. That's why these cards usually make better Unglued type cards, so you can make a card like Explosive Runes that triggers when the opponent reads it.

Because THAT feels more like the comic than, "Oh, V is green, and green doesn't deal direct damage, so...darn."

And, no offense to you, to worry THAT much about a bunch of people on a non-Magic forum making is unnecessary. I don't think anyone here is making a whole set. They're making one or two cards for important people. Sure, the card they make might be out-of-color, but who cares? Is anyone ever going to play with them?

Now, to comment and say that it's out of color, or a different effect would be better, sure. But c'mon...no need to worry about it.

And even a lot of your complaints are only if you buy into the way Magic is currently designed, and there's a lot of people out there who feel the best designs came much, much earlier than any of this post-2010 stuff.

Other than that, I absolutely LOVE how well you know your stuff. Let's play sometime.

[Thomar_of_Uointer]

It would be interesting to make multiple card versions of each of the characters.

Nale, Evil Twin, UR1
Legendary Human Warrior Rogue Wizard, 3/1
Your opponent may discard a card to tap Nale, Evil Twin.
TU1: Tap X creatures you control, then tap X creatures your opponent controls.
R1: Target attacking creature gains +3/+0 until end of turn if Nale, Evil Twin is tapped.
"No one denies me, Elan. Not father, not you, no one."

Nale, Evil Genius, UUU1
Legendary Human Warrior Rogue Wizard, 1/4
Your opponent may discard a card to tap Nale, Evil Twin.
TU1: Tap X creatures you control, then tap X creatures your opponent controls.
UU: Return target tapped creature to its owner's hand. Draw a card.
"We might have a change of plans."

Nale, Son of Tarqin, UUBB1
Legendary Human Warrior Rogue Wizard, 4/2
Your opponent may discard a card to tap Nale, Son of Tarqin.
TU1: Tap four creatures. For each creature tapped in this manner its owner may draw a card.
BBUU: Exile target tapped creature, then all players draw a card. If the target was a legendary creature then Nale, Son of Tarqin gains four +1/+0 counters.
"I've been thinking about killing you since I was nine years old!"

Even more interesting would be a set of new common, non-legendary cards from the comic for non-plot-critical NPCs and trope spells. You could build an entire block from the OotS universe.

Non-Player Character, W
Human Citizen, 1/1
T: Tap target legendary creature you control. It gains a +1/+1 counter.
"Adventurers. In our town. I think we all know what that means."

Recurring Plot Element, W
Sorcery
Choose up to three cards from your graveyard. Your opponent may exile up to two of them, then put the remainder into your hand.
"It's happened before." - Elan the Bard

Dramatic Musical Cue, R
Instant
All creatures gain +1/+0 until end of turn.
"Elan, stop doing dramatic musical cues for the dead chimera!" - Roy

Start of Darkness, BB2
Sorcery
Search your deck for a legendary creature, reveal it, then put it in your hand. You and your opponent take damage equal to its converted mana cost.
"I ripped off my own living flesh so that I wouldn't have to admit weakness. That's the difference between bonafide true Evil with a capital "E" and your whiny "evil, but for a good cause," crap." - Xykon the Lich

Origin of the PCs, GG2
Sorcery
Search your deck for a legendary creature, reveal it, then put it in your hand. Put a number of +0/+1 tokens equal to its converted mana cost on creatures you control, divided how you choose. Then your opponent may do the same.
"We have a goal?"
"Sure. Why did you think we were here?"

No Cure For The Paladin Blues, UU2
Sorcery
Search your deck for a legendary creature, reveal it, then put it in your hand. You may exile a creature, then your opponent may exile a creature.
"The tragedy here is that this could have been avoided if I had just made a Gather Information check." - Miko the Paladin

War And XPs, RR2
Sorcery
Search your deck for a legendary creature, reveal it, then put it in your hand. You and your opponent each gain a number of 1/1 Soldier tokens equal to its converted mana cost.
"Would you prefer to represent our sacrifice with the red dragon hatchlings or the fiendish boars?"

Don't Split The Party, WW2
Sorcery
Search your deck for a legendary creature, reveal it, then put it in your hand. During your next attack phase and your opponent's next attack phase, the defender must choose to either defend with as many creatures as possible or not defend at all.
"This is the dumbest idea in a long history of dumb ideas." - Belkar Bitterleaf