Adaptation Clarity: Shadowcasters

[Xuldarinar]

Long have I been a fan of the shadowcaster, but it was only recently that I payed much attention to it's adaptations. While adjusting them to become smokecasters or mistcasters is a simple matter of refluffing, the other two mentioned adaptations effect both flavor and mechanics.


First mentioned is an adaptation where shadowcasters might draw their powers from a deity of night, functioning as divine rather than arcane casters. In this, the fluffing is simple enough but what of mechanics? Here, the simplest approach would simply having their mysteries cast as divine spells rather than arcane spells, as much as they are normally anyways, before becoming Sp and Su. But is that the intent or is this adaptation rather to make them a divine spellcasting class, essentially a 'cleric' for deities of night? At that point though, I cannot help but think about domains. That having been said, what deities (or other entities that are worshiped and grant spells, directly or indirectly) are valid for this?

The other mentioned adaptation, which could go hand in hand with the first, is that they may draw from the night itself. Those that do being more potent after sunset but less so during the day. In this, mechanically I'm curious what they had in mind. A simple +1 CL during the night and -1 CL during the day? Would it be unreasonable to combine the two, recasting them as individuals who hold a bond to the night not dissimilar from the druid's bond to nature?

[Gemini476]

Clerics are the only divine spellcasting class that has domains. The other classes that don't have domains are, in no particular order, the Paladin, Archivist, Favored Soul, Adept, Shugenja, Rangers, Druids, Healers, aand I think I forgot one.
My point is, anyway, that being a divine class by no means implies domains. In this case, it seems to just be switching the spells from arcane to divine (nixing ASF in the process).
Since Shadowcasters do not count as arcane spellcasters nor divine for requirments, no change is needed there.

Also, a "cleric of the night" would likely just be a Cleric. Darkness is an appropriate domain, for instance.

As for the weaker-during-the-day thing, I have no clue.

[Xuldarinar]

Clerics are the only divine spellcasting class that has domains. The other classes that don't have domains are, in no particular order, the Paladin, Archivist, Favored Soul, Adept, Shugenja, Rangers, Druids, Healers, aand I think I forgot one.
My point is, anyway, that being a divine class by no means implies domains. In this case, it seems to just be switching the spells from arcane to divine (nixing ASF in the process).
Since Shadowcasters do not count as arcane spellcasters nor divine for requirments, no change is needed there.

Also, a "cleric of the night" would likely just be a Cleric. Darkness is an appropriate domain, for instance.

As for the weaker-during-the-day thing, I have no clue.

Your right, sort of, on the first point. Clerics typically are the only ones with domains. Druids can, but thats something mentioned in UA briefly as an idea/suggestion/'houserule'. Archivists can learn the spells anyways. The rest, nothing short of PrCs (or feats), to my knowledge. I know making it divine doesn't imply domains, but the notion just brought it to mind for me. A cleric of the night certainly would likely just be a cleric, but still shadowcasters could take on that flavor. Darkness, shadow, vile darkness, and so on are definitely appropriate domains. If we at all pay attention to the cleric/shadowcaster/mystic theurge restriction then Knowledge, Magic, and Illusion are also suitable domains. Not to mention the moon domain, and if we stretch things the cold, ocean, sky, winter and water domains could be argued for (and more). Though what entities that can sponsor divine spellcasters (Deities, Archfiends, Demon Lords, ect.) are/can be associated with night? Almost certainly Pelor is right out.

[Psyren]

Shar, Mask, Tenebrous, the Dark Six... anybody associated with shadow will do, I'd say.

+CL at night/-CL in the daytime is the most logical expression of that ability. I would also let them avoid the CL penalty if they stick to shadows, or wear that goop that vampires can put on to walk around in daytime.

[peacenlove]

The other mentioned adaptation, which could go hand in hand with the first, is that they may draw from the night itself. Those that do being more potent after sunset but less so during the day. In this, mechanically I'm curious what they had in mind. A simple +1 CL during the night and -1 CL during the day? Would it be unreasonable to combine the two, recasting them as individuals who hold a bond to the night not dissimilar from the druid's bond to nature?

You can also draw ideas from Faerun's Shadow weave magic (+1/-1 CL/penetration, additional feats to enhance effects cast at night or shadow illumination (dim light for PF terminology) rather than specific schools).

Bond with shadow can be expressed by making the Master of Shadow PRC a 20 level base class with mechanics similar to shadowcaster but with a shadow companion instead of the usual class features. Might expand on that by selecting different companions (low int incorporeals, shadow beasts and so on) but the balancing would be a nightmare.

[Gemini476]

Bond with shadow can be expressed by making the Master of Shadow PRC a 20 level base class with mechanics similar to shadowcaster but with a shadow companion instead of the usual class features. Might expand on that by selecting different companions (low int incorporeals, shadow beasts and so on) but the balancing would be a nightmare.

Wouldn't that basically be the Shadowcasting version of the Druid/Summoner? I'm not sure that it's even possible to balance pets in 3.5. I certainly understand why 4E struck down so hard on it, at least.

[peacenlove]

Wouldn't that basically be the Shadowcasting version of the Druid/Summoner? I'm not sure that it's even possible to balance pets in 3.5. I certainly understand why 4E struck down so hard on it, at least.

You can't. Nature's bond Fleshraker is basically a given for 1st level druid with 2 books (MM3 and Races of Wild IIRC) and it overshadows everyone in the party, including the druid, the Shadowcasting version will have similar problems (or even worse since the shadow companion is incorporeal). The good side is that is ineligible for the Shadow Grasp feat, with its low charisma. Lastly it evens out and is left behind the more levels you gain since a shadowcaster does not possess the potency of buffs a druid has.