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Kaveman26
2014-01-09, 03:30 PM
Hypothetically if a super computer had tracked every game of d and d 3.0 and later and calculated the single most commonly cast spell and the single least used spell ever what do you think they would be?

sideswipe
2014-01-09, 03:34 PM
probably detect magic. from 1st to 20th its a brilliant spell, always used. use it rather than identify with an certificates monocle. it can be used to trap find magic traps if no rogue.
and warlocks and a few other things get it as an at will ability. at that point its just spam spam spam.

Bakkan
2014-01-09, 03:34 PM
Most Cast: Probably Magic Missle, given how it's a level 1 spell and one of the most iconic Wizard spells.

Least Cast: Hard to say, probably some obscure spell from a random setting sourcebook. I imagine there are spells that have literally been cast in a real game less than 5 times.

<nitpick> When a warlock uses his detect magic ability, it's a spell-like ability, not a spell.</nitpick>

sideswipe
2014-01-09, 03:38 PM
<nitpick> When a warlock uses his detect magic ability, it's a spell-like ability, not a spell.</nitpick>

in that case we cannot include manifestations, any alternate magic's, or initiations.
if not detect magic then its cure light wounds. especially if you are counting it as "cast" when they make the potion. or the wand

Darth Stabber
2014-01-09, 04:17 PM
A lot of this depends on how broad a net we are willing to cast. The most cast spell is undoubtedly a core spell, probably either detect magic or cure light wounds. The least used spell is a more finicky classification. Find the poorest selling book that contains new spells and pick the most obviously bad spell in that book and you probably have a winner.

Kaveman26
2014-01-09, 04:22 PM
Limited to core only for worst spell. That should narrow down list.

Icewraith
2014-01-09, 04:22 PM
Greater Arcane Fusion.

All someone has to do is pull off the infinite loop trick once ever at a real gaming table before the DM bans it to win, since it is by definition cast an infinite number of times.

Edit:

Core only? By similar reasoning, technically wish.

Eliminating table shenanigans, I agree with Detect Magic.

Double Edit: Core only for worst?

Potentially Wierd, or perhaps one of the Summon ____ 9 spells? You tend to get very little bang for your 9th level spell slot IIRC.

Darth Stabber
2014-01-09, 04:38 PM
Can't say with any sort of certainty but shambler (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/shambler.htm) seems crappy, and I have never seen it used, nor heard of it being used. Getting 1d4 cr6 critters for a 9th level slot seems pretty aweful, and only druids and plant domain clerics have access.

Hamste
2014-01-09, 05:06 PM
Not that bad, the long duration makes it somewhat worth it in that you can spam it for all its worth the day before entering the dungeon (so you can get your ninths back). They will die horrible but assuming four castings with an average of 4.5 made that means you have 18 disposable minions at the expense of having to have a day to prepare. Give them each a +1 shocking weapon which they constantly lick (gets expensive so not required but a nice touch)

Want to set up a good guard that lasts awhile? Shambler is good for that as well, a single month spent just casting Shambler will net the same druid mentioned before 72 shambling mounds. Then pair them up with a nice electricity trap/monster and they become good guardians for the next 6 months.

Grek
2014-01-09, 05:11 PM
I submit that the least cast Core only spell would be Holy Sword, which can only be cast by a paladin of 14th level or higher.

Humble Master
2014-01-09, 05:24 PM
Most cast would definitely by from core and would probably fall to Detect Magic, Light, Magic Missile or Cure Light Wounds.

Least cast from core. Hmm, that's a hard one. I'm tempted to say Ventriloquism as it isn't really ever useful except in very specific situations.

SamsDisciple
2014-01-09, 05:35 PM
For most cast I am jumping on the bandwagon that votes for cure light wounds, especially if wands are involved.
I would look at high level ranger spells since I have never seen a ranger played who focused on his spells. (Several ever even remembered they had any)
And I would like to say that ventriloquism is used all the time by annoying illusionists

incarnate236
2014-01-09, 05:36 PM
I think since about level three my current character has used Detect Magic every single session. I would think least used spell if we are going beyond core, might be one of the cantrips that aren't in the Player's Handbook. Many players wouldn't know about them at the level cantrips are likely to be utilized often and most of them aren't very impressive anyways.

Elderand
2014-01-09, 05:38 PM
I think read magic is probably a serious contender for the title of most used spell.

Least used ? A worthless 9th level spell exclusive to a subpar class.

Slipperychicken
2014-01-09, 05:47 PM
The least-used spell in core? I think Sympathy (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/sympathy.htm) would be a strong contender. It's high-level, has an extremely situational and useless effect, and takes 1500gp per casting.

Commune With Nature (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/communeWithNature.htm) is another one, because it's so useless.

Chronos
2014-01-09, 06:43 PM
Commune with Nature is plenty useful. In many situations, it'll let you find the villains anywhere within a radius of many miles.

And Read Magic is used a lot, but I can't think of many situations it's likely to be used without also using Detect Magic.

Elderand
2014-01-09, 06:59 PM
Commune with Nature is plenty useful. In many situations, it'll let you find the villains anywhere within a radius of many miles.

And Read Magic is used a lot, but I can't think of many situations it's likely to be used without also using Detect Magic.

Everytime a wizard need to learn a new spell ?

Icewraith
2014-01-09, 07:16 PM
What about Heal Mount?

It requires a high level paladin who actually gets to use his mount in combat regularly, and requires the mount to be wounded instead of killed outright, and requires the paladin to blow a standard action in combat healing his mount instead of himself since outside combat he can just burn part of a wand of CLW. It also requires that at very high levels, the Cleric isn't just busting out Mass Heal.

Sympathy is really nasty when combined with any sort of pressure plate or for giggles, a sphere of annihilation (it doesn't require touch).

sideswipe
2014-01-09, 07:21 PM
Everytime a wizard need to learn a new spell ?

i believe that wizards do not need to cast read magic to read a scroll.

they have to decipher magical writings, and this can be done with a spellcraft check.

so to learn a spell its either read magic and then spell craft at the end of the day.
Or it can be 2 spellcraft checks.

Osiris
2014-01-09, 07:21 PM
TELEPORT. Every wizard EVER who could cast this ended up casting this at least once. Other choices are Magic Missile (for ghosts and mirror images) and invisibility. I dunno, but all MY wizards have Black Tentacles.

Hand_of_Vecna
2014-01-09, 07:24 PM
Everytime a wizard need to learn a new spell ?

You use Spellcraft to learn spells not Read Magic, it's a day long process. Read Magic can be used to identify spells, but it's a fall back after you've failed your Spellcraft check.

Even so, learning new spells happens zero to maybe a few dozen times on a very long lived character. At an absolute bare minimum, Detect Magic gets cast at the end of every dungeon crawling "day" on the pile o' loot.

I'll ditto CLW, since it's the go to source of out of combat healing.

No idea on least. In 2nd Ed I'd put forward Familiar Enhancer III. It had a permanent effect, so you scribed it and only cast it once unless you outlived your familiar.

Well out of core, maybe the spell that's like water breathing for aquatics, then again a few fluke campaigns would probably throw that number way off.

Sith_Happens
2014-01-09, 07:27 PM
i believe that wizards do not need to cast read magic to read a scroll.

they have to decipher magical writings, and this can be done with a spellcraft check.

so to learn a spell its either read magic and then spell craft at the end of the day.
Or it can be 2 spellcraft checks.

The DC to decipher a scroll is non-trivial until mid-levels, though.

Dalebert
2014-01-09, 08:23 PM
Has the 2.0 version of Flame Arrow as a 3rd level spell EVER been cast? That's my pick for least cast. Touch an arrow head and make it flaming. It does no extra damage but it can ignite stuph. You can ignite one arrow per segment. The arrow is consumed within one round if not fired. Duration of the spell is 1 segment per level when 1 segment is a tenth of a combat round. :smallconfused:

HunterOfJello
2014-01-09, 08:35 PM
Used?

Commonly Prepared: Light

For wands: Lesser Vigor is tops blooby.

For scrolls: Control Undead is the ultimate choice, but may not be the most common

Thanatosia
2014-01-09, 10:23 PM
Haste might be a good canidate... fairly low level, broadly useful, very potent aoe party buff. Often quickened at higher levels. If SLAs count, then even more so as many higher level monsters seem to be granted some form of haste power.

But even above that - I'd say either Cure Light Wounds or Lesser Vigor, depending on how optimized the overall average campaign in the world is. Not only cast frequently by low level healbots, but endlessly from wands and other sources. It's pretty much how hp gets recovered for most parties.

Aasimar
2014-01-09, 10:37 PM
Light
Detect magic
Cure light wounds
Magic missile (from all those people who tried to create contingencies upon contingencies to see how many magic missiles could be cast in a round...I forget what the end result was, but it was in the thousands I think)

Thurbane
2014-01-09, 11:20 PM
I'm also going to say Detect Magic, by quite some margin.

Drachasor
2014-01-09, 11:22 PM
Cure Light Wounds easily wins. It is cast a lot more than Detect Magic, especially when you consider wands (and CLW wands are used more than Vigor Wands, imho).

EugeneVoid
2014-01-09, 11:30 PM
Prestidigitation?

Look up the EVD (I think that's what it's called) for more uses of it.

CaptnQ!

WildPyre
2014-01-09, 11:59 PM
If you count Pathfinder into this, then 0 level spells take a huge leap in times used, bringing Detect Magic and Prestidigitation way to the front.

Incorrect
2014-01-10, 05:30 AM
Cure Light Wounds.
In my experience, each high level combat is usually followed by draining at least 50 wand charges. That adds up.

Dr. Cliché
2014-01-10, 06:33 AM
Prestidigitation?

Look up the EVD (I think that's what it's called) for more uses of it.

CaptnQ!

Sorry, but what's the EVD?

Killer Angel
2014-01-10, 07:05 AM
Cure light wounds.
Fireball.


Can't say with any sort of certainty but shambler (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/shambler.htm) seems crappy, and I have never seen it used,

look at the duration... You can create an army. :smallamused:

Gwendol
2014-01-10, 07:07 AM
Cure light wounds has to be the most cast, followed by detect magic.

Least cast? I'm going with high level ranger or paladin only spells, especially the former.

Grizzled Gryphon
2014-01-10, 07:19 AM
I would also say that CLW wins. Yeah, Detect magic is probably second, but that isn't something that a caster blows all their slots on at low levels like CLW. How many clerics use most of their slots for that spell? Even when they get second and third level spells, they are still casting CLW a lot.

As for least cast... Probably something like Protection from Law. not sure I have heard of anyone even taking that spell.

Ydaer Ca Noit
2014-01-10, 05:11 PM
For a moment I was expecting mage armor to win this (ok you cast it only once, but you have it in every battle so...), but if we count wands obviously cure spells win

The Trickster
2014-01-10, 07:33 PM
3.5? Cure Light Wounds or Detect Magic. CLW is used a lot early in games, Detect magic a lot as the game gets higher leveled.

Pathfinder? Detect Magic spam FTW.

Urpriest
2014-01-10, 10:04 PM
Depends on what counts as a game. If you need the full "people sitting around a table, DM and players and a social contract", then it's probably Cure Light Wounds, maybe Detect Magic.

If, on the other hand, optimization exercises count (we're playing the game too! Just differently...) then it's probably some spell that's part of some ungodly loop. Arcane Fusion if you count infinities, though at that point anything that gets to infinite status is indistinguishable.

Come to think of it, there are people who play at TO-ish op-levels. Tippy has probably cast infinite spells at one point in an actual game, if his games don't routinely ban infinite loops.

Darth Stabber
2014-01-11, 01:28 AM
I highly doubt that any character, tippy related or not, has actually used anything technically infinite. Much like in M:tG there is no infinite only "arbitrarily large", as it it can go as many times as you want, but you must end the loop at a real number (like say 6.022*10^23, so you can deal a mole of damage let's say). So actual infinity is not a problem. The issue becomes the number of people playing vs. How often open ended loops are allowed. Assuming we use a conservative estimate of number of iterations of an open ended loops as the minimum needed to achieve the desired result without risk of failure (or minimum risk of failure if no amount of loops completely removes the risk), all of a sudden detect magic and cure light wounds come back into the running. So the the real question is do we count superfluous iterations or not? I personally would not count them as they don't actually have any effect other than showing that you are trying to compensate for something, and we are already dealing with arbitrary figures.

Now if we run into a situation where the loop's odds of achieving a desired result are asymptotic to 100% then we have another question. For example regardless of what the save modifier is there is a non-zero chance of failing and non-zero chance of succeeding any saving throw against a finger of death spell. If you had an openended loop that cast finger of death at an enemy with each iteration the odds of them succeeding never actually reaches 0. Same with any die roll that has auto fail/success options. In these scenarios the question becomes how close to 100% do the odds have to be before the GM says "F' it he's dead". Personally I would say 99.99, but I avoid using the 3rd decimal place when i'm not doing something important (building things, designing things, taxes).

Urpriest
2014-01-11, 07:52 PM
There's a guy on this forum who in-game made an army of something like 7 billion Awakened constructs. Just to give a rough estimate for the scales of some of these loops.

How many D&D players are there in the world? It's got to only be a few million, right?

Darth Stabber
2014-01-11, 07:59 PM
There's a guy on this forum who in-game made an army of something like 7 billion Awakened constructs. Just to give a rough estimate for the scales of some of these loops.

How many D&D players are there in the world? It's got to only be a few million, right?

Did he need all 7 billion? If not than we need only count the minimum needed to accomplish the goal without risk of failure or a failure chance of 0.01% for the sake of mathematical ease in asymptotic failure chances. I believe this is a fair compromise when arguing the validity of loops.

Urpriest
2014-01-11, 08:34 PM
Did he need all 7 billion? If not than we need only count the minimum needed to accomplish the goal without risk of failure or a failure chance of 0.01% for the sake of mathematical ease in asymptotic failure chances. I believe this is a fair compromise when arguing the validity of loops.

See, I think your criterion makes sense when applied to damage or the like: no need for more spells than are necessary to kill your target, after all. But when your goal is "bestow upon the Forgotten Realms a new people, conceived in Tippy-esque magics, founded on the principle that all constructs are created equal..." and you then create 7 billion, and that specific number has plot implications afterward...at that point it's not a matter of whether you're "showing off" or not, it's a matter of whether the higher number ends up changing anything meaningful. And if you've been following the "what do I do now?" threads on this topic, it absolutely did.

Darth Stabber
2014-01-11, 08:44 PM
Fair enough.

Bakkan
2014-01-12, 02:10 AM
If, on the other hand, optimization exercises count (we're playing the game too! Just differently...) then it's probably some spell that's part of some ungodly loop. Arcane Fusion if you count infinities, though at that point anything that gets to infinite status is indistinguishable.

In theory, if someone was able to cast uncountably many spells, that would be larger than most of the infinites that are possible.


I highly doubt that any character, tippy related or not, has actually used anything technically infinite. Much like in M:tG there is no infinite only "arbitrarily large", as it it can go as many times as you want, but you must end the loop at a real number (like say 6.022*10^23, so you can deal a mole of damage let's say). So actual infinity is not a problem.

I don't know about actually infinite spells (I suspect something's possible with nested Energy Transformation Fields), but actually infinite (aleph-null) damage is achievable via the 1d2 Crusader combo.

(For that matter, literally infinite chains can happen in M:tG too: If there's an Oblivion Ring on the field with an Oblivion Ring linked to it, and if there are no other nonland permanents in play, then if someone plays another Oblivion Ring they will cycle indefinitely, causing the game to end in a draw because continuing would require you to keep doing that cycle forever.)

tiercel
2014-01-12, 02:57 AM
As the least common Core spell...

How many times has freedom been cast in any game, ever? (Other than a particular quest usage in Baldur's Gate II?)

Do PCs ever find use for storm of vengeance? (As a plot point/adventure hook/NPC spell, perhaps.)

Relative to the level of access to the spell, I imagine magic stone has to be one of the least-cast spells. (Even magic weapon must see more play, even if rarely and nearly only ever at 1st level.)

supervillan
2014-01-12, 01:19 PM
Most used is probably CLW, Detect Magic a close second.

Least used, core only, I'm going for either Virtue or Know Direction. There is always a more useful 0-level spell to choose. I've never seen either of these prepared. Any character who could potentially cast Know Direction probably has enough Survival skill and/or Wis bonus to render the spell redundant.

Telonius
2014-01-12, 01:50 PM
Can't say with any sort of certainty but shambler (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/shambler.htm) seems crappy, and I have never seen it used, nor heard of it being used. Getting 1d4 cr6 critters for a 9th level slot seems pretty aweful, and only druids and plant domain clerics have access.

I've actually seen this used to excellent effect in combat once. The players were going up against a Lightning-Bolt-happy caster. Operation: Hide Behind the Plant was a huge success.

nedz
2014-01-12, 02:27 PM
Most used: probably CLW or Lesser Vigor.


There's a guy on this forum who in-game made an army of something like 7 billion Awakened constructs. Just to give a rough estimate for the scales of some of these loops.

How many D&D players are there in the world? It's got to only be a few million, right?

How many NPCs are in any given setting ?
Several billion I'd guess, including all of the planes.
And each game has it's own setting.

Now most of this casting will be off screen, but then so were more of the 7 billion Awakened constructs I guess.

The OP never mentioned PCs.

As for the least cast ?
Probably some useless level 9 spell: Weird maybe ?
Many games never see 9th being cast, so there is less opportunity.


Commune With Nature (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/communeWithNature.htm) is another one, because it's so useless.

My high level Ranger casts this all of the time, well 1/day quite often. It's very good for finding party members who've gone and got themselves lost in the forest.

137beth
2014-01-12, 03:22 PM
Detect Magic or CLW.

If pathfinder counts, then detect magic.

Hamste
2014-01-12, 04:39 PM
As the least common Core spell...

How many times has freedom been cast in any game, ever? (Other than a particular quest usage in Baldur's Gate II?)

Do PCs ever find use for storm of vengeance? (As a plot point/adventure hook/NPC spell, perhaps.)

Relative to the level of access to the spell, I imagine magic stone has to be one of the least-cast spells. (Even magic weapon must see more play, even if rarely and nearly only ever at 1st level.)

Magic stone doesn't care what size you are and allows massive (for level 1) damage against undead at range which gives it a nice advantage. It's quite useful for small creatures who don't have a strength negative (or even better they have a strength bonus) and I have seen it used a lot when we know undead are coming. I consider the spell quite better than magic weapon

TypoNinja
2014-01-12, 05:53 PM
I'd say Magic missile, CLW, and Grease for most commonly cast spells.

Magic missile keeps its utility for a long time with the whole never miss bit, And I'm a huge fan of fell draining magic missiles to spread a whole pile of negative levels around. Great debuff to a group.

CLW is probably the most spammed for after combat heals, Lesser vigor is by far superior, but in my experience much less well known.

I use grease more than detect magic. In a campaign that's gone up to the mid teens in levels I still use grease more often than not. It might be just me but I freaking love that spell.

Least used? Probably some 9th level spell, just on sheer statistics. Getting to 9's tend to be near the of a campaign. Even a really popular 9 like Time Stop or Energy Drain are still going to be buried under a simple Fireball in terms of number of castings. I'd guess Powerword Kill. What the hell are you fighting at that level with less than 100 HP?

paddyfool
2014-01-12, 06:29 PM
Sympathetic Vibration (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/sympatheticVibration.htm) may also be one of the least used in Core, since it's the only Bard-only level 6 Bard spell, and kind of niche. Awesome though it is should you find a need to bring the house (or fortress/secret volcano lair/whatever) down.

Level 6 Bard-only spells may well see less play even than level 4 Paladin-only spells. Both are only available from level 16 of a specific class, but Bards only know a certain number of spells on their list, while Paladins can prepare whatever they like from their list.

Togo
2014-01-12, 07:19 PM
I have played games in which holy sword, sympathetic vibration, storm of vengence, shambler, and, yes... freedom, were all used. In some cases regularly.

Holy sword is a great spell if you get paladin spells without being a paladiin - ie chameleon or Pious templar PrC or similar.

Storm of vengence is the spell embedded in the Orb of storms, a useful core item for getting storm effects in a game that involves a lot of ships.

Freedom came up as a 9th level choice for a divine crusader, who didn't have much choice in his spells. It was used to free people from an imprisonment.

I've also played games that created multiple universes filled with infinitely continuously recast spells, including cure light wounds. Tippy is just one cast member amongst many in these kinds of comparisons.

Hamste
2014-01-12, 08:14 PM
Darsson's line of spells from Shining South get very little player use (Bonus points if you can name one with out searching it up). If I ever DM 3.5 however I know I would have every one of my high level wizards prepare and cast them every day. Animate City sees very little use (Requiring the city domain level 9), Moonfire is a 9th level moon domain spell, Sanctify the wicked is also rarely used due to the cost and due to needing the sanctified domain

On most commonly used...probably detect magic or cure light wounds (By players and not counting near infinite loops)