How to Boost Pistol Damage? 3.5

[roguemetal]

I'm going to be in a campaign shortly where the DM has allowed us to use all 3.5 material, even Dragon Magazine, (no Pathfinder) with the only restriciton being that we don't make the new guys feel useless. (pretty tall order) In addition, they stated that while using the D&D rules, any location on Earth is a viable birthplace. So, I decided to attempt to challenge myself to make a ranged gish-like build using the alternate setting Automatic Pistol in the DMG pg. 147.

Sadly, this has become a bigger issue than I expected, as most feats, spells, etc. that involve ranged weapons only apply to bows, arrows, crosswbows, or bolts. Even several weapon properties don't work on the pistol.

So, I defer to the community.
Is there a way to make the Automatic Pistol a viable weapon?

[Snowbluff]

Knowledge Devotion and Travel Devotion!

[roguemetal]

Knowledge Devotion certainly works, but how does Travel Devotion help?

[Gazzien]

Swift-action movement to keep your Full Attacks.

[Kioras]

Since they allow all 3.5 material, do they allow d20 modern?

If they do, should have some gun related stuff in there.

[roguemetal]

Since they allow all 3.5 material, do they allow d20 modern?

Sadly they are not. :smallfrown:

[Snowbluff]

Knowledge Devotion certainly works, but how does Travel Devotion help?

You can reload a pistol with the move action as well.

Also, dual wield them and take the Dead Eye feat from Dragon Compendium (which was errataed to require only 1 BAB).

[Xerlith]

You can reload a pistol with the move action as well.


Travel devotion grants the ability to move up to your speed, not a move action.

[Snowbluff]

Travel devotion grants the ability to move up to your speed, not a move action.

:o You're right. My bad. Take it anyway.

[roguemetal]

Also, dual wield them and take the Dead Eye feat from Dragon Compendium (which was errataed to require only 1 BAB).

That seems heavily feat intensive for a gish.
I'm hoping to be using something like Persisted Divine Power (gained with Extra Spell) and various buffs so I don't need to worry about hit chance, but even then several feats for MAD damage bonus doesn't seem great.

[(Un)Inspired]

I would go factotum 8/martial monk 2/X 10

Take knowledge devotion and deadeye; make sure you add splitting and collision to your pistol.

okay now take as many shots as you can. you get to add your dex+int+10 to damage and all your shots get doubled.

Edit: if you want to be a gish make your last 10 levels ardent. Now in addition to all the bullet based nastiness you can unload, you can also manifest 9th level powers.

[PairO'Dice Lost]

Edit: if you want to be a gish make your last 10 levels ardent. Now in addition to all the bullet based nastiness you can unload, you can also manifest 9th level powers.

That won't work, unfortunately; 10 levels of ardent plus 4 from Practiced Manifester doesn't give you the ML 17 you need to learn a 9th-level power.

[DeltaEmil]

The Automatic Pistol and every other non-renaissance firearm in the 3.5 DMG 1 has stats that are from D20 Modern and are not correctly compatible with 3.5. You'll notice how the range increment on modern era weapons is smaller than that of renaissance weapons, because D20 Modern uses its own rules regarding range increments and damage that are separate from 3.0/3.5.

So for starter, if you use 3.5 weaponry (like crossbows, swords, longbows, wands of magic missile, muskets, automatic rifles, antimatter rifle and so on), all those post-renaissance firearms must be corrected with a far more increased range increment.

[(Un)Inspired]

That won't work, unfortunately; 10 levels of ardent plus 4 from Practiced Manifester doesn't give you the ML 17 you need to learn a 9th-level power.

That's why you add in overchannel and the psiotheurgist and practiced spellcaster (for ardent or factotum or both) feats. Your manifest level will be in the 30s and you can easily pull 9th level powers almost instantly.

[Metahuman1]

honestly, I'd get a ton of flintlock pistols instead, get travel and knowledge devotion, then go swift hunter and TWF + a couple of basic ranged feats like precise shot.

[PairO'Dice Lost]

That's why you add in overchannel and the psiotheurgist and practiced spellcaster (for ardent or factotum or both) feats. Your manifest level will be in the 30s and you can easily pull 9th level powers almost instantly.

Psiotheurgist will definitely work; Overchannel is up to DM judgment, since it's not a constant ML boost and would thus be like a wizard with 15 Int using a casting of fox's cunning to qualify to learn a 9th level spell.

Regardless, my post was mostly to point out that 10 levels of ardent on its own won't qualify you for 9s, you'll need to jump through a bunch of hoops first.

[roguemetal]

Awesome ideas from everyone.
I think I'll give that Factotum build a shot.

[Scalpless]

You could use a weapon with the Aptitude special ability from Tome of Battle. It allows you to apply any feat you've got to the enchanted weapon. You could, for example, use Chakram Ricochet from Champions of Ruin to bounce your bullets around or Rapid Reload for free action reloading.

It's pretty cheap, too. Just a +1.

[(Un)Inspired]

Psiotheurgist will definitely work; Overchannel is up to DM judgment, since it's not a constant ML boost and would thus be like a wizard with 15 Int using a casting of fox's cunning to qualify to learn a 9th level spell.

Regardless, my post was mostly to point out that 10 levels of ardent on its own won't qualify you for 9s, you'll need to jump through a bunch of hoops first.

Fair enough.

[Azoth]

See if he will let you put Self Loading and Quick Loading on the pistol. That way it free action reloads itself and has a 100 round clip size. You even get to designate which type of ammo stored within the clip is fired with each shot.

It might be worth it to ask if you can reskin arcane archer to work with fire arms for a 2 level dip. Put AoE spells in your bullet's as a standard action.

If you can get PGtF allowed and don't mind a divine gish, Rune Caster is a fun option for 8 levels. Put any divine spell you know on a bullet as a 1 shot item in 10 minutes. By 8th level you can set any trigger you want to set the rune off aside having it strike an enemy. Still fun for all kinds of shenanigans.