I think that Vaarsuvius might be a man.

[Hyena]

I've been leaning on V being a woman until I began re-reading the comic and stumbled upon this strip. (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/images/oots0086.gif)
See how everyone is looking nervous? Everyone but Haley - because she is a woman and therefore does not have a line to stand in?

[Keltest]

V doesn't need to use the bathroom though. His "noble Elven metabolism" is far more efficient.

[Composer99]

Strip #86 does not appear to be conclusive evidence of Vaarsuvius' sex or gender.

I might add that the very next strip (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0087.html) shows that Haley does indeed have to deal with a line-up (parodying what is often jokingly described as a near-universal experience of women using public washrooms).

(As an aside, I just realized that strip #87 is the source of the joke in this strip (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0683.html), nearly, what, 10 years later or so.)

[DaggerPen]

It seems likely that V was originally intended to be male (to my dismay, since I originally read V as female), but since V didn't need to use the restroom either way, I wouldn't call it much evidence either way.

For the record, the reasons I think V was originally meant to be male:
1. Before Rich started OOTS, he did stick figure avatars for his forums. All the female stick figures with robes had defined breasts, which V does not.
2. Men tend to have squarer bodies; women have rounder bodies, excepting Hilgya, who had armor and came later in the strip.
3. Men, as Rich has said, have their eyes higher up in the head than women. Check out Roy wearing the sex-changing belt to see the eye position change. V's eyes are in the male position.
4. Rich originally thought V's gender was obvious - he did not intend for V to be ambiguous. So the male body pattern layout for V was not intentional misdirection.
5. Most tellingly, every time Rich has forgotten to use the s/he pattern when describing V, he has used "he" or "his." If it were just random typos, I'd expect the occasional "she" or "her" in there, but it's always "he," "him" or "his."

It also seems likely that Inkyrius is also male, having the same body pattern, and that V is either gay or bisexual (I lean towards gay, because Haley doesn't seem like the type to room with V were V potentially interested, married or not, but V doesn't seem like the type to be particularly fussy about gender, either.)

[Loreweaver15]

V's expression in 86 is because V is annoyed at the triviality of the problem.

[ChristianSt]

If you think Vaarsuvius is male, than you can certainly think so.
But I don't think we ever will see an answer on this, so I think the most correct form is still "ambiguously gendered" and will stay that way.


[If someone would force me at gunpoint to decide between male/female, I would say he/she is female (don't know exactly why, but it just feels a bit better to me)]

[Hyena]

I also originally thought that V is female - mostly because of hair. Which is weird, because IRL I've always sported a pretty similiar hairstyle. The fact that V is supposed to be genderly ambigious didn't hit me until some years after I
began reading the comic.

And yes, kudos to everyone who pointed out that V does not, in fact, use bathroom in the next strip.

Offtopic: Oh, and by the way. Who is the stone woman in the next strip? Is this a half-golem?

[DaggerPen]

I also originally thought that V is female - mostly because of hair. Which is weird, because IRL I've always sported a pretty similiar hairstyle. The fact that V is supposed to be genderly ambigious didn't hit me until some years after I
began reading the comic.

And yes, kudos to everyone who pointed out that V does not, in fact, use bathroom in the next strip.

I originally thought V was clearly female until around the "team eagerly tries to see which restroom V uses" joke, which is when I started to clue in to the running gag, though I didn't realize V's gender was up in the air until much later.

I think V was intended to be male, but since Rich is never going to confirm it either way, I'll live in denial. :smalltongue:

(As for the stone woman question, she's a regular goblin who should have perhaps thought better about staring too hard at that medusa in front of her.)

[Sadsharks]

I've been leaning on V being a woman until I began re-reading the comic and stumbled upon this strip. (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/images/oots0086.gif)
See how everyone is looking nervous? Everyone but Haley - because she is a woman and therefore does not have a line to stand in?

I'm kinda confused about what you're trying to say and I'm not entirely sure you're serious. Nobody looks nervous at all. Nobody's expression except for Belkar's implies nervousness, and he's obviously only nervous because of the close call. Roy and Durkon's faces are blank and emotionless. Elan's is sympathetic. Haley seems to be glad that they got there in time. V's expression looks like annoyance to me. V is only irritated because what she thought would be a massive threat turned out to be a trivial joke. Also, V probably knows she doesn't need to use the bathroom because of her metabolism, so there's no reason she would be worried about lines.

P.S. You seem to be mixed about who does and doesn't have a line: there's nothing to imply that there were lines in the male bathroom, while Haley is clearly shown standing in a line.

And finally, please ignore me if this was just a joke thread.

[eaglewingz]

It seems likely that V was originally intended to be male

I tend to agree with this interpretation.

Roy referring to V as "V-Man" in strip 9 (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0009.html) and "dog" in strip 20 (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0020.html) seems to imply the Giant originally wrote V as masculine. There's also the "smurfette" comment from the Giant.

If the Playground ambiguous gender discussion started before strip 9 then this could be totally off. Not to mention the retcon of it only showing Roy's view of V's gender.

[Sunken Valley]

I used to think V was female because of the Dragon magazine comics (V wants shampoo as treasure and qualifies for the Uptight English Teacher PrC). Looking at the comics, V is clearly male.

Why? Because the Rich Burlew who wrote "Evan's Spiked Tentacles of Forced Intrusion" and thought it was funny at all would never have been progressive enough to write a group of protagonists with more than one female.

The Rich Burlew who wrote Start of Darkness would have been progressive enough to make V gay in 2009 with a square bodied, male partner.

[Bulldog Psion]

Nice try, but ... I don't think so. V is just irritated at the situation in general, with all the drama over a full bladder or whatever. There's nothing in either strip to suggest which bathroom the elf would use if they didn't have a "noble elven metabolism." And even if they picked one, I'd guess that it would be chosen on the basis of something other than sex -- by length of line, cleanliness, arcane power attunement, whatever -- since V perceives neither sex nor gender.

[Kish]

Why? Because the Rich Burlew who wrote "Evan's Spiked Tentacles of Forced Intrusion" and thought it was funny at all would never have been progressive enough to write a group of protagonists with more than one female.
Yeah, he totally didn't write a group of protagonists with four men and two women in Five Foot Steps around the same time.

(Oh wait.)

[Jay R]

If Vaarsuvius's gender doesn't matter to Vaarsuvius, then I can't imagine how it could possibly matter to me.

[Cerussite]

Haley doesn't seem like the type to room with V were V potentially interested, married or not
Unless she secretly wanted to get it on with him/her! Her whole arc with Elan just happened because she never got V to become interested in her.

[Sunken Valley]

Yeah, he totally didn't write a group of protagonists with four men and two women in Five Foot Steps around the same time.

(Oh wait.)

Nice Try. He wrote 5 foot steps in 2005/6. In 2003, Rich wasn't as accomplished a writer.

[DaggerPen]

A lot of Rich's groups seem to have a 2 women/4 men breakdown (Five Foot Steps, the initial Linear Guild, the Laurinear Guild, various random adventuring parties we've seen), but, well, I've already outlined my reasons above for thinking V was meant to be male.

Re: the V-Man comment, though - the debate about V's gender did start earlier on. Rich explained that he took a reader poll and found that more people thought V was female, so he threw in that comment to sow additional confusion, because he found it entertaining.

[Kish]

A lot of Rich's groups seem to have a 2 women/4 men breakdown (Five Foot Steps, the initial Linear Guild, the Laurinear Guild, various random adventuring parties we've seen), but, well, I've already outlined my reasons above for thinking V was meant to be male.
Two things you said there I want to address:
Someone did measure the position of Vaarsuvius' eyes a few years ago. They're between the two positions, not in the male position.

Rich usually refers to Vaarsuvius as "he," "him," and so on on the forum. He said a while ago that he's using the male terms gender-neutrally, because it tires him to write "him/her" all the time; whatever my or anyone else's opinion of "gender-neutral masculine," it's not a slip, Freudian or otherwise.

[Mutant Sheep]

Why? Because the Rich Burlew who wrote "Evan's Spiked Tentacles of Forced Intrusion" and thought it was funny at all would never have been progressive enough to write a group of protagonists with more than one female.

The Rich Burlew who wrote Start of Darkness would have been progressive enough to make V gay in 2009 with a square bodied, male partner.
I still don't have a solid opinion on V, so I'm not going to weigh in on that, but..really? He wasn't "progressive enough"?:smallconfused: He would never have written a...:smallsigh: No. Just no. I highly doubt the gender of the elf mattered to him anywhere near as much as him getting his elven wizard for his joke strip about a D&D party. Which probably helped in changing V to ambiguous. It was not as important to the character, so why not make a joke out of it?

Also, he didn't make V gay. He made V sexually ambiguous. That's the joke.:smalltongue:

[Angel Bob]

I used to think V was female because of the Dragon magazine comics (V wants shampoo as treasure and qualifies for the Uptight English Teacher PrC). Looking at the comics, V is clearly male.

There's no gender restriction on the Uptight English Teacher prestige class whatsoever. Take it from a kid who's still in school; I should know. :smallwink: Also, while I may be in the minority, I'm a male who would never mind a bit of extra shampoo free of charge. I undertake great effort to maintain my luxurious bangs. :smalltongue:

Now, as for the topic at hand: I don't think I ever really gave any thought to Vaarsuvius' gender until the 600s; V was the hilariously snarky elven mage, nothing more, nothing less. Of course, come the Familicide arc, I was made to scrutinize the character more closely. I came to conclude that Vaarsuvius was female, but I'll be damned if I know the reason why. It wasn't Inkyrius being (apparently) male, it wasn't Vaarsuvius rushing off to save the children like a "Mama Bear" (as the TVTropes folks would say), it wasn't even the hairstyle; she just reads as female to me, and that's all there is to it. *shrug*

[Amphiox]

I too am of the opinion that it is likely that V was initially (and only briefly) envisioned as male, and then the Giant changed his mind and decided to make V's gender an open question.

But, is not the general practice, when an author appears to have changed his intent in such a fashion and at such a time (ie very early in the work), to accept the second one as the "canon"?

[DaggerPen]

Two things you said there I want to address:
Someone did measure the position of Vaarsuvius' eyes a few years ago. They're between the two positions, not in the male position.

They are? It's a bit difficult to quite tell the top of the head due to V's hair, but-

http://ft.trillian.im/8e92bbd6fc57dc9f88a2972b98ff74b657a29b87/6mJ5VIEtNhfEyHt8StsiDAJ3pidFq.jpg

... huh.


Rich usually refers to Vaarsuvius as "he," "him," and so on on the forum. He said a while ago that he's using the male terms gender-neutrally, because it tires him to write "him/her" all the time; whatever my or anyone else's opinion of "gender-neutral masculine," it's not a slip, Freudian or otherwise.

Is that so? Huh. I feel like V does typically draw women with visible breast curves, but that definitely does throw things up in the air a bit more. Thanks!

[Amphiox]

Why? Because the Rich Burlew who wrote "Evan's Spiked Tentacles of Forced Intrusion" and thought it was funny at all would never have been progressive enough to write a group of protagonists with more than one female.

The Rich Burlew who wrote Start of Darkness would have been progressive enough to make V gay in 2009 with a square bodied, male partner.

I must raise a note of caution here. It is fraught with danger to make blanket assumptions about people like this. Human beings tend to be a lot more complicated than this.

"Progressiveness" for one thing is not a singular measure or scale. It is entirely possible for someone to be very progressive on one set of issues and not very much at all on another.

I move around quite a number of progressive circles on-line, and I can tell you that there are many progressives who are plenty progressive on the issue of gays and their depictions in literature, and have been for decades, but who would still make a joke like the forced tentacle one, and be very defensive about it if anyone dared to call them out on it.

It is actually rather depressing to see, sometimes, but it is how people, apparently, tick.

[Koo Rehtorb]

V is clearly a man because all the fathers in the comic have been terrible parents.

Eugene, Tarquin, Ian. Think about it.

[Amphiox]

V is clearly a man because all the fathers in the comic have been terrible parents.

Eugene, Tarquin, Ian. Think about it.

Ah, but that is only human fathers. And fathers in the generations older than the Order-ites.

Confounding variables! If only we could do a randomized controlled trial of fatherhood quality in the Stickverse....

[eilandesq]

The only thing that those two strips proved with relation to V. is that half-camels almost certainly have a +0 level adjustment.*

*--The above sentence has been run through the Belkelan Logic Translator, and is not guaranteed to make any sense when viewed through real world logic. :smallcool:

[Lord Torath]

I like to think of Vaarsuvius as a female, but I suspect V was originally a man, before becoming Androgynous.

Here's why: (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=15058416#post15058416) Rich admits that the original group of six was all male. Then he smurfetted Hailey, and some folks already thought V was female. Sorry, Rich, I think you sort of blew V's gender with this quote. Don't you love/hate ThePhantom's Index of the Giant's Comments?

[Kish]

Rich admits that the original group of six was all male.Wow, is that ever an example of Telephone Game--with a link to what he actually said, even.

[dps]

I must raise a note of caution here. It is fraught with danger to make blanket assumptions about people like this. Human beings tend to be a lot more complicated than this.

"Progressiveness" for one thing is not a singular measure or scale. It is entirely possible for someone to be very progressive on one set of issues and not very much at all on another.

I move around quite a number of progressive circles on-line, and I can tell you that there are many progressives who are plenty progressive on the issue of gays and their depictions in literature, and have been for decades, but who would still make a joke like the forced tentacle one, and be very defensive about it if anyone dared to call them out on it.

It is actually rather depressing to see, sometimes, but it is how people, apparently, tick.

For one thing, as someone else pointed out, the original Linear Guild had 2 female members, so the assumption that Rich wasn't "progressive" enough at the time to include 2 female members in the OotS seems to simply not match up with observed facts.

Secondly, I don't think that including multiple females in a party of six is per se a sign of progressive" thinking. I can easily imagine a very chauvanistic writer making a third of the main characters female, even if only for fanservice, or indeed, making the party half male and half female so that everyone could be paired up in a straight relationship.

And third, I don't really see any relationship between whether or not one finds the "Evan's Spiked Tenacles of Forced Intrusion" joke funny or not has anything at all to do with one's views of gender roles or orientation.

[Harbinger]

Why? Because the Rich Burlew who wrote "Evan's Spiked Tentacles of Forced Intrusion" and thought it was funny at all would never have been progressive enough to write a group of protagonists with more than one female.


That's... a pretty huge assumption right there, not to mention kind of offensive.

[Rodin]

I don't think we can say anything based on what Rich originally wrote V as, because even if V started off definitively as one gender Rich can easily change his mind. Since the answer has never been revealed in-comic or outside it, there's no way to know.

Personally, I think of V as a she simply because of this strip:

http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0123.html

All of the boys go into one room, and the girls go into the other. Of course, that's hardly definitive, but for a mental gender assignment it works well enough.

[Amphiox]

For one thing, as someone else pointed out, the original Linear Guild had 2 female members, so the assumption that Rich wasn't "progressive" enough at the time to include 2 female members in the OotS seems to simply not match up with observed facts.

Secondly, I don't think that including multiple females in a party of six is per se a sign of progressive" thinking. I can easily imagine a very chauvanistic writer making a third of the main characters female, even if only for fanservice, or indeed, making the party half male and half female so that everyone could be paired up in a straight relationship.

And third, I don't really see any relationship between whether or not one finds the "Evan's Spiked Tenacles of Forced Intrusion" joke funny or not has anything at all to do with one's views of gender roles or orientation.

Well one is indeed often hard pressed to label most of the various examples of harem literature, with its one male and oodles of female protagonists as a norm, "progressive".

[marq]

For the record, the reasons I think V was originally meant to be male:
1. Before Rich started OOTS, he did stick figure avatars for his forums. All the female stick figures with robes had defined breasts, which V does not.
2. Men tend to have squarer bodies; women have rounder bodies, excepting Hilgya, who had armor and came later in the strip.
3. Men, as Rich has said, have their eyes higher up in the head than women. Check out Roy wearing the sex-changing belt to see the eye position change. V's eyes are in the male position.
4. Rich originally thought V's gender was obvious - he did not intend for V to be ambiguous. So the male body pattern layout for V was not intentional misdirection.
5. Most tellingly, every time Rich has forgotten to use the s/he pattern when describing V, he has used "he" or "his." If it were just random typos, I'd expect the occasional "she" or "her" in there, but it's always "he," "him" or "his."

I think this analysis of original intention is probably correct.

However, this joke of V's sex has been going on so long...I actually don't see it as having any sex at all.

People are (in this thread even) always saying that they think V is a male, or that it's a female...I'm at the point that I don't think of it as anything. Just...no sex at all. It's been so long of being ambiguous that even the jokes about it fall flat. For me, it's just V.

[David Argall]

Well, of course he is male, unless she is female.

[J's]

It seems likely that V was originally intended to be male (to my dismay, since I originally read V as female), but since V didn't need to use the restroom either way, I wouldn't call it much evidence either way.

For the record, the reasons I think V was originally meant to be male:
1. Before Rich started OOTS, he did stick figure avatars for his forums. All the female stick figures with robes had defined breasts, which V does not.
2. Men tend to have squarer bodies; women have rounder bodies, excepting Hilgya, who had armor and came later in the strip.
3. Men, as Rich has said, have their eyes higher up in the head than women. Check out Roy wearing the sex-changing belt to see the eye position change. V's eyes are in the male position.
4. Rich originally thought V's gender was obvious - he did not intend for V to be ambiguous. So the male body pattern layout for V was not intentional misdirection.
5. Most tellingly, every time Rich has forgotten to use the s/he pattern when describing V, he has used "he" or "his." If it were just random typos, I'd expect the occasional "she" or "her" in there, but it's always "he," "him" or "his."

It also seems likely that Inkyrius is also male, having the same body pattern, and that V is either gay or bisexual (I lean towards gay, because Haley doesn't seem like the type to room with V were V potentially interested, married or not, but V doesn't seem like the type to be particularly fussy about gender, either.)

While I agree about the original intentions for V that has no influence on Inky's gender as inky wasnt shown until after V becoming purposefully ambiguous.

Also the original intention for V has as much relevance for the current comic as the original intention to be a joke a day comic.

[DaggerPen]

While I agree about the original intentions for V that has no influence on Inky's gender as inky wasnt shown until after V becoming purposefully ambiguous.

Also the original intention for V has as much relevance for the current comic as the original intention to be a joke a day comic.

I think it depends on whether the Giant still thinks of V as V's original gender, or if Giant thinks of V as indeterminate. The way Giant made a point to have their kids be adopted to raise the possibility that they're a same-sex couple makes me think they're both the same sex, though.

[cobaltstarfire]

I think of V as male, but I also don't think V's gender matters. (or rather changing V's gender, whichever it is won't change who V is at all for me).

I don't know if it's a weird outlook to have or not, but I've found this applies to any many characters for me personally, they could be gender bent, and they would still be the same to me. I feel it's an odd way of looking at things because to most people a characters gender/sex is important and can have lots of implications within a story, that I am just absolutely blind to.

[halfeye]

No, s/he's an elf. :smallwink: :smallbiggrin:

[dps]

I think of V as male, but I also don't think V's gender matters. (or rather changing V's gender, whichever it is won't change who V is at all for me).

I don't know if it's a weird outlook to have or not, but I've found this applies to any many characters for me personally, they could be gender bent, and they would still be the same to me. I feel it's an odd way of looking at things because to most people a characters gender/sex is important and can have lots of implications within a story, that I am just absolutely blind to.

Well, on one hand, when Roy put on the belt of gender changing, he was still Roy even though he was no longer a he. OTOH, it would have had implications later in the story, unless Celia swings both ways.

[CaDzilla]

Lirian is the only definite female elf we know of. (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0532.html)

[Nimrod's Son]

Lirian is the only definite female elf we know of. (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0532.html)
No, there have also been at least a couple of drow, and a few wood elves (in SoD).

[super dark33]

Speculation ahoy!

Well, Lirian may be a querter elf or somthing, that gives her a human gender while still being an elf.

And the rest of the elves? They have no gender. They reproduce by releasing spores through their mouths that combine with the spores of other elves on leafs in Elven forests.

Then the combined spore drops into the ground and after 9 years sprouts out as a baby elf, which is then Harvested adopted by mature elves.


Orrrr The Giant has another idea. :smalltongue:

[Taelas]

At this point, V's sex is "ambiguous". There is no need to ever "reveal" his true gender, as it makes absolutely no difference to the story what his gender is. (This goes for Inkyrius as well.)

If you see V as male, and Inkyrius as female, it doesn't change anything. If you see the opposite, or see them as the same sex, it still doesn't change anything. Basically, you can get what you want out of their relationship.

My personal interpretation is that V is male. I have made no determination as to Inkyrius' gender, though.

[David Argall]

I think it depends on whether the Giant still thinks of V as V's original gender, or if Giant thinks of V as indeterminate. The way Giant made a point to have their kids be adopted to raise the possibility that they're a same-sex couple makes me think they're both the same sex, though.
No such assumption can be made. The very nature of the joke means it can't be ruled out, but it also is hard to maintain the joke if the kids were not adopted. If V is the natural mother or father, it is just too automatic to say so.
Also all details of Inkyrius are designed to maintain the uncertainty. We can't draw any conclusions about the real sex when the very intent is to confuse the issue.

[Juhn]

Personally, I think of V as a she simply because of this strip:

http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0123.html

All of the boys go into one room, and the girls go into the other. Of course, that's hardly definitive, but for a mental gender assignment it works well enough.
I always thought it was because V is happily married, and Haley knows this. V also isn't the lusty type in general.

[Haar]

No, s/he's an elf. :smallwink: :smallbiggrin:

Humor purposes aside, this is what I was lead to think, in combination with super dark33's post. Beings with 100% elven blood in them do not have any defined gender.

Don't ask me how they reproduce with other races. I have no idea and would most likely be spewing absolute nonsense.

[Keltest]

Humor purposes aside, this is what I was lead to think, in combination with super dark33's post. Beings with 100% elven blood in them do not have any defined gender.

Don't ask me how they reproduce with other races. I have no idea and would most likely be spewing absolute nonsense.

Given that V goes out of his way to turn invisible while going to the bathroom outdoors to spite Belkar, I think we can assume that elves do have defined biological genders, and the outward signs are simply not nearly as overt as they are on humans/other demihuman races.

[CaDzilla]

The elf in the 10th panel has a round bottom but no breasts (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0611.html)

[CaDzilla]

No, there have also been several drow (both in-comic and in SoD), and a few wood elves (in SoD).

Where are the drow in SoD?

[Nimrod's Son]

Where are the drow in SoD?
I actually meant Origin there, in the scene with Elan and Sir Francois in the tavern, but it turns out it was my memory playing tricks and it was actually a male.

But yeah, female drow have appeared (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0087.html) online (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0497.html) at any rate.

[Sylthia]

When I first started reading the comic, I thought V was male. I didn't find out about the mystery until checking out the forums.

[Lettuce]

I personally read V as male. Possibly because he looks vaguely similar to another male mage (http://lparchive.org/Fire-Emblem-Blazing-Sword/Update%2035/73-E21P60.png) in a game I was playing around the time when I discovered the comic. I see Kyrie as male as well, though maybe female->male transgender? Haven't given it a whole lot of thought.

All things considered, V's gender isn't really a plot point in the story so it's not something I care too much about. I definitely get the most enjoyment out of being uncertain and hearing what everyone else thinks. :smallamused: Well played, Giant!

[DaggerPen]

I personally read V as male. Possibly because he looks vaguely similar to another male mage (http://lparchive.org/Fire-Emblem-Blazing-Sword/Update%2035/73-E21P60.png) in a game I was playing around the time when I discovered the comic. I see Kyrie as male as well, though maybe female->male transgender? Haven't given it a whole lot of thought.

Wow, that looks unbelievably like Vaarsuvius.

And is also a character whose gender I would have been unable to get a bead on sans your description.

[Lombard]

V was originally male. Then Rich realized that some people weren't sure if V was male or female (and that he hadn't specifically stated which gender V was yet) and that this ambiguity was a potential comedy goldmine. At that point V became non-gendered. And I don't mean 'written as non-gendered'. V's sexual traits literally became fuzzy little question marks all the way down to the molecular level. It was like a Christmas miracle! :elan:

[Cerussite]

Wow, that looks unbelievably like Vaarsuvius.

And is also a character whose gender I would have been unable to get a bead on sans your description.

The only reason you can't is because most boys in that game look like ladies (the ones who aren't rugged anyways).

[JessmanCA]

I've been leaning on V being a woman until I began re-reading the comic and stumbled upon this strip. (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/images/oots0086.gif)
See how everyone is looking nervous? Everyone but Haley - because she is a woman and therefore does not have a line to stand in?

V could be upset because she has to wait behind Haley

Or V could be upset because choosing a door would reveal his/her gender.

[Lettuce]

The only reason you can't is because most boys in that game look like ladies (the ones who aren't rugged anyways).

Pretty much this. It's an art style thing. It's pretty clearly defined in dialogue from the outset that he's a dude, though.


Back on topic, I read that comic as that V was just upset that there wasn't a real external 'threat', as previous dialogue had lead him to infer.

[FujinAkari]

V was originally male. Then Rich realized that some people weren't sure if V was male or female (and that he hadn't specifically stated which gender V was yet) and that this ambiguity was a potential comedy goldmine. At that point V became non-gendered. And I don't mean 'written as non-gendered'. V's sexual traits literally became fuzzy little question marks all the way down to the molecular level. It was like a Christmas miracle! :elan:

You might want to slap a big old "in my opinion" on this, as it sure reads as though you are stating fact when nothing you have posted is confirmed :)

[Lombard]

You might want to slap a big old "in my opinion" on this, as it sure reads as though you are stating fact when nothing you have posted is confirmed :)

No I literally went on a vision quest for this, I printed out all the strips (on high-quality colored paper) and every forum posting (on regular black & white) and built a massive bonfire inside a sweat lodge. After three days my spirit animal appeared (an alpine marmot) and granted me special temporary brain powers whereby I was able to divine certain truths which, while plainly before me, were nonetheless left unspoken. I immediately spent all my tokens on divining V's current and former gender. Totally worth it though! :thog:

[malloyd]

No I literally went on a vision quest for this, I printed out all the strips (on high-quality colored paper) and every forum posting (on regular black & white) and built a massive bonfire inside a sweat lodge. After three days my spirit animal appeared (an alpine marmot) and granted me special temporary brain powers whereby I was able to divine certain truths which, while plainly before me, were nonetheless left unspoken. I immediately spent all my tokens on divining V's current and former gender. Totally worth it though! :thog:

At least that's a lot more solid evidence that is usual for forum theories.

[luna the cat]

why does V have to be male or female

why can't V be a non-binary genderqueer identity

using cues like "it looks like V is male/female" negates how they actually identify and express themselves, and I haven't seen any evidence that V themselves identifies as either gender

[DaggerPen]

why does V have to be male or female

why can't V be a non-binary genderqueer identity

using cues like "it looks like V is male/female" negates how they actually identify and express themselves, and I haven't seen any evidence that V themselves identifies as either gender

I doubt it's authorial intent, but I really do like the idea of genderqueer Vaarsuvius, myself.

[luna the cat]

it even kinda plays into The Giant's attempts to highlight the limits and assumptions of Dungeons and Dragons in terms of world building.

Much like how having stats for a baby black dragon encourages players to think of killing it, having stats for different genders encourages people to think in terms of gender essentialism. And, it makes it harder for players to imagine a character outside of that or not defined by that.

whether or not V was born male or female is their business, not anyone elses, and has no bearing on how they identify or conceive of themselves, so why press the issue when clearly V is annoyed/bothered in a lot of strips by attempts to forcibly peg them into male/female binary?

[Ghost Nappa]

1) Vaarsuvius is the same gender as the Pyro (http://wiki.teamfortress.com/wiki/Pyro).
2) Vaarsuvius finds your speculation on his alleged gender binary as trivial, irrelevant and "an action whose endangerment is sufficient for triggering the clause of self-defense. (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0684.html)"
3) Vaarsuvius is history's worst mass murderer. (http://http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0883.html)
4) Vaarsuvius has a familiar. (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0003.html)
5) The Order of the stick consists of 3 males, 1 female, 1 constant eh, and another one who is usually male but has crossed the line to save another (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0234.html).


Aside: Did the person who compared the eye-levels compare Roy's male face with his female face?

[DaggerPen]

1) Vaarsuvius is the same gender as the Pyro (http://wiki.teamfortress.com/wiki/Pyro).
2) Vaarsuvius finds your speculation on his alleged gender binary as trivial, irrelevant and "an action whose endangerment is sufficient for triggering the clause of self-defense. (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0684.html)"
3) Vaarsuvius is history's worst mass murderer. (http://http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0883.html)
4) Vaarsuvius has a familiar. (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0003.html)
5) The Order of the stick consists of 3 males, 1 female, 1 constant eh, and another one who is usually male but has crossed the line to save another (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0234.html).


Aside: Did the person who compared the eye-levels compare Roy's male face with his female face?

I did not do so in a graphic, but his eyes are lower in his female face, yeah.

[cheesecake]

I tgought v was female until I came to the forum and seen people posting the v gender thread version 21232344