Does DR stop ability damage?

[nyee]

A party member that I DM brought up that DR should affect ability damage. His reasoning is in the DMG on page 292-293, it has a list of things that bypass DR, and ability damage wasn't one of them.

I disagree, seeing ability damage as very similar to energy drain (which is on that list). Also, I think that with DR being pretty easy to get it would eliminate the power and sting of ability damage (which usually comes pretty small outside of poisons).

I reference DnD wiki, where it states

A creature with this special quality ignores damage from most weapons and natural attacks. Wounds heal immediately, or the weapon bounces off harmlessly (in either case, the opponent knows the attack was ineffective). The creature takes normal damage from energy attacks (even nonmagical ones), spells, spell-like abilities, and supernatural abilities.

Since ability damage is a supernatural ability, I thought that solved it. However, the player brought to my attention that the DMG doesn't mention supernatural abilities.

What am I missing? Is he right/wrong, and why?

[Fax Celestis]

Ability damage does not interact with damage reduction.


Damage Reduction
A creature with this special quality ignores damage from most weapons and natural attacks. Wounds heal immediately, or the weapon bounces off harmlessly (in either case, the opponent knows the attack was ineffective). The creature takes normal damage from energy attacks (even nonmagical ones), spells, spell-like abilities, and supernatural abilities. A certain kind of weapon can sometimes damage the creature normally, as noted below.

The entry indicates the amount of damage ignored (usually 5 to 15 points) and the type of weapon that negates the ability.

Some monsters are vulnerable to piercing, bludgeoning, or slashing damage.

Some monsters are vulnerable to certain materials, such as alchemical silver, adamantine, or cold iron. Attacks from weapons that are not made of the correct material have their damage reduced, even if the weapon has an enhancement bonus.

Some monsters are vulnerable to magic weapons. Any weapon with at least a +1 magical enhancement bonus on attack and damage rolls overcomes the damage reduction of these monsters. Such creatures’ natural weapons (but not their attacks with weapons) are treated as magic weapons for the purpose of overcoming damage reduction.

A few very powerful monsters are vulnerable only to epic weapons; that is, magic weapons with at least a +6 enhancement bonus. Such creatures’ natural weapons are also treated as epic weapons for the purpose of overcoming damage reduction.

Some monsters are vulnerable to chaotic-, evil-, good-, or lawful-aligned weapons. When a cleric casts align weapon, affected weapons might gain one or more of these properties, and certain magic weapons have these properties as well. A creature with an alignment subtype (chaotic, evil, good, or lawful) can overcome this type of damage reduction with its natural weapons and weapons it wields as if the weapons or natural weapons had an alignment (or alignments) that match the subtype(s) of the creature.

When a damage reduction entry has a dash (-) after the slash, no weapon negates the damage reduction.

A few creatures are harmed by more than one kind of weapon. A weapon of either type overcomes this damage reduction.

A few other creatures require combinations of different types of attacks to overcome their damage reduction. A weapon must be both types to overcome this damage reduction. A weapon that is only one type is still subject to damage reduction.

Ammunition fired from a projectile weapon with an enhancement bonus of +1 or higher is treated as a magic weapon for the purpose of overcoming damage reduction. Similarly, ammunition fired from a projectile weapon with an alignment gains the alignment of that projectile weapon (in addition to any alignment it may already have).

Whenever damage reduction completely negates the damage from an attack, it also negates most special effects that accompany the attack, such as injury type poison, a monk’s stunning, and injury type disease. Damage reduction does not negate touch attacks, energy damage dealt along with an attack, or energy drains. Nor does it affect poisons or diseases delivered by inhalation, ingestion, or contact.

Attacks that deal no damage because of the target’s damage reduction do not disrupt spells.

If a creature has damage reduction from more than one source, the two forms of damage reduction do not stack. Instead, the creature gets the benefit of the best damage reduction in a given situation.

[Red Fel]

A party member that I DM brought up that DR should affect ability damage. His reasoning is in the DMG on page 292-293, it has a list of things that bypass DR, and ability damage wasn't one of them.

I disagree, seeing ability damage as very similar to energy drain (which is on that list). Also, I think that with DR being pretty easy to get it would eliminate the power and sting of ability damage (which usually comes pretty small outside of poisons).

I reference DnD wiki, where it states


Since ability damage is a supernatural ability, I thought that solved it. However, the player brought to my attention that the DMG doesn't mention supernatural abilities.

What am I missing? Is he right/wrong, and why?

First, don't cite DND Wiki. Just don't. Trust me.

That said, look at the first line: A creature with DR ignores damage from most weapons and natural attacks. That's what it applies to. Not spells, not powers, not supernatural abilities, not anything that explicitly overcomes DR - just most weapons and natural attacks.

The fact that it's not on the short list of things that overcome DR isn't relevant - it doesn't have to be. A special (usually supernatural or spell-like) ability that deals ability damage is not a "weapon or natural attack," and therefore is not subject to DR.

Your player is trying to sneak one by you. Teach him the error of his ways.

EDIT: Wall-of-swordsage'd.

[Fax Celestis]

In addition, if he still doesn't believe you, ask him to tell you why Strongheart Vest uses the phrasing it does instead of just stating "you gain DR 3/- only applicable against ability damage".

[nyee]

What if the ability damage is caused by a natural attack? Specifically if a monster's claws deal regular damage and ability damage? (The monster in question's claws did 1d8+7 plus 1d4 Cha damage)

[Psyren]

What if the ability damage is caused by a natural attack? Specifically if a monster's claws deal regular damage and ability damage? (The monster in question's claws did 1d8+7 plus 1d4 Cha damage)

Usually attacks that deal ability damage are supernatural in some way, or at the very least tied to a poison/disease. What creature are you referring to specifically?

[nyee]

It was a demon from the Fiendish Codex…Paeliryon on pg 130

[Fax Celestis]

What if the ability damage is caused by a natural attack? Specifically if a monster's claws deal regular damage and ability damage? (The monster in question's claws did 1d8+7 plus 1d4 Cha damage)


Whenever damage reduction completely negates the damage from an attack, it also negates most special effects that accompany the attack, such as injury type poison, a monk’s stunning, and injury type disease. Damage reduction does not negate touch attacks, energy damage dealt along with an attack, or energy drains. Nor does it affect poisons or diseases delivered by inhalation, ingestion, or contact.

If you have DR 10/adamantine, and the demon rolls a 1 on his damage, you can ignore the ability damage.

[Psyren]

It was a demon from the Fiendish Codex…Paeliryon on pg 130

Well I'll just look at the picture and OH GODS CAN'T UNSEE!!!!

Yeah, as Fax said this ability relies on the claws themselves doing damage first, so stopping the claws from hurting you will protect you from the rest.

[Fax Celestis]

For further clarity, the monster's attack is 1d8+7 plus 1d4 Cha damage, so it's an extra effect of the attack. An "and" in there would also work. However, for a monster that just dealt ability damage (like a joystealer, I think?), DR wouldn't apply.

[nyee]

Cool. Thanks for the replies! And Psyren, I feel your pain haha

[Spore]

Cool. Thanks for the replies! And Psyren, I feel your pain haha


http://i.somethingawful.com/u/elpintogrande/october10/fiendfolio/fiendfolio_paeliryon.jpg

Idk, this really says: Ursula the Sea Witch to me

http://images2.fanpop.com/image/photos/9500000/Ursula-disney-villains-9586464-800-600.jpg