No save, SR: yes die spells?

[Deaxsa]

Are there any? Is there a way to remove a save from a spell?

[Fouredged Sword]

Spellwarp sniper can remove the save from some spells by turning them into rays. It can remove reflex saves from an area spell.

[sideswipe]

I believe there is an item... or a spell... i'm trying to find it.

whatever it is it exists and when used the target cannot breath air for I think 24 hours.

so the target dies unless it has breath water or does not require breathing.

if it is an item it requires no save.
if it is a spell I'm trying to find it and see if it has a save.

bare with me.

[Karsh]

Power Word Kill, though that is constrained by the target having 100 HP or fewer.

[Somensjev]

I believe there is an item... or a spell... i'm trying to find it.

whatever it is it exists and when used the target cannot breath air for I think 24 hours.

so the target dies unless it has breath water or does not require breathing.

if it is an item it requires no save.
if it is a spell I'm trying to find it and see if it has a save.

bare with me.

are you possibly thinking of aboleth mucus?
20gp for one vial thing of it
ranged attack to hit a creature (no splash)
DC 19 fortitude save, or the creature can't breath

i think that's right, but i cant check it

[sideswipe]

are you possibly thinking of aboleth mucus?
20gp for one vial thing of it
ranged attack to hit a creature (no splash)
DC 19 fortitude save, or the creature can't breath

i think that's right, but i cant check it

yes i was thank you, i could not remember the name.

and i guess i forgot the fortitude save. thanks.

[Somensjev]

yes i was thank you, i could not remember the name.

and i guess i forgot the fortitude save. thanks.

that's fine, and i'm always forgetting about the stuff, if i hadn't read about it earlier today i wouldn't have been able to help you

[Chronos]

Irresistable Dance doesn't kill, but since it prevents the target from doing anything but dancing for the duration, they might as well be dead.

[ShurikVch]

Putrefaction (Dragon #300) - 9th lvl no-save necromancy. Target creature aging one age category per turn. On the next turn after achieving venerable, target dies from old age, body animates as zombie, and soul transform into ghost - both under the caster's control.

[Fouredged Sword]

Putrefaction

Ok, now I want to play a wyrmling dragon that uses this spell to age to great wyrm status, bypassing all those levels, only to iron heart surge out of the spell at the desired age.

[Ansem]

Irresistable is a metamagic feat for +4 that removes saving throws from spells.
Great with sleep for example, as you're either immune or fall asleep.

[Vedhin]

Irresistable is a metamagic feat for +4 that removes saving throws from spells.
Great with sleep for example, as you're either immune or fall asleep.

It was errata'd to be +10 DC.
It's also from the non-1st party Kingdoms of Kalamar books. Their Villain Design Handbook gave us things like the Darklight Wizard and some kind of reverse-feats (flaws but with extra broken).

[Zanos]

Ok, now I want to play a wyrmling dragon that uses this spell to age to great wyrm status, bypassing all those levels, only to iron heart surge out of the spell at the desired age.
Advancing yourself by an age category is already a valid use of Bestow Curse.

Avasculate has a save, but you lose half your max hp even if you pass it, so there's that. I can't think of any spells that actually flat out kill stuff without any saving throw at all.

[ShurikVch]

Ok, now I want to play a wyrmling dragon that uses this spell to age to great wyrm status, bypassing all those levels, only to iron heart surge out of the spell at the desired age.No luck in it.
Firstly, target is stunned the whole time.
And second,
This spell has no effect on dragons or other creatures that do not not age in the standard fashion.

[HammeredWharf]

Death by Thorns is a nasty spell from Book of Vile Darkness that kills on a failed fort save and incapacitates for d4 rounds on a successful one. It gets bonus points for being AoE. So, it's a "no save, you lose" spell.

[Broken Crown]

No save, SR: yes?

I'm surprised no one's mentioned Blasphemy, Dictum, Holy Word, and Word of Chaos. These are only lethal up to Caster Level -10, but they have lesser (but still potentially game-winning) effects on more powerful targets, and there are relatively easy ways to boost your CL. And they affect an area, so that's extra good.

[Jormengand]

Irresistible spell may not actually make your spell no-save-just-die any more, but if you make your save DCs horrific then nothing's gonna pass them anyway. Irresistible Phantasmal Killer to the face, go!

PWK is probably your best bet. Microcosm doesn't actually kill things, but you can just CdG them forever, and you can increase the HP limit. No, no it isn't a spell.

If your target is flying high enough and your ability doesn't actually need to be a spell (SLAs are close enough, right?) a reversed greater Seek the Sky can do enough damage to kill things easily. At first level a Reversed Mortalbane Lesser Word of Nurturing does enough damage to kill, or at least knock out, with no save.

Death By Thorns is a good idea actually - remember to bring a scythe or similar 4* weapon.

None of these except PWK (which can be screwed up by a level ~5 barbarian - probably even lower if they're trying) actually fits your description, but there are ways of doing something that probably counts as close enough.

[Lightlawbliss]

well, any spell that allows coup de grace can easily be an impossible save, no sr: dead.

[Yomega]

Factotum level 11 ability Cunning Breach

Cunning Breach (Su): Starting at 11th level, your broad knowledge allows you to study an opponent and gain a brief flash of insight to breach her defenses. By spending 2 inspiration points as a free action, you can ignore a single target’s spell resistance and damage reduction for 1 round. The target automatically fails any spell resistance check that she attempts to avoid your spell.

By level 11 you have a minimum of 6 inspiration points so thats 3 spells per encounter that ignore spell resistance

note: I cant believe I just recommended a 11 level dip :smalleek: Would be good for gestalt :smalltongue:

[Zweisteine]

Irresistible spell has high prerequisites, and has a +4 metamagic adjustment. It also removes the save from a spell (but errata reduces that to just +10 to the DC). It can be very useful, and it's not too hard to break spell resistance.

[Thrice Dead Cat]

Its name escapes me, but there is a 9th level wu jen [fire] spell with reflex save or die in Complete Mage. Combine with spellwarp sniper for no-save, SR: yes, just die.

[Gemini476]

Its name escapes me, but there is a 9th level wu jen [fire] spell with reflex save or die in Complete Mage. Combine with spellwarp sniper for no-save, SR: yes, just die.

Internal Fire is in Complete Arcane and has a Fort save. It's also waay higher than the 5th level spell that a Spellwarp Sniper is capable of spellwarping.

Complete Mage does give the Wu Jen Arboreal Transformation, however. Gotta love Save-or-turn-into-a-tree combined with being slowed for days/level on a successful save. Ninth level spell, am I right?


...Having looked through DnDtools for an Instantaneous spell with a Reflex save that kills people (between levels zero and six, due to Sanctum Spell) and I've come up blank. I know that a lot of stuff hasn't been cataloged there yet, but there really aren't that many save-or-dies at so low levels.

[ShurikVch]

Wu Jen?
Transcend Mortality (http://dndtools.eu/spells/complete-mage--58/transcend-mortality--885/)!

[Deophaun]

Ok, now I want to play a wyrmling dragon that uses this spell to age to great wyrm status, bypassing all those levels, only to iron heart surge out of the spell at the desired age.
That would be terrible for you, as you then have to take a bunch of RHD levels before gaining the benefits of either your age category or ever taking a regular class level again (Draconomicon, pg 142). A black dragon has to contend with 13 such levels just to get beyond Juvenile.

[Silva Stormrage]

Enervation with enough metamagic counts :smalltongue:

[strider24seven]

Are there any? Is there a way to remove a save from a spell?

Well, there's a heavily metamagic'd (http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=9309.msg318518#msg318518) Hail of Stone (http://dndtools.eu/spells/spell-compendium--86/hail-stone--4677/).

Oh wait, sorry. That's SR: No.