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View Full Version : Making my first bard, might need some pointers.



kamap
2014-01-22, 08:54 AM
So I'm making my first bard, lvl 3.
I'll use the 32 point buy system (no stats under 10 before racial adjustment).
I'm thinking buffer ranged bard that can do some scouting if necesarry.

I can use every book there is out there (just no special races, I can use subraces from the PHB like the Stonehunter Gnomes from dragon magic)

For race I'll be a stonehunter Gnome (didn't see that one comming, right?)

For stats:
I was thinking along the lines of (before racial adjustment)
16 cha
14 dex
12-14 con (more hp yes or no)
12 str (just to not go in minus)
12-14 int (more skill points yes or no)
wis 12

For feats I was thinking along the lines of:
lvl 1: Melodic Casting (I'll max perform(sing))
lvl 3: Dragonfire Inspiration
When I get to lvl 6: Song of the heart

I'll learn the inspirational boost spell and I'll also use (1200-1400GP) for a badge of valor.

So if I'm not mistaken on lvl 3 I'll have a +3 inspire courage, from inspirational boost and the badge of valor as long as I have charges / lvl 1 spells left. Which can be changed to 3d6 fire dmg and on lvl 6 it will be +4.

What else to do with the 1500-1300GP I have left (I'll buy a shortbow and the ussual adventuring equipment and will still have hundreds of GP left)
I'm thinking of getting craft (alchemy) since hey I'm a gnome and better at it and make some special arrows.

Any other spells I should get?
Any other feats that are very good?
I doubt I'll be able to convince my DM to let me take words of creation though, 8d6 on lvl 9 for everyone in the party would be a bit ludicrous.
Any bard skills that i should really get or shouldn't ever think about getting.

Or is this a silly build that wont ever work and should be reworked into something totally different?

Thanks in advance for any answer I might get.

Biffoniacus_Furiou
2014-01-22, 09:28 AM
Check out the Bard class section in the Eberron Campaign Setting, it says you can trade a type of song for one of the music feats from that book. So you can get Song of the Heart instead of your Suggestion bardic music without having to spend a feat on it.

Some of the other alternate songs and alternate class features (Spellbreaker Song, Healing Hymn, Bardic Knack) are also worth picking up. Check out the Bard Handbook (http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=8284.0) for an overwhelming volume of advice.

kamap
2014-01-22, 10:14 AM
I'll still need to be lvl 6 for it, right? Cause I need the inspire competence ability.

That would indeed be nifty then I could take another feat at lvl 6 and have 4 feats.

I might even take a flaw from Unearthed Arcana and have more feats, I'll surely check out that handbook, hopefully I'll find some nice feats in there that complement my buffing.

Gwendol
2014-01-22, 10:34 AM
Melodic casting allows you to skip Concentration. Since you are gnome you might want to sink some points in stealth. Tumble is always useful, as is balance (5 ranks). Social skills are a given. Knowledges are good too, if not only to pick up the collector of stories skill trick (to ID creatures you encounter).
If you are going the archery route you will want to pick up point blank shot, and precise shot at least.

kamap
2014-01-23, 07:44 AM
I have some more questions about the eberon campaign setting bard choices and other bard related things.

Can you take Song of the heart feat from the eberon campaign setting at lvl 3? You get inspire competence at lvl 3, so can you take the feat then or do you have to wait till lvl 6?

Can you change any bardic music thing for a feat, can I for example drop countersong or fascinate and take a feat from the eberon campaing setting?

Does the words of creation feat (from Book of Exalted Deeds) just doubles your inspire courage bonus, so if you have items (like badge of valor) is this also doubled?

So on lvl 3 I could have +3 inspire courage (1 from beeing a bard, +1 from inspirational boost and another +1 from badge of valor)

Does this turn into +6 with the words of creation feat, my guess is that it would be 5 or even just 4? Does it double base value, which would make IC +4 (+2 from WoC, +1 from inspirational boost and +1 from BoV) or does it double when you start inspiring, then it goes like this: cast Inspirational boost, start inspiring with words of creation (which then makes IC +4) end your round, activate badge of valor as immediate action (using next turns swift action, which makes IC +5)

Questions, questions.

Gwendol
2014-01-23, 10:04 AM
For Words of Creation my reading is it doubles the base number, but I have seen other interpretations. Check with your DM!

Not sure about the Eberron related questions since I haven't played in that setting.

Biffoniacus_Furiou
2014-01-23, 10:35 AM
When leveling up, you gain new feats before you gain new class features, so no Song of the Heart can't be taken at 3rd level. (PHB p58-59)

Only a few specific feats can be gained in place of bardic music abilities, and most can't be taken at level 1 so it's difficult to replace your 1st-level songs with anything useful. These feats are: Haunting Melody, Music of Growth, Music of Making, Song of the Heart, and Soothe the Beast. (ECS p34)

Words of Creation doubles your current Inspire Courage bonus at the time it's applied. You can apply your own effects in the most beneficial order. However, effects like Words of Creation, Song of the Heart, and the spell Inspirational Boost are applied when you start singing, and a Badge of Valor is applied after the song has already started. Words of Creation can't double the bonus gained from a Badge of Valor, but it can double all the rest.

A +3 from base +1, Song of the Heart +1, Inspirational Boost +1 would be doubled to +6 by Words of Creation, and you can activate a Badge of Valor to bring it up to +7.

kamap
2014-01-24, 04:02 AM
Thanks for all the replies, so that means either dropping suggestion for song of the heart or use the 6th lvl feat to gain song of the heart.
Taking the former leaves me an extra feat to take and no suggestion.

So on lvl 6 I could have 6 feats (1 from lvl 1, 2 from 2 flaws, 1 at lvl 3 and 2 at lvl 6)

I only "need" 5 so thats good.

lvl 1: Melodic casting, dragonfire inspiration, precise shot
lvl 3: point blank shot
lvl 6: song of the heart, (words of creation, if my DM is so silly to allow it ^^)

I'll make a few versions of the bard and see what my DM will allow.

kamap
2014-02-03, 08:26 AM
@Biffoniacus_Furiou: I believe you are missinformed the PHB at page 58-59 indeed states what things you should check when you gain a lvl but it dones't state that its in that order.

Page 22 of the PHB states: that you can get the feat when you get the prerequisite for the feat.

PREREQUISITES
Some feats have prerequisites. Your character must have the
indicated ability score, class feature, feat, skill, base attack bonus,
or other quality designated in order to select or use that feat. A
character can gain a feat at the same level at which he or she
gains the prerequisite. For example, at 3rd level, Krusk, the halforc
barbarian, could spend 1 skill point on the Ride skill
(gaining his first rank in Ride) and select the Mounted Combat
feat at the same time.
A character can’t use a feat if he or she has lost a prerequisite.
For example, if your character’s Strength drops below 13
because a ray of enfeeblement spell, he or she can’t use the Power
Attack feat until the prerequisite is once again met.

So you can take Song of the heart feat at lvl 3, cause you get inspire competence at lvl 3 and even change that out for the feat if you so wish.

kamap
2014-02-06, 06:42 AM
another question came to mind.

If I use a masterwork mandolin to inspire courage it gives +1 to attack, so does that stack and get doubled with words of creation? Would that make my inspire courage at lvl 6 +9?

inspire courage base (1)
inspirational boost (+1)
Song of the heart (+1)
masterwork mandolin (+1)
Thats 4, then words of creation doubles that which makes it +8 then I use badge of valor for +9?

Which would turn into +9d6 if I use dragonfire inspiration, cause it transforms the attack to damage.

Thanks in advance for the answers.

Gwendol
2014-02-06, 06:51 AM
That looks right.