I seek a half-fiend half-celestial creature.

[qwertyu63]

I need a creature that is half-fiend and half-celestial. Preferably as close to 6 hit dice as possible. Thank you in advance.

[Red Fel]

It... really doesn't work that way. Both half-fiend and half-celestial are inherited templates, meaning that (unless a deity decides to rewrite your existence or Reincarnation goes really right wrong) you have them at birth. And Celestials and Fiends tend to be mutually incompatible to the utmost.

That said? There are ways, if you don't specifically want those two templates.

One option is to use a planetouched race. For example, a Half-Celestial Tiefling or a Half-Fiend Aasimar could make for a very interesting story. ("Well, my father was an Eladrin, and one night he got super drunk...")

Another option is one I used in an epic-level campaign, which may very well go over your HD limit. I started with a Human, then slapped on Half-Celestial template and Major Devil Bloodline. My justification was that the father, a Celestial (I forget what type) fell in love with the mother, a humble devotee of Pelor (or maybe Lathander, I forget the setting). Unbeknownst to both, the mother's ancestor was a Devil, and the bloodline was manifested as a result of the father's involvement. Hence, Half-Celestial Devil-Blooded character.

But creatures that are inherently half and half? To my knowledge, can't happen.

[the_david]

Concordant Killer, MMIV page 34, except he's CR19.
So, uhm... Make one yourself?

Take a fiend and apply the half-celestial template or vice versa?

[Red Fel]

Concordant Killer, MMIV page 34, except he's CR19.
So, uhm... Make one yourself?

Take a fiend and apply the half-celestial template or vice versa?

Concordant Killer. I totally forgot about that guy. "Both celestial and demonic," true neutral. Good catch.

[qwertyu63]

It... really doesn't work that way. Both half-fiend and half-celestial are inherited templates, meaning that (unless a deity decides to rewrite your existence or Reincarnation goes really right wrong) you have them at birth. And Celestials and Fiends tend to be mutually incompatible to the utmost.

I already have a case where a fiend and a celestial would mate set up (love is a strange force), I just need the result and was wondering if it was already out there (making one up was plan B, as I suck at making creatures).

[Red Fel]

I already have a case where a fiend and a celestial would mate set up (love is a strange force), I just need the result and was wondering if it was already out there (making one up was plan B, as I suck at making creatures).

Ordinarily, I would say that they are completely biologically incompatible, much the same way elves and orcs cannot breed. That said, there are, so I'm told, rules for breeding between species in the BoEF. You could always check there and see if they cover Celestials and Fiends.

[danzibr]

Concordant Killer, MMIV page 34, except he's CR19.
So, uhm... Make one yourself?

Take a fiend and apply the half-celestial template or vice versa?
Yeah, what an awesome creature this is. Scale it down, perhaps?

[hamishspence]

Ordinarily, I would say that they are completely biologically incompatible, much the same way elves and orcs cannot breed.

http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/eo/20060407a


This installment features bizarre creatures that cannot be -- that is, the rules don't allow them to exist. But you might find them interesting or useful in your campaign, so for an April Fool's special (who says it has to be just one day?) we've deviated from the norm to explore what happens when you break the rules.

Rule-Breakers

Because these creatures break the rules, some of them have apparently conflicting abilities. It's better not to worry about such matters because these creatures do not need to be reconciled with the rules. They are presented purely for your enjoyment, so just enjoy them!

Half-Fiend/Half-Angel

Alignment restrictions normally prohibit applying the half-fiend template to an angel, but the combination makes for a creature with interesting conflicts.

This half-fiend/half-astral deva, named Memonor, looks like a corrupted version of a deva. His batlike wings are covered with patches of white feathers, and his head is crowned with small horns. His brown skin is streaked with black, and his eyes glow red. Because he has trouble balancing his evil and good natures, he can behave in unpredictable ways. He may attack on sight, he may choose to aid a group of adventurers, or he may help them one day and attack them the next.

[Larkas]

Consider these quotes:


A celestial’s magical nature allows it to breed with virtually any creature. The offspring of the resulting unions, half-celestials, are glorious and wonderful beings.


A fiend’s magical nature allows it to breed with virtually any creature. Spawned deep in the dark, nether planes, these fiendish offspring are abominations that plague mortal creatures.

A couple of celestial and fiendish varieties of something (say, humans) could breed and produce an offspring that's both half-celestial and half-fiend.

Furthermore, nothing says that the offspring of a half-something has to have a "lesser" template or different race (i.e.: aasimars and tieflings). The game actually implies the contrary when talking about the planetouched, where they say that


The effects of having a supernatural being in one’s heritage last for many generations. Although not as dramatically altered as a half-celestial or a half-fiend, planetouched still retain some special qualities.

If it lasts for many generations, one can imply that a half-celestial bloodline may only "degrade" into aasimar many generations down the line. The son of a half-celestial human and a normal human can just as well also be a half-celestial. As such, the son of a half-celestial human and a succubus could easily be a half-celestial half-fiend human.

Don't get too attached to the "half-" part of the templates' names. It's only there to imply that the creature is "part-celestial" or "part-fiend" while sounding a lot better. A half-celestial human, if one takes a literal approach to the name, is actually 1.5 of a being, as it is half-celestial and full human (i.e.: he has all the qualities of a regular human, and then some).

That said, I can see a TN half-celestial erinyes as a very interesting character. :smallsmile:

[qwertyu63]

Ordinarily, I would say that they are completely biologically incompatible, much the same way elves and orcs cannot breed. That said, there are, so I'm told, rules for breeding between species in the BoEF. You could always check there and see if they cover Celestials and Fiends.

That book covers it by banning it outright. So, I'm going to ignore that book.


http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/eo/20060407a

Alright, new plan B. Half-fiend hound archron (ignoring the alignment rule as I often do, both parents have alignment drifted to TN anyway).

[Sith_Happens]

I already have a case where a fiend and a celestial would mate set up (love is a strange force), I just need the result and was wondering if it was already out there (making one up was plan B, as I suck at making creatures).

In that case, the offspring would be either a half-fiend celestial or a half-celestial fiend. Its offspring, should it have any, might then be a half-fiend, half-celestial whatever.

[Dr. Azkur]

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_B2mU1mjh_kc/S_7jmaH9Y9I/AAAAAAAABj4/F9THMtIPO5E/s1600/Preacher%2B-%2BIssue%2B01%2B-%2Bpage%2B34%2Bof%2B40.jpg

I'm just sayin'

[Blackhawk748]

Ordinarily, I would say that they are completely biologically incompatible, much the same way elves and orcs cannot breed. That said, there are, so I'm told, rules for breeding between species in the BoEF. You could always check there and see if they cover Celestials and Fiends.
Emphasis mine

And KoK has the Tel'Amholthans Half Orc Half Elves, so i see no problem with a Half Celestial Half Fiend, im sure theres a great drunk story behind it

[otakumick]

Little Nicky

[Gemini476]

Didn't that Succubus Paladin fall in love with an angel or something?

Not to mention Savage Species outright saying that a Half-Elf Half-Celestial Half-ogre, for instance (not the actual example), is actually a Quarter-Human Quarter-Elf Quarter-Celestial Quarter-Ogre. And so on.

A Half-Fiend Half-Celestial Human could be Quarter-Fiend Quarter-Celestial Half-Human, in that case.

Of course, going by RAW a Half-Fiend Half-Celestial can't work unless you find some way to either get the template later or add some inherited template after one of them that changes alignment to something non-good or evil.

Actually, let me do that.

Let's see. Half-Fiend is LA+4, Half-Celestial is also LA+4, so you're never going to do this at less than ECL 9. Hrm.

Shadow Creature (MotP 190) adds LA+3, but makes you a Magical Beast. Arachnoid (Und 90) makes you an Aberration but also Always Evil.

So a Half-Fiend Arachnoid Shadow Half-Celestial is LA+11 and basically unplayable, but it's a Half-Fiend Half-Celestial. It's also really weird if you try to fit the fluff of all those templates, together, but it works.

If you are asking as a DM rather than a player, the HFASHC is CR+2 (+2 for 5 or less HD, +4 for 6-10HD, +6 for 11+HD).
It's extremely underpowered no matter what system you are using, though.

[qwertyu63]

Didn't that Succubus Paladin fall in love with an angel or something?

Not to mention Savage Species outright saying that a Half-Elf Half-Celestial Half-ogre, for instance (not the actual example), is actually a Quarter-Human Quarter-Elf Quarter-Celestial Quarter-Ogre. And so on.

A Half-Fiend Half-Celestial Human could be Quarter-Fiend Quarter-Celestial Half-Human, in that case.

Of course, going by RAW a Half-Fiend Half-Celestial can't work unless you find some way to either get the template later or add some inherited template after one of them that changes alignment to something non-good or evil.

Actually, let me do that.

Let's see. Half-Fiend is LA+4, Half-Celestial is also LA+4, so you're never going to do this at less than ECL 9. Hrm.

Shadow Creature (MotP 190) adds LA+3, but makes you a Magical Beast. Arachnoid (Und 90) makes you an Aberration but also Always Evil.

So a Half-Fiend Arachnoid Shadow Half-Celestial is LA+11 and basically unplayable, but it's a Half-Fiend Half-Celestial. It's also really weird if you try to fit the fluff of all those templates, together, but it works.

If you are asking as a DM rather than a player, the HFASHC is CR+2 (+2 for 5 or less HD, +4 for 6-10HD, +6 for 11+HD).
It's extremely underpowered no matter what system you are using, though.

Wow...

At this point, I've got a LN Hound Archon having a kid with an LN Bearded Devil, and getting a half-fiendish hound archon. Yeah, I'm the DM, so alignment restrictions are not in play here.

[hamishspence]

In the Diabloverse, the nephalem (progenitors of humanity) are the offspring of demons and angels.

Would be an interesting idea for D&D.

[sideswipe]

so basicly... your trying to make little nicky?

GET IN THE FLASK!

EDIT - damn didn't see i was ninja'd

[Seffbasilisk]

Wasn't there some obscure splatbook creature, with a black eye that counted as both good and evil?

[Gemini476]

Wow...

At this point, I've got a LN Hound Archon having a kid with an LN Bearded Devil, and getting a half-fiendish hound archon. Yeah, I'm the DM, so alignment restrictions are not in play here.

In that case feel free to just make a Half-Fiend Half-Celestial Thri-Kreen or whatever if you ignore alignment prerequisites. As a GM you don't need to worry about LA, and CR is what you want to keep an eye on (although it's pretty useless unless you have a Truenamer in the party).

So
{table=head]HD|CR
>5|+2
6-10|+4
11+|+6[/table]
is the CR increase from those templates. If you apply both Half-Fiend and Half-Celestial, that is.

As for just sticking the Half-Fiend template on a Hound Archon, eh. "Always" in D&D does not mean Always. A Chaotic Evil Hound Archon is unusual, and possibly unique, but it's not impossible.

A Half-Fiend Hound Archon has 6HD and is CR 6. He'll be Evil, probably, although the template rules are fuzzy on that. Just slap the template on top of a Hound Archon and you're done.

Being a DM is a lot simpler than being a PC when it comes to applying templates.

[qwertyu63]

In that case feel free to just make a Half-Fiend Half-Celestial Thri-Kreen or whatever if you ignore alignment prerequisites. As a GM you don't need to worry about LA, and CR is what you want to keep an eye on (although it's pretty useless unless you have a Truenamer in the party).

So
{table=head]HD|CR
>5|+2
6-10|+4
11+|+6[/table]
is the CR increase from those templates. If you apply both Half-Fiend and Half-Celestial, that is.

Sticking both templates on one creature actually wouldn't give me what I want at all. That would be the result of multiple breeding stages involving a fiend, a celestial and some third creature. There is no room for a third creature here.


As for just sticking the Half-Fiend template on a Hound Archon, eh. "Always" in D&D does not mean Always. A Chaotic Evil Hound Archon is unusual, and possibly unique, but it's not impossible.

A Half-Fiend Hound Archon has 6HD and is CR 6. He'll be Evil, probably, although the template rules are fuzzy on that. Just slap the template on top of a Hound Archon and you're done.

Being a DM is a lot simpler than being a PC when it comes to applying templates.

This however works, so I'm going to just use that and call it a day. Thank you everyone.

[Phelix-Mu]

I think you have a couple distinct problems.

1.) Most outsiders don't breed normally. Angels aren't the result of a loving embrace between two mature, adult angels, but rather a natural feature of Upper Planes/created by gods/promoted from exceptionally virtuous souls/petitioners. The fluff varies, but they don't have a normal biological process that is similar to reproduction.

2.) Dissimilar outsiders almost never breed, and the RAW says nothing about what would happen if an angel dated an eladrin.

3.) Most outsiders are magically fertile and can choose whether children are produced and whether the progeny inherit outsider blood (I think this is from BoEF...have the strong impression that I read this somewhere).

4.) So, if there is a specific coupling in question, first decide what you want it to be. Do the fiend and angel give birth to an angel, a fiend, or something unique. Once you know the resulting base creature, add the opposite template to it, resulting in half-celestial fiend or half-fiend celestial.

At least that is my take. Props on a classic idea that never gets old.

[Slipperychicken]

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_B2mU1mjh_kc/S_7jmaH9Y9I/AAAAAAAABj4/F9THMtIPO5E/s1600/Preacher%2B-%2BIssue%2B01%2B-%2Bpage%2B34%2Bof%2B40.jpg

I'm just sayin'

For heavens sake! If you're going to throw down giant NSFW images, you should at least put it in spoiler tags, if not warn us that it's NSFW. It's a damn good thing I wasn't looking at that in class.