Monster suggestions....

[DarkKensai]

Hey everyone. I am currently running my first campaign, and I had a couple of questions I wanted to put out there.

1. Later on in the campaign, I want to put the players in position for a "Summon bigger fish" scenario. One of the monsters was largely inspired by Deathwing(I think?) from WoW Cataclysm. I was planning on a super large dragon or similar creature. Do you guys have any ideas for a good idea on the second creature? Or even if there is something better than a dragon for the first one. Bonus points if it's inherently evil (better to give the Paladin a hard time)

2a. I would like to run a dungeon based off of the movie "Alien." Do you have any suggestions for a creature thematically similar to the xenomorph? I want to introduce the creature in a pseudo horror setting while they're at a fairly low level, then let them fight the creatures more properly later on (Alien => Aliens)

2b. Do you have suggestions on good ways to ratchet up the tension to create a creepier experience while encountering the lone "xenomorph"?
(I'm looking for DM/Gameplay suggestions, not ambient music and such)

Thanks in advance for your help!

edit: any thematically appropriate elements are welcomed, homebrew included

[Phelix-Mu]

Kytons from Book of Vile Darkness are much like xenomorphs.

Also, kruthiks from, I think, Miniatures Handbook are also a good choice.

As for atmosphere, describe sounds, smells, and colors. The air is damp, maybe hot and sticky. There is a smell of rotting flesh in the air, along with the tang of acid eating through metal. The exploding bodies are wet, as chunks of people go flying, and acid spittle melts through flesh like it was a hot poker through a marshmallow.

[HunterOfJello]

1. Lots of stuff. Let me go look around for a bit and get back to you.

2a. Steel Predator from the Fiend Folio is a good start.

[DarkKensai]

Thanks.
Those both look like something I could use, although the Steel Predator might have too high of an EL for where I want it.

[DJroboninja]

I second the Kyton suggestion, I always thought they felt like fantasy xenomorphs.

If you want to keep your players on edge in a horror setting, don't be afraid to use the fourth wall to do so. Ask for Perception checks, and no matter what they roll just respond with "...ah, okay, moving on." Tell everyone to roll initiative and afterward have a rat scurry out of a hole in the wall, to show the characters' high tension.

Meanwhile, show don't tell when it comes to the monster. Have then explore a dungeon, occasionally finding the remains of those who went up against the creature. They find a notebook next to a dead body with a slit throat and a razor blade in his hand - the notes describe the last survivor of one such fight, who writes about how everyone just died while he was in the other room. No descriptions, just aftermath.

Ten rooms into the dungeon, your party will go from "I can't wait to find some monsters so we can kick their ass" to "oh my god, what if that thing is behind that door".

(Horror D&D isn't favorite)

[Chester]

2a. The Kaorti (Fiend Folio), though not 100% like the Alien, create a dungeon "Cyst" using secreted resin. Very Alien-like.

[Kol Korran]

I'd suggest something a bit different for the "Alien horror scene". A Kyton is interesting (and tough), but it still feels like a "normal" monster that is just quite tough. Aannnd... it feels a bit like a straight rip off. (Nothing wrong with that, but still)

I once did a reworking of the simple gibbering mouther to fit specifically in horror themed ideas. I think it could fit perfectly. Check out part 1 (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=13411526&postcount=68) and part 2 (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=13411717&postcount=69) (The second part have suggestions on how to use it in actual play).

Ok, that out of the way, some general advice for Horror:
1) Reveal things slowly. Work off by clues and hints of what the characters perceive, and let THEIR IMAGINATION do the horror for you! Don't show a wholly mutilated body wit hthe exact marks of how it was killed. Instead let them find... parts.. clues to it. A leg here, a smear of blood there, some guts with acid marks and so on... Let tension build up SLOWLY.

2) Attack the party's security bases. This can be as simple as monsters going straight for their weakest party member for example, to shaking "secure stuff" such as killing beloved PCs, or having things they heavily rely on stop working (Though try to do this for a good reason, even if not inherently obvious). Don't do it all out and big, but do it slowly. Again- build tension, make the players fear of "what will go wrong next?".

3) Try and make it PERSONAL. I'm not talking personal to the characters, but rather personal to the players! What spikes fear in them? what is important to them? Try to strike at people's "touchy" spots, and make them fear losing something they actually fear to lose. You know your players the best, so you know what works. If you can have the monster/ threat/ horror actually "Get to know" the party, and thus use that info more convincingly to further the terror, all the better (Again, the Gibbering mouther version is splendid for this).

If you can come to somehow have some sort of communication between monster and party (Doesn't have to be verbal, doesn't have to be entirely understood or sane), all the better!

4) Make the monster/ horror personal. This means it doesn't always try to kill the party. It isn't a "who kills the other first" kind of thing (Since in most cases that means the monster is supposed to win) but rather the monster has a purpose, and has strengths and weaknesses (Which the party needs to find out in order to have any chance). I suggest looking through Rich' gaming articles on how to make a villain, and jut do it more small scale. You need to have the party engaged in the enemy emotionally, not just "lets see which game mechanic we use to kill this thing".

5) Oh, another possible idea is to do make it "who kills each other first", where the monster can't kill the entire party immediately, but can pick them off slowly, while the party tries to achieve some other goal. The monster HARASSES the party, though possibly in a very deadly manner. Use the terrain, the situation (Time pressure! Also- don't let them sleep! It always attack then, never letting them to recuperate. Make no place fully "safe"), the conditions and more to give the monster some sort of an advantage (For example the gibbering mouther can have multitudes of small tunnels all around the place they are in. A ghost can have narrow corridors, and thus slide from wall to wall and attack in the middle).

6) Levels of information and understanding: Control the flow of information. At first the party perceive one sort of threat, but as they figure out a way of the specific problem, they realize something else, worse. and again, only more. and again! only MORE! (What is this monster? We must get away to the X spot!... We got here, but wait, this is not the end, and there are more creatures? Lets alarm Z, we must get to Y!... We got to Y! Yay! But Z is no longer... No one in the city responds? These creatures are... everywhere?)

7) Specifically for D&D: I suggest to not use a "Stock creature", but a very special one/s. You can do stuff with templates and such, but for a real horror scene I'd suggest to use your imagination and create something specific for the scene. It can be a strange horrific power, or a defense, or even just a mannerism, or something that feels UNIQUELY WRONG about the creature. By breaking from straight game mechanics, and giving the feeling of somethign extra, you break the players from the "what dice do we roll?" routine, and try to immerse them in something that is totally... experience.

I hope this helps, good luck! And if you try the mouther and it works (You really don't have to, but I think it has some potential) Let me know, eh? :smallwink:

[DarkKensai]

Cool. Lots of good ideas there.
I'll take a look at the mouther for sure. It's not what I was originally looking for, but a quick perusal showed some promise.

One thing I couldn't help but thinking of when reading about the mouther: The "Black Wind" from the Wheel of Time series. Those random, creepy utterances kinda got to me a little bit when I first read them. I don't suppose anyone knows of a sound file that has stuff like that that I could have playing during the encounter?

Also, does anyone have any ideas for my first question?


1. Later on in the campaign, I want to put the players in position for a "Summon bigger fish" scenario. One of the monsters was largely inspired by Deathwing(I think?) from WoW Cataclysm. I was planning on a super large dragon or similar creature. Do you guys have any ideas for a good idea on the second creature? Or even if there is something better than a dragon for the first one. Bonus points if it's inherently evil (better to give the Paladin a hard time)


Thanks for all your help.

[Kol Korran]

I have heard of the term "Summon bigger fish" only in passing, so I'm not sure I'm getting it right, and I don't know who Death wing is (Never played WoW), but some possible ideas:

- A greatly advanced purple worm, perhaps with templates, that lies deep beneath the earth. When the party summons it it is awakened and rushes up, to DEVOUR! :smalltongue: Only then, it is loose... (Think of the Shai- Hulud great worms of Dune)

- The tarrasque? same deal...

- Nothing quite as obvious, but rather this Death wing get killed by some invisble force, in a shadowy display of great pain and suffering. The party can't quite see what kills it. Then, this... something, asks for a price. a suitable price, and gives them some time. If you're really nasty, you can avoid telling the party what the price IS, and have them freak out.

Tic toc tic toc... hello new adventure!

[Dr. Azkur]

1.For a bigger fish than Deathwing the Destroyer... looking at how he is a pretty badass dragon... I suggest you take Deathwing, swap all of its fire-based powers for ice-based powers, and splat the Feral template and the Multiheaded Template twice (So you have a fiercer 3-headed dragon), both from Savage Species.
Or if you want a literally bigger fish then take Deathwing (which I suppose is a True Dragon) and advance it an age category.

If I got it all wrong and you don't actually have Deathwing set then I suggest you look at the Hellfire Wyrm... which is BAAAADAAAASSS (MM2 pg. 125). It's pretty strong... it's final boss material, so I don't know if it's going to work out.

If I were to build Deathtwing from scratch (whom I know almost nothing about, just that he's black and he's quite fond of fire)... I'd take a Red Dragon (Age Category depends), slap him with Half-Fiend (and make his scales black while we're there) and throw in a bunch of Metabreath Feats. Done. Oh and Xorvintaal Dragon because he has no spellcasting.

If that doesn't cut it... then take this (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=16018069&postcount=10)

2a. Insectile Creature template from Savage Species might be of use.

(Yes I just finished reading SS and it's a pretty badass book)

[PraxisVetli]

If I remember correctly (which I may or may not), Deathwing is that giant lava dragon.
Clearly a Pyroclastic Dragon.
Or half, depends on the desired CR.
Half Pyroclastic Dire Bat
Half Pyroclastic Wyvern
Half Pyroclastic Nightwing
Half Pyroclastic Half Fire Elemental Winged Paragon BattleTitan

[DarkKensai]

I have heard of the term "Summon bigger fish" only in passing, so I'm not sure I'm getting it right, and I don't know who Death wing is (Never played WoW), but some possible ideas:



It's literally a reference to a webcomic, but what it is referring to is when you summon a monster to fight another monster. It's kind of referencing the old Godzilla movies when some monster would start attacking, and it couldnt be defeated so the humans woke up Godzilla and got him to fight the new monster.



If I got it all wrong and you don't actually have Deathwing set then I suggest you look at the Hellfire Wyrm... which is BAAAADAAAASSS (MM2 pg. 125). It's pretty strong... it's final boss material, so I don't know if it's going to work out.


I don't actually have Deathwing. To be honest, the Deathwing reference is mostly meant to be a reference to power and strength (capable of breaking continents, bringing down mountains, etc) If there are already things of that power level made, I would look at them and see if they work.