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Kazyan
2014-01-27, 06:03 PM
For my Races of the Margin homebrew project, I will have two new dieties that could use statting. It's generally understood that Dieties and Demigods dieties are not up to snuff, but I'm not sure how powerful DvR 2 and DvR 8 dieites should be in modern play. Thoughts? Please compare to something more objective than a level X party of mid-op or high-op or whatever; three-label optimization level is too vague for this purpose.

sideswipe
2014-01-27, 07:03 PM
All a god needs is the alter reality ability from deities and demigods and epic level spell casting (and ageless of course).
There is literally nothing else a god needs.

The alter reality ability can be used for many things, all of them good and over-powered.
The main abuse is infinite time stop.
When they have racked up 3 years of time stop they then sit down, contemplate the exact spell they need to invent. spend as long as they need crafting the spell. spend the rest drinking beer and celebrating there victory. then when the time stops end, there invented spell which has any effect you could possibly imagine, and as many of them as you want, triggers and does whatever you want to the any amount of targets.

Anything except a more powerful god would be eradicated from all existence, past or future. and cannot be revived by any means except by a god of similar or greater power.

If you don't want epic spell casting, then just give them access to alter reality and deity powers, with CL 20 cleric, druid and wizard casting. the ability to convert any power/initiation/utterance/shadow-caster spell/miscellaneous spell I haven't included into a cleric/wizard/druid spell.

that should be a high level deity powers.

if you want a divine rank 8, just give them the spell casting and 50HD. and that amount of feats. with all casting as spontaneous and basicly unlimited they have godlike powers but no unlimited uber break reality.

Kazyan
2014-01-27, 07:46 PM
To clarify: I'm not looking to optimize a diety. I'm looking to see how powerful, in the grand scheme of things, they should be. What CR, if you will.

Unless you're telling me that a DvR 2 deity should be able to obliterate everything but a more powerful deity instantly with Alter Reality -> Time Stop -> Epic Spellcasting abuse. In which case, I don't want institutionalized cheese to be the source of power.

Vhaidara
2014-01-27, 07:51 PM
God's should be as powerful as necessary. If you want the players to not fight them, then they are all insanely strong (they are gods, after all). If you're running a godslayer campaign, they should be CR (Party Level) +5 or +6. Ergo, incredibly challenging.

Zweisteine
2014-01-27, 08:04 PM
Gods should be as powerful as they want/need to be.

If you seriously are having your players fight a god, have him be able to do what he wants. Stat them up using Deities and Demigods, but give them a limited version of Alter Reality for free. They can manipulate everything in their immediate vicinity at will.

If your players aren't going to be fighting them, stat them up, and count the statted up gods as nothing more than manifestations of the gods themselves. With this system, gods are infinitely powerful (except maybe gods who rose from mortality, like Vecna), and the version of the god that presents itself to those who would see it is only an avatar, made to interact with reality.

Clistenes
2014-01-27, 08:16 PM
I wonder...can a god send a non-divine Avatar (Greyhawk's gods often use those) or even an Aspect, have it live some adventures, earn some XP, learn a few new tricks, take a level, and then take it back home, absorb it and keep that brand new level for themselves?

Brookshw
2014-01-27, 08:29 PM
Personally I'm inclined to use the stats in dieties and demigods an their avatars and leave the gods themselves unstatted.

HunterOfJello
2014-01-27, 08:37 PM
That depends strongly on your campaign setting. Do these people live in a world like Forgotten Realms where gods rise and fall by being killed by other deities as well as mortals? Are there lots of gods with a great variance between the weak ones and the strong ones?

Or is this all in a setting more like Eberron where the gods are each practically omnipotent and it would be impossible for a mortal to ever even attempt to threaten one?

Tell us how dangerous the other gods are in your campaign setting are first. This is a major decision you have to make for your entire setting and it should have drastic consequences on your setting too.

Kazyan
2014-01-27, 09:18 PM
Tell us how dangerous the other gods are in your campaign setting are first. This is a major decision you have to make for your entire setting and it should have drastic consequences on your setting too.

This is not for a setting, specifically. This will be part of what is essentially a homebrew sourcebook, thus, it should be useable in most settings. I imagine that the statblock listed will be listed as an option for the DM to use as either A) the actual diety or as B) merely their avatar, depending on the nature of the setting.

In either case, I want the statblock given to be something that an intelligently-played part won't just roflstomp pre-epic like people claim they can do to the contents of Dieties and Demigods.

Coidzor
2014-01-27, 10:59 PM
Depends on the scale you're comfortable with using.

You wanna give the most minor of deities 50 HD on top of the benefits of 20 levels of every base class that has any possible bearing on their portfolios along with all the levels of relevant PrCs and the bigger they get the more bonus Outsider HD and epic progressions of those classes they get, sure.

You want them to be more along the lines of CR 30ish, that's also fine.

OldTrees1
2014-01-27, 11:19 PM
Honestly this depends on the role gods will play in your campaign.


Gods could be normal people (say 15th level) except within their portfolio. Within thier portfolio they have +yes modifiers.

Gods could be high level + divine multiplier. Stated out like a 20th level character but the DM adjusts everything they do to factor in their divine power. (Examples: Time Stop would do 1d4+1 minutes instead of rounds. Fireball creates 10 non overlapping fireballs.)

Or Gods could be mortals with Epic Spellcasting.

Kazyan
2014-01-27, 11:26 PM
Rephrasing and rethinking again. These gods' statblocks are supposed to be generic, for a variety of players and DMs. However, I acknowledge that people using a homebrew sourcebook are likely to be experienced optimizers. I do not want people to look at the DvR 2 diety and say "Yeah, I just need to buff up before I kill it" at level 13.

It seems the playground's opinion is "it varies depending on setting". I think I want to make these deities stronger than what one will find in Dieties and Demigods, at least.

Poking around leads me to mentions of Dicefreaks diety rules, but the Dicefreaks site itself is gone, so I don't know how to find those rules. They seem like they'd be what I want.

Vaz
2014-01-27, 11:34 PM
I wonder...can a god send a non-divine Avatar (Greyhawk's gods often use those) or even an Aspect, have it live some adventures, earn some XP, learn a few new tricks, take a level, and then take it back home, absorb it and keep that brand new level for themselves?

Through epic spellcasting they can create the race with the ability they desire, even made up ones, and then use the Fusion Astral Seed trick to gain it.

Hell, they can create Instantaneous Duration spells with that ability.

Xar Zarath
2014-01-28, 12:52 AM
Your god should be like Emperor Tippy:smallredface:

Coidzor
2014-01-28, 01:22 AM
IIRC, that Dicefreaks material is still around, it's just on a new site. Can't recall the name though. Mostly involves lots of large numbers from what I'd heard, but that was mostly their Demon Princes and Arch Devils.

Zweisteine
2014-01-28, 06:51 AM
Personally I'm inclined to use the stats in dieties and demigods an their avatars and leave the gods themselves unstatted.

Exactly.
The gods themselves are actually something like hyper-sentient bulges in spacetime, that spit out avatars so they an interact with creation.
Exceptions: St. Cuthbert, Vecna, Kurtulmak, most demigods

The gods listed above are just indescribably powerful. I'd stay them up as having divine rank 20, and have lesser versions that ct as avatars with divine rank 5 or 10. Of course, if players actually wanted to kill a god, I'd make the gods slightly less unkillable, unless I didn't want them to have a chance.

Aasimar
2014-01-28, 07:25 AM
Somewhere between 'extremely' and 'insurmountably'

Karnith
2014-01-28, 07:54 AM
Poking around leads me to mentions of Dicefreaks diety rules, but the Dicefreaks site itself is gone, so I don't know how to find those rules. They seem like they'd be what I want.

IIRC, that Dicefreaks material is still around, it's just on a new site. Can't recall the name though. Mostly involves lots of large numbers from what I'd heard, but that was mostly their Demon Princes and Arch Devils.
Dicefreaks is back up over here (http://dicefreaks.freeforums.org/old-d-d-1-3e-pf-f11.html), with their general rules on divinity in this thread (http://dicefreaks.freeforums.org/divinity-repost-request-t98.html). They've reposted a few of the deities in that forum, and I saved a bunch of deity stats before the old Dicefreaks website went down, if anyone's interested in looking at them. Here's how they statted up Boccob, for instance:
"Seek balance above good, evil, law, or chaos. Fight to push back the encroachment of good just as you would the oppression of evil. Magic is the most important thing on Oerth, and it must be preserved so that the balance can be preserved.

"Balance above morality, knowledge above all."
Boccob
The Uncaring, Lord of All Magics, the Archmage of the Deities
Greater Deity
Symbol: An eye balanced on a pedestal inside a pentagon
Home Plane: The Divided Unity of Concordant Opposition
Alignment: Neutral
Aliases: None
Superior: None
Allies: Wee Jas, Istus, Lendor, Cyndor, Delleb, Zuoken (all distant)
Foes: Tharizdun
Servants: Zagyg the Mad; Burning Eye
Servitor Creatures: Crystalmists, golems, greyhawk dragons, huge elementals (any type), invisible stalkers, jann genies, pseudodragons, will o'wisps, and wizshades; disenchanters, hakeashars, laraken, and nishruu to punish offenders
Manifestations: A nimbus of flickering, purple light which envelops a magical item or a spellcaster in an effect similar to faerie fire; often accompanied by helpful spells
Signs of Favor: Unique flowers or roses of unusual hue, dweornite gems and other magical jewels
Worshipers: Arcane spellcasters, philosophers, oracles, sages
Cleric Alignments: CN, LN, N, NE, NG
Speciality Priests: Arcanologists
Holy Days: Great Discovery (date?), important celestial conjunctions, Last Rite of the Prophet
Portfolio: Magic, knowledge, foresight, nonintervention, balance
Domains: Balance, Fate, Knowledge, Magic, Oracle, Spell
Favored Weapon: Staff of the Archmagi (Quarterstaff)

Wizard 20/Loremaster 35/Archmage 5
Medium Outsider (Extraplanar)
Divine Rank: 17
Hit Dice: 20d4 + 5d4 + 35d4 + 600 (840 hp)
Initiative: +7 (Dex)
Speed: 60 ft. (12 squares)
AC: 80 (+9 deflection, +7 Dex, +17 divine, +5 luck, +32 natural), touch 48, flat-footed 59
Base Attack/Grapple: 30/72
Attacks: Staff of the archmagi 78 melee (6 + 11); or arcane fire 74 ranged touch (170 + 10/spell level); or spell 72 melee touch, or 74 ranged touch
Full Attack: Staff of the archmagi 78/73 melee (6 + 11); or arcane fire 74/69 ranged touch (170 + 10/spell level); or spell 72/67 melee touch, or 74/69 ranged touch
Space/Reach: 5 ft./5 ft.
Special Abilities: Alter reality, applied lore, arcane fire, arcane geometry, arcane shield, familiar, forbidden knowledge, gauge weakness, lore, mastery of counterspelling, mastery of elements, mastery of shaping, metamagic effect, seize concentration, snatch spell, spell-like abilities
Special Qualities: Cold immunity, divine aura (DC 36), divine immunities, DR 30/epic and mythril, epic spell artisan, fire immunity, sonic resistance 37, spell power +3, SR 99, uncanny dodge
Saves: Fort 72, Ref 73, Will 89
Abilities: Str 21, Dex 25, Con 30, Int 58, Wis 45, Cha 28
Skills: Bluff 109, Concentration 112, Craft (alchemy) 124, Craft (bookbinding) 124, Craft (calligraphy) 124, Craft (gemcutting) 124, Decipher Script 124, Diplomacy 109, Forgery 124, Gather Information 109, Heal 117, Intimidate 109, Knowledge (arcana) 136, Knowledge (architecture and engineering) 124, Knowledge (dungeoneering) 124, Knowledge (geography) 124, Knowledge (history) 124, Knowledge (nature) 124, Knowledge (nobility and royalty) 124, Knowledge (the planes) 124, Knowledge (psionics) 124, Knowledge (religion) 124, Profession (apothecary) 117, Profession (herbalist) 117, Profession (librarian) 117, Search 124, Sense Motive 117, Spellcraft 178, Use Magic Device 109
Feats: Attune Gem, Augment Spell, Brew Potion, Craft Construct, Craft Contingent Spell, Craft Magic Arms and Armor, Craft Rod, Craft Staff, Craft Wand, Craft Wondrous Item, Empower Spell, Etch Rune, Forge Ring, Fortify Spell, Greater Spell Focus (all), Heighten Spell, Maximize Spell, Quicken Spell, Scribe Scroll, Skill Focus (knowledge [arcana], spellcraft), Spellcasting Prodigy (wizard), Spell Focus (all), Spell Mastery (all), Twin Spell
Epic Feats: Advanced Metamagic, Attune Epic Gem, Brew Epic Potion, Craft Epic Magic Arms and Armor, Craft Epic Rod, Craft Epic Staff, Craft Epic Wand, Craft Epic Wondrous Item, Enhance Effect, Enhance Spell x2, Epic Counterspell, Epic Skill Focus (spellcraft), Epic Spellcasting, Epic Spell Focus (all), Etch Epic Rune, Forge Epic Ring, Improved Heighten Spell, Increased Snatch Spell, Master Staff, Multispell x4, Scribe Epic Scroll
Salient Divine Abilities: Arcane Mastery, Archmage of the Deities, Automatic Metamagic (quicken spell), Clear Sight, Control Magic, Craft Artifact, Create Object, Disc of Concordant Opposition, Divine Creation, Divine Recall (magic), Divine Skill Focus (spellcraft), Divine Spellcasting, Energy Storm (negative, positive), Increased Spell Resistance, Instant Counterspell, Know Death, Know Secrets, Lord of all Magicks, Planar Might, See Magic, Spontaneous Arcane Spells, True Knowledge
Environment: The Library of Lore
Organization: Unique
Challenge Rating: 62
Treasure: Listed items
Alignment: Neutral
Advancement: --

Boccob speaks all languages, and can communicate with any living creature. His natural weapons are treated as epic and mythril for the purpose of overcoming damage reduction.

Alter Reality: Boccob exerts a considerable measure of control over reality itself, and his presence can command the very essence of the world around him. This warping of reality manifests in a number of ways.

Boccob can use wish with regard to his portfolio. This ability costs no experience points, and requires a standard action to implement. When he attempts to alter reality in opposition to another deity’s altering, he must succeed at an opposed rank check. Boccob can also use alter reality to cast any cure or inflict spell at will as a standard action. He can apply metamagic feats to the spells if desired, but doing so requires him to forego using alter reality for 1 round for each level the feat would normally add to the equivalent spell.

As a free action, Boccob can assume any size from Fine to Colossal. He also can change the size of up to 100 pounds of objects it touches. Boccob’s familiar can change size with him if Boccob touches it, but its weight counts against this weight limit. This ability allows Boccob to assume any proportions from the size of a grain of sand up to as much as 1,600 feet tall. A radical change in size can have great impact on his combat ability. His Strength, Armor Class, attack bonus, and damage dealt with weapons changes according to the size he assumes. Boccob’s Strength score can never be reduced to less than 1 through this ability. Also note that use of this divine ability does not affect all of Boccob’s characteristics.

Applied Lore (Ex): Boccob may make a Lore check to analyze any single foe that he can see (even via a scrying effect). The DC for this check is equal to 10 + the opponent’s CR, and the analysis takes at least three rounds. Afterwards, he gains a +4 insight bonus to attack and damage rolls against that opponent, a +4 insight bonus to AC against attacks made by that opponent, and a +4 insight bonus to saving throws against effects created by that opponent.

Arcane Fire (Su): Boccob can channel arcane spell energy into arcane fire, manifesting it as a bolt of raw magical energy. The bolt is a ranged touch attack with long range (1080 feet) that deals 170 points of damage plus 10 points of damage per level of the spell used to create the effect (maximum 420 damage from a 25th-level spell), and breaks through barriers as a divine blast would.

Arcane Geometry (Ex): Boccob employs an obscure system for recording the details of arcane spells through the use of complex geometrical figures. This notation is far more efficient and drastically reduces the time and expense of maintaining spellbooks. Spells require only a single page in his spellbooks (which he still maintains despite his Arcane Mastery), and one hour per spell level to scribe. In addition, Boccob need only pay half the normal cost to scribe epic spells onto tablets.

Geometrical notation is difficult for most spellcasters to decipher and use. The Spellcraft DC to decipher or prepare spells from spellbook using this notation is increased by 10 for all but geometers and others familiar with the style. Copying spells from such a spellbook takes twice as much time and resources as normal.

Arcane Shield (Su): Boccob can channel arcane spell energy into a barrier that absorbs incoming attacks. The shield collapses after it absorbs a number of points of damage equal to 17 x the level of the spell used to create the effect (maximum 425 damage from a 25th-level spell). This barrier is otherwise identical to a divine shield. Boccob can only have one arcane shield at a time.

Archmage of the Deities (Di): Boccob possesses an effective archmage level of 17. He has mastered the following high arcana: arcane fire, arcane shield, greater arcane fire, greater arcane shield, mastery of counterspelling, mastery of elements, mastery of shaping, spell power +3, true mastery of counterspelling, true mastery of elements, true mastery of shaping.

Control Magic (Di): Boccob’s control over magic is unmatched. He possesses the Snatch Spell and Seize Concentration abilities, and gains Improved Snatch Spell as a bonus feat.

Disc of Concordant Opposition (Di): Twenty times per day, Boccob can weave positive and negative energy into a disc of pure destructive force and hurl it at his foes. The disc is fifteen feet across, and if Boccob aims it at a specific creature, he may make a ranged touch attack to strike the target with it. A successful attack means that the target is affected by a disintegrate effect (DC 46) and gains no save against the disc’s damage.

The disc of concordant opposition deals 204 damage (Reflex DC 46 partial) to the target and to all adjacent creatures. Any creature reduced to 0 or fewer hit points by the disc is entirely disintegrated, leaving behind only a trace of fine dust. A disintegrated creature’s equipment is unaffected. Half the damage from this effect comes from positive energy, half from negative energy. Unlike the negative energy from an inflict wounds spell, the disc of concordant opposition does not cure undead (nor does its positive energy component cure living creatures).

When used against an object, the disc simply disintegrates as much as one 15-foot cube of non-living matter. Thus, the spell disintegrates only part of a very large object or structure targeted. The disc destroys any magical effect it comes in contact with, including a wall of force, prismatic wall, or prismatic sphere (all layers in a prismatic effect are destroyed). A divine shield can stop the disc, but is subject to its damage.

A creature that makes a successful Reflex save is partially affected, taking only half damage. If this damage reduces the creature or object to 0 or fewer hit points, it is entirely disintegrated.

Divine Immunities: Boccob is immune to polymorphing, petrifaction, or any other attack that alters her form. Boccob's own shape-altering powers function normally on himself. He is not subject to energy drain, ability drain, or ability damage, and is immune to mind-affecting effects (charms, compulsions, phantasms, patterns, and morale effects). He is also immune to disease, poison, stunning, sleep, paralysis, death effects, and disintegration. In addition to these, Boccob is immune to effects that imprison or banish him. Such effects include banishment, binding, dimensional anchor, dismissal, imprisonment, repulsion, soul bind, temporal stasis, trap the soul, and turning and rebuking. These immunities are ignored on a successful opposed rank check (remember that a check must be made for each attempt to breach an immunity).

Domain Powers: Boccob uses scrolls, wands, and other devices with spell completion or spell trigger activation as an 88th-level wizard, and casts divination spells at +3 caster level. 17 times per day, he can add his Wisdom modifier (+17) to his Armor Class for 60 rounds (6 minutes). Boccob possesses the uncanny dodge ability.

Epic Spell Artisan: Boccob can develop epic spells with less expense in time and resources. When determining the cost of raw materials for researching an epic spell, he multiples the Spellcraft DC by 7,000 gp instead of the usual 9,000 gp and reduces the development time and XP cost accordingly.

Like all deities, he is considered to have a pool of 30,000 XP to spend each week, and he can use this pool to research spells up to DC 107 without expending any of his own life force.

Forbidden Knowledge (Ex): Boccob has had horrible supernatural experiences and studied forbidden tomes, learning truly dark secrets that have challenged everything he thought he knew. But in time he has learned to accept and adapt to his discoveries, and regained his mental equilibrium. He gains a +4 bonus on all Will saves made to resist effects that induce insanity, magical or otherwise. In addition, he adds Forbidden Lore to the topics covered by his Lore ability.

Gauge Weakness (Ex): Boccob may make a Lore check to analyze any single foe that he can see (even via a scrying effect). The DC for this check is equal to 10 + the opponent’s CR, and the analysis takes at least three rounds. He gains intimate knowledge of the opponent’s special attacks, qualities, and vulnerabilities. For example, if he makes a successful check against the Tarrasque, he would know of its vulnerability to wish magic.

Lord of All Magicks (Di): Boccob gains a +4 bonus to all spell DCs. He can also cast spells from any spell list (arcane or divine) as wizard spells.

Lore (Ex): Boccob knows legends and information regarding various topics, just as a bard does. He never fails a lore check, no matter how obscure the knowledge involved. Boccob can use legend lore and analyze dweomer as immediate actions.

Mastery of Counterspelling (Ex): When Boccob counters another's spell, instead of simply negating its effect, he can choose from among the following options:
. . Aid: Boccob can boost the effectiveness of an ally’s spell by applying one metamagic feat from the following list: Empower Spell, Enlarge Spell, Extend Spell, Maximize Spell, or Widen Spell. To use this option, he must expend a spell slot whose spell level equals or exceeds that of the ally’s spell with the desired metamagic feat applied.
. . Manipulate: Boccob can seize control of the spell’s range, area, or targets (as appropriate), and reshape these factors as he chooses. For example, he could cause an enemy wizard’s fireball to explode at her feet, or he could cause her haste spell to target his allies within the area she has specified. Only one property of the spell, chosen from among those that the caster can normally designate, can be manipulated in this manner. For example, Boccob could not choose the targets of a sleep spell because the targets affected are determined by the spell itself, not the caster.
. . Turn: Boccob can counter the spell as normal, but it is turned back upon the caster as if it were fully affected by a spell turning spell. If the spell cannot be affected by spell turning, then it is merely counterspelled.

Mastery of Elements (Ex): When Boccob casts a spell that deals elemental damage, the elemental damage is of the type that is most effective against the target. It acquires the appropriate elemental subtype. If a creature is equally vulnerable to multiple elements, Boccob chooses which element the spell uses. Alternately, Boccob may choose a specific type of elemental damage (acid, cold, electricity, fire, or sonic) for the spell to deal to all targets.

Mastery of Shaping (Ex): Boccob can alter area and effect spells that use one of the following shapes: burst, cone, cylinder, emanation, or spread. He may create spaces within the spell’s area or effect that are not subject to the spell. The minimum dimension for these spaces is a 5-foot cube. Furthermore, any shapeable spells have a minimum dimension of 5 feet instead of 10 feet. Boccob can also alter an area effect spell by changing the shape of the area. The new area must be chosen from the following list: cylinder (10-foot radius, 30 feet high), 40-foot cone, four 10-foot cubes, or a ball (20-foot radius spread). The spell works normally in all respects except for its shape. Boccob can increase the spell’s area, range, and duration (ass applicable) by 50%. Finally, his spell effects can be delayed up to 3 rounds. Mastery of shaping is considered a metamagic effect that does not increase the spell level of affected spells for the purpose of interacting with Boccob's other abilities.

Metamagic Effect (Ex): Boccob can attempt to apply a metamagic feat he possesses to a persistent spell effect that is already in place. To use this ability, he must be adjacent to or within the spell effect and make a successful Spellcraft check (DC 18 + [3 x modified spell level]). Boccob may use this ability up to 27 times per day. Using this ability is a full-round action that provokes attacks of opportunity.

Planar Might (Di): Each day, Boccob can join with the massive energy of the Cosmos for up to 17 minutes (170 rounds, which need not be continuous). This connection transfigures Boccob and greatly augments his power. While in this state, he is immune to critical hits, is a native on any plane he visits, and can use his greater teleport and planeshift spell-like abilities as swift actions.

In addition, using his exceptional knowledge Boccob can draw off excess energy from the Cosmos itself to increase his spell DCs, effective caster level, or enhance any attack roll, saving throw, skill check, or ability check. Alternately, he can increase the effective level of a spell slot, either to apply metamagic feats without increasing its actual level, or to increase the power of his arcane fire and arcnae shields.

Drawing off excess energy from the Cosmos is dangerous, and it deals Boccob 10 points of backlash damage for each +1 bonus applied to a single roll, each +1 caster level or DC on a single spell, or each virtual spell level.

Spell-Like Abilities: At will—antimagic field, anyspell, arcane sight, augury, banishment, break enchantment, bestow curse, Boccob's rolling cloud, calm emotions, clairaudience/clairvoyance, clarity of mind, commune, detect secret doors, detect thoughts, discern location, disk of concordant opposition, dismissal, dispel magic, divination, find the path, foresight, geas/quest, greater anyspell, greater arcane sight, greater scrying, greater teleport, identify, imbue with spell-like ability, legend lore, limited wish, mage armor, magic aura, mark of justice, mass sanctuary, moment of prescience, Mordenkainen’s disjunction, planeshift, protection from spells, Rary’s mnemonic enhancer, Rary’s telepathic bond, scrying, silence, spell resistance, spell turning, true seeing, true strike, vision, weighed in the balance, word of balance. Caster level 77th; save DC 46 + spell level.

Wizard Spells Per Day: 16/16/15/15/15/15/13/12/12/12/4/4/4/6/5/5/5/5/4/4/4/4/3/3/3/3. 73rd caster level (76th on Divination spells). Base DC = 40 + spell level. Can cast arcane and divine spells from any spell list as wizard spells.

Boccob’s non-epic metamagic feats may be applied twice to the same spell (if applicable), and have level increases as follows: Augment Spell (varies), Empower Spell (+2), Fortify Spell (varies), Heighten Spell (varies), Quicken Spell (automatic), Twin Spell (+4). Five quickened spells may be cast per round.

Epic Spells: 6 epic spells per day, up to Spellcraft DC 218. Boccob has full access to the heal and life seeds, and should be considered to know any spell he needs up to DC 107. He also knows alternate versions of most of his spells that allow him to sacrifice up to 20,000 XP to mitigate the DC down to this level.

Possessions: Amulet of the archmagi, purple robe of the archmagi, ring of the archmagi, staff of the archmagi. In addition, Boccob's spellbooks detail every spell every devised, and his Library of Lore includes vaults that contain a copy of every magic item ever created by mortals. He also possesses one of the largest mundane libraries in the Cosmos, including every alchemal and scientific formula ever tested.

Other Divine Powers
Boccob automatically gets the best result possible on all die rolls he makes. Calculate success, failure, or other effects accordingly. When a roll of 20 would grant automatic success (as on an attack roll or saving throw), a d20 should still be rolled and used to check for automatic success. Certain rolls (such as miss chances and rank checks) should still be rolled by the DM (Boccob does not automatically succeed).

Boccob is immortal. The only way for him to die is through special circumstances, usually by being slain in magical or physical combat. Boccob risks permanent destruction only if slain on the Concordant Opposition and provided the attacker succeeds at a rank check. Otherwise, he reforms within the Library of Lore after sixty years.

Automatic Actions: Boccob can use Craft (alchemy), Craft (bookbinding), Craft (calligraphy), Craft (gemcutting), Decipher Script, Forgery, Knowledge (arcana), Knowledge (architecture and engineering), Knowledge (dungeoneering), Knowledge (geography), Knowledge (history), Knowledge (nature), Knowledge (nobility and royalty), Knowledge (the planes), or Knowledge (religion) as an immediate action if the DC for the task is 30 or lower, or Spellcraft if the DC is 47 or lower. He can also use analyze dweomer and legend lore as immediate actions. Boccob can perform up to twenty swift actions each round.

Create Magic Items: Boccob can create any kind of magic item, and need expend only half of the normal time and resources when doing so.

Portfolio Sense: Boccob senses any working of the Art (that is, any spell, spell-like ability, or magic item effect) seventeen weeks before it happens and retains the sensation seventeen weeks after the event occurs. He has the similar ability to sense the discovery, recording, or sharing of any spell or bit of arcane knowledge.

Senses: Boccob can see (using normal vision or low-light vision), hear, touch, and smell at a distance of seventeen miles. As a standard action, he can perceive anything within seventeen miles of his worshipers, holy sites, objects, or any location where one of his titles or name was spoken in the last hour. He can extend his senses to up to twenty locations at once. He can block the sensing power of deities of less than 18 divine ranks at up to two remote locations at once for 17 hours.

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Amulet of the Archmagi: This major artifact can absorb spells as a rod of absorption, except that it has no limit to how many spell levels it can absorb. As a standard action, the wearer may draw a number of spell levels equal to her Intelligence modifier from the amulet and use them to restore an equal number of her expended spell levels (as a Rary’s mnemonic enhancer spell). A deity can do so as a swift action.

Purple Robe of the Archmagi: This heavy purple robe is covered in stylized arcane runes stitched in gold. Its wearer, if an arcane spellcaster, gains the following powers:
o +10 insight bonus on Knowledge (arcana) and Spellcraft checks.
o +10 bonus to arcane caster level.
o +10 bonus to arcane spell DCs.
If the robe is donned by any non-neutral character, she immediately gains five negative levels. While these negative levels never result in lost levels, they remain as long as the garment is worn and cannot be overcome in any way (including restoration spells).

Ring of the Archmagi: This major artifact functions as a ring of wizardry, except that it doubles the wearer’s arcane spells per day of all levels that she can cast. It also grants the wearer a +40 competence bonus on Spellcraft checks made during epic spellcasting.

Staff of the Archmagi: A long silver staff, shod in gold, capped with a massive diamond, and inscribed with sigils and runes of all types, this potent artifact contains many spell powers and other functions. Some of its powers use charges, while others don’t. The following powers do not use charges:
o Continual flame
o Enlarge person (Fortitude DC 15 negates)
o Greater enhance eldritch flow (constant)
o Hold portal
o Light
o Mage hand
o Magic missile
o Unseen servant
o Stinking cloud
o Summon swarm
The following powers drain 1 charge per usage:
o Cloudkill
o Cone of cold
o Dispel magic
o Fireball (heightened to 5th level, 10d6 damage)
o Globe of invulnerability
o Hold monster
o Ice storm
o Invisibility
o Knock
o Levitate
o Lightning bolt (heightened to 5th level, 10d6 damage)
o Minor Creation
o Passwall
o Pyrotechnics
o Ray of enfeeblement (heightened to 5th level)
o Summon monster VI
o Wall of fire
o Wall of force (in a 10-ft.-diameter hemisphere around the caster only)
o Web
These powers drain 2 charges per usage:
o Chain lightning (maximized)
o Meteor swarm
o Monster summoning IX
o Plane shift
o Prismatic sphere
o Prismatic spray (extended)
o Sunburst (empowered)
o Telekinesis (400 lb. maximum weight)
The staff of the archmagi gives the wielder spell resistance 23. If this is willingly lowered, however, the staff can also be used to absorb arcane spell energy directed at its wielder, as a rod of absorption does. Unlike the rod, this staff converts spell levels into charges rather than retaining them as spell energy usable by a spellcaster. If the staff absorbs enough spell levels to exceed its limit of 170 charges, it explodes as if a retributive strike had been performed (see below).

The wielder of the staff of the archmagi gains a +5 luck bonus to AC and saving throws. The staff is also a +6 quarterstaff of greater spell storing (9th-level spells), and its wielder may use it to smite opponents. If 1 charge is expended (as a free action), the staff causes double damage (x3 on a critical hit) for 1 round.

Retributive Strike: The staff of the archmagi can be broken for a retributive strike. Such an act must be purposeful and declared by the wielder. All charges in the staff are released in a 30-foot spread. All within 10 feet of the broken staff take hit points of damage equal to 8 times the number of charges in the staff, those between 11 feet and 20 feet away take points equal to 6 times the number of charges, and those 21 feet to 30 feet distant take 4 times the number of charges. A Reflex save reduces damage by half.

The character breaking the staff has a 50% chance (01–50 on d%) of traveling to another plane of existence, but if she does not (51–100), the explosive release of spell energy destroys her. Only specific items, including the staff of the magi and the staff of power are capable of a retributive strike.

Kelb_Panthera
2014-01-28, 07:55 AM
For my Races of the Margin homebrew project, I will have two new dieties that could use statting. It's generally understood that Dieties and Demigods dieties are not up to snuff, but I'm not sure how powerful DvR 2 and DvR 8 dieites should be in modern play. Thoughts? Please compare to something more objective than a level X party of mid-op or high-op or whatever; three-label optimization level is too vague for this purpose.

The problem with the gods in deities and demigods isn't with the divine rank system and its associated DSA's and divine bonuses. The problem is with how horribly unoptimized they are as characters before that.

Making sure they all get 20 levels of progression in one of the core caster classes is essential. Just reselecting their feats, in particular making sure they -all- get epic spellcasting, would go a -long- ways toward making them viable as well.

As someone upthread mentioned, alter reality alone makes a deity nigh unbeatable to non-deities. Life and Death allows a god to snuff any non-god he pleases as long as they're not under the protection of a more powerful god.

Psyren
2014-01-28, 09:10 AM
If you're statting them at all then you want them to be killable. And if they are killable at any level they are killable at level 1.

Clistenes
2014-01-28, 09:38 AM
I wonder...if a god gains the prerrequisites for a divine ability thanks to an item, could he take a divine ability? (say, reaching Cha 29 thanks to a pendant or ring or similar and taking Alter Reality).

Kelb_Panthera
2014-01-28, 09:47 AM
I wonder...if a god gains the prerrequisites for a divine ability thanks to an item, could he take a divine ability? (say, reaching Cha 29 thanks to a pendant or ring or similar and taking Alter Reality).

If he happens to have it on him and active when he gains the divine rank that allows him to take the ability, I don't see why not. Gaining a divine rank is kind of a big deal and not all that common.

Ravens_cry
2014-01-28, 10:51 AM
Personally, I like gods to be largely unstatted. Can you destroy the wind? Can you destroy the very concept of light and darkness? War and peace? Good and evil?
Maybe you can, but not by swinging swords at it.

SinsI
2014-01-28, 11:42 AM
Strength of a god should be proportional to the number of believers they have.
Treat them as a Cleric with caster level equal to log_2 (number of believers).