Dead Eye?

[Fates]

It seems odd to me that in Op-discussions regarding ranged characters, this feat isn't brought up more often. It seems somewhat ideal to me for ranged characters in general, perhaps more so than crossbow sniper, which seems to be held in much higher regard.

Is there something I'm missing here? Is it the 30-foot range restriction? The fact that it's from Dragon Compendium? The fact that it doesn't work against crit-immune enemies? What?

Thanks in advance,
Fates

[Nettlekid]

What it is is that Dex to damage just isn't that much. Your Dex mod might be like +5, +10 if you pump it up? It's true that that's great for punching through a lot of DR that makes ranged attacks otherwise shudder, but it's not that big of a number. Shadow Blade is appreciated on Rogue/Swordsage builds because they get lots of attacks so the Dex to damage builds up, and it's usually there to supplement Sneak Attack as opposed to being the main source of damage on its own.

The thing that makes ranged attacks less viable as a damage source is the lack of any ranged version of Power Attack/Shock Trooper/Leap Attack. That's where melee's big damage comes from. Even Hank's Energy Bow doesn't really pick up the slack, though it's a good start. That, and like you said the fact that being within 30 ft invalidates the whole point of range, that is to say to be far away from bad guys, also speaks against it.

[Fates]

That's all well and good, but I was speaking specifically of optimization for characters that use ranged attacks as their primary source of damage. Saying it's inferior to what melee dex-based characters get is fairly meaningless- I'm already well aware.

Anyway, I agree about the 30-foot range bit. It's pretty clear that, in an ideal situation, no archer in their right mind would ever be that close to their enemy. Thanks for clearing that up.

[Kelb_Panthera]

I've seen it mentioned a few times, though usually in reference to the original dragon magazine version rather than the one from the compendium. I doubt there's any difference between the two. It's a pretty straight-forward feat but it's kinda lackluster.

It's only a little extra damage and only inside 30ft. Generally, if you're an archer and you're inside 30ft, you're too close. Between that and the fact that archery just can't do any serious damage unless you're machine-gunning, a feat intensive track to take, it's just not worth the feat most of the time.

[Nettlekid]

That's all well and good, but I was speaking specifically of optimization for characters that use ranged attacks as their primary source of damage. Saying it's inferior to what melee dex-based characters get is fairly meaningless- I'm already well aware.

Anyway, I agree about the 30-foot range bit. It's pretty clear that, in an ideal situation, no archer in their right mind would ever be that close to their enemy. Thanks for clearing that up.

What I meant by comparing it to melee characters is that in both cases, it's Dex to damage. And yet Shadow Blade is mentioned a lot more than Dead Eye. There are reasons for that. So I compared the two to describe those reasons, and why Dex to damage for ranged isn't amazing enough to be brought up in the same way it is for melee.

[Thrice Dead Cat]

There's also the fact that crossbows have to go through a lot of hoops to get access to full attacks, on top of the glorious greater manyshot skirmish combo.

[Gadora]

That's all well and good, but I was speaking specifically of optimization for characters that use ranged attacks as their primary source of damage. Saying it's inferior to what melee dex-based characters get is fairly meaningless- I'm already well aware.

Anyway, I agree about the 30-foot range bit. It's pretty clear that, in an ideal situation, no archer in their right mind would ever be that close to their enemy. Thanks for clearing that up.

A scout archer would probably get some good mileage out of it, especially with the errata putting the BAB requirement at +1, assuming they can spare the feats. Other than that, I can't think of any reason for an archer to want to be in a 30 foot range on a regular basis.

[Rebel7284]

Combination of reasons:

1. Obscure source.
2. Originally printed with high BAB requirements, not everyone is aware of the errata that put it back at BAB +1
3. Not all good archer builds have good dex (Zen Archery)
4. Has no place in the archer builds that focus on long range.

I am fairly sure 1. and 2. are the main reasons that you don't see it more. Although as people pointed out, there are few ranged builds, period.

[Slipperychicken]

The thing that makes ranged attacks less viable as a damage source is the lack of any ranged version of Power Attack/Shock Trooper/Leap Attack.

Yeah, PF basically instituted ranged PA (called "Deadly Aim (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/combat-feats/deadly-aim-combat)"), and it works beautifully for making archery viable again (that along with the extra feats PF gives everyone). I recommend porting it to 3.5 so you can play an archer and deal respectable damage.

[Nihilarian]

If you are an archer firing within 30ft., you are almost certainly someone who utilizes precision damage.

Anyone who wants to use precision damage with a ranged weapon is far more likely to want to use Crossbow Sniper. The two aren't mutually exclusive, but they don't work well together. The 60ft. Range is worth a few points of damage.