[3.5] Airship Invention

[Saambell]

Say I'm a wizard, level 10-15, and I am in a setting that does not have airships. But I want one. How would a wizard of roughly the above level take an existing Sailing Ship and convert it to a flying vessel?

[Bullet06320]

the best way I can think of, is reaserch your own custom spell, create minor helm, Its a 6th level spell, its originally from 2nd edition spelljammer

http://www.romsys.demon.co.uk/frpg/spelljam/spells.htm#Create_Minor_Helm

http://www.spelljammer.org/

theres all the rules u need

[sktarq]

I imagine you'd have just as much luck with the DM using the variety of levitate that is used to create flying castles (which you may have to research in this world) and enchanting a ship (possibly custom created) with levitation. And a gust of wind projector with permanency on a gimbal as a fan boat for possibly the simplest propulsion.

[Fortinbro]

https://scontent-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/t1/539101_10200536555999585_1806126673_n.jpg

Go to a higher tech plane like Mechanus and pay the natives.

[Zweisteine]

Eberron has flying ships, so you might want to look into that. It involves binding a fire* elemental to a special ship, to make it fly.
There is a feat that allows you to perform such bindings, though you may need an eberron-specific gnome-only Prfor such a powerful elemental. If that is the case, convince your DM that, because you are not in Eberron, it doesn't have to be gnome-only. The only reason it is at all is because the gnomes carefully guard the secrets to elemental binding in Eberron.
http://static4.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20080830211125/eberron/images/4/43/Skyship.jpg

*Because they think a ring of fire around the ship looks cool. An air elemental would actually be more appropriate.

[Haldir]

Pretty simple.

Have Craft Wondrous Item or a goodly amount of gold.

Create Boards of Levitation: http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/SRD:Boots_of_Levitation, to be installed in the keel and hull. At CL 10, your Levitation spells can lift 1000 lbs, so you have to build as many as you need to lift your ship, you can use metal to ensure the ship lifts evenly, but be sure to account for any extra weight. CLEARLY define the command method you build that allows you to activate all of the Boards of Levitation at once, you may possibly need another magic item to do this, if your DM is a jerkface.

Create Thrust: There are a ton of ways to do this, and this thread will soon fill up with them, but I personally like turbines bound with some version of Cyclonic Blast. http://dndtools.eu/spells/spell-compendium--86/cyclonic-blast--4301/.

It has a Bullrush mod + 12 AND rotates at tornado speed, I'm no physicist, but I think a well designed prop going at that speed will get you moving reasonably fast....

[Diarmuid]

The Stronghold Builder's Guidebook may also have relevant (read: not from dandwiki) stuff for how to make structures that fly. More than likely, the logic could be extrapolated and applied to a ship in similar fashion.

[Pex]

Way back when in 2E someone in my gaming circle created a Mass Levitation spell, 8th level I believe, that could affect a volume/weight large enough to have an airship. It required the wizard to maintain concentration to move the ship/whatever is being levitated. The net effect was to increase the economy of the home country because it opened up trading markets with another continent that was faster than normal seafaring.

I've adopted the idea and effect for my own game which I'm running now.

[Ravens_cry]

https://scontent-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/t1/539101_10200536555999585_1806126673_n.jpg

Go to a higher tech plane like Mechanus and pay the natives.
Sails don't work on airships, as the craft is moving along with the wind, there is no relative difference in speed.

[Totema]

Sails don't work on airships, as the craft is moving along with the wind, there is no relative difference in speed.

Oh, the poor cat girls! I can hear them screaming!

[Lightlawbliss]

Sails don't work on airships, as the craft is moving along with the wind, there is no relative difference in speed.

Depends on how fast you want to move. High altitude winds can make the stuff we are getting down low look slow. If you need proof that winds can push stuff in the air: hot air balloons.

[Ravens_cry]

Depends on how fast you want to move. High altitude winds can make the stuff we are getting down low look slow. If you need proof that winds can push stuff in the air: hot air balloons.
Oh, wind can push stuff around, duh, but you can't use sails to *control* where you go on an aerostat for the aforementioned reasons.

Oh, the poor cat girls! I can hear them screaming!
I have scientific evidence any time a fanboy or fangirl squees, a catgirl is created. I only do my part to prevent an population explosion that would have a devastating effect on fictional ecologies everywhere.

[Deophaun]

Sails don't work on airships, as the craft is moving along with the wind, there is no relative difference in speed.
Sure they do, if you have a wizard hitting them with gust of wind. :P

[Duke of Urrel]

Sails can work on airships in a limited way. You can use them to travel with the wind behind you, but not perpendicular to the wind or against it, as you can (closing in up to nearly 30° of a headwind) in a sailboat. The only way to sail perpendicular to the wind or against it in a sailboat is to use a triangular sail and a keel to create lateral resistance underwater. In an airborne airship, both the keel and the sail are exposed to the same wind from the same direction, so they can't work against each other, as they do in a sailboat that tacks perpendicular to or against the wind. Indeed, if you have a sidewind or a headwind, you'd better trim all your sails in an airship, because the wind will only slow you down or blow you off course. But if the wind is behind you, an airship can certainly sail before the wind.

[Gavinfoxx]

Don't use a sailing ship. Seriously.

https://docs.google.com/document/d/14zilT4WGOyHM0AfpG4-GmD2FkgDg1HZ9HC1cTleQHds/edit

[unseenmage]

Sails can work on airships in a limited way. You can use them to travel with the wind behind you, but not perpendicular to the wind or against it, as you can (closing in up to nearly 30° of a headwind) in a sailboat. The only way to sail perpendicular to the wind or against it in a sailboat is to use a triangular sail and a keel to create lateral resistance underwater. In an airborne airship, both the keel and the sail are exposed to the same wind from the same direction, so they can't work against each other, as they do in a sailboat that tacks perpendicular to or against the wind. Indeed, if you have a sidewind or a headwind, you'd better trim all your sails in an airship, because the wind will only slow you down or blow you off course. But if the wind is behind you, an airship can certainly sail before the wind.

This does make me wonder if one couldn't use the Reverse Gravity spell or similar to simulate the forces of the water against hull. As sailing ship-esque airships are oft depicted some force or another is levitating or pushing the ship where it is, if not where it's going.

[Duke of Urrel]

This does make me wonder if one couldn't use the Reverse Gravity spell or similar to simulate the forces of the water against hull. As sailing ship-esque airships are oft depicted some force or another is levitating or pushing the ship where it is, if not where it's going.

Well, why not? And I confess that the picture provided by Fortinbro looks really cool. There must be some magical way to make it work.

The biggest flaw I can see in Fortinbro's picture is the parasailing individual who's trailing behind the ship. If the ship is being driven before the wind, as the swelling square sails seem to indicate, then the parasailer's line should stretch out in front of the ship, not trail behind it.

Another flaw is of course the skull-and-crossbones flag, which ought to flap toward the front of the ship rather than toward the rear, because that is the direction of the wind – and actual sailing ships that sail with the wind can never go faster than the wind. (A tacking sailboat with a triangular sail is a different matter.) This is a detail that lots of artists get wrong.

But I still think the image is cool.

[Deophaun]

This does make me wonder if one couldn't use the Reverse Gravity spell or similar to simulate the forces of the water against hull.
Reverse gravity happens to be the exact spell the Stronghold Builder's Guidebook uses as a prerequisite for floating strongholds.

[Ravens_cry]

Sails can work on airships in a limited way. You can use them to travel with the wind behind you, but not perpendicular to the wind or against it, as you can (closing in up to nearly 30° of a headwind) in a sailboat. The only way to sail perpendicular to the wind or against it in a sailboat is to use a triangular sail and a keel to create lateral resistance underwater. In an airborne airship, both the keel and the sail are exposed to the same wind from the same direction, so they can't work against each other, as they do in a sailboat that tacks perpendicular to or against the wind. Indeed, if you have a sidewind or a headwind, you'd better trim all your sails in an airship, because the wind will only slow you down or blow you off course. But if the wind is behind you, an airship can certainly sail before the wind.
It's moving with the wind, but that has nothing to do with the sails. It's that it's been carried along with the wind, having the same average density. A balloon, no sails, will be carried along by the wind just fine.

[Fortinbro]

Well, why not? And I confess that the picture provided by Fortinbro looks really cool. There must be some magical way to make it work.

The biggest flaw I can see in Fortinbro's picture is the parasailing individual who's trailing behind the ship. If the ship is being driven before the wind, as the swelling square sails seem to indicate, then the parasailer's line should stretch out in front of the ship, not trail behind it.

Another flaw is of course the skull-and-crossbones flag, which ought to flap toward the front of the ship rather than toward the rear, because that is the direction of the wind – and actual sailing ships that sail with the wind can never go faster than the wind. (A tacking sailboat with a triangular sail is a different matter.) This is a detail that lots of artists get wrong.

But I still think the image is cool.

I'm using this image for a ship in my campaign. The seasoned old captain paid warforged to upgrade his old sailing ship. Airships exist in the setting so this design is extremely expensive and mechanically inefficient but the captain in question is sentimental. The ship is called "Rustbucket."

[Captnq]

Step 1: Select a Craft. Anything you can ride in will do. It has to be at least large size.
Step 2: Animate the craft.
Step 3: Enslave the craft to your will.
Step 4: Get a fleshgrafter. Have them graft a 10,000 gp pair of demonic Feathered wings to your animated vehicle. (Your craft will become evil. Make sure you maintain control over it with an iron fist.)
Step 5: Pay a 15th level wizard to polymorph any object and make the craft as large as possible. If you are only making it really BIG, it should be permanent.
Step 6: Avoid Anti-Magic Fields.
Step 7: ???
Step 8: Profit.

[Drachasor]

I think you ideally want a Construct-based solution. This would still work in an anti-magic field.

Effigy Air Elementals are probably a good place to start, though there are others. Get enough to life your airship as a light load, and you'll be cruising along at a good click. If the DM allows they could even be completely contained within the ship. Worst case vents and the like might be needed to allow air flow.

Though I'd check with your DM to make sure he'd allow the ship to fly into space (if made space-worthy). It's always good to reach for the stars.

[Ravens_cry]

If you want to go into space, you want a Spelljammer (http://www.spelljammer.org/).

[unseenmage]

I think you ideally want a Construct-based solution. This would still work in an anti-magic field.

Effigy Air Elementals are probably a good place to start, though there are others. Get enough to life your airship as a light load, and you'll be cruising along at a good click. If the DM allows they could even be completely contained within the ship. Worst case vents and the like might be needed to allow air flow.

Though I'd check with your DM to make sure he'd allow the ship to fly into space (if made space-worthy). It's always good to reach for the stars.

How do you manage an Effigy Air Elemental? Thought it could only be applied to the living flesh and blood type creatures.
(Specifically aberration, animal, dragon, giant, humanoid, magical beast, monstrous humanoid, or vermin.)
Sorry, had the book open in front of me, and I'm genuinely curious about applying Effigy to nonstandard stuff.

[CIDE]

Ahem... (https://docs.google.com/document/d/14zilT4WGOyHM0AfpG4-GmD2FkgDg1HZ9HC1cTleQHds/edit)

Someone already did all the work for us, guys. An amazing job at that.

[Drachasor]

How do you manage an Effigy Air Elemental? Thought it could only be applied to the living flesh and blood type creatures.
(Specifically aberration, animal, dragon, giant, humanoid, magical beast, monstrous humanoid, or vermin.)
Sorry, had the book open in front of me, and I'm genuinely curious about applying Effigy to nonstandard stuff.

Ahh, point. I didn't notice that. A Half-Dragon Air Elemental would work though, it's type is Dragon. Air Elementals are corporeal, it seems, since they aren't Incorporeal. You don't need anything special to grapple them for instance.

Really though I just picked the first thing I could think off. There are plenty of other creatures that fly without wings.

[unseenmage]

Ahh, point. I didn't notice that. A Half-Dragon Air Elemental would work though, it's type is Dragon. Air Elementals are corporeal, it seems, since they aren't Incorporeal. You don't need anything special to grapple them for instance.

Really though I just picked the first thing I could think off. There are plenty of other creatures that fly without wings.

Darn. And here I was hoping to stumble onto another Construct combo. :smallfrown:

[Flame of Anor]

Sails can work on airships in a limited way. You can use them to travel with the wind behind you, but not perpendicular to the wind or against it, as you can (closing in up to nearly 30° of a headwind) in a sailboat. The only way to sail perpendicular to the wind or against it in a sailboat is to use a triangular sail and a keel to create lateral resistance underwater. In an airborne airship, both the keel and the sail are exposed to the same wind from the same direction, so they can't work against each other, as they do in a sailboat that tacks perpendicular to or against the wind. Indeed, if you have a sidewind or a headwind, you'd better trim all your sails in an airship, because the wind will only slow you down or blow you off course. But if the wind is behind you, an airship can certainly sail before the wind.

Yeah, but it doesn't need sails for that, because there's nothing stopping it from going with the wind. That's like saying you need to add fins to a cork so that it floats down the river properly and doesn't hold still in the middle of the stream.

[Gavinfoxx]

Ahem... (https://docs.google.com/document/d/14zilT4WGOyHM0AfpG4-GmD2FkgDg1HZ9HC1cTleQHds/edit)

Someone already did all the work for us, guys. An amazing job at that.

Why thank you! I'm glad you like my work. But I've already swordsaged you earlier. ;)

[CIDE]

Why thank you! I'm glad you like my work. But I've already swordsaged you earlier. ;)


I don't know how I missed your post... And yes! You did an amazing job on that document. I haven't had a chance to use it in a game or anything but it was still awesome. Thanks for the hard work.