Quick poll on an aspect of Gestalt (Bonus Feats)

[Von Krieger]

So I'm in a weekly Skype game, and the GM insists that he's always played it this way and I think it's a bit silly.

If two classes both offer a class feature marked "Bonus Feat" at the same level that the player takes them (Monk 1 / Fighter 1, for example) even if they draw from separate lists, it is considered the same class feature and thus a character only gets one.

However if this bonus feat is granted by a different class feature, via selecting a bonus feat as a Rogue Talent, it's perfectly allowable.

I think the matter is silly, inconsistently applied, and mostly affects classes that don't need to have their power level dropped even further.

So I'm curious to know how many players and GM's actually have implemented the Bonus feats thing with gestalt games in the manner of mutual exclusivity. Or haven't, as it were.

[Omegas]

Bonus Feats are a class feature that are not subject to the stacking rules. Any class level that offer Bonus Feat (including level 1) rewards the character with an additional feat they did not have each time. The player must choose in accordance with any lists but other them that it is part of what makes the character.

The exception is when the RAW text directly says otherwise.

[Bullet06320]

bonus feats from class level are usually from specific lists
for fighters its the fighter feat list
for monk its a choice between 2 different feats
for wizards its metamagic feat, an item creation feat, or Spell Mastery
so for gestalt u would get the class features of both, the bonus feats for both classes, just that each feat would have to be from the appropriate list

[Zweisteine]

If you are playing a fighter//monk, you fully deserve two free bonus feats.

That said, I would assume bonus feats do mot overlap, especially when the classes are using different lists. They are not identical features, and you could not successfully argue that spellcasting does not overlap, even though it is a class feature that always has the same name, "spellcasting."

[Von Krieger]

I'm not at all confused on how bonus feat lists and the like work. My GM and I are having a clash of views regarding two classes that grant bonus feats.

I think that if two classes offer bonus feats, listing them as bonus feats, that the intent is that you get both the bonus feats, as selected from the lists appropriate to the class granting you them.

He states that you cannot stack identically named class features. Fighter 1 and Monk 1 both give the class feature "Bonus Feat" and even though the feat selection lists are different, and you can very rarely take two copies of the same feat, a Fighter 1 / Monk 1 only gets one Bonus Feat selection.

So he thinks because it's the same named class feature, you don't get it twice, even though the class feature called "Bonus Feat" is essentially a shorthand of "Choose from xxx options," even if they are from radically different lists (IE Fighter, Monk, or Wizard bonus feats.)

[zilonox]

Class features that two classes share (such as uncanny dodge) accrue at the rate of the faster class.

Both Fighter and Monk have a class feature called "Bonus Feat". So, according the SRD, you should only get the faster of the two progressions.

However, if I were DM'ing then I would allow both progressions since both classes need all the help they can get.

[Yawgmoth]

Both Fighter and Monk have a class feature called "Bonus Feat". So, according the SRD, you should only get the faster of the two progressions. By your logic, a wizard//cleric would have to choose which spellcasting progression they follow, since they both have a class feature named "spell per day". Which is exactly as wrong as saying that Bonus Feats don't stack.

OP, tell your DM that he is 100% wrong on this and then kick his knees off for crippling melee for no reason.

[Karnith]

By your logic, a wizard//cleric would have to choose which spellcasting progression they follow, since they both have a class feature named "spell per day". Which is exactly as wrong as saying that Bonus Feats don't stack.
Gestalt spellcasters get a specific exception that allows them to progress their spells per day for both classes separately. Per the SRD (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/gestaltCharacters.htm#buildingAGestaltCharacter):

A gestalt character gains the class features of both classes.
[...]
A gestalt character follows a similar procedure when he attains 2nd and subsequent levels. Each time he gains a new level, he chooses two classes, takes the best aspects of each, and applies them to his characteristics. A few caveats apply, however.

Class features that two classes share (such as uncanny dodge) accrue at the rate of the faster class.
Gestalt characters with more than one spellcasting class keep track of their spells per day separately.
A gestalt character can’t combine two prestige classes at any level, although it’s okay to combine a prestige class and a regular class. Prestige classes that are essentially class combinations-such as the arcane trickster, mystic theurge, and eldritch knight-should be prohibited if you’re using gestalt classes, because they unduly complicate the game balance of what’s already a high-powered variant. Because it’s possible for gestalt characters to qualify for prestige classes earlier than normal, the game master is entirely justified in toughening the prerequisites of a prestige class so it’s available only after 5th level, even for gestalt characters.(Emphasis mine)

It's still a bad idea to punish the a gestalted Fighter/Monk, though, and I've never played in a gestalt game in which characters don't progress bonus feats from both sides. It's generally just going to needlessly target classes that are already weak.

EDIT: Wait, I take it back. I knew a DM once who vetoed a Fighter/Psychic Warrior character getting all those bonus feats. Because, you know, Fighter feats are soooooo OP.

[zilonox]

{scrubbed}

Totally nija'd by Karnith. =)

[Zweisteine]

Here's an argument:
Gestalt prevents stacking of identical class features. A fighter's and a monk's bonus fears, while they share a name, are not the same feature. This is proven by the fact that the text of the two features is not the same.

And point out to him that you could be playing a Wizard/Cleric and destroying the world instead. Monks need love. Fighters need lots of love.