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2014-02-10, 09:20 PM
Its a flat DC20 to sleight of hand an object away from someone as a standard action if you dont mind if they notice. You can make that a free action if you take a -20 penalty to the roll. If you have infinate free actions you can brute force everything off of someone if you have the possibility of making a DC40 check (even if its only on a natural 20 :smallwink:).
A great build from poster A_S used this in the Skill Optimization Challenge thread a few years back:
Lyssa and Lintra: The Two-Edged Blade - A study in the use and abuse of Sleight of Hand
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The BuildRace and AbilitiesRace: Dvati
Abilities (32 point buy):
Str: 8
Dex: 16 > 20
Con: 14
Int: 16
Wis: 8
Cha: 14
Abilities (including items):
Str: 8
Dex: 30
Con: 14
Int: 24
Wis: 8
Cha: 22
Progression{table=head]Level|Class|Base Attack Bonus|Fort Save|Ref Save|Will Save|Skills|Skill Tricks|Feats|Class Features
Level Adjustment +1
1st|Factotum 1|
+0|
+0|
+2|
+0|Balance 4, Bluff 4, Concentration 4, Hide 4, Iaijutsu Focus 4, Move Silently 4, Perform (Sing) 4, Sleight of Hand 4, Tumble 4||Flaw (Shaky), Flaw (Inattentive), Skill Focus (Sleight of Hand), Improved Initiative, Darkstalker|Inspiration, Cunning Insight, Cunning Knowledge, Trapfinding
2nd|Swashbuckler 1|
+1|
+2|
+2|
+0|Balance +1, Bluff +1, Iaijutsu Focus +1, Tumble +1|Nimble Charge|Weapon Finesse (b)|
3rd|Rogue 1|
+1|
+2|
+4|
+0|Concentration +1, Hide +2, Iaijutsu Focus +1, Move Silently +2, Sleight of Hand +1, Tumble +1, Use Magic Device +1||Quick Draw|Sneak Attack +1d6, Mimic 1/day
4th|Rogue 2|
+2|
+2|
+5|
+0|Concentration +2, Hide +1, Move Silently +1, Sleight of Hand +2, Tumble +1|Hidden Blade||Evasion
5th|Rogue 3|
+3|
+3|
+5|
+1|Concentration +1, Hide +1, Iaijutsu Focus +2, Move Silently +1, Perform (Sing) +1, Sleight of Hand +1|||Sneak Attack +2d6, Penetrating Strike
6th|Swashbuckler 2|
+4|
+4|
+5|
+1|Concentration +1, Iaijutsu Focus +1, Tumble +1|Sudden Draw|Daring Outlaw|Grace +1, Sneak Attack +3d6, Dodge Bonus +1
7th|Swashbuckler 3|
+5|
+4|
+6|
+2|Hide +1, Iaijutsu Focus +1, Move Silently +1, Tumble +1|||Insightful Strike
8th|Swordsage 1|
+6|
+4|
+8|
+4|Concentration +3, Hide +2, Iaijutsu Focus +1, Move Silently +2|||Quick to Act +1, Discipline Focus (Weapon Focus, Shadow Hand)
9th|Factotum 2|
+7|
+4|
+9|
+4|Concentration +1, Hide +1, Iaijutsu Focus +1, Move Silently +1, Sleight of Hand +2, Tumble +3||Craven|Arcane Dilettante (1 spell)
10th|Factotum 3|
+8|
+5|
+9|
+5|Concentration +1, Hide +1, Iaijutsu Focus +1, Move Silently +1, Perform (Sing) +2, Sleight of Hand +2, Tumble +1|||Brains Over Brawn, Cunning Defense
11th|Marshall 1|
+8|
+7|
+9|
+7|Perform (Sing) +5|Acrobatic Backstab|Skill Focus (Diplomacy) (b)|Minor Aura (Motivate Dexterity)
12th|Uncanny Trickster 1|
+8|
+7|
+11|
+7|Concentration +1, Hide +2, Iaijutsu Focus +2, Move Silently +2, Perform (Sing) +1|Nimble Stand (b)|Staggering Strike|Favorite Trick (Acrobatic Backstab)
13th|Uncanny Trickster 2|
+9|
+7|
+12|
+7|Concentration +2, Hide +1, Iaijutsu Focus +1, Move Silently +1, Perform (Sing) +3|Twisted Charge (b)||Favorite Trick (Sudden Draw), Sneak Attack +4d6, Uncanny Dodge
14th|Uncanny Trickster 3|
+10|
+8|
+12|
+8|Concentration +1, Hide +1, Iaijutsu Focus +1, Move Silently +1, Perform (Sing) +1, Tumble +4|Mosquito's Bite (b)||Favorite Trick (Hidden Blade), Tricky Defense
15th|Rogue 4|
+11|
+8|
+13|
+8|Concentration +1, Hide +1, Iaijutsu Focus +1, Move Silently +1, Perform (Sing) +1, Sleight of Hand +2, Tumble +1||Shadow Blade|Sneak Attack +5d6
16th|Rogue 5|
+11|
+8|
+13|
+8|Concentration +1, Hide +1, Iaijutsu Focus +1, Move Silently +1, Perform (Sing) +1, Sleight of Hand +2, Tumble +1|||
17th|Rogue 6|
+12|
+9|
+14|
+9|Concentration +1, Hide +1, Iaijutsu Focus +1, Move Silently +1, Perform (Sing) +1, Sleight of Hand +2, Tumble +1|||Sneak Attack +6d6, Improved Uncanny Dodge
18th|Rogue 7|
+13|
+9|
+14|
+9|Concentration +1, Hide +1, Iaijutsu Focus +1, Move Silently +1, Perform (Sing) +1, Sleight of Hand +2, Tumble +1||Master Pickpocket|Dodge Bonus +2
19th|Rogue 8|
+14|
+9|
+15|
+9|Concentration +1, Hide +1, Iaijutsu Focus +1, Move Silently +1, Perform (Sing) +1, Sleight of Hand +2, Tumble +1|||Sneak Attack +7d6, Skill Mastery (Concentration, Hide, Iaijutsu Focus, Move Silently, Perform (Sing), Sleight of Hand), Grace +2[/table]
SkillsItalicized skill ranks in table are cross-class.
Final skill ranks: Balance 5, Bluff 5, Concentration 22, Hide 22, Iaijutsu Focus 22, Move Silently 22, Perform (Sing) 22, Sleight of Hand 22, Tumble 22, Use Magic Device 1
Skill Tricks (Favorite): Nimble Charge, Hidden Blade, Sudden Draw, Acrobatic Backstab, Nimble Stand, Twisted Charge, Mosquito's Bite
Maneuvers and StancesManeuvers: Ruby Nightmare Blade
Cloak of Deception
Shadow Blade Technique
Shadow Jaunt
Mountain Hammer
Emerald Razor
Stances: Island of Blades
Gear:WBL at ECL 20: 760000
Gear: Sleight of Hand item +30 (90000)
Sleight of Hand item +30 (90000)
Manual of Quickness of Action +4 (110000)
Tome of Leadership and Infulence +2 (55000)
Tome of Clear Thought +2 (55000)
Gloves of Dexterity +6 (36000)
Gloves of Dexterity +6 (36000)
Cloak of Charisma +6 (36000)
Cloak of Charisma +6 (36000)
Headband of Intellect +6 (36000)
Headband of Intellect +6 (36000)
Total: 616000
The rest can be spent on armor and weapons, as you see fit.
Sources Dragon Compendium Volume I (Dvati)
Dungeonscape (Factotum, Penetrating Strike ACF)
Unearthed Arcana (Flaws)
Lords of Madness (Darkstalker)
Oriental Adventures (Iaijutsu Focus)
Complete Warrior (Swashbuckler)
Complete Scoundrel (skill tricks, Daring Outlaw, Uncanny Trickster)
Exemplars of Evil (Mimic ACF)
Tome of Battle (Swordsage, Shadow Blade)
Champions of Ruin (Craven)
Miniatures Handbook (Marshall)
Complete Adventurer (Staggering Strike)
Eberron: City of Stormreach (Master Pickpocket)
The Trick
This build represents a pair of Dvati who focus on using epic Sleight of Hand checks to teleport and hide one another as free actions during combat, allowing them to deliver enormous amounts of sneak damage and bewilder their opponents as they dart around, flickering in and out of sight.
Sleight of Hand check (level 19):
10 (take 10)
22 (ranks)
6 (Motivate Dexterity)
7 (Brains over Brawn)
2 (Bluff synergy)
3 (Skill focus)
30 (custom competence item)
Total: 90 (enough to succeed with Master Pickpocket feat)
CombatLyssa and Lintra in combat function as a sneaky melee DPS team with an exceptionally large array of ways to reliably deliver their damage.
Sources of damage (level acquired): Iaijutsu Focus (level 1, improves steadily over the build)
Sneak Attack (level 3, improves steadily over the build, works on sneak-immune targets thanks to Penetrating Strike)
Int to damage (level 7)
Various maneuvers (level 8)
Dex to damage (level 15)
Ways to make opponents flat-footed (for Iaijutsu Focus, Sneak Attack): Stealth: The build is Dex-focused, takes Darkstalker at level 1, and keeps Hide and Move Silently maxed. Starting at 10th and 11th level, respectively, it also gets Int and Cha to both skills. Lyssa and Lintra should generally get a surprise round.
High initiative: It's a Dex-focused build with Improved Initiative from level 1. It gets another +1 at level 8 from Swordsage. In addition to the surprise round, you should usually act before your opponents in the first regular round of combat, getting you more flat-footed goodness.
Skill tricks: Hidden Blade, Sudden Draw, and Acrobatic Backstab all let you treat opponents as flat-footed. Thanks to Uncanny Trickster, you get to use each of them twice per encounter (per twin).
Ruby Nightmare Blade: Self explanatory, gained as one of your Swordsage maneuvers. Concentration stays maxed or close to maxed throughout the build.
Other sources of sneak attack: Flanking: As Dvati, you're especially good at this, getting a +3 instead of +2 on flanking attacks. You also pick up the Island of Blades stance at level 8, allowing you to qualify as flanking as long as both twins are adjacent to the same opponent, regardless of exact position. And once the Sleight of Hand trick comes online, good luck maneuvering out of flanking position; each twin can teleport the other 10 feet as a free action, meaning they can rearrange each other to get into perfect positions to flank.
Cloak of Deception: Swift action Greater Invisibility, gained as a Swordsage maneuver at level 8.
Sleight of Hand trick: By making a willing, adjacent creature disappear, the twins basically have Hide Other In Plain Sight. Each round, the twin whose action it is gets to hide and teleport the other one as a free action. When the other twin's turn comes along, they're already hidden...Sneak Attack away!
Debuff: Staggering Strike: Thanks to this feat, starting at level 12, anyone you sneak attack becomes terrible.
Survivability: In this category, you're basically relying on your respectable AC (dex-focused, Swashbuckler dodge bonus, Uncanny Dodge), decent saves w/ evasion, and excellent stealth to stay alive. This is not a strength of the build, though (it generally isn't for rogue types); you should not be tanking damage.
Role-PlayingThe flavor of this build all flows together fairly nicely: It's a stealthy but focused combatant. Fighting against Lyssa and Lintra, you should never really feel like you have any idea of what's going on, as they dart around you, flicker in and out of sight, and deliver devastating blows from angles you were never expecting before fading back into the shadows, leaving you never sure they were even there (except for all the blood). Which, let's be honest, is a totally badass combat style.
The Dvati thing should add some interesting and unique role-playing opportunities. Also, their "serene" side fits well with the "focused combatant" aspect of the build (Iaijutsu Focus, Swordsage), while their "intellectually energetic, and curious" side fits well with the dependence on skills for combat effectiveness.
The only thing that doesn't flow particularly with the fluff is the level of Marshall. Ah, well; such are the sacrifices we make for skill optimization.
UtilitySleight of Hand has two main uses in combat: The teleportation trick discussed above, and the ability to steal somebody else's weapon. The former serves as essentially the capstone to the build, allowing an additional means to reliably deliver sneak damage, and an effective way to escape combat should the need arise, greatly increasing survivability. The latter has the potential to be extremely useful against many melee builds; anybody who depends on Power Attack and a two-hander for damage, for instance, is going to be much less effective without the two-hander. Thus, an effective way to open many combats would be to steal the enemy's weapons before they even become aware of the threat.
Outside of combat, the uses of Sleight of Hand are obvious: How often are the PCs faced with a situation in which somebody has something they need? What if somebody in the party had a Sleight of Hand check high enough that they were practically guaranteed to be able to get that item without getting caught? Problem solved.
Creativity/OriginalityThorgrim didn't even see them until the first blow fell: Pale furies out of some hell, lovely and cold. Armed and armored. Long, light hair. Eyes like ice. Their knives found seams in his armor he would have sworn no Dwarven craft should possess, and he felt blood flow from half a dozen deep cuts as he raised his shield. Half dead and only now ready to start the fight, he thought. Who are these shadows?
As he took a mighty swing at one of his assailants, her companion cast a corner of her cloak between them and his intended victim seemed to fade into the night, her snow-white face but a trick of the moonlight. His axe swung true, but its blade parted only air from air, as where instants ago there had stood a woman there now were only shadows.
Thorgrim hefted his shield to turn aside a lightning-fast strike from the remaining assassin's blade, but before he could answer with a blow of his own, a whispered rustle in the wind warned him of peril behind him. Far to late to turn and face the danger, he lowered his head and charged forward, sending a silent prayer of thanks heavenward as he heard a knife blade whistle by the back of his neck. The woman in front of him calmly sidestepped his clumsy rush, slashing another wound into his side as he passed.
The dwarf turned to face his foes, and they each took a hasty step backwards. That's right, he thought, now I'm ready for you. He strode forward, ready to make blood answer for blood. As he closed, though, the twins opened their mouths and sang, in eerie unison. The sound of their mingled voices seemed to fill Thorgrim's head, blocking all sound, all thought, and he involuntarily lifted his hands toward his ears. As he shook his head to clear it, one of his foes danced across the grass in front of her double, and when the swirl of her cloak had passed, only one opponent stood before the dwarf. Undeterred, he swung his axe in a deadly arc. The dagger raised to turn the blow aside could only alter its course so far, and the dwarf shouted a triumphant "Ha!" as he felt his blade bite into flesh.
Thorgrim's elation lasted for perhaps half a second. The last thing he felt was the knife sink into his back.
(With apologies to Roger Zelazny.)
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I developed the basics of this build when I looked through the Epic Skills page (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/epic/skills.htm), saw the top-level use for Sleight of Hand, and went, "woah, I'll bet you could use that in combat." Then somebody came along and posted a link to that damn Lightning Thief (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=142080) build. *sigh*
Okay, so I'm not the first person to ever think of optimizing Sleight of Hand. However, I'd like to think that this build incorporates the epic Sleight of Hand trick more completely into a thematically unified build. Lyssa and Lintra are not a one-trick pony; instead, the Sleight of Hand trick serves as a capstone ability that synergizes with the capabilities already in place when it is acquired.
Furthermore, although I did pick a single skill to optimize to truly epic levels, I also tried to make the entire build centered on the use of skills in combat. Practically everything Lyssa and Lintra do relies on skill use: Sleight of Hand is obvious.
Iaijutsu Focus delivers bonus damage based on a skill check.
Hide and Move Silently are crucial to delivering Sneak Attack and Iaijutsu Focus damage.
The other ways the build has for delivering Iaijutsu Focus damage are also skill-dependent (skill tricks, and Concentration for Ruby Nightmare Blade)
Whenever you don't have anything better to do with your move actions (like when you're already at melee range but you want to deliver a standard action maneuver), you can make a Perform (Sing) check to gain combat bonuses against your opponent.
In addition to optimizing a single skill to epic levels, I've tried to optimize the use of skills in combat in general as a central theme of this build.
DifficultyAs is plain from the build I linked above, I'm not the first to think of using Sleight of Hand in combat. However, I'm hoping the extensive use of additional skills in combat will serve me in this category.
Plus, you know, I'm not a Jumplomancer :smallwink: .
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