How much damage should a fighter be doing?

[Yogibear41]

How much damage should a moderately optimized to non-optimized fighter/barbarian be doing at every level from 1-20, feel free to skip a few levels like 1, 4, 6, 9, etc. some of the time a level or 2 doesn't really change that much.

When I say moderately optimized I mean smart enough to say oh weapon focus, and weapon specialization help me out with attacks, and power attack and cleave seem pretty good too, and not pick things that are ridiculously stupid like skill focus: climb or something.

I do not mean uber-charger shock trooper builds that deal 100+ damage at level 6.

Would also like to work with a standardish race: orcs, half-orcs, humans, dwarves are all fine.

Feral Half-Minotaur Water Orcs not so much. (great in theory, just trying to see what a normal person can/should be able to do)

Basically I want to know what a build for an average joe type player would look like, a person who knows the game well enough, but who has never read anything on the internet to "minmax" his build.

[Firechanter]

Are we talking with Buffs from Party members, or just all by himself?
A very conservative, unoptimized build on level 12:

Falchion +3
Str 18 +3 +6 = 27 (+8)
GWS: +4
Improved Crit Falchion: x1,3 (avg.)
Power Attack -3 / +6

-> 5 +3 +12 +4 +6 = ~30; x1,3 = 40 avg per Hit
3 attacks per round
1,9 hits expected -> 76 dpr

basic Buffs:
Inspire Courage (unoptimized ca +4)
Haste (1 extra attack)

-> 44 avg dmg, expect 3 hits -> 132 dpr
not counting cleave.

But that's really pretty much the floor.

[holywhippet]

Kind of varies. If they go for sword and shield style they will do less damage than someone with a greatsword. For an average player that is a fair chance though. So presume a 1d8 damage weapon.

Assume 16 strength to at level 1 with increases to strength every 4th level.

Assume they take weapon specialization at level 4 and the greater version at level 12 for +2 damage each.

At level 1 they will do 1d8 + 3 damage.

At level 4 they will do 1d8 + 5 damage.

At level 8 they will do 1d8 + 6 damage.

At level 12 they will do 1d8 + 7 damage.

At level 16 they will do 1d8 + 8 damage.

If they take power attack they can subtract from their BAB and add to their damage. This is tricky to factor in as it reduces their odds of actually hitting. In theory a level 20 fighter could add 20 to damage, in practice they aren't going to hit much if they try it.

The final factor is weapon enchantments. Roughly speaking they'd expect an extra +1 to their weapon every 4-5 levels. But the enchantments can also do damage directly like a flaming weapon which does and extra 1d6 of fire damage. That really depends on what as a DM gives them or gives them the chance to acquire. That also includes strength enhancing items like gauntlets of ogre power.

[Flickerdart]

A fighter should be dropping level-appropriate mooks (where more than one of them makes up a CR-equivalent encounter) in one blow. Let's face it, they're just basically there to take up time and stand between you and things that matter.

In encounters against real enemies that matter (1 or more CR-appropriate foes) then one or two full attacks with all hits landing should be enough to either finish them off or convince them to flee. Between hits whiffing and positioning hokey-pokey, this extends into 3-4 rounds of face-smashing that encounters are supposed to take up.

[Raimun]

More. And more.

[Seerow]

More. And more.

And then some more.

[subject42]

EricGrau did some excellent math (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8888663&postcount=15) on this a while back:

[Urpriest]

There is no "should" on this.

A melee character should be doing their job, and doing it reliably. Every round, said melee character should have a meaningful effect on the battle, whether that means dropping one of a number of enemies if they are damage-focused, or preventing one or more enemies from acting if they are control-focused. Basically, you should always trade at one action for more than one action.

To focus a bit more on this criteria, combat lasts around three rounds and you're part of a party of four. That means that each round, you should be getting rid of more than 1/12 of the enemy's total actions for that combat, if all your allies are contributing effectively. So if you're fighting four enemies, they in total get twelve actions, so you need to at least prevent one enemy from acting for one round, and deal some damage in the process. If you can't prevent the opponent from acting (by dazing, tripping, etc.), and you're purely focused on damage, then getting rid of one round's worth of actions with one round of your actions means dealing half the opponent's hit points (if you do it again next round, they're two rounds down for two rounds of action) and being able to take the resulting full attack. Most builds can't take the resulting full attack, which means you need to kill the enemy this round instead.