[Pathfinder] Is there any way to command undead indefinitely?

[BizzaroStormy]

I'm trying to find a way to command an intelligent undead indefinitely but the Command Undead spell unfortunately works more like a charm spell so it wont really work for my purposes. Pretty much has to be possible by RAW and the closest i've come to a solution would be an item implanted with the body with a continuous Command Undead effect.

[Raven777]

Control Undead (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/c/control-undead), 7th level Sorc/Wiz spell. Have fun trampling over a sentient creature's rights, you monster.

[BizzaroStormy]

Control Undead (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/c/control-undead), 7th level Sorc/Wiz spell. Have fun trampling over a sentient creature's rights, you monster.

Its actually a former party member and they lost their rights when they died. Its not like im trapping their soul, just making their body continue to be useful.

[Raven777]

If they're intelligent, as mentioned by Magic Jar (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/m/magic-jar), the soul is still holding the wheel. "(Undead creatures are powered by negative energy. Only sentient undead creatures have souls.)"

[BizzaroStormy]

huh....sucks for her

[Urpriest]

This tends to be what the Command Undead feat is for.

[BizzaroStormy]

Right now it looks like my best option would be a continuous Command Undead effect and would simply result in brief periods of it ignoring me. The issue is that I can't figure out how its saving throws would work. I don't know how often an item with a continuous effect would check against her save if she got off the metaphoric leash.

[Karoht]

Its actually a former party member and they lost their rights when they died. Its not like im trapping their soul, just making their body continue to be useful.
So someone else has already raised the party member as an undead? Or is that about to happen?
Because if YOU raise the corpse, you get control, no spells involved. All you need is a scroll if you don't have the appropriate spell.

[Urpriest]

So someone else has already raised the party member as an undead? Or is that about to happen?
Because if YOU raise the corpse, you get control, no spells involved. All you need is a scroll if you don't have the appropriate spell.

That's only true if you're making a Zombie or Skeleton. Create Undead has no special control clauses.

[Karoht]

Command Undead also lasts for days/level. Are you away from this creature for more than days at a time?
What kind of Undead is this person being turned into?

[BizzaroStormy]

The party member just died and will be thrown into a bag of holding when it is safe to do so. I planned on using Create Undead to turn them into a juju zombie so they retain their abilities.

The problem im having now is that I can't find a way to keep them under my boot. I was planning on surgically implanting an item with a continuous Command Undead effect but im not sure how often the creature will get a save against the effect.

[Spore]

I was planning on surgically implanting an item with a continuous Command Undead effect but im not sure how often the creature will get a save against the effect.

If you create it on CL 3, every 3 days. You COULD read it as one save and then never again but I see it as the spell triggering every 3 days again. By the way, I think the item should be that implanted item and a control item (a ring or somesuch) because it is a targetted spell and not target self. By RAW a permanent command undead item wouldn't know to listen to whom without a bound item.

[Segev]

If they're a party member, why do you need to magically keep them under your boot? Won't that harm the other player's fun with his character? Why wouldn't he work with you as he had in life, without magical coercion?

[BizzaroStormy]

Because the player bailed on the game entirely and my character is interested in a servant, not something he'll have to negotiate with.

[Karoht]

1-Get Corpse
2-Strap Corpse to table.
3-Cackle madly.
4-Something something lightning.
5-Create the Juju Zombie
6-Cackle madly.
7-First, try negociating with the creature. If it doesn't agree to work for you, command undead until it fails a save. Take as long as you want, the creature isn't going anywhere. And if they have a spell resistance/will save boosting item, remove that first. Remember to refresh the spell every 3 days or so.
8-Cackle madly.

Do not issue any orders that it knows to be suicidal and everything is good. Treat it nice and maybe the Command Undead is unnecessary.

Best of luck.

*cackles madly*

[Segev]

Also, if you're a necromancer, you have Command Undead, the feat. That is indefinite and is not a charm-effect on intelligent undead. They're just stuck obeying you.

[BizzaroStormy]

1-Get Corpse
2-Strap Corpse to table.
3-Cackle madly.
4-Something something lightning.
5-Create the Juju Zombie
6-Cackle madly.
7-First, try negociating with the creature. If it doesn't agree to work for you, command undead until it fails a save. Take as long as you want, the creature isn't going anywhere. And if they have a spell resistance/will save boosting item, remove that first. Remember to refresh the spell every 3 days or so.
8-Cackle madly.

Do not issue any orders that it knows to be suicidal and everything is good. Treat it nice and maybe the Command Undead is unnecessary.

Best of luck.

*cackles madly*

The problem is the creature being a high-level monk in life so any attempt at binding it would do nothing.

[Karoht]

The problem is the creature being a high-level monk in life so any attempt at binding it would do nothing.Binding the corpse means you can take 20, or just keep rolling until you get a 20, you are in absolutely no rush. Or you can just cast True Strike, as it boosts CMB's as well. Also, check under CMD the rules for escaping being bound in such a manner. It's quite difficult, even for a monk. Add in some skeletons and I'm pretty sure you can boost that CMB even higher.

Monk wakes up
Huh? Why can't I-- *will save*
Erg. Why can't I see? Who's there? What's going on? *will save*
*Spends a standard action attempting to escape.* *will save*

He only needs to fail it once and he's yours. Renew the Command every 3 days, before you renew it tell him to fail his next Save.


Mind you, if you are concerned about DM fiat, it's not likely to work either way.

[BizzaroStormy]

Binding the corpse means you can take 20, or just keep rolling until you get a 20, you are in absolutely no rush. Or you can just cast True Strike, as it boosts CMB's as well. Also, check under CMD the rules for escaping being bound in such a manner. It's quite difficult, even for a monk. Add in some skeletons and I'm pretty sure you can boost that CMB even higher.

Monk wakes up
Huh? Why can't I-- *will save*
Erg. Why can't I see? Who's there? What's going on? *will save*
*Spends a standard action attempting to escape.* *will save*

He only needs to fail it once and he's yours. Renew the Command every 3 days, before you renew it tell him to fail his next Save.


Mind you, if you are concerned about DM fiat, it's not likely to work either way.

They've already got access to abundant step so we're talking about a move action to teleport out of any bonds I may have, then the proper feats to immediately invert my digestive tract upon ending said move action.

I don't think I have to worry about DM fiat since he wants to do everything by the book. I've considered making a cursed item, however, though it would require some fenagling that im not sure this DM would go for.

[Karoht]

They've already got access to abundant step so we're talking about a move action to teleport out of any bonds I may have, then the proper feats to immediately invert my digestive tract upon ending said move action.

I don't think I have to worry about DM fiat since he wants to do everything by the book. I've considered making a cursed item, however, though it would require some fenagling that im not sure this DM would go for.
Ah. That high level. I understand the difficulty. Final suggestion, cast Dimentional Anchor on his corpse before you raise it?
I'm just of the mind that an item seems a bit unnecessary.