Durkula's slip ups

[Zmflavius]

So, like many others, I'm sure, I totally did not see that twist coming.

But I now have to wonder, does anyone know where precisely Durkula managed to slip up on the accents, because I completely missed all of those.

Though, and this is also something I'm a mite curious about, but precisely who do you think is Durkula? I mean, to go by the way Malack was talking, evidently, he expected that when he released Durkula from thralldom, that it would essentially be Durkon who appeared, but in vampire form. Is this some kind of consequence of Durkon not being released from thrall form before Malack's untimely end...but, the other problem, though, is that the way Hel speaks, Durkula has been her pawn for quite a long time (though Durkon clearly isn't in hock with her), possibly ever since he was initially turned into a vampire, or even before (though I doubt very much Durkon the living dwarf was aware of this). Another issue, I think, is that because Hel and Durkula are at least familiar with each other, it would seem that either 1) Durkula at some point contacted Hel before reaching the airship, but without the OOTS noticing, 2) Hel and Durkula have some way of communicating informally that is functionally invisible (but which would call into question why he needs a ritual now to contact her) or 3) Durkula as an entity technically existed before Durkon was vampirized (but evidently without Hel's planning this out, considering how he is described as her 'serendipitous servant'). Or, and I would not know about this, being inexperienced with DnD, is the entire thing is some consequence of the special traits and abilities Durkon receives as a vampire?

[Jaxzan Proditor]

He slipped up in 931 (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0931.html). (Panel 5)

[Gift Jeraff]

"GIVE ME MY STAFF!" (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0931.html) should be "GIVE ME ME STAFF!" or something. Durkon's accent was always inconsistent, though.

[orrion]

People cited actual Scottish friends saying "GIVE ME MY STAFF" wasn't a screw up.

Of course, they could have lying.. but why lie about that?

[Keltest]

He slipped up in 931 (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0931.html). (Panel 5)

besides his accent sounding like MY when shouted, he has used "my" in the past. I think its significantly more likely that he is referring to him ALMOST saying something, then catching himself before he blows his cover.

[reaverb]

but precisely who do you think is Durkula?Hel clearly states in #946 that she created the new soul of Durkula. "..but the dwarves fall under my preview. Your dark soul was birthed in my hall."

[redzimmer]

Perhaps Durkon's "original sin" which led to his banishment was bad enough where his eternal soul was damned in the eyes of secular dwarves, whereas Thor never gave a toss being chaotic in nature, explaining why he still answered the prayers.

So once he died, his soul went to Hel and the evil goddess in question took control of the body that was essentially "hers".

[Jaxzan Proditor]

besides his accent sounding like MY when shouted, he has used "my" in the past. I think its significantly more likely that he is referring to him ALMOST saying something, then catching himself before he blows his cover.

Well, as was pointed out earlier, keep in mind that his accent has never been consistent. I don't think it was originally ever more than a joke anyways. Do real Scots sound like that?

[Keltest]

Well, as was pointed out earlier, keep in mind that his accent has never been consistent. I don't think it was originally ever more than a joke anyways. Do real Scots sound like that?

Depends on the scot. As with most accents, it will sound more or less the same to someone unfamiliar with the culture, but someone who is can tell the difference. IE, most of the different American accents would sound similar to someone who didn't learn to identify them.

[Steward]

Perhaps Durkon's "original sin" which led to his banishment was bad enough where his eternal soul was damned in the eyes of secular dwarves, whereas Thor never gave a toss being chaotic in nature, explaining why he still answered the prayers.

So once he died, his soul went to Hel and the evil goddess in question took control of the body that was essentially "hers".

That's an interesting concept. I had just assumed that the vampire bite is the reason why Durkon could not join Thor; his soul was locked inside his body along with the dark spirit of the vampire possessing him. Hel is the one asking the vampire, "what of the dwarf's spirit?" which implies to me that she doesn't have his soul -- it's still trapped inside his vampirized corpse.

[RiOrius]

(but which would call into question why he needs a ritual now to contact her)

I don't think he's using a ritual. It looks like he was simply meditating and then she appeared before him. Look at his expression when she speaks, panel 6 of the second page: he wasn't expecting her.

[Keltest]

I don't think he's using a ritual. It looks like he was simply meditating and then she appeared before him. Look at his expression when she speaks, panel 6 of the second page: he wasn't expecting her.

He was visibly channeling energy of some sort; not something you normally do when trying to regain energy.

[Thrillhouse]

http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0939.html

Panel 3 of this comic is something of hint at it--vampirized Durkon couldn't really continue to worship Thor, but luckily for Durkula Belkar doesn't know that.

[Keltest]

http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0939.html

Panel 3 of this comic is something of hint at it--vampirized Durkon couldn't really continue to worship Thor, but luckily for Durkula Belkar doesn't know that.

He could still vow by him though. If he were really Durkon, he would continue to use his verbal tics.

[Porthos]

http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0939.html

Panel 3 of this comic is something of hint at it--vampirized Durkon couldn't really continue to worship Thor, but luckily for Durkula Belkar doesn't know that.

Something I just picked up on:

In that same comic in panel 10 he says 'Och' instead of 'Ach', which is what I think he normally says.

And if I'm wrong, I'm sure I'll be told soon enuf. :smalltongue:

[Cracklord]

Personally, I was hoping his accent would change over time to reflect his new nature.

Zuh vay zhe dvarf szpoke vould became iconic.

But who knows. I might get lucky yet. I'm pretty happy with it so far.

[RMS Oceanic]

Another subtle clue is that during the Tarquin fight, unless Durkon was being spoken to/attacked directly, he was curiously blank. I will admit I was taken in with everyone else, so when I saw that I thought it was Durkon's passive nature being enhanced somehow.

[ti'esar]

Another subtle clue is that during the Tarquin fight, unless Durkon was being spoken to/attacked directly, he was curiously blank. I will admit I was taken in with everyone else, so when I saw that I thought it was Durkon's passive nature being enhanced somehow.

To me, that same passivity is what made "GIVE ME MY STAFF" so suspicious whether you considered it dropping the accent or not. It was one of the only times we'd really seen Durkon display any sort of emotion since Malack was dusted - and the other was killing Z. Though I certainly never believed the theory that "Durkon" wasn't, that sort of thing definitely pointed to there being something nasty underneath his seemingly-mostly-unchanged personality.

[Mad Humanist]

So, like many others, I'm sure, I totally did not see that twist coming.

I didn't see it coming either. Personally I cannot stand roller-coasters though I love OOTS. But to those who do, are you able in any meaningful way to see the coming twists and turns of the ride and does it help cope with the pain and horror?

[RMS Oceanic]

I didn't see it coming either. Personally I cannot stand roller-coasters though I love OOTS. But to those who do, are you able in any meaningful way to see the coming twists and turns of the ride and does it help cope with the pain and horror?

The two biggest twists in this book were basically hidden in plain sight: Malack was a Vampire; and who we thought of as Durkon wasn't. They felt like the obvious inference, so obviously they couldn't be, right?

In an internet soaked in post-modernism, sometimes the biggest twist is when things are exactly as they appear to be.

[b_jonas]

Also in #929, he manages to pronounce "the" correctly (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0929.html). He usually pronounces it "tha".

[JessmanCA]

Panel 8 here is too clear, no accent at all.

http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0939.html

[Keltest]

Panel 8 here is too clear, no accent at all.

http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0939.html

Spelling that with an accent would make me want to throw my keyboard out the window.

"wonce each night, ahdeally."

*crash*

See? there it goes. Thank you integrated keyboards.

[drazen]

Another slip-up might be panel 1 in #922 (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0922.html). Wouldn't he normally say "Methinks" and "Thar backin' away" rather than "I think" and "They're backin' away" ?

[NerdyKris]

Perhaps Durkon's "original sin" which led to his banishment was bad enough where his eternal soul was damned in the eyes of secular dwarves, whereas Thor never gave a toss being chaotic in nature, explaining why he still answered the prayers.

So once he died, his soul went to Hel and the evil goddess in question took control of the body that was essentially "hers".

He was exiled because the high priest wanted to avoid a prophecy, actually. Not through any fault of his own.

Also, his "exile" was to learn about human cultures. It was not phrased in any way as a punishment.

[Keltest]

Another slip-up might be panel 1 in #922 (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0922.html). Wouldn't he normally say "Methinks" and "Thar backin' away" rather than "I think" and "They're backin' away" ?

Thar is for there, as in Over There. Methinks... well, im honestly not entirely sure. Im reasonably certain he could say that, but Rich has been inconsistent enough its hard to peg.

[Rogar Demonblud]

Go further back, to when he was a thrall, and you can see Rich left a lot of clues. Duron doesn't use the accent once.

Now we know that it's not because he was a thrall, but because he didn't see a need for the con.

[Demoman]

#929: http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0929.html

Panel 4: "THE sun!"

To quote the wise words of Belkar: "he can pronounce stratosphere but not 'the'?"

[Keltest]

#929: http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0929.html

Panel 4: "THE sun!"

To quote the wise words of Belkar: "he can pronounce stratosphere but not 'the'?"

ah hah! a real slip!

[orrion]

Go further back, to when he was a thrall, and you can see Rich left a lot of clues. Duron doesn't use the accent once.

Now we know that it's not because he was a thrall, but because he didn't see a need for the con.

At the time it wasn't a clue because he was a thrall. Since thralls have no free will there's no reason to believe he had any control over his speech in the first place.

[Jaxzan Proditor]

I think it's funny how obvious the slip ups are in hindsight. Most of us just noticed "Give me my staff".

[wyrmhole]

He was exiled because the high priest wanted to avoid a prophecy, actually. Not through any fault of his own.

Also, his "exile" was to learn about human cultures. It was not phrased in any way as a punishment.

Ugh! Haven't these people read the classics (from another reality)?

When will they figure out that trying to avoid the prophecy is always what ends up bringing it about.

[Porthos]

Ugh! Haven't these people read the classics (from another reality)?

When will they figure out that trying to avoid the prophecy is always what ends up bringing it about.

Origins Spoiler:

They specifically noted that possibility.

A beat later they decided to forget all about it by grabbing a beer. :smalltongue:

[Zmeoaice]

This raises a lot of questions about vampirism in OoTS

So if Durkula is destroyed, does that mean he's gone forever? Or would the "spirit" go back to Hel's place. Do all vampires have a "Spirit" sent to them by a death god? Was Malack's soul struggling to get out of the Vampire's body?

[Mith]

I'm wondering about Malack here. When he says that he was not the same lizard shaman that he was 200 years ago, would it still work with this new spirit inhabiting his corpse, since he WASN'T the same being? Or is it more of Malack being a bit delusional?

[Porthos]

Something I just picked up on:

In that same comic in panel 10 he says 'Och' instead of 'Ach', which is what I think he normally says.

And if I'm wrong, I'm sure I'll be told soon enuf. :smalltongue:

Turns out I'm wrong. (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0247.html) Other dwarves with that accent has said it that way too (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0229.html).

Aw, well. Back to the drawing board. :smalltongue:

[Forikroder]

This raises a lot of questions about vampirism in OoTS

So if Durkula is destroyed, does that mean he's gone forever? Or would the "spirit" go back to Hel's place. Do all vampires have a "Spirit" sent to them by a death god? Was Malack's soul struggling to get out of the Vampire's body?

maybe after long enough the 2 spirits merge together

who wants to bet that Durkula will make a slip up, someone will call him on it and hell mention a small mistake with his accent or something and Roy will catch on hes fake?

[Mad Humanist]

who wants to bet that Durkula will make a slip up, someone will call him on it and hell mention a small mistake with his accent or something and Roy will catch on hes fake?

I actually don't think it matters that much if his accent slips up. Roy seems to be taking the view that it's better to have Durkon as a useful vampire rather than a heavy corpse on a stick. Durkon actually needs to play his hand, before Roy will change his mind.

[Forikroder]

I actually don't think it matters that much if his accent slips up. Roy seems to be taking the view that it's better to have Durkon as a useful vampire rather than a heavy corpse on a stick. Durkon actually needs to play his hand, before Roy will change his mind.

hes still accepting its durkon on some level though, if he has a reason to think that durkulas been faking then hed stake it

[Zmeoaice]

hes still accepting its durkon on some level though, if he has a reason to think that durkulas been faking then hed stake it

I guess Durkula could say he was faking the accent to make Roy and the rest of the order feel better, so they'd let him slide.

[Forikroder]

I guess Durkula could say he was faking the accent to make Roy and the rest of the order feel better, so they'd let him slide.

http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0305.html

but to Durkon its not an accent at all, its just how those words are spoken

[Keltest]

http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0305.html

but to Durkon its not an accent at all, its just how those words are spoken

that's what an accent is...

He just doesn't realize he does it.

[Forikroder]

that's what an accent is...

He just doesn't realize he does it.

he wrote the words as theyd sound with his accent

thats not him having an accent he was taught to speak and write it that way

[Keltest]

he wrote the words as theyd sound with his accent

thats not him having an accent he was taught to speak and write it that way

People with accents are taught to speak that way as well. Perhaps you aren't quite understanding what an accent is.

[Forikroder]

People with accents are taught to speak that way as well. Perhaps you aren't quite understanding what an accent is.

and accent is a "mistake" in pronunciation, not in spelling Durkon spells the words the way he pronounces them

[Keltest]

and accent is a "mistake" in pronunciation, not in spelling Durkon spells the words the way he pronounces them

you don't seem to be understanding the concept of a joke.

[Knight.Anon]

The time I knew Durkon was changed was when he casually broke the Drows neck while talking about being a vampire as a good thing. Durkon would never boast about something he hated so much.

[Forikroder]

you don't seem to be understanding the concept of a joke.

what now your trying to say you were jsut trying to be funny?

[Keltest]

what now your trying to say you were jsut trying to be funny?

No. Durkon writing in an accent was obviously meant to be a joke. Using it as an example of how Roy could tell something changed about Durkon is stretching credulity, especially because it would not be at all hard for Durkon to have picked up proper scribing between then and now. Heck, he even had a studying montage!

[Forikroder]

No. Durkon writing in an accent was obviously meant to be a joke. Using it as an example of how Roy could tell something changed about Durkon is stretching credulity, especially because it would not be at all hard for Durkon to have picked up proper scribing between then and now. Heck, he even had a studying montage!

so you think the Giant couldnt possibly have planned this from that far back?

[Keltest]

so you think the Giant couldnt possibly have planned this from that far back?

Its possible, not probable. He would have had to have been thinking of dialogue several YEARS in advance.

[Jaxzan Proditor]

so you think the Giant couldnt possibly have planned this from that far back?

Durkon was always going to end up a Vampire. (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=15709954#post15709954) That doesn't mean that the Giant was planning on using a joke that was only brought up once as a way to reveal to Roy that something was wrong.

[Forikroder]

Its possible, not probable. He would have had to have been thinking of dialogue several YEARS in advance.

hes already said he has the story all planned out and is just missing detail, and he said that he planned to vamp durkon since strip one so i dont consider it wierd at all

[Keltest]

hes already said he has the story all planned out and is just missing detail, and he said that he planned to vamp durkon since strip one so i dont consider it wierd at all

As Jaxzan said, just because he has the general story planned out does not mean he has had every specific detail worked out since he decided on what the story would be.

[Cavenskull]

and accent is a "mistake" in pronunciation, not in spelling Durkon spells the words the way he pronounces them

An accent is a variation in pronunciation, not a mistake in pronunciation.

[wyrmhole]

Origins Spoiler:

They specifically noted that possibility.

A beat later they decided to forget all about it by grabbing a beer. :smalltongue:

Ha! Classic OotS. :smallsmile:

[Forikroder]

As Jaxzan said, just because he has the general story planned out does not mean he has had every specific detail worked out since he decided on what the story would be.

and you think how they figure out that Durkon is not the vampire is not a big detail

[Jaxzan Proditor]

I doubt it will come from noting that the quality of Durkon's writing has improved (or has gotten worse, for that matter).

[Zmeoaice]

and you think how they figure out that Durkon is a vampire is not a big detail

The original idea was to have Durkon become a vampire for one strip to make a "turn undead" joke, and then have the next strip have Durkon become a normal dwarf inexplicably.

[Forikroder]

I doubt it will come from noting that the quality of Durkon's writing has improved (or has gotten worse, for that matter).

im saying Durkon may slip up the accent, it get noticed then him admit that its an accent

[NihhusHuotAliro]

I knew it from the panel he said, "but that two o' ye're still tha same old *****".

Because Durkon would never say the word ***** like that.

[Jaxzan Proditor]

im saying Durkon may slip up the accent, it get noticed then him admit that its an accent
You mean that it is fake? In any case, he has already slipped up on the accent several times (and it was never that consistent to begin with). I imagine that he will also get better at controlling his voice, much like he was able to make an indoor voice (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0879.html).

[NihhusHuotAliro]

http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=295787

Note how the forum reacted to the accent...

[Jaxzan Proditor]

http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=295787

Note how the forum reacted to the accent...
That is now hysterically funny, on so many levels.

[Forikroder]

You mean that it is fake? In any case, he has already slipped up on the accent several times (and it was never that consistent to begin with). I imagine that he will also get better at controlling his voice, much like he was able to make an indoor voice (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0879.html).

Durkon never thought of it as an accent, so if Durkula saids it is an accent it may be enough to raise Roys suspicion high enough

[Jaxzan Proditor]

The way you phrased it made it sound like "Durkon will admit that his accent is an accent" (implying that he is aware he speaks differently from others, but not faking), not "Durkon will admit that his accent is not his natural way of talking", which is what I said.

[ORione]

I didn't see it coming either. Personally I cannot stand roller-coasters though I love OOTS. But to those who do, are you able in any meaningful way to see the coming twists and turns of the ride and does it help cope with the pain and horror?

Do you mean metaphorical, emotional roller coasters, or literal ones? With metaphorical ones, I prefer not to see them coming. Makes it all the more fun when events unfold! If it's about something fictional, that is. Real life emotional roller coasters suck. With literal ones, I don't really consider the ride painful or horrifying at all, but I do prefer to see what's coming up so that I can brace for it.


Ugh! Haven't these people read the classics (from another reality)?

When will they figure out that trying to avoid the prophecy is always what ends up bringing it about.

Pity the high priest didn't know Elan. Or even Tarquin.

[skim172]

I'm gonna go back to his first "free will" moment and his attack on Z and Nale. I'm not gonna argue that killing Z was good or evil or whatever - but I will say that dropping a casual quip with a sly grin as he snapped a guy's neck didn't really seem like Durkon's style.

Other than that, I think it's probably just some inconsistencies with the accent. Here, for example (panel 3) (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0927.html), I think Durkon would be more likely to say, "I've got naught" - seems more refined. Of course, his accent has always been inconsistent - the written version of a fantasy accent based on a stereotypical Scot can't help but be a little off.

One thing - I think Darkon's taken a little bit of a "backseat" role in terms of leadership than Durkon would. Durkon was actively planning, conversing with Roy, throwing out suggestions - Darkon doesn't really do much other than respond. And in the heat of battle, when Durkon would be emotional and angry and desperate and shouting things out, Darkon just seems a bit too blase. "Ho hum, my teammate's long-lost father who is also Hitler is trying to kill us on a dinosaur with his teleporting psychic friend."

And it's not that he's incapable of emotion - when he loses his staff, man, does he get angry.


I'd bet that there's probably something wrong with his smell, too. That's probably partly what's troubling Belkar.

I mean, other than the fact that he may have been the closest thing Belkar had to a friend, and was torturously killed, weeping, right in front of Belkar's eyes, in order to save Belkar's worthless little life, and then was brought back as an abomination against creation to suck the very life out of Belkar - may have predisposed Belkar to be a bit suspicious.

[swordsmankirby]

"Moderate": http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0077.html and http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0908.html

[coineineagh]

There are different Scottish dialects, and I should know since I grew up with Doric.

"Give me my staff" isn't necessarily a slip-up, as we've never seen Durkon in an emotional state. Accent-true would be more like: "Gimme ma staff!" or "Gimme me staff!" but they don't seem to rhyme with the occasion. The reason is that many Scottish accents are spoken with contained nonchalance and dry wit, while Durkon was clearly in a state of crazed desperation. Even the Scots will speak in more clearly understandable English when they're shouting in desperation.

[RMS Oceanic]

I think it's funny how obvious the slip ups are in hindsight. Most of us just noticed "Give me my staff".

The hallmark of a great reveal is that it's obvious after the fact. I think that's what we've got here.

[Gi01]

So, like many others, I'm sure, I totally did not see that twist coming.
1) Durkula at some point contacted Hel before reaching the airship, but without the OOTS noticing, 2) Hel and Durkula have some way of communicating informally that is functionally invisible (but which would call into question why he needs a ritual now to contact her)

Hello

I don't post, but I read OOTS since... 2004.

I was post-reading 907 (www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0907.html) and I think that this is the moment Hel slips up in Durkula's head, freshly released from Malack, and "communicates" somehow with him. He just stands there while Nale and 'Zz talk. He istantly starts to speak with Durkon's accent. He becomes an active, Durkon-style member. We now know that this was part of the plan, therefore something should have happened.

All the above combined with 946 makes me think that this is the moment when the plan begins. Before, Durkula had no free will and couldn't possibly communicate with Hel.

Don't know if this was pointed out, but makes sense to me