What would this be worth as far as LA?

[CyberThread]

+2 dex +2 int -2 con, medium sized, 30ft walking 50ft flying

dark vision 60, low light vision

immunity to sleep

+2 innate bonus on will saves against enchantment and negative energy spells.

Alter Self between Humanoid form, and winged humanoid form

+2 racial bonus bluff,hide,listen,search,disguise,spot checks.

1/day clairvoyance, suggestion, detect thoughts


Please rate versus 3.5 power level, and then again with pathfinder power creep.

[Metahuman1]

Hmm, reflexively, I wanna say 2. Those SLA's and flight are nice, and the stat boosts aren't bad, but a Con penalty hurts everyone and none of those ability's in and of themselves are overwhelming.

[ngilop]

LA +2 for D&D and LA +1 for Pathfinder as its pretty similar to tiefling/assimar though suggestion alone makes me want to slap that up another LA for both.. I erred on the low side I think.

[Nirhael]

For 3.5, LA +3 in my opinion, positive stats, flight, all those racial skill bonuses and SLAs bump it up quite a bit.

[Metahuman1]

Suggestion is 1/day, stat dependent for the save and has lots of things that are immune to it.

I'm more worried about the other two SLA's, and even then, 1 a day SLA's do not the equivalent of character levels make. There nice, but generally not game breaking, certainly no more so then casters with known divination spells.

[Urpriest]

Don't bother for Pathfinder, they don't have a functioning LA system yet.

For 3.5...+1, maybe +2. Precedent is for flight to be hard to get, and the SLAs are third level spells.

In practice, I'd probably just use an existing race for the setting niche. These guys don't seem particularly unique thematically speaking, and people play D&D in order to play in the setting D&D creates.

[Zaydos]

Savage Species: +4.

Functional: +2. I'd advise allowing buy-off at ECL 10, or reducing the LA to +1 if the game is intended to run primarily in the 8+ range.

This assumes Alter Self is actually Alternate Form between Winged and Wingless and not full fledged Alter Self.

[ddude987]

I'd make it +1. The only ability that seems overly LA worthy is the flight. Net positive ability scores, misc bonuses to saves and skills are no LA. The SLAs are good, but not overpoweringly so.

[Deaxsa]

What type is the race?

[Fax Celestis]

I would compare to half-fey, which has better stat mods (in the right build), better fly speed, and better SLAs for +2. You could probably call this +1 and be fine.

[OldTrees1]

3.5
LA +1 if under ECL 5
LA +0 if ECL 5 or above
Reference used: Raptorian

[Zweisteine]

What is the creature type (sounds like a monstrous humanoid to me).

What is its maneuverability in the air?

I'd give it an LA of +2, most likely, though if it has good or perfect maneuverability and a powerful type (especially outsider), that could go up to +3.

(All in 3.5, of course.)

[Snowbluff]

I'd say +2. Without SLA's it's a strong +1.

Also, this is called a Fey'ri with different SLAs.

[Forrestfire]

I'm thinking +2 or high +1 as well. Half-fey is better in almost every respect (more SLAs, flat-out immunity to enchantment, more ability mods, faster fly speed probably), and it's at +2.

[CyberThread]

Thank you all, for the opinions.

[Snowbluff]

Thank you all, for the opinions.

You're welcome, Cyberthread.

[Yogibear41]

Flying seems too good just for a +1, but rest of it doesn't really seem that great for +2, maybe remove the con penalty toss on a +2 cha and make it +2.

I am assuming you are using LA buy-off.

[Studoku]

The main issue with this is the fly speed. It's game breaking until around level 5 where it becomes less and less relevant as flying becomes easier and more common.

If you give the fly speed a similar qualifier to the Raptoran flying- it only allows flight at 5+HD- this could just about work as LA+1.

[Gavinfoxx]

Is this a Fey'ri? You should compare this to a Fey'ri and Lesser Fey'ri...

[Chronos]

I would call it a LA +2. Yeah, it gets full flight a couple of ECL before raptorans do, but it's paying for that with two actual levels. The stats are just barely above LA 0, almost all races get miscellaneous skill bonuses, and the SLAs are decent, but still only 1/day.

You could maybe argue for LA +3, given that the winged template is LA +2 and the stats and SLAs would be worth 1 more. But that'd be the highest I'd consider justifiable, and probably too high.

[137beth]

Yea, I'm going to say +2 for 3.5. +3 would be stretching it. Flight is the main attraction, of course, but a full two levels is a lot.
Yes, it is a bit better than Winged Creature...by a small bit. Not enough to make it LA+3. I try to err on the side of lower LA, though.



For pathfinder, you're probably safe just lowering the LA by one.

A couple questions, though: what is the maneuverability on its flying?
Second, is the alter self ability (Ex), (Su), or (Sp)? If the flight can be dispelled, then it isn't much more than an Overland Flight spell, and is probably weaker than other flying races.




What type is the race?


Alter Self between Humanoid form, and winged humanoid form
Sounds humanoid:smallwink: