Spear or Long Spear

[Grayson01]

Making a Stealthy Leaping Attack Character what would be better Spear or Long Spear?

[ZamielVanWeber]

Long spear. In a war of reach vs being able to throw, reach wins. If you can get your hands on thiclet of.blades all the better.

[Gavinfoxx]

Longspear with Gauntlet for close in fighting. Assuming only simple weapon proficiency?

If you have Martial, you can do better...

[weckar]

I never liked reach weapons much, because you almost always have to move to attack. Full attacks are nearly always out.

[Sir Chuckles]

Longspear with Gauntlet for close in fighting. Assuming only simple weapon proficiency?

If you have Martial, you can do better...

Well, he said stealthy, so I'm working on a "Rogue" assumption.
So yeah, Long for reach and gauntlet or spiked gauntlet. Martial weapons would be nice, though.

[Gavinfoxx]

I never liked reach weapons much, because you almost always have to move to attack. Full attacks are nearly always out.

I've never found this... five foot step, pounce, even without it, you can generally attack more creatures with a reach weapon than with a non reach weapon... just make sure you also threaten adjacent at the same time (armor spikes, gauntlet, spiked gauntlet, etc.)


So Fauchard or Longspear for reach, and Morningstar or Heavy Sickle for close in fighting if you don't have the Longspear/Fauchard out, and Gauntlet for close in fighting when you are using your reach weapon.

This is assuming a strength based rogue.

[Grayson01]

Sorry Should have gave you all more information 1 level Scout/X Dragon Shaman (Black). So pretty much only Simple Weapons. I am just think with the long Spear it might be a little harder to jump out the shadows and get into a square that threatens. Normally my go to simple weapon (expecially with DS) going to use a Morning Star 2-handed as my back up. but Spiked Gantlets are a good call.

[Sir Chuckles]

Sorry Should have gave you all more information 1 level Scout/X Dragon Shaman (Black). So pretty much only Simple Weapons. I am just think with the long Spear it might be a little harder to jump out the shadows and get into a square that threatens. Normally my go to simple weapon (expecially with DS) going to use a Morning Star 2-handed as my back up. but Spiked Gantlets are a good call.

Tie a dagger to a 10ft folding pole.
Or convince your DM to be allowed the equivalent.
A Modular (can be taken apart and reassembled) weapon +150gp, and a folding bow is +75gp.

You Scout movement bonus should greatly help with the whole jumping out part.
It's also already two-handed.

[Grayson01]

Tie a dagger to a 10ft folding pole.
Or convince your DM to be allowed the equivalent.
A Modular (can be taken apart and reassembled) weapon +150gp, and a folding bow is +75gp.

You Scout movement bonus should greatly help with the whole jumping out part.
It's also already two-handed.

Scout Fast movement doesn't kick in until 3rd level and I am only taking the one. But I did take the Trait Quick for an extra +10 ft. I only took Scout cause I needed Listen, Spot, & jump and plan on doing the stealthy sneaking up front so Trapfinding and Disaple Device were nices added ons and since
my main attack style is leaping Skirmish was a better choice then Sneak Attack for once.

Oh and what is already a two-handed weapon.

[Gavinfoxx]

I am just think with the long Spear it might be a little harder to jump out the shadows and get into a square that threatens.

There are no rules which support this. You think a huge weapon will make it hard to hide, but IT DOES NOT.

[Grayson01]

There are no rules which support this. You think a huge weapon will make it hard to hide, but IT DOES NOT.

No no no not the hiding but the straight line on a charge, with the way the grid is set up making a straight line to a spot with in 10 ft with the diagnal rules and the charging only in a straight line rules. Beacuse for leaping attack you have to follow all the rules for a Jump check and a Charge.

[Nihilarian]

Both!

The Changeling property from MIC will let you switch between spear, shortspear and longspear.

[Grayson01]

Both!

The Changeling property from MIC will let you switch between spear, shortspear and longspear.

Okay but what about from 1-5 level? lol

[Sir Chuckles]

Okay but what about from 1-5 level? lol

Changling is +2,000gp.
You can pick it up at 3rd or 4th level, following WBL.
Between that, if you're honestly concerned about the charging rules, just use a regular Spear. Or take the Twisted Charge skill trick from Complete Scoundrel.

[Grayson01]

Changling is +2,000gp.
You can pick it up at 3rd or 4th level, following WBL.
Between that, if you're honestly concerned about the charging rules, just use a regular Spear. Or take the Twisted Charge skill trick from Complete Scoundrel.

Long Spear then Cause it won't really matter until 6th level when I get Leaping Attack.

[Slipperychicken]

Ask your GM if he'll allow you to hold the longspear further up the shaft (referred to as "choking" it) to strike adjacent foes with like a -2 penalty. That's a real thing spearmen do, and it works. Maybe charge a Swift action to swap between holds.

Also, Longspear ftw.

[Grayson01]

Ask your GM if he'll allow you to hold the longspear further up the shaft (referred to as "choking" it) to strike adjacent foes with like a -2 penalty. That's a real thing spearmen do, and it works. Maybe charge a Swift action to swap between holds.

Also, Longspear ftw.

No not without taking Shorthaft, I already asked but thank you.

[Vogonjeltz]

Long Spear then Cause it won't really matter until 6th level when I get Leaping Attack.

Weapon has to be magic already, so that's 2000 on top of the 2000 for an at least +1 weapon, isn't it?

[Slipperychicken]

Weapon has to be magic already, so that's 2000 on top of the 2000 for an at least +1 weapon, isn't it?

Spear (2gp) + Masterwork (300gp) + 1 Magic (2,000gp) + Changeling (2000gp) = 4,302 gold.

[Vogonjeltz]

Spear (2gp) + Masterwork (300gp) + 1 Magic (2,000gp) + Changeling (2000gp) = 4,302 gold.

Thanks, isn't wbl at 4th such that that isn't realistically affordable?

[lsfreak]

No no no not the hiding but the straight line on a charge, with the way the grid is set up making a straight line to a spot with in 10 ft with the diagnal rules and the charging only in a straight line rules. Beacuse for leaping attack you have to follow all the rules for a Jump check and a Charge.

Just to make sure there's no confusion, there's no rules about having to charge in a cardinal direction or midpoint between them. It's perfectly legal to charge five squares forward and one square sideways, provided you don't change direction during the charge.

[Slipperychicken]

Just to make sure there's no confusion, there's no rules about having to charge in a cardinal direction or midpoint between them. It's perfectly legal to charge five squares forward and one square sideways, provided you don't change direction during the charge.

This is true. It took me a while to recognize it.

If you want to determine if you can charge, set up a straight line between the centers of both squares (use a ruler, pencil, string, or something similar) and move your character through each square the line passes through. Obviously, all those squares have to be legal (i.e. not occupied by enemies or difficult terrain).


Thanks, isn't wbl at 4th such that that isn't realistically affordable?

I believe WBL for 4th level is 6,000gp, although it's probably not the best investment to put all your money into a weapon. It might be wiser to just get a +1 spear (2,302gp), then use a gauntlet for close combat until 5th level when you have more cash. Then have it upgraded with Changeling (according to MiC, cost to upgrade is simply the regular cost difference).

[Techwarrior]

Okay but what about from 1-5 level? lol

Carry both. Or rather, carry a Longspear and a Shortspear. A Shortspear has much better mechanics in regards to throwing (normal attack as opposed to full-round action that provokes), which is well worth the die size less damage. Once you get +1 BAB you can move and draw in the same action so it becomes a lot easier to deal with carrying two spears. Try and make Changeling your first major buy.