Solo Druid vs Army

[Shadus]

I'm a level 8 Druid// Barbarian. My mission is too stall a army of Hobgoblins from marching on a town until a airfortess arives. I have a staff that allows you to cast control weather 5 times and can use it too cause blizzards.
The army is composed of mostly Hobgoblins, but there are also orges, tigers, Half-Dragon Trolls, and to top it off two Dragons.
So while I could play it safe and stay outside of camp and shake my staff, I want to cause as much trouble for my enemies as I can. What would you do?

[Gavinfoxx]

www.thetangledweb.net/forums/profiler/view_char.php?cid=54924

You shouldn't wait outside the place and shake your staff.

You should be a high altitude stealth bomber.

Leave the staff for something you can't do with your class abilities...

Make sure to move at half speed, using night and distance to hide / move silently (take 10, using distance penalties so you can't be noticed), and then cast long range spells to bomb the heck out of them while they all sleep...

What colors are the dragons?

You want to open with tornado scale winds on the dragons, to keep them from flying... and you WILL be at maximum altitude for your bombing run.

[Rubik]

The only class more capable than a mid-level druid in a man-vs-army scenario is a high-level wizard, and that's only because high-level wizards outshine everything. Druids have some of the best mass AoE effects in the entire game, and properly utilized (especially in a natural environment), they're fiendishly horrific opponents to wage war against.

Make sure you look through the druid list (primarily in Core, the Spell Compendium, and the It's X Outside books) for spells that hamper large areas, with a secondary focus on damage, and then look for any buffs that allow you to ignore their effects. Also look for ways to cut the opposing side off from necessities, such as food, water, work animals, and intel. Find ways to spoil their food supplies, limit their ability to gather more, poison their water, enrage their draft animals, hinder any possibility of movement, castrate their scouting for intel, bury their command units under a quarter-mile of snow, prevent flying (especially of the dragons) with gale-force winds, raise the plants and animals of the forest itself against them... The possibilities are vast. Anything you can do to cut their legs out from under them and kill hundreds -- or even thousands -- of their soldiers is only of import once you've neutered their ability to respond in any meaningful fashion, though if an especially delicious opportunity arises to cause chaos and mass damage, take it.

And all while maintaining an inconspicuous identity, such as a sparrow or a crow.

[Phelix-Mu]

Control weather, while rather nebulous to look at in terms of dice of damage dealt, can wreak havoc with a large force (especially due to its ridonculous duration). eggy will be by and advise control winds and boreal winds, so I might as well swordsage those comments.

Finally, if you can arrange to coat the ground in snow, blood snow is totally awesome. Really, just read every druid spell in Frostburn. There are only a couple that aren't totally bonkers awesome (like raise ice forest...what is that spell useful for?).

[Telonius]

I'd suggest infiltrating the camp. All of those enemies have to eat. Find their food or water stores, and Summon a bunch of Nature's Allies to get themselves a free lunch. With the army's food supplies gone, they'll need to forage. If they have carts, Warp Wood on the wheels to sabotage them.

If you're Evil, find yourself a single inoffensive-looking animal, and cast Contagion (Blinding Sickness). Have it take a swim in their water containers. Blinding Sickness is "spread in tainted water," so you've now potentially infected the entire camp.

[eggynack]

eggy will be by and advise control winds and boreal winds, so I might as well swordsage those comments.
But control winds is next level. It's tragic, really. Boreal winds is still sweet though. Druids are so good at army destruction though, as Rubik noted, that it might be worth focusing on not-army destruction, and targeting those dragons that are probably the actual problem. What kindsa dragons are we talking about here? Also, what alignment are you? The good/evil half is all relevant and stuff. I mean, you should definitely open by controlling the weather and consuming the world in snow, but hobgoblins aren't that threatening when you're high above the enemy camp. It might be worth casting the long term version of friendly fire (EoE, 27), such that you won't get shot to death.

[Gavinfoxx]

FYI the most relevant part of my army destroyer is the spell list...

1 - 6
Camouflage
Cloudburst
Snowsight
Embrace the Wild
Eyes of the Avoral
Hawkeye

2 - 5
Blood Snow
Briar Web (2x)
Summon Swarm
Obscuring Snow

3 - 4
Arctic Haze
Spike Growth
Wind Wall
Call Lightning

4 - 4
Vortex of Teeth (2x)
Boreal Wind (2x)

5 - 2
Control winds (2) (if they stack with one another to produce tornado scale winds)

(alternately if two control winds do NOT stack with one another: Blizzard & Call Avalanche )

[Silva Stormrage]

Seconding blood snow if you can get snow on the ground. Huge area and really lethal effect.

Sleetstorm + snow sight also makes you pretty much immune to ranged attacks as they can't detect you and you have winds blowing every which way around you.

Boreal winds in front of the army can kill a large amount of troops as well especially if you can get them in some kind of choke point/canyon pass maybe?

[Shadus]

The Dragons are Red and Blue. They're both at least adult. The Blue one tends too like to blast with his breath/wands from afar. Don't know about the Red.
Honestly I'd rather leave the Dragons too the rest of the party.
I'm NG. Also we're playing in Eberron and I'm a member of the Gatekeepers so no summoning outsiders, and we consider poison dishonorable.
I currently have 6 1st, 5 2nd, 5 3rd, and 4 4th level spells to work with.

Without Magic it is already blizzarding outside.

[Silva Stormrage]

Blood snow is an amazing amazing spell then.

Call Avalanche + Boreal Winds for 4th level spells.

You can probably do hit and run tactics to wipe out a good portion of their army without them really able to fight back.

[eggynack]

Call avalanche is actually a 5th level spell, which is fitting given its sweetness. Boreal wind and blood snow both fit in reasonably well though. I'd advise getting snowsight on pretty much everyone in the party if you expect them to successfully crush dragons in blizzard conditions.

[Rethmar]

I'm off topic here, but this reminds me of Nwm from Sepulchrave's campaign logs. Everyone should read them. Just incredible.

Back on topic, these guys above have given the safest and best suggestions. You'll be pretty safe from danger while wiping out masses, or entangling them at the very least.

[Drachasor]

I'd focus on destroying their logistics. Destroy food, break wagon wheels, that sort of thing. That's probably the most effective way to slow people down. Though Spike Stones (as has been suggested) on roads and bridges is good too.

Eye of the Hurricane (Spell Compendium) can be a very effective way for a Druid to mess up a lot of people. Use it while Wildshaped while flying in your fastest form. You can easily screw a lot of people up and you'll be very hard to catch. It'll do 1d4 to 4d4 non-lethal damage too, so it can easily knock out a lot of 1 HD enemies. Then the army has to decide whether to wait for them to wake up or not. Even better

Contagion or Plague Carrier can also be good. Both should be able to spread disease around.

Chameleon is a 2nd level Spell from the Complete Arcane that gives you a +10 Hide Bonus for 1 hour/level. Pretty good for sneaking in and out.

I wouldn't do many Hit and Runs where you do fighting though -- except fly-bys with Eye of the Hurricane. Either be stealthy or just make a summon that can do sufficient damage in one round. Either way you want to avoid getting into combat yourself.


The only class more capable than a mid-level druid in a man-vs-army scenario is a high-level wizard, and that's only because high-level wizards outshine everything. Druids have some of the best mass AoE effects in the entire game, and properly utilized (especially in a natural environment), they're fiendishly horrific opponents to wage war against.

Actually, barring high-op shenanigans, the Druid is better even than a High Level Wizard against a conventional army (5th level guys and below, let's say). Or at least there are more options outside of Gate and Ice Assassin stuff.

Druids have:
Control Weather (larger radius and duration than Wizards)
Control Winds
Storm of Vengeance (360ft radius)
Various other stuff controlling lots of plants and so forth.

Though both have Fimbul Winter, though you can't always get that to work well.

It's kind of hard actually to find spells that deal with say 1000 people, let alone 10k, 100k, or 1 million people. The Druid seems to have a decent advantage here in number and variety.

Granted, a Wizard could take out an army very effectively. It would just take more work.

[Silva Stormrage]

Call avalanche is actually a 5th level spell, which is fitting given its sweetness. Boreal wind and blood snow both fit in reasonably well though. I'd advise getting snowsight on pretty much everyone in the party if you expect them to successfully crush dragons in blizzard conditions.

Huh you are correct. I thought it was one level lower than blizzard. Whoops :smalltongue:

[CrazyYanmega]

I'm not too concerned about that red dragon. Since it is Fire subtype, it takes double damage from Cold, and should go down pretty fast unless it has some kind of "Immunity to Cold" type spell or buff on it. Keep in mind the dragons will not be affected by Blood Snow, since they can fly. Also, the spell still has verbal components, so if the dragons are able to put two and two together, they may realize that the hawk screeching over there may not be a hawk after all and fly over to do something about it. 180 ft. range is well within a dragon's flight capabilities.

EDIT: How does your DM run spot checks for enemies? This could be really important, as different DMs sometimes have different rules. I remember using an Entangle spell, which is non-directional, at about 300 ft in the air while my allies emerged for a frontal ambush. As soon as I used that spell, my DM told me that all of the enemies knew my location, and I got bombarded with Acid Arrow spells.

[Brookshw]

I'm off topic here, but this reminds me of Nwm from Sepulchrave's campaign logs. Everyone should read them. Just incredible.


That was the first thing that sprang to my mind as well :smallbiggrin:

Just as a tactics matter attack at night to hopefully leave them fatigued/exhausted and slow the march.

[Blkmge]

Wildshape into a snake, slither into the enemy camp at night. Wildshape then into a horse and join the picket. From there.. Speak With Animals and convince them to rebel against their riders/drivers. Suddenly the army is devoid of any beasts of burden and mounts, reducing the rate of travel immensely.

While in the camp turn into a dog or cat and dart around, using Warp Wood to ruin carts, barrels/crates so supplies can't be carried easily. Set fire traps in the latrines or officers tents to demoralize them. (Seriously, if you can kill leaders without getting caught do it!) Rusting grasp/heat metal to sabotage weapons, the smithy and seige weapons.

Ahead of the now foraging army, use Diminish Plants to make it harder for them to find supplies. Control Water to dry out any bodies of water Judicious use of Wild Empathy/Animal Companion/Speak With Animals to turn the area into a barren wasteland. Then.. Produce Flame / Gust of Wind to create a grassfire, blowing it into the enemy's flank, herding them off course. Here you can use shape stone/spike stones to set up a trap. Drive them into a valley and use your AOE spella to wreck them.

Even if they have clerics to supply food/water you are forcing them to waste resources to counter your efforts that could be better used elsewhere.


Edit:
Or, just stay as a wildshaped animal amongst their midst and then at night, slip out and kill the officers. No one will ever suspect that one of the horses in their group is actually a druid - they'll be busy looking for a traitor or assassin!

[Fouredged Sword]

If summer, I would dry the area with a heat wave, rather than dump snow. A good brush fire is an armies worst nightmare. Not only do they have to abandon most of their stuff and run, it levels all the forage in the area, so they won't be able to live off the land as they move back over the land.

THEN hit them with a blizzard, after all their tents have burned.

[NotScaryBats]

That was the first thing that sprang to my mind as well :smallbiggrin:

Just as a tactics matter attack at night to hopefully leave them fatigued/exhausted and slow the march.

Yeah, I was gonna suggest reading that for inspiration. He was super high level (maybe epic? I don't remember when it happened), but he basically was flying overhead as a dire eagle, raining down destruction. He summoned an Air Elemental to help out.

Really epic scene.

[Nerd-o-rama]

If summer, I would dry the area with a heat wave, rather than dump snow. A good brush fire is an armies worst nightmare. Not only do they have to abandon most of their stuff and run, it levels all the forage in the area, so they won't be able to live off the land as they move back over the land.

THEN hit them with a blizzard, after all their tents have burned.

If the DM in this scenario is the type to apply real-world logic, you could Control Weather to melt the snow already on the ground, then re-freeze it with CW or a similar spell to surround the enemy with entire square miles of ice.

If not, just bury them, preferably in a canyon, mountain pass, or other narrow region. Snow, hurricanes, tornadoes, avalanches - any combination of these will bring an army to a complete stop, especially if they're relying on conventional vehicles for a supply train. Then when they're bogged down and miserable, start picking off bulks of the enemy troops with AoE damage and/or Blood Snow. Stay in crow or hawk or whatever form so you can hide from their scouts...or just have wolves eat all their scouts.

[Fouredged Sword]

Also, summon creatures while wildshaped as a creature to avoid the dragons. A bunch of crows are hard to tell apart when chasing one.

Earth elementals make really nasty assassins. They haul someone underground and just let go. Then they are stuck under several feet of dirt and can't breathe. The army will have a hard time stopping infiltration from an opponent who can simply walk under their feet.

Have it go for the commanders and spellcasters.

[mangosta71]

we consider poison dishonorable.
You say "dishonorable", I say "effective". A bit of black lotus extract mixed into a pot of stew or a keg of ale, then just sit back and watch everyone take 6d6 CON damage. (I've used this tactic to assassinate everyone at a royal feast. It was glorious.)

I'm a little saddened to see that while clerics get Shivering Touch, druids do not. It would be an extremely quick and easy way to negate the threat of the dragons. Maybe you can get a wand or scroll.

How long do you have to harry the army before they come into contact with your allies? Do they have to cross any bridges or other choke points? If your GM allows it, warp wood on a couple bridge supports could bring the whole thing down then they try to cross it, which would kill some and force the rest to find another route. It might even split their army, allowing your allies to deal with the guys that made it across before the bridge collapsed in a leisurely manner.

[eggynack]

I'm a little saddened to see that while clerics get Shivering Touch, druids do not. It would be an extremely quick and easy way to negate the threat of the dragons. Maybe you can get a wand or scroll.
It's not relevant here, because of alignment stuff, but lahm's finger darts (BoVD, 98) can do some good work along these lines. At this level it deals 3d4 dexterity damage, with no rolls aside from possibly spell resistance, and it does so at medium range. It's not a perfect substitute for shivering touch, especially not in this case, but it does some good work.

[Rebel7284]

What feats do you have? Greenbound Summoning would make it too easy with the wall of thorns SLA. Entangle has a huge area of effect for a first level spell if they pass through an area with vegetation.

[ericgrau]

Just about any dragons short of wyrmlings will laugh at the fort save DC of a blizzard. Don't bother using it on them, use it on the army. 5 uses is more than you think and you'll never get a better opportunity for a 3 mile radius spell than taking down an army. The entirety of the ground forces won't stand much chance. Even the ogre forces will have a lot of trouble with the save and become divided. Wait for them to get within a mile and a half so they can't easily flee and try something else. By then you might catch the dragons within the area anyway.

Spike stones has an hour/level duration so you can set it up ahead of time and wreck large areas. Problem is you can only hit rocky terrain with it so eventually foes will go around all rocks. You can still get a large number on one patch though.

Sleet storm has a 40 foot radius which was the best I could find in core. Will also ruin the day of twenty things on the ground you cast it on. You can use it on the half dragon trolls perhaps who might be the only ground force that can press through the blizzard as one group.

[Rubik]

Summon Nature's Ally IV for 1d3 thoqquas to burrow under the campsight and collapse the ground beneath the army and their supplies? Useful for causing cave-ins and other similar problems in areas with overhead cliffs and rocky overhangs, as well.

[Segev]

If you've a particularly good period of time over which to work, some more subtle ways to mess with them would include having small summoned creatures steal pieces of the dragons' hoards and secret them in the possessions of mid-level officers in the army. Not the commanding officers, but the sergeants and the quartermaster and the like. Minor enough that the leaders don't know them directly, but important enough that their loss is a blow to the army's organization.

[Fouredged Sword]

Thoqquas are also great for setting fires. They can pop up and set a supply area on fire, then pop back down before anyone can respond. Immobile structures like tents and wagons automatically catch fire, as they auto fail reflex saves. Also great for coming up in tents and setting PEOPLE on fire.

[Karoht]

The key thing about an army is they need to eat, sleep, drink water, and have mobility. A druid can positively RUIN all of those things.

Spike Stones is awesome because they count as a magical trap. The DC to spot it is non-trivial, and it covers a pretty big area. Cast it on a cluster of tents while people are sleeping. Chances are they're dead, if they aren't it's going to cause a pretty significant commotion in the middle of the night. Disrupting sleeping patterns causes fatigue/exhaustion.

Stone to Mud all the ground next to siege impliments, buildings, ect. Do this every day. Try and keep as much of the camp completely muddy for as long as possible. If you want to really be a jerk about those siege weapons, Stone to Mud, wait a round or two for them to sink in, Mud to Stone. Good luck getting those out without destroying them.
Or just use Stone to Mud on the supplies or sleeping soldiers. Keep denying them safe access to supplies and safe places to sleep. You'll go far.

Control Weather is going to go very very far. Keep them in a muddy nasty downpour for as long as possible.

Summon Swarm in the middle of the night is pretty lethal, and quite the annoyance. Doo eeet.

Warp wood on siege weapons if you can get close enough. Fun times.

Earth Elementals are awesome. Grab people (who are sleeping) and pull them underground and let go of them, as someone else mentioned. Aside from Summon Swarm, probably your best summoning option.

Remember to focus more on hit and run tactics, rather than a prolonged engagement. The trolls and Dragons are not to be trifled with. Take your time to scout things out, wait for good opportunities rather than taking foolish risks. Come back several times per night, attack from different angles and mess up different areas of the camp.

Also, Sleetstorm and Snowsight are druid spells you may want to use for escaping.

As always, happy hunting.

[fishyfishyfishy]

I am the DM, so I figure I could give the Playground a bit more insight on the situation. The Hobgoblins are a 16 hour march from the small town the PC's are trying to protect. They were relying on a high level Lich and a Bard with UMD to keep the weather in good condition during the stormy season of late autumn/early winter. The PC's now have the staff with Control Weather, and they convinced the Lich to stop assisting. So now this army is stuck in an unexpected blizzard (I rolled it on the chart in the DMG), just trying to wait it out. I won't give details on how much supplies they have, but I will say they can't wait around forever. They're going to have to march soon and try to take this town or they'll starve. The PC's decided to stall for time and have the Druid use the staff to keep the blizzard going. Argonth is on it's way to assist, but it's almost 5 days out.

I'm looking forward to seeing how the group handles this.

[Fouredged Sword]

Well, the druid should keep the blizzard going for as many daylight hours as possible. That should make travel near impossible, as night travel through packed snow with an army won't be happening. At 8d12 hours (he gets double duration) a casting, he should be able to pull of 5 days of blizzard.

Then it becomes a matter of cutting of water and food supplies, and slowing travel. Broken wagon axles and spoiled food make for a hard winter camp. Setting fire to tents and blankets in a winter means dead troops as soon as night falls.

A good blizzard should create low enough visiblity that a snowsighted bird shaped druid can act with near impunity while attacking from overhead. If the dragons fly up to stop you, they can't see in the blowing snow better than anyone else (but you!), and you are a small, white bird in a big white sky.

[Phelix-Mu]

I am the DM, so I figure I could give the Playground a bit more insight on the situation. The Hobgoblins are a 16 hour march from the small town the PC's are trying to protect. They were relying on a high level Lich and a Bard with UMD to keep the weather in good condition during the stormy season of late autumn/early winter. The PC's now have the staff with Control Weather, and they convinced the Lich to stop assisting. So now this army is stuck in an unexpected blizzard (I rolled it on the chart in the DMG), just trying to wait it out. I won't give details on how much supplies they have, but I will say they can't wait around forever. They're going to have to march soon and try to take this town or they'll starve. The PC's decided to stall for time and have the Druid use the staff to keep the blizzard going. Argonth is on it's way to assist, but it's almost 5 days out.

I'm looking forward to seeing how the group handles this.

Terrain manipulation during the blizzard, and widening the area of effect via multiple castings, leaves a fair chance that the army's scouts just get lost. Stick a few groups of wolves in there to chase the scouts around until they are disoriented, and next thing you know they might not even be headed in the right direction.

Depending on the morale/dedication of the hobgoblins (typically pretty high), appearing and disappearing wolf packs, earth elemental ambushes, and blood snow are likely to be seriously disheartening.

Also, I'd like to add a note that, while earth elementals can earthglide freely, they can't move through snow effectively, especially deep snow.

Also, don't know what books are on the table, but elemental guardian from Dragon Magazine is 4th level spell for druids and lasts day/level, making it an excellent guard. Place a few of them at choke points along the road to the town. They are pretty effective skirmishers, even considering they are anchored to the area in which they are called.

[Haldir]

There's a spell from the Spell Compendium called Nature's Rampart. You're gonna wanna take a good look at that guy, as I doubt you could find another 3rd level spellslot that stops as many goblins.

[Shadus]

I am the DM

OH NO!HE FOUND ME!RUN!

So the smallest animals I can find are Snakes and Egales. Are there any other good infiltration forms? So far I've been sticking to snow leopard with it +20 to hide in snowy areas.

[Coidzor]

Badgers are Small and so a form you could take, IIRC, you can use their burrow speed. Standard dogs are Small. Dire Rats are Small. Donkeys are medium, Horses and Mules are Large. Oxen are also Large and use Bison stats by default unless you've got more specific stats to draw upon.

Always seems so odd that the better stealth forms of being Tiny or Diminutive require such a high level.

[mangosta71]

In general, the best infiltration forms depend on the circumstances. You want something that, if spotted, won't appear unusual. For example, a horse wouldn't look out of place near the enemy's mounts, but it would be decidedly odd to see one running around the commander's tent. In this case, a snake will set off alarm bells unless they're stupid. An eagle, especially a white eagle, is likely enough to not get seen to be suitable. The snow leopard is also a good option in your circumstances, and probably wouldn't tip your enemies off that there's a druid in the area messing with them even if you *do* get seen.

[Karoht]

16 hour march?
Stone to Mud is your go to. Turn every last step of that march into the muddiest, soggy slog. The Sloggy-est slog that ever slogged. Turn that 16 hours into 24-36 or more, before any major delays.
Also, that mud is the perfect place to hide Spike Stones/Spike Growth.
Throw Entangle here and there, especially in their rear, and pick off some stragglers with Summon Swarm.

Sadly, you may have difficulty going after the casters specifically, but the army itself is the easier, more vulnerable target. Make them waste spells trying to keep the army moving/functional/alive. If you manage to land lethal or nearly lethal damage on casters in the process, bonus.

This is easy stuff for a Druid. This is your playground. Be a giant. Doo eet.

[Gavinfoxx]

we consider poison dishonorable.

You're a druid. A third of your spells cause poisoning. huge chunks of nature uses poison and venom. It is a neutral act that befits your theme of nature.

[Rubik]

What's the wind speed on a blizzard, and how much effort will it take to turn those winds into raging tornadoes with Control Winds, hmmmmmm?

[Phelix-Mu]

You're a druid. A third of your spells cause poisoning. huge chunks of nature uses poison and venom. It is a neutral act that befits your theme of nature.

Note that druids vary wildly by individual on what methods they consider acceptable for maintaining any principles they espouse. Even druids that are part of established organizations are often given huge...erm..."flexibility" in the field, and only held to account for obvious failures of major organizational goals.

[Segev]

Do recall that dragons have blindsense, so don't rely on them being blinded just because they can't see.

You'll need more to distract them and keep them from identifying which Small creature they're sensing is the source of their woes, and even at that you don't want to be in the red dragon's cone of fire breath with 30 of your closest birdie friends. Even if you're immune to fire, they're not, and that is a pretty good clue for the dragons.

If you've got polymorh (and you should), try polymorphing into a red or blue dragon and eating some horses or other supplies in sight of the hobgoblins. Do it in the heavy blizzard, then roar at them and stalk away. You're big and it's hard to see, so they likely can't really be sure HOW big you were, and the damage you do to their supply lines will be morale-damaging, too. You might just get them to start blaming the dragons.