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Lord Iames Osari
2007-01-31, 09:00 PM
SRD (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/feats.htm#twoWeaponFighting):
Two-Weapon Fighting [General]

You can fight with a weapon in each hand. You can make one extra attack each round with the second weapon.
Prerequisite

Dex 15.
Benefit

Your penalties on attack rolls (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/combat/combatStatistics.htm#attackRoll) for fighting with two weapons are reduced. The penalty for your primary hand lessens by 2 and the one for your off hand lessens by 6. See the Two-Weapon Fighting (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/combat/specialAttacks.htm#twoWeaponFighting) special attack.
Normal

If you wield a second weapon in your off hand, you can get one extra attack per round with that weapon. When fighting in this way you suffer a -6 penalty with your regular attack or attacks with your primary hand and a -10 penalty to the attack with your off hand. If your off-hand weapon is light the penalties are reduced by 2 each. (An unarmed strike (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/equipment/weapons.htm#unarmedStrike) is always considered light.)
Special

A 2nd-level ranger (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/classes/ranger.htm) who has chosen the two-weapon combat style is treated as having Two-Weapon Fighting, even if he does not have the prerequisite for it, but only when he is wearing light or no armor.
A fighter (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/classes/fighter.htm) may select Two-Weapon Fighting as one of his fighter bonus feats.
Improved Two-Weapon Fighting [General]

Prerequisites

Dex 17, Two-Weapon Fighting (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/feats.htm#twoWeaponFighting), base attack bonus +6.
Benefit

In addition to the standard single extra attack you get with an off-hand weapon, you get a second attack with it, albeit at a -5 penalty. See the Two-Weapon Fighting (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/combat/specialAttacks.htm#twoWeaponFighting) special attack.
Normal

Without this feat, you can only get a single extra attack with an off-hand weapon.
Special

A fighter (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/classes/fighter.htm) may select Improved Two-Weapon Fighting as one of his fighter bonus feats.
A 6th-level ranger (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/classes/ranger.htm) who has chosen the two-weapon combat style is treated as having Improved Two-Weapon Fighting, even if he does not have the prerequisites for it, but only when he is wearing light or no armor.

Greater Two-Weapon Fighting [General]

Prerequisites

Dex 19, Improved Two-Weapon Fighting (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/feats.htm#improvedTwoWeaponFighting), Two-Weapon Fighting (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/feats.htm#twoWeaponFighting), base attack bonus +11.
Benefit

You get a third attack with your off-hand weapon, albeit at a -10 penalty. See the Two-Weapon Fighting (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/combat/specialAttacks.htm#twoWeaponFighting) special attack.
Special

A fighter (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/classes/fighter.htm) may select Greater Two-Weapon Fighting as one of his fighter bonus feats.
An 11th-level ranger (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/classes/ranger.htm) who has chosen the two-weapon combat style is treated as having Greater Two-Weapon Fighting, even if he does not have the prerequisites for it, but only when he is wearing light or no armor.Since the majority opinion is that TWF, in addition to not being able to match the damage output of THF, is also too feat-intensive to be good at anything else. Hence, these feats.


Two-Weapon Fighting [General]
You can fight with a weapon in each hand. You can make one extra attack each round with the second weapon.
Prerequisite: Dex 15.
Benefit: Your penalties on attack rolls for fighting with two weapons are reduced. The penalty for your primary hand lessens by 2 and the one for your off hand lessens by 6. See the Two-Weapon Fighting special attack. For every iterative attack you gain with your primary weapon as a result of having a high base attack bonus, you gain an additional attack with your off-hand weapon, suffering an additional -5 penalty for every off-hand attack after the first.

Normal: If you wield a second weapon in your off hand, you can get one extra attack per round with that weapon. When fighting in this way you suffer a -6 penalty with your regular attack or attacks with your primary hand and a -10 penalty to the attack with your off hand. If your off-hand weapon is light the penalties are reduced by 2 each. (An unarmed strike is always considered light.)
Special: A 2nd-level ranger who has chosen the two-weapon combat style is treated as having Two-Weapon Fighting, even if he does not have the prerequisite for it, but only when he is wearing light or no armor.
A fighter may select Two-Weapon Fighting as one of his fighter bonus feats.

Two-Weapon Defense [General]
Prerequisites: Dex 15, Two-Weapon Fighting.
Benefit: While fighting with two weapons or a double weapon, you gain a +1 shield bonus to AC. For every iterative attack you gain with your primary weapon as a result of having a high base attack bonus, this shield bonus increases by 1.

While fighting defensively or using the total defense action, the shield bonus provided by this feat doubles.
Special: A fighter may select Two-Weapon Defense as one of his fighter bonus feats.

And, to answer the inevitable question, "What does the TWF ranger get later?", I will repost here some feats I created a while back, before the server switch.

Ambidexterity [General]
You can use both hands in combat equally well.
Prerequisites: Str 15, Dex 15.
Benefit: Your off hand is treated as your on hand when fighting with two weapons. That is, you take -6 to attack rolls made with either hand when fighting with two weapons. If you have the Two Weapon Fighting Feat, this is reduced to -4, as this feat reduces penalties to attacks made with you on hand by two. If you also have the Oversized Two Weapon Fighting feat, or wield at least one light weapon, the penalties to all attacks are -2.
Attacks made with your off hand add your full strength bonus to damage rolls.
Normal: See Table 8-10: Two Weapon Fighting Penalties on page 160 of the Players Handbook.
Special: A character need not have this feat to be able to write with both hands.
A 6th level ranger who has selected the two-weapon combat style is treated as having Ambidexterity, even if he does not have the prerequisites for it, but only when he is wearing light or no armor.
A fighter may take this feat as a fighter bonus feat.

Twin Threat [General]
You have honed your skills at fighting with two weapons to the point where you no longer suffer from a decrease in accuracy.
Prerequisites: BAB +10, Str 15, Dex 19, Ambidexterity, Power Attack, Two-Weapon Fighting, Oversized Two-Weapon Fighting.
Benefit: You take no penalty on attack rolls when fighting with two weapons or a double weapon.
Special: An 11th level ranger who has selected the two-weapon combat style is treated as having Twin Threat, even if he does not have the prerequisites for it, but only when he is wearing light or no armor.
A fighter may select Twin Threat as one of his fighter bonus feats.

magic8BALL
2007-02-01, 04:24 AM
The argument aggainst:

An 8th level fighter with DEX 17 at level 1, and DEX 19 and STR 15 by level 8 *could*:

Feats:Ambidexterity, Power Attack, Two Weapon Fighting, Monkey Grip, Exotic Weapon Profficiency and Weapon Focus (Bastard Sword), Twin Threat.

Full Attack: Bastard sword +9/+9/+4/+4 2d8+2, 19-20/x2

STR 15, BAB +8, -2 to attack for Monkey Grip. No magic.

By level 8, probly 2 +2 bastard swords and boots of speed. 17 870gp worth of magic items.

Full Attack: Bastard sword +12/+12/+12/+7/+7 2d8+4, 19-20/x2

Seems over powered.

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

The argument for:

The upgrades to Two Weapon Fighting and Two Weapon Defence are good, they allow the feats to improve as the character improves, and to me, this makes heaps of sence.

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

Sugestion:
Pull Twin Threat out, or at least have it have Monkey Grip as a Prerequisite. One Handed weapons traeted as Light weapons needs more training than Power attack in my view.
Also, pull Ambidexterity. Two weapon fighting at no penalties is simply not ment to be.

Lord Iames Osari
2007-02-01, 05:43 AM
Well, it turns out Twin Threat is obsolete anyway, thanks to Oversized TWF, which requires even less training (Str 13, TWF). WTF?

Anyway, I'm curious as to why you say TWF without penalties is so awful.

Sampi
2007-02-01, 05:50 AM
Hmmm.. ambidexterity lessens your penalty for attack rolls, but does it make the strength damage bonus normal for your offhand. If so, it seems a bit hefty for one feat.

Lord Iames Osari
2007-02-01, 05:56 AM
That's true, but you have to think to yourself - how many characters are going to have 17 Dex at 1st level?

Sampi
2007-02-01, 06:59 AM
For the ones that rely on DEX? Enough, I'd say. but combined with a decent STR? I think you do have a point there.

magic8BALL
2007-02-01, 07:08 AM
If two weapon fighting were to have no penalties at all, there would not be a prestige class that obtains that.

The Tempest in Complete... Warrior I think...

Well anyway, the point is, the fine folk at Wizards deem TWF with no penalties unbalancing, and I'm inclined to agree.

Here is a suggestion... hopefully this is more benificial to you than me just blasting as I'm prone to do...

Ambidexterity [General]
You are ambidextrous; you can use both hands equally well.
Prerequisites: Dex 15, Str 15, BAB +1
Benefit: You have no off-hand. Put another way, you have two primary hands. As such when you are fighting with two weapons, you add your strength modifier to damage rolls with both weapons.
Normal: You have one primary hand and one off-hand. You add 1/2 your strength modifier to damage rolls with your off hand weapon.
Special: A 6th level ranger who has selected the two-weapon combat style is treated as having Ambidexterity, even if he does not have the prerequisites for it, but only when he is wearing light or no armor.

I've pulled out the 1st level only prereq, as people can learn to use both hands.

Lord Iames Osari
2007-02-01, 08:18 AM
Hmmm... I like it, except for the BAB requirement, because it excludes people who might want this at 1st level. And I think I need to make it clearer that your TWF attack penalties are affected by your having 2 primary hands, as well.

Sampi
2007-02-01, 10:20 AM
The Tempest is in Complete Adventurer. And I do agree you need to be able to take ambidexterity on 1st level - but isn't ambiDEXTRERITY just that? - the precision of both hands, not the equal strength? Maybe two feats for eiher thing..

Yakk
2007-02-01, 12:53 PM
TWF feat seeds:

Less penalty.
Iterative attacks.
Second attack in a simple action/charge.
Defence.
Use heavier weapons.
Damage boost (maybe +1/2 dex bonus to damage, up to original str bonus?)
Parry. (Reserve an attack during your turn. When attacked, you can parry. If you beat the opponent's BaB roll, you subtract a damage roll from the opponent's damage roll.)
Follow-up attack. If you hit with your main weapon, burn an AoO to attack with your offhand weapon.

...

Concerns: TWF is already an optimal build for a sneak attack character (or other buckets-of-bonus-dice builds). How do we make it useful to the non-sneak-attack build without overly boosting the sneak-attack build?

Lord Iames Osari
2007-02-01, 01:21 PM
How're these versions?

Ambidexterity [General]
You can use both hands equally well.
Prerequisites: Str 15, Dex 17.
Benefit: You have no off-hand. Put another way, you have two primary hands. As such when you are fighting with two weapons, you add your full Strength modifier to damage rolls with both weapons, and you do not take extra penalties for wielding a weapon in your off-hand, since you do not have an off-hand.
Normal: You have one primary hand and one off-hand. You add 1/2 your Strength modifier to damage rolls with your off hand weapon.
Special: A 6th level ranger who has selected the two-weapon combat style is treated as having Ambidexterity, even if he does not have the prerequisites for it, but only when he is wearing light or no armor.

Twin Threat [General]
You have honed your skills at fighting with two weapons to the point where you no longer suffer from a decrease in accuracy.
Prerequisites: BAB +10, Str 15, Dex 19, Ambidexterity, Power Attack, Two-Weapon Fighting, Oversized Two-Weapon Fighting.
Benefit: You take no penalty on attack rolls when fighting with two weapons or a double weapon.
Special: An 11th level ranger who has selected the two-weapon combat style is treated as having Twin Threat, even if he does not have the prerequisites for it, but only when he is wearing light or no armor.
A fighter may select Twin Threat as one of his fighter bonus feats.

To respond to Yakk's concern: Make it feat intensive. I can't believe I'm saying that, given that one of the problems with TWF is that it's too feat intensive, but by making the basics less feat intensive (getting rid of the ITWF, GTWF nonsense) and making the more advanced techniques more feat intensive (like the new version of Twin Threat just above), we should be able to keep a lid on the power creep.

Roderick_BR
2007-02-01, 02:36 PM
I'm working on a set of feats, and I'm doing it this way:
Two-Weapon Fighting. Req: Dex 13
Two-Weapon Defense. Req: Two-Weapon Fighting, Dex 13
Improved Two-Weapon Fighting. Req: Two-Weapon Fighting, Dex 15, BAB +6
Improved Two-Weapon Defense. Req: Improved Two-Weapon Fighting, Two-Weapon Defense, Dex 15, BAB +6
Greater Two-Weapon Fighting. Req: Improved Two-Weapon Fighting, Dex 15, BAB+11
Greater Two-Weapon Defense. Req: Greater Two-Weapon Fighting, Improved Two-Weapon Defense, Dex 15, BAB+11
Supreme Two-Weapon Fighting. Req: Greater Two-Weapon Fighting, Dex 19, BAB+16, Fighter 16
Supreme Two-Weapon Defense. Req: Supreme Two-Weapon Fighting, Improved Two-Weapon Defense, Dex 19, BAB+16, Fighter 16

I reduced the Dex requisites, and added the Supreme version (Sword and Fist, Tempest class ability, 3.0), requiring also a Fighter level of 16.
You can still get Oversized Weapon Fighting, Two-Weapon Pounce, Dual Strike (Better than Two Weapon Pounce), and Two-Weapon Rend as normal.
That, with the possibility of using a double weapon can make it easier and more worth taking all these feats.

Lord Iames Osari
2007-02-01, 02:54 PM
Making the feats easier to take doesn't solve the problem that you need all those feats to make TWF even halfway effective, while THF really only needs one: Power Attack.

magic8BALL
2007-02-01, 08:18 PM
Fighter6, STR 15, DEX 17

1st: Two Weapon Fighting
F1st: Ambidexterity
F2nd: Exotic Weapon Proficiency Bastard Sword
3rd: Weapon Focus
F4th: Weapon Spec
6th: Two Weapon Defence
F6th: Monkey Grip

Full Attack: 2 Large Bastard Swords +6/+1 (2d8+4)
AC 15+armor

(assuming medium size, non-human race, and no magic)

Becouse of ambidexterity and TWF, I can weild a Large bastard sword in either hand at no penalty other than the -2 for monkey grip. Who needs Oversized TWF or Twin Threat? Both feats become obsolite with the phrase "you do not take extra penalties for wielding a weapon in your off-hand, since you do not have an off-hand."

Draz74
2007-02-01, 09:06 PM
I liked Gorbash Khadzar's old idea. The fix for TWF is simple: just include the TWD feats inside the TWF feats. Oh, and ban Animated Shield (or make it, like, +4 equivalent instead of +2). Yay -- now there's a reason to take TWF instead of THF.

Problems: Sword-and-board still sucks; THF might still be better at high levels where the TWF fighter has to pay way more money for good weaponry than his counterpart.

Lord Iames Osari
2007-02-01, 09:07 PM
You're misinterpreting that phrase. In the example you gave, you'd take a -6 penalty on all attacks. -4 for fighting with 2 weapons, neither of which are light, and the -2 for Monkey Grip. All that phrase means is that you don't have an off hanf, so you can't take penalties for wielding a second weapon in the off hand you don't have. But, you do have 2 primary hands, and the penalties associated with the primary hand during TWF do apply.

Matthew
2007-02-01, 09:13 PM
I liked Gorbash Khadzar's old idea. The fix for TWF is simple: just include the TWD feats inside the TWF feats. Oh, and ban Animated Shield (or make it, like, +4 equivalent instead of +2). Yay -- now there's a reason to take TWF instead of THF.

Problems: Sword-and-board still sucks; THF might still be better at high levels where the TWF fighter has to pay way more money for good weaponry than his counterpart.

I agree, but those fixes have been proposed and Iames is proposing an alternate solution (which also has its benefits).

magic8BALL
2007-02-01, 10:33 PM
You're misinterpreting that phrase. In the example you gave, you'd take a -6 penalty on all attacks. -4 for fighting with 2 weapons, neither of which are light, and the -2 for Monkey Grip. All that phrase means is that you don't have an off hanf, so you can't take penalties for wielding a second weapon in the off hand you don't have. But, you do have 2 primary hands, and the penalties associated with the primary hand during TWF do apply.

eh?

So I still take the -4 in on hand becouse I have a one handed weapon in my off ahnd, wich is really an on hand? Seems silly, but I get the reasoning.

Normally, when you fight with one one handed weapon in your on hand, and no other weapon, you take no penalty.

So, with this, I should really take no penalty for fighting with a one handed weapon in my on hand, and no other penalty for fighting with a one handed weapon in my other on hand. That's how it reads to me.

Here's my take on it at the moment. (someone will point out an obvious flaw that I have not seen, and then I shall change my opinion again...)

Ambidexterity [General]
You can use both hands in combat equally well.
Prerequisites: Str 15, Dex 15.
Benefit: Your off hand is treated as your on hand when fighting with two weapons. That is, you take -6 to attack rolls made with either hand when fighting with two weapons. If you have the Two Weapon Fighting Feat, this is reduced to -4, as this feat reduces penalties to attacks made with you on hand by two. If you also have the Oversized Two Weapon Fighting feat, or wield at least one light weapon, the penalties to all attacks are -2.
Attacks made with your off hand add your full strength bonus to damage rolls.
Normal: See Table 8-10: Two Weapon Fighting Penalties on page 160 of the Players Handbook.
Special: A character need not have this feat to be able to write with both hands.
A 6th level ranger who has selected the two-weapon combat style is treated as having Ambidexterity, even if he does not have the prerequisites for it, but only when he is wearing light or no armor.
A fighter may take this feat as a fighter bonus feat.

I think this is what you were actually saying, Lord Iames Osari, but I may be wrong. What do you think?

Lord Iames Osari
2007-02-02, 12:23 AM
eh?

So I still take the -4 in on hand becouse I have a one handed weapon in my off ahnd, wich is really an on hand? Seems silly, but I get the reasoning.

Normally, when you fight with one one handed weapon in your on hand, and no other weapon, you take no penalty.

So, with this, I should really take no penalty for fighting with a one handed weapon in my on hand, and no other penalty for fighting with a one handed weapon in my other on hand. That's how it reads to me.

Here's my take on it at the moment. (someone will point out an obvious flaw that I have not seen, and then I shall change my opinion again...)

Ambidexterity [General]
You can use both hands in combat equally well.
Prerequisites: Str 15, Dex 15.
Benefit: Your off hand is treated as your on hand when fighting with two weapons. That is, you take -6 to attack rolls made with either hand when fighting with two weapons. If you have the Two Weapon Fighting Feat, this is reduced to -4, as this feat reduces penalties to attacks made with you on hand by two. If you also have the Oversized Two Weapon Fighting feat, or wield at least one light weapon, the penalties to all attacks are -2.
Attacks made with your off hand add your full strength bonus to damage rolls.
Normal: See Table 8-10: Two Weapon Fighting Penalties on page 160 of the Players Handbook.
Special: A character need not have this feat to be able to write with both hands.
A 6th level ranger who has selected the two-weapon combat style is treated as having Ambidexterity, even if he does not have the prerequisites for it, but only when he is wearing light or no armor.
A fighter may take this feat as a fighter bonus feat.

I think this is what you were actually saying, Lord Iames Osari, but I may be wrong. What do you think?

Yes, that's it precisely, but I was too lazy to spell it all out.:smallbiggrin:

Rebonack
2007-02-02, 12:23 AM
Hmmm... You know, with the decrease in damage made with two handed weapons when using Leap Attack from 4 to 3 for each BAB sacrificed I can see an instance where TWF will actually come out ahead.

Feats: Two Weapon Fighting, Two Weapon Pounce, Power Attack, Leap Attack, Oversized Two Weapon Fighting, Improved Bull Rush, Shock Trooper. For Seven feats you get effectively a +4 bonus to damage for each BAB you sink.

Three extra feats for a little bit of extra damage? Eh, seems reasonable. Too bad it doesn't work. Two-weapon pounce causes you to give up the to-hit bonus on charges. Look at that, TWF gets sunk again.

Roderick_BR
2007-02-02, 12:41 AM
You can use Dual Strike. It allows to use your off hand weapon in any situation you can do one normal attack, like a charge, without extra penalties. It's from complete adventurer or warrior.
I agree the total cost is too high, though. Hmm... With the build I was planning, you could get the 4 attacks, possibly good damage with two one-handed weapons, the ability to strike at least twice each round, and a shield bonus equal to +4, when a THF would get no defense bonus. It is a comitment, indeed. Someone suggested to put TWF and TWD in one, though I think it would get a bit overpowered. Oh well.
The way you use Ambidexterity here is interesting. Way more useful than in the 3.0. I don't really think you should remove all penalties from using two weapons though. But maybe it's just me.

Rebonack
2007-02-02, 01:36 AM
Hmmm...

Dual strike gives you a -4 penalty. Add in another -1 for the simple fact that enhancing one weapon is cheaper than enhancing two and THF still comes out ahead.

It's almost as if WotC is making a concerted effort to make TWF worse despite all the feats you have to burn for it.

Though looking over Dual Strike gives me a nice idea. Give all characters TWF as per the current normal feat.

Have Improved Two Weapon Fighting provide two benefits. First, it allows the user to make additional off-hand attacks due to high BAB. Second, it allows the character to attack with both weapons as a standard action (or charge, or whatever), but with only one attack roll. This roll is at a -2 or -4 penalty as per normal as opposed to Dual Strike's -4 and -10.

That would allow a TWF to match damage with a THF on non-full attacks without giving Rouge types too much of a boost (since precision based damage is only added once as per any volley attack). It would also allow them to match THF damage on charges if the TWFer took Oversized Two Weapon Fighting as well. If the TWF took Leap Attack they could actually beat THF damage.

It seems like a useful trade-off. Two feats for some extra damage and a fighting style that isn't awful anymore. Not much damage mind you, about ten percent more.

Now, that leaves us with Sword and Board. My suggestion is to add a feat that allows the user to get a 2:1 return with Combat Expertise so long as they're wielding (hence no animated shields or rings of shield) a shield other than a buckler (no improved buckler defense with THF!) and banninate Shield Expert to keep it from being stacked with TWF.

Matthew
2007-02-02, 04:28 PM
I don't think it really matters that the Rogue would get to make all his attacks as part of a Two Weapon Fighting Routine as a Standard Attack Action. It's no bigger deal than allowing him to get six of them as Full Attack Action. I did some of the maths for it a while whilst suggesting the Mobile Two Weapon Fighting (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1798151#post1798151) and Even Handed (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1793539#post1793539) Feats.

Legoman
2007-02-03, 11:45 AM
Might want to put a special addendum for all the Thri-Kreen mooks out there, that if you have more than two hands, then only two of your hands count as primary, the other two are still off-handed.

Lord Iames Osari
2007-02-03, 01:55 PM
Might want to put a special addendum for all the Thri-Kreen mooks out there, that if you have more than two hands, then only two of your hands count as primary, the other two are still off-handed.

They'll have their own feats for that. Multidexterity, Multiweapon Fighting, etc.

magic8BALL
2007-02-04, 09:47 PM
Might want to put a special addendum for all the Thri-Kreen mooks out there, that if you have more than two hands, then only two of your hands count as primary, the other two are still off-handed.

No... they only have one primary hand. All the rest are secondary. Reguardles of how many hands you have. Page 304 Monster Manual v3.5, under Multiweapon Fighting.

Here are the "more than two hands" versions of the feats... I left Twin strike out... I thought it was already wrong... but a Thri Kreen equivelent? No thanks!

Multiweapon Fighting [General]
You can fight with a weapon in each hand. You can make one extra attack each round with the secondary weapons.
Prerequisite: Dex 15, three or more hands.
Benefit: Your penalties on attack rolls for fighting with multiple weapons are reduced by 2 with the primary hand and by 6 with off hands. See the Two-Weapon Fighting special attack. For every iterative attack you gain with your primary weapon as a result of having a high base attack bonus, you gain an additional attack with each of your off-hand weapons, suffering an additional -5 penalty for every off-hand attack after the first.
Normal: A creature without this feat takes a -6 penalty on attacks made with its primary hand and a -10 penalty with its off hands. (It has one primary hand, and all the rest are off hands.) See Two-Weapon Fighting, page 160 of the Player's Handbook.
Special: This feat replaces Two Weapon Fighteing for creatures with more than two arms.

Multidexterity [General]
You can use all your hands in combat equally well.
Prerequisites: Str 15, Dex 15, three or more hands.
Benefit: Your off hands are treated as on hands when fighting with multiple weapons. That is, you take -6 to attack rolls made with any hand when fighting with multiple weapons. If you have the Multiweapon Fighting Feat, this is reduced to -4, as this feat reduces penalties to attacks made with you on hand by two. If you also have the Oversized Multiweapon Fighting feat, or wield at least one light weapon, the penalties to all attacks are -2.
Attacks made with your off hand add your full strength bonus to damage rolls.
Normal: See Table 8-10: Two Weapon Fighting Penalties on page 160 of the Players Handbook.
Special: This feat replaces ambidexterity for creatures with more than two hands.

Oversised Multiweapon Fighting [General]
(description here... lost the book)
Prerequisites: (can't find my Complete Adventurer, but as Oversised Two Weapon Fighting), three or more hands.
Benifit: You treat any one handed weapons in your off hand as light weapons for the purpose of determining penalties for fighting with multiple weapons.
Special: this feat replaces Oversized Two weapon fighting for creatures with more than teo hands.

Roderick_BR
2007-02-10, 11:28 PM
Ah, you made the feats improve with the character's level. I think that works. If it gets TWF too cheap, you could use that option to combine the TWF with TW Defenses.