Stage weapons

[weckar]

Hi there, I was wondering how to craft/price stage weapons. By this I mean weapons that could feasibly be used in plays.

I was thinking of using permanent spell storing weapons with invisible maximized cure light wounds on them, but I don't know if this is even possible or how much it would cost.

Preferably it would be a no-damage guarantee, so if there is a way to prevent crits that would also help.

Thanks in advance!

[zimmerwald1915]

Hi there, I was wondering how to craft/price stage weapons. By this I mean weapons that could feasibly be used in plays.

I was thinking of using permanent spell storing weapons with invisible maximized cure light wounds on them, but I don't know if this is even possible or how much it would cost.

Preferably it would be a no-damage guarantee, so if there is a way to prevent crits that would also help.

Thanks in advance!
Do they have to be magical? Because prop weapons as we know them in the real world would probably just be masterwork tools that apply their bonus to Perform (act) checks.

[weckar]

I would prefer them to be magical, yes. I want the combat on stage to be as real as possible (for both plot and setting reasons). And even prop weapons can be potentially used lethally, which I'd like to avoid.

[zimmerwald1915]

I would prefer them to be magical, yes. I want the combat on stage to be as real as possible (for both plot and setting reasons). And even prop weapons can be potentially used lethally, which I'd like to avoid.
You could try modifying the merciful (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/magicWeapons.htm#merciful) weapon quality so that the wielder cannot choose to deal lethal damage. It shouldn't modify the cost of adding the quality.

[weckar]

Interesting, and worth considering... I'd prefer not to knock any actors out, but it'll be a good fallback if we don't find anything else.

[Crake]

I think there is an official mace or something out there that actually heals when it hits someone.

[weckar]

Interesting, I may go digging for that, if only for a price guide....

[Slipperychicken]

Actors generally don't try to kill their coworkers onstage. Shouldn't they be fine simply pretending to fight, like they normally do? Perform(Acting) typically doesn't involve killing people for real.

[weckar]

But if you could, without actually inflicting damage, stab someone... I think many actors would prefer it.

[zimmerwald1915]

But if you could, without actually inflicting damage, stab someone... I think many actors would prefer it.
Speaking as an actor, I'll just say that I disagree and what's more, that I have yet to meet anyone who has ever said anything like that. Stage combat's hazardous enough as it is.

[Hand_of_Vecna]

Magical weapons that allow "real" combat on stage will only be effective if all of your actors are high BAB combatants with the same combat styles as the characters their playing. That's really restrictive.

Also, showmanship abilities of gladiator type PrCs suggest that real combat isn't as entertaining as flashy stage combat to the people of the typical D&D world. Well past it's peak prowrestling still brings in better numbers than UFC and UFC has had to take steps away from it's unregulated bloodsport roots to get where it is.

Obviously in a sufficiently blood thirsty society the fact that it's real will increase entertainment value, but your "stage weapons" will kill the fun for that crowd just as much as stage fighting will. Also, if it's part of a play someone may need to "throw" the fight to advance the story so it's still fake stage fighting.

[Ravens_cry]

You probably want an illusionist on staff, making the swords look fiery or frosty, or what have you, as well as adding sound and lighting effects.

[dascarletm]

I would think that only in niche scenarios would this be used.

One that comes to mind.

A play based on bitter rivals who are now friends. Both are willing to act out their lives on stage, and recreate their battles.

I don't know.

I'd assume actual actors in dnd would be experts or commoners Or aristocrats (Shakespeare in love)

That would lead to pretty boring fights.

[Fax Celestis]

I think there is an official mace or something out there that actually heals when it hits someone.

MIC, inquisitors bracers

[Gensuru]

You probably want an illusionist on staff, making the swords look fiery or frosty, or what have you, as well as adding sound and lighting effects.


By the same token you should also be able to use plain stage-weapons (blunted swords etc.) and add in the desired realism via the special effects guy (aka Illusionist). I'd assume that'd be cheaper than being forced to commission all sorts of enchanted weapons. Unless all your plays are meant to contain only swords of one specific type, you will need enchanted swords, axes, sabres, maces, spears, rapiers etc. A competent illusionist and a bit of coordination and preparation should get you the same effects for "real" wounds at a much lower price. On top of that, having one (or several) illusionists on your payroll will also allow you to use them for stage-props and backgrounds, making them far more versatile (and cost-efficient) than any enchanted weapon could hope to be.


And if you want a bit more realism for wounds you can always add little packs of animal blood from the local slaughterhouse, hide those under the costume and have the actors slice them open during combat to get the desired result without bothering with magic at all. Makes more of a mess you have to clean up afterwards, though xD

[Slipperychicken]

I think at the point where people are actually making attack rolls against each other, you're basically talking about performance combat (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/gamemastering/other-rules/performance-combat).

Also, PF has this to say about staged combats:

Staged Combats: Staged combats are less dangerous than knockout bouts. In these contests, combatants typically arrange to have blows that just barely land, so the hits are not registered as either nonlethal or lethal damage, but crowd reaction is determined in the same way as for normal battles. Staged combats often require advanced training (see the Stage Combatant feat). Those without advanced training can attempt to participate, but take a –6 penalty on attack rolls in order to make it seem like their attacks hit without doing real damage.

[Ravens_cry]

By the same token you should also be able to use plain stage-weapons (blunted swords etc.) and add in the desired realism via the special effects guy (aka Illusionist). I'd assume that'd be cheaper than being forced to commission all sorts of enchanted weapons. Unless all your plays are meant to contain only swords of one specific type, you will need enchanted swords, axes, sabres, maces, spears, rapiers etc. A competent illusionist and a bit of coordination and preparation should get you the same effects for "real" wounds at a much lower price. On top of that, having one (or several) illusionists on your payroll will also allow you to use them for stage-props and backgrounds, making them far more versatile (and cost-efficient) than any enchanted weapon could hope to be.


And if you want a bit more realism for wounds you can always add little packs of animal blood from the local slaughterhouse, hide those under the costume and have the actors slice them open during combat to get the desired result without bothering with magic at all. Makes more of a mess you have to clean up afterwards, though xD
That was precisely my thoughts as well. Also, imagine a stage production of Henry V where you had the sound and ambiance of a whole army on the stage for that famous and oh, so awesome speech. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A-yZNMWFqvM) Some shadows, dancing lights and ghost sound should do.

[Big Fau]

Also, PF has this to say about staged combats:

Have you actually read the rules for Performance Combat, or the Stage Combatant feat? PF severely overcomplicated it and made it cost a feat (said feat also has a feat tax, multiple if you have to use more than one weapon).

[dascarletm]

Have you actually read the rules for Performance Combat, or the Stage Combatant feat? PF severely overcomplicated it and made it cost a feat (said feat also has a feat tax, multiple if you have to use more than one weapon).

That's why it should just go off the characters Perform (acting).

[Skysaber]

I'd say go Merciful, with Morphic and Sizing (so it can duplicate any weapon, no point in having racks full of these) and that special property that also grants proficiency if you want the "as real as it gets without killing people" approach.

Otherwise, shape a wand like a dagger hilt and pass out wands of Major Image so they can emulate burning swords, blood and guts/whatever.

[Zetapup]

By the same token you should also be able to use plain stage-weapons (blunted swords etc.) and add in the desired realism via the special effects guy (aka Illusionist). I'd assume that'd be cheaper than being forced to commission all sorts of enchanted weapons. Unless all your plays are meant to contain only swords of one specific type, you will need enchanted swords, axes, sabres, maces, spears, rapiers etc. A competent illusionist and a bit of coordination and preparation should get you the same effects for "real" wounds at a much lower price. On top of that, having one (or several) illusionists on your payroll will also allow you to use them for stage-props and backgrounds, making them far more versatile (and cost-efficient) than any enchanted weapon could hope to be.

Well, you could fix the 'sword of one specific type' problem by using sizing morphing shuriken (plus with the way shuriken work, it'd be a somewhat affordable price). However, I definitely agree that an illusionist would be a better idea, as they'd be useful for far more situations.