Illusion Disbelief Questions

[Techno Magician]

If you have proof that something is an illusion you automatically succeed the save for disbelief. This is great and all, but in a world of ethereal stuff, the displacement spell and all other types of spells what is definite proof.

Now this might seem like I am saying you can't auto succeed at all but I agree with the basics of it. You walk up to a wall and put your arm through it, "oh it's an illusion".

So a few situations

1. I create an illusion of a cloud spell, do those inside the cloud auto succeed because it isn't acting right, and can I make part of the illusion a giant hammer hitting my allies in the face(after being obscured in smoke of course) so they auto succeed?

2. If I create an illusion of a person, what does it take to hit them with an attack, and If my illusion is a rocket powered butterfly do they hit it as easily as a stationary one? Do Illusions provoke AoO?

3. If I shoot a bow through an illusionary wall at an enemy do they auto succeed?

4. If someone else sees me stick my arm through a wall, do they auto succeed because their friend just stuck their hand through an illusion and that is impossible, and do they even get a save at all since they aren't the ones interacting with it(maybe they need to spend a move as a second glance at what just happened getting a +4 bonus)?

5. How do constructs react to illusions, or do they auto succeed because they are objects, do they still have to interact with it at least? or does it just never even appear in their vision at all? We have played they have 0 intelligence so they just accept it as part of their world but I've been thinking that is more wisdom based then intelligence. How do you guys play 0 int creatures and illusions?

[holywhippet]

http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicOverview/spellDescriptions.htm#illusion

I don't see where you automatically succeed if you have proof something is an illusion. You do get a bonus to your save if someone else has passed their save and tells you that it is an illusion.

[Duke of Urrel]

I don't see where you automatically succeed if you have proof something is an illusion. You do get a bonus to your save if someone else has passed their save and tells you that it is an illusion.

You have to look a little farther below the passage you quoted.


"Saving Throws and Illusions (Disbelief)

Creatures encountering an illusion usually do not receive saving throws to recognize it as illusory until they study it carefully or interact with it in some fashion.

A successful saving throw against an illusion reveals it to be false, but a figment or phantasm remains as a translucent outline.

A failed saving throw indicates that a character fails to notice something is amiss. A character faced with proof that an illusion isn’t real needs no saving throw. If any viewer successfully disbelieves an illusion and communicates this fact to others, each such viewer gains a saving throw with a +4 bonus."


If you have proof that something is an illusion you automatically succeed the save for disbelief. This is great and all, but in a world of ethereal stuff, the displacement spell and all other types of spells what is definite proof.

Now this might seem like I am saying you can't auto succeed at all but I agree with the basics of it. You walk up to a wall and put your arm through it, "oh it's an illusion".

So a few situations

1. I create an illusion of a cloud spell, do those inside the cloud auto succeed because it isn't acting right, and can I make part of the illusion a giant hammer hitting my allies in the face(after being obscured in smoke of course) so they auto succeed?

First off, unless you're the DM, you should discuss with your DM what illusions can and cannot do, because there are many ways to interpret illusions.

I have many house rules concerning illusions that I apply when I'm the DM. For example, I consider all illusions created by Figment spells to be hollow on the inside. So an illusory cloud created by a Figment spell only looks impenetrably murky from the outside. Any creature that enters an illusory cloud immediately knows that it is not real. So you can hide inside an illusory cloud, but you're immediately discovered by any enemy that follows you inside.



2. If I create an illusion of a person, what does it take to hit them with an attack, and If my illusion is a rocket powered butterfly do they hit it as easily as a stationary one? Do Illusions provoke AoO?

According to the SRD, "A figment’s AC is equal to 10 + its size modifier." I add the house rule that an illusory object's AC adds a Dexterity modifier of -5, just as a real object's AC does. A rocket-powered butterfly of Diminutive size would have an AC of 14. I believe illusory creatures provoke attacks of opportunity just as real ones do. When you hit an illusory creature, you strike thin air, and I allow you to perceive that it is illusory without having to make a saving throw. An illusory creature created by the Major Image spell bursts like a bubble when it is hit.



3. If I shoot a bow through an illusionary wall at an enemy do they auto succeed?

Yes, I would say so. The only exception to this rule is an illusory wall made by an illusionist with the extraordinary Chains of Disbelief (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/specialistWizardVariants.htm#chainsofDisbelief) ability. This power doesn't allow automatic Will saves to disbelieve in illusions. If you see an illusion created with this power, even a demonstration of its illusory nature gives you nothing better than a Will save at +10.



4. If someone else sees me stick my arm through a wall, do they auto succeed because their friend just stuck their hand through an illusion and that is impossible, and do they even get a save at all since they aren't the ones interacting with it(maybe they need to spend a move as a second glance at what just happened getting a +4 bonus)?

I would say that everybody with an Intelligence score of at least three who sees somebody stick an arm though a wall realizes that it is insubstantial without having to make a Will save. Only an illusory wall created with Chains of Disbelief would be an exception to this rule.

It is a little harder to demonstrate that an illusory creature is insubstantial, because you have to hit it to show that your hand or weapon passes right through, and your allies may easily miss this demonstration, because it happens so quickly. So in this case, they may not automatically disbelieve, but may make new Will saves that add +4.

But this is one of those cases where interpretations will differ. Some would say that once you fail a Will save, your mind is so fixated on believing in an illusion that you only get a re-try at +4 when somebody else tries to convince you that it's not real. Some would say that you automatically disbelieve an illusion only if you yourself poke an arm or a leg through it, not if somebody else does.



5. How do constructs react to illusions, or do they auto succeed because they are objects, do they still have to interact with it at least? or does it just never even appear in their vision at all? We have played they have 0 intelligence so they just accept it as part of their world but I've been thinking that is more wisdom based then intelligence. How do you guys play 0 int creatures and illusions?

Sensory illusions, that is, the effects of spells of the Figment, Glamer, and Shadow subschools, are not Mind-Affecting spells. They only fool a creature's senses, they don't mess with its mind (as spells of the Pattern or Phantasm subschool do). Therefore, I believe spells of the Figment, Glamer, and Shadow subschools affect non-Intelligent creatures, such as most Constructs and Vermin, normally.

Since many creatures of the Ooze type have extraordinary senses, such as Blindsight, they may simply be oblivious of illusions rather than disbelieve them.

Animals with the Scent ability may also be able to sniff their way through illusions, at the DM's discretion. Note that the most low-level illusions don't have any odors, but the higher-level ones do.

[rmnimoc]

First off, unless you're the DM, you should discuss with your DM what illusions can and cannot do, because there are many ways to interpret illusions.

As a bit of proof as to the many ways to interpret illusions...



According to the SRD, "A figment’s AC is equal to 10 + its size modifier." I add the house rule that an illusory object's AC adds a Dexterity modifier of -5, just as a real object's AC does. A rocket-powered butterfly of Diminutive size would have an AC of 14. I believe illusory creatures provoke attacks of opportunity just as real ones do. When you hit an illusory creature, you strike thin air, and I allow you to perceive that it is illusory without having to make a saving throw. An illusory creature created by the Major Image spell bursts like a bubble when it is hit.

In my campaigns this does not auto-disbelieve, as there are any number of other effects that could be causing your stick to pass through the object/creature. I instead rule that the attacker gets another will save with a +4 bonus, unless they are a mindless creature. Then they just keep doing their thing like the idiot they are.



Yes, I would say so. The only exception to this rule is an illusory wall made by an illusionist with the extraordinary Chains of Disbelief (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/specialistWizardVariants.htm#chainsofDisbelief) ability. This power doesn't allow automatic Will saves to disbelieve in illusions. If you see an illusion created with this power, even a demonstration of its illusory nature gives you nothing better than a Will save at +10.

I once again would rule that this is not an auto-disbelieve, because there are other possible situations in which this is not an illusion, meaning you don't have proof. I do give a save for interacting with the illusion when this happens to notice that something is wrong.



I would say that everybody with an Intelligence score of at least three who sees somebody stick an arm though a wall realizes that it is insubstantial without having to make a Will save. Only an illusory wall created with Chains of Disbelief would be an exception to this rule.

Same deal as before, I would say this STILL isn't proof that it is an illusion. You get the will save for interacting, and I'd also give you another spellcraft check to identify the spell.



It is a little harder to demonstrate that an illusory creature is insubstantial, because you have to hit it to show that your hand or weapon passes right through, and your allies may easily miss this demonstration, because it happens so quickly. So in this case, they may not automatically disbelieve, but may make new Will saves that add +4.

Unless your allies are taking a move action to carefully examine it (per spot "noticing something you failed to see previously"), they probably won't notice or get the check. If they do notice, they get the will+4 to disbelieve. Or at least that is how I rule it.



But this is one of those cases where interpretations will differ. Some would say that once you fail a Will save, your mind is so fixated on believing in an illusion that you only get a re-try at +4 when somebody else tries to convince you that it's not real. Some would say that you automatically disbelieve an illusion only if you yourself poke an arm or a leg through it, not if somebody else does.

Totally agree with you there. Lots of DM dependancies in this school.



Sensory illusions, that is, the effects of spells of the Figment, Glamer, and Shadow subschools, are not Mind-Affecting spells. They only fool a creature's senses, they don't mess with its mind (as spells of the Pattern or Phantasm subschool do). Therefore, I believe spells of the Figment, Glamer, and Shadow subschools affect non-Intelligent creatures, such as most Constructs and Vermin, normally.

Since many creatures of the Ooze type have extraordinary senses, such as Blindsight, they may simply be oblivious of illusions rather than disbelieve them.

Animals with the Scent ability may also be able to sniff their way through illusions, at the DM's discretion. Note that the most low-level illusions don't have any odors, but the higher-level ones do.

I agree that the non-mind affecting illusion work on non-intelligent creatures, and that any creature with blindsight is immune to almost all illusions (shadow illusions, the few glamers that have tactile components not included). Any creature with just Scent auto disbelieves any visual only illusions, and any creature with Scent gets a will save to disbelieve+4 as though they had interacted/closely studied the illusion.



As mentioned, Illusion is the most DM dependant of the magic schools, and it is best to talk to your DM before playing an illusionist. If your illusion lasts for more than eight hours, be sure to call your doctor right away.

[kabreras]

I agree that the non-mind affecting illusion work on non-intelligent creatures, and that any creature with blindsight is immune to almost all illusions (shadow illusions, the few glamers that have tactile components not included). Any creature with just Scent auto disbelieves any visual only illusions, and any creature with Scent gets a will save to disbelieve+4 as though they had interacted/closely studied the illusion.

It all depend of the illusion...

I dont see how scent would help for the illusion of a wall on a street corner.

[Rainshine]

Again, illusion tends to be one of the more DM-dependent schools for viability; my answers reflect how I run my table

1. No. They would, however, get a save pretty much immediately to disbelieve. As for the hammer, I'd still say no, but honestly, I'm not sure I've ever had a player try that. More often, they just work out a signal in the party or telepathy or something for communicating that sort of thing.

2. The AC has already been listed -- I generally leave it to the caster to describe what happens, but if the AC is hit, the attacker is going to get a save for sure, usually at a +4 if it was a melee hit. Yes, they provoke if the caster is deliberately illusioning a creature.

3. No. In fact, if the caster is smart enough, they might not even get a save.

4. No. Honestly, I'd probably roll it behind the screen for them. If they want to take time on their turn to really examine the wall, they'd be able to get another save.

5. Unless listed as otherwise, like everyone else. They still need some way of perceiving other creatures -- and they are expressly listed as using sight, so they're going to be vulnerable to even the most basic illusions.

[Deophaun]

In my campaigns this does not auto-disbelieve, as there are any number of other effects that could be causing your stick to pass through the object/creature. I instead rule that the attacker gets another will save with a +4 bonus, unless they are a mindless creature. Then they just keep doing their thing like the idiot they are.
I'd say this is not an interpretation but a houserule, as we do know what qualifies as proof:

A failed saving throw indicates that a character fails to notice something is amiss. A character faced with proof that an illusion isn’t real needs no saving throw. A character who falls through a section of illusory floor into a pit knows something is amiss, as does one who spends a few rounds poking at the same illusion.
Striking something and having the strike pass through is not qualitatively different than putting your foot through what should be a solid floor.

Also note that a succesful saving throw isn't "OMG an illusion" but "Gee, something seems strange." By RAW, just noticing that the effect is behaving oddly counts as disbelief; you don't have to rule out incorporeal ghosts or other magical effects first.

[Psyren]

1) It's very hard to not make a magical cloud "act right." Just about any behavior it exhibits can be attributed to magic. Blowing with the wind? Fine. Ignoring the wind? Also fine. Lighter than water? Sure. Denser than water? Sure. White vapors? Sure. Rainbow vapors? Why not. And so on. If I see you wave your hands and a fog bank appears out of nowhere, nothing about that scenario will scream "illusion" to me automatically unless I recognize the verbal components/gestures you're using as not being conjuration.

2) An illusion of a person would be a figment, and others have provided the figment AC for you. As for whether the illusion is moving or not, remember that aside from AoOs, movement doesn't really matter much in D&D to the question of whether you can hit something.

3) Yes, because you've just presented them proof that the wall isn't real. Of course, if you built arrow slits into your illusion and shot through one of those, that's a different issue.

4) Again, watching someone stick their arm through a wall would count as proof that the wall isn't there, unless the person in question is someone that can regularly do that sort of thing (e.g. a manifested ghost.)

5) Mindless creatures are a topic of some debate here. The best answer I've seen is that they would be fooled unless made to interact with the illusion in some way. So if skeletons are chasing you and you run around the corner and throw up a wall, when they arrive they will not see you and break off pursuit. If their master orders them to attack the wall, or if the master made his save and commands them to walk through the wall, they will do so, with both situations causing them to auto-succeed once they pass through it.

[Duke of Urrel]

It all depend of the illusion...

I dont see how scent would help for the illusion of a wall on a street corner.

I agree with you that the Scent ability won't instantly make a creature disbelieve in a wall, because creatures with Scent aren't usually interested in walls, or in any other inanimate objects, for that matter. However, they usually are interested in other creatures and can identify them by their smell, particularly if these creatures qualify as enemies or prey.

Now suppose you create an illusory wall so that you and your comrades can all hide behind it – a common use of an illusion of this kind. If a creature pursuing you has the Scent ability and you are within range of this extraordinary sense, the creature instantly smells you through the wall. I believe that very soon, this creature, following its nose according to its own instinct, will poke its nose through the wall, at which moment it will automatically disbelieve in the illusion.

[Phelix-Mu]

I always wondered what would happen if an illusionist created an accurate illusion of a ghost and confronted a commoner with it. But the commoner doesn't know that ghosts are incorporeal, and so when he touches it and his hand goes through, does he get a chance to save?

Likewise, what about something like an illithid? They are pretty rare and bizarre looking. Could a person that doesn't know about them just disbelieve because he has never heard of them? Kind of like those horror movies where it's a zombie, but everyone just thinks it's a person in a fancy mask.

[Crake]

3) Yes, because ou've just presented them proof that the wall isn't real. Of course, if you built arrow slits into your illusion and shot through one of those, that's a different issue.

Isn't there an arrow enchantment which lets arrows go through solid objects? Or like, an arcane archer ability? I definitely know there's something. So I wouldn't call this an auto-pass, but it would definitely give them a save.


4) Again, watching someone stick their arm through a wall would count as proof that the wall isn't there, unless the person in question is someone that can regularly do that sort of thing (e.g. a manifested ghost.)

Same reason as before. There are some incorporeal creatures out there that don't actually even look incorporeal, so simply phasing through a wall isn't immediate 100% guarenteed proof that the wall is an illusion (someone pushing you through the wall on the other hand). But as above, I would definitely let it give you a chance to save.

[Psyren]

I always wondered what would happen if an illusionist created an accurate illusion of a ghost and confronted a commoner with it. But the commoner doesn't know that ghosts are incorporeal, and so when he touches it and his hand goes through, does he get a chance to save?

"Ghosts are incorporeal" would probably count as common knowledge though.


Likewise, what about something like an illithid? They are pretty rare and bizarre looking. Could a person that doesn't know about them just disbelieve because he has never heard of them? Kind of like those horror movies where it's a zombie, but everyone just thinks it's a person in a fancy mask.

"That thing is bizarre!" isn't proof that it doesn't exist. After all, as you said, they might simply think it's something they haven't heard of before, not that it isn't there.

But there are details of these illusions that can cause disbelief. For example, if your "illithid" is walking around in broad daylight without protection and an aberration-hunting Ranger sees it, he would probably get a will save, while a commoner would not. Or if your gelatinous cube is sliding towards someone without leaving a trail of slime on the floor or eating through any of the wooden furniture it rolls over, there might be a disbelief save there as well.


Isn't there an arrow enchantment which lets arrows go through solid objects? Or like, an arcane archer ability? I definitely know there's something. So I wouldn't call this an auto-pass, but it would definitely give them a save.

I would only say that's a save rather than automatic if the archer in question has demonstrated himself to be an arcane archer before. Arrows flying through walls are much more likely to throw the wall's nature into question than that of the arrow I'd say.


Same reason as before. There are some incorporeal creatures out there that don't actually even look incorporeal, so simply phasing through a wall isn't immediate 100% guarenteed proof that the wall is an illusion (someone pushing you through the wall on the other hand). But as above, I would definitely let it give you a chance to save.

If it's your friend Jim putting his arm through though, you know he's not incorporeal. Therefore the wall is the obvious fake.

[jedipotter]

1. I create an illusion of a cloud spell, do those inside the cloud auto succeed because it isn't acting right, and can I make part of the illusion a giant hammer hitting my allies in the face(after being obscured in smoke of course) so they auto succeed?

Folks inside an illusion of a cloud get a save, and the save is what lets the creature know the cloud is not action right. If the make the save, they notice something wrong, like for example, that the cloud fills a exact cube and ''winks of of sight with a tiny twinkle'' at the edge. I'm not sure what your talking about with the hammer.




2. If I create an illusion of a person, what does it take to hit them with an attack, and If my illusion is a rocket powered butterfly do they hit it as easily as a stationary one? Do Illusions provoke AoO?

This is covered in the rules. And no you can't enhance the AC just by moving the illusion fast. Somewhere a rule does say that illusions don't provoke AoO, but you can just Houserule they do. It does not break the game.




3. If I shoot a bow through an illusionary wall at an enemy do they auto succeed?

You don't auto hit the enemy. Any anything inanimate like water, rocks or arrows ignores an illusionary wall completely. They would get a save to notice the illusion




4. If someone else sees me stick my arm through a wall, do they auto succeed because their friend just stuck their hand through an illusion and that is impossible, and do they even get a save at all since they aren't the ones interacting with it(maybe they need to spend a move as a second glance at what just happened getting a +4 bonus)?

They get a save with the bonus.




5. How do constructs react to illusions, or do they auto succeed because they are objects, do they still have to interact with it at least? or does it just never even appear in their vision at all? We have played they have 0 intelligence so they just accept it as part of their world but I've been thinking that is more wisdom based then intelligence. How do you guys play 0 int creatures and illusions?

Constructs are creatures and are effected by illusions just like all creatures as per that creatures type. Constructs don't auto succeed vs an illusion. 0 intelligence creatures treat illusions as 'real', but illusions have a lesser effect on them anyway. If you order a construct to walk in a straight line 100 feet forward, and place an illusionary wall of fire at 50 feet, or an real wall of fire at 50 feet or even a wall of utter obliteration at 50 feet, the construct will walk through all three.

[Tindragon]

Again, illusion tends to be one of the more DM-dependent schools for viability; my answers reflect how I run my table



Pretty much sums it up. I have a player that he and I have played together for a long time (1e) and back in the 1e days, you didn't even get a save, if you didn't state you were disbelieving right off the bat. And then, if the sword was real, you pretty much took a cu de gra to the face. (happened)

3.x is better at defining circumstances and guidelines, but illusion can cause table problems from time to time. Be consistent, do what you can do stay within the RAW without making too much splatter, and try to not have to get stuck dropping the 'DM hammer'

Creative players tend to try to over play lower level illusions beyond the intended benefit, beware.

[Urpriest]

The real problem here is that disbelieving an illusion somehow also makes you able to see through it. If that weren't the case then everything would be much simpler and more logical.

[Segev]

Probably the best way to examine whether you get no save is to think of the fluff behind what's "really happening" when you make a will save vs. illusion: You're making your belief that it is not an illusion iron-clad, such that you have no doubt. You're FORCING yourself to look past it by FORCING all doubts as to its unreality out of your head.

If you would have reason to think the stone wall could have arrows fly out of it or your buddy george put his arm through it, then you don't have absolute proof it's not "really there." Absolute proof requires sufficient knowledge that you just can't reasonably believe your senses. A monster attacking you and literally doing nothing when it tries would be "absolute proof" unless you had solid reason to believe that possible for a real monster.

In short, if there's any doubt as to whether you have "absolute proof," you roll your save rather than simply seeing through it.

[Deophaun]

Probably the best way to examine whether you get no save is to think of the fluff behind what's "really happening" when you make a will save vs. illusion: You're making your belief that it is not an illusion iron-clad, such that you have no doubt. You're FORCING yourself to look past it by FORCING all doubts as to its unreality out of your head.
Except that's not what the game says the fluff is. Quite the opposite.

A failed saving throw indicates that a character fails to notice something is amiss.
That's it.

If you would have reason to think the stone wall could have arrows fly out of it or your buddy george put his arm through it, then you don't have absolute proof it's not "really there."
This would be a problem if "absolute proof" were required, and "absolute proof" was defined in this way. Instead, only "proof" is required, and "proof" is defined as "[noticing] something is amiss."

A character who falls through a section of illusory floor into a pit knows something is amiss, as does one who spends a few rounds poking at the same illusion.

[Segev]

Except that's not what the game says the fluff is. Quite the opposite.

That's it.

This would be a problem if "absolute proof" were required, and "absolute proof" was defined in this way. Instead, only "proof" is required, and "proof" is defined as "[noticing] something is amiss."

Okay, I stand corrected.

So the burden is very much on the illusionist to provide no hints.

[Deophaun]

So the burden is very much on the illusionist to provide no hints.
Yeah. As I say in a lot of these threads, by RAW, the best use of an illusion is the equivalent of creating a tree in a forest.

[Segev]

I'm still fond of coupling Silent Image with a careful use of Create Water to make a magic item that gives a clammy feel to the air (creating water in the broad area in an amount designed to be humid only). The Image is of fog or mist thick enough to obscure vision.

Let your party know that it's an illusion, so they gain the +4 to the save.

Most things won't count as having "interacted" with it in a way that even permits a save until they realize that their enemies (your party) can see through it. It looks and feels appropriate, and there's nothing "amiss" to even vaguely notice.

That is, perhaps, the sticking point, though: the rules only allow disbelief saves when you "interact" with it. But when you interact is when you might get "absolute proof." So what allows a save? Probably when you deliberately test it in a way that might give you proof, but it somehow resists that test. (Note, "I swing my sword through the fog" is not going to prove the fog isn't there, especially if your sword gets a bit of condensation on it.)

[Deophaun]

That is, perhaps, the sticking point, though: the rules only allow disbelief saves when you "interact" with it. But when you interact is when you might get "absolute proof." So what allows a save? Probably when you deliberately test it in a way that might give you proof, but it somehow resists that test. (Note, "I swing my sword through the fog" is not going to prove the fog isn't there, especially if your sword gets a bit of condensation on it.)
I think that's right. As long as the thing your illusion is imitating does not normally interact with a sensation that the illusion cannot replicate, observers have to make a Will save pretty much no matter what they do (baring Spellcraft checks). So walls of smoke and fog clouds are safe, as would be a roaring dragon off in the distance.

[Segev]

I think that's right. As long as the thing your illusion is imitating does not normally interact with a sensation that the illusion cannot replicate, observers have to make a Will save pretty much no matter what they do (baring Spellcraft checks). So walls of smoke and fog clouds are safe, as would be a roaring dragon off in the distance.

More importantly, unless they can qualitatively "interact" with it along a sense it immitates, they don't get a save at all.

This is sticky, though, because "hearing a roar" could be argued to be interacting. But by that logic, perceiving the illusion is "interacting," and so the lines in the rules about only getting a save if you interact are odd.

[Techno Magician]

I will talk to my DM about it, but we all take turns dming at our group, so this has all been quite helpful.

Would succeeding your spellcraft check not just give you a +4 on your save, as I don't see a difference between telling someone this is an illusion spell and them seeing that you are casting an illusion spell.

Besides I have to agree that the word "proof" is pretty vague in a world of magic, as mentioned an arrow flying through a wall isn't proof of anything when phasing bolts exist. I guess it's proof some sort of magic is involved but that's it.

On your friend sticking his arm through a wall, I just noticed either you auto succeed right then, or you get a +4 only if they guy who stuck his arm through tells you.

The rules seem pretty clear it needs to be someone who disbelieved the illusion telling you(Infact by RAW your allies don't get +4 when you tell them you are going to cast an illusion, only if you tell them after you cast it).

The hitting them with illusionary hammers while in the fog was to make them auto succeed the save to see through the fake fog bank. they don't get a +4 they just auto succeed as it proves it is fake.