Using a tower shield

[Enguebert]

Hello everyone

I have some questions about the tower shield and cover

1) According to the rules, you can use the tower shield to take cover but need to drop all attacks
- Wich type of action is it ? Swift action (so you can do it while opponent breath on you), simple action, complex action ?

The question arised when the fighter wanted to use his tower shield to have cover from dragon breath, but has no way to know when the dragon will breath.

Requiring a simple or complex attack means he can never attack.
Requiring a swift action when dragon breath and sacrifying next round of attack seems too easy

2) While hiding behind a tower shield, what can do a player. "Sacrifying attacks" is not clear.
Of course, he cannot do range/melee attack, but a cleric could cast buff or heal spells.
I think that "sacrifying all attacks" should be changed in "using a xxx action to set up cover" for the first round, then following rounds, you still have cover but can do other actions like buffing, drinking potions,...
What type of action should be "set up cover"

3) if you want to end your cover and get back your tower shield, i guess it is a move action ? but not sure

[Andezzar]

Since no action is specified it must be a non-action i.e. an action not of the normal types (free, move, standard full, round, swift or immediate). As such it takes no time at all, but as all other actions except immediate actions (swifts cannot) can only be performed on the character's turn. So to take cover from the dragon's breath the character has to take cover on his turn, which would have to come before the dragon's. He could only emerge from cover on his next turn.

[MadGreenSon]

Dosen't everyone just have an Unseen Servant carry the Tower Shield and hide behind it as needed? Then it's just mobile cover!

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

From the FAQ (https://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/er/20030221a):

To claim total cover from a tower shield, you must use a
standard action. The tower shield rules don’t say that, but that’s
what they mean. Since you can take only one standard action
each round, you cannot also attack, cast a spell, activate a
magic item (except for some use-activated items), use a special
ability, use total defense, or start or complete a full-round
action during the same round you claim total cover from the
shield. You can, however, take a move action before or after
you claim cover from the shield.

While this is 100% RAI and not RAW (it even points out that this isn't what the rules actually say), you should expect most DMs to go with this. From a strictly RAW standpoint, you can still cast spells, concentrate to maintain an active spell, and do anything else you want except make attacks in a round that you gain cover from the tower shield. Note that whether or not you gain cover from it is still a decision made during your turn, though since it's a standard action you could definitely ready an action for it.

[Curmudgeon]

Once again, the FAQ author appears to be making up something that's not in the rules. I believe that deploying a shield for any purpose requires use of the Ready or Loose a Shield action (a move action). The prohibition against attacking is a special rule concomitant with using the shield for total cover, rather than just a consequence of the deployment action used as this FAQ answer surmises.


Dosen't everyone just have an Unseen Servant carry the Tower Shield and hide behind it as needed? Everyone doesn't do that, simply because it's impossible. An Unseen Servant can lift a maximum of 20 lbs., and a tower shield weighs more than double that: 45 lbs. Plus, even if it were possible, only the user of the tower shield can gain cover from it. Does your Unseen Servant need the protection? :smallbiggrin:

[Enguebert]

Thanks for the link to the FAQ

Seems logical that taking cover is a move or standard action and can be taken only on his turn (or ready it)

[Darrin]

Once again, the FAQ author appears to be making up something that's not in the rules. I believe that deploying a shield for any purpose requires use of the Ready or Loose a Shield action (a move action). The prohibition against attacking is a special rule concomitant with using the shield for total cover, rather than just a consequence of the deployment action used as this FAQ answer surmises.


Readying or loosing a shield is the equivalent of drawing or sheathing a weapon. If the tower shield is already being carried and is ready, then what is the action to take cover?



Everyone doesn't do that, simply because it's impossible. An Unseen Servant can lift a maximum of 20 lbs., and a tower shield weighs more than double that: 45 lbs. Plus, even if it were possible, only the user of the tower shield can gain cover from it. Does your Unseen Servant need the protection? :smallbiggrin:

A darkwood/mithral feycraft tower shield weighs 18 lbs and could be carried by an unseen servant. I agree that you can't use the unseen servant's tower shield for total cover, but wouldn't it still count for normal cover (+4 AC)?

[Gavinfoxx]

Everyone doesn't do that, simply because it's impossible.

Unless you are using a Feycraft Darkwood Tower Shield. Or a Small Darkwood Tower Shield, and you, yourself, are small.

[MadGreenSon]

Everyone doesn't do that, simply because it's impossible. An Unseen Servant can lift a maximum of 20 lbs., and a tower shield weighs more than double that: 45 lbs. Plus, even if it were possible, only the user of the tower shield can gain cover from it. Does your Unseen Servant need the protection? :smallbiggrin:

Eh, you're no fun!

There's more ways to reduce the weight of objects than either one of us want to take the time to list and are you going to honestly say that something the size and shape of a tower shield being held by an invisible force doesn't count as cover because the word "shield" is attached?

If so, I'll get my Reinforced Plank of Cover with Easy Carry Handle (tm) ready to go over here with a wand of Unseen Servant ready to go. :smallcool:

[Andezzar]

If so, I'll get my Reinforced Plank of Cover with Easy Carry Handle (tm) ready to go over here with a wand of Unseen Servant ready to go. :smallcool:That thing would have to be at least 5 ft by 5 ft. to cover your square. Additionally hiding behind the tower shield gives omnidirectional total cover. A wall placed near you only provides cover if it is between you and the attacker.

[Curmudgeon]

A darkwood/mithral feycraft tower shield weighs 18 lbs and could be carried by an unseen servant.
Your arithmetic is off. A standard wooden tower shield is 45 lbs. A darkwood tower shield is half that, or 22.5 lbs.
Darkwood: This rare magic wood is as hard as normal wood but very light. Any wooden or mostly wooden item (such as a bow, an arrow, or a spear) made from darkwood is considered a masterwork item and weighs only half as much as a normal wooden item of that type.
Weight: A feycraft shield or suit of armor weighs 10% less than its normal counterpart. 22.5 x .9 = 20.25 lbs., which is still more than the 20 lb. maximum an Unseen Servant can lift.

[Andezzar]

The question is whether the "normal counterpart" is a Tower Shield or a Darkwood Tower shield.

[Curmudgeon]

The question is whether the "normal counterpart" is a Tower Shield or a Darkwood Tower shield.
That makes zero sense. You can construct the shield to be 10% less of the material you're using; you can't construct the shield to be 10% less of the material you're not using. 10% of something you're not using is always going to be nothing. :smallconfused:

[Darrin]

Your arithmetic is off. A standard wooden tower shield is 45 lbs. A darkwood tower shield is half that, or 22.5 lbs. 22.5 x .9 = 20.25 lbs., which is still more than the 20 lb. maximum an Unseen Servant can lift.

Depends on where you put the 10% reduction. If it's 10% + 50%, then 45 x .4 = 18. Darkwood and Feycraft don't specify an order of operations.

[JeenLeen]

That makes zero sense. You can construct the shield to be 10% less of the material you're using; you can't construct the shield to be 10% less of the material you're not using. 10% of something you're not using is always going to be nothing. :smallconfused:

While I agree with your logic, I'm not sure about the RAW reading. Since it talks about "its normal counterpart," I could see that meaning the completely normal base item without other augmentations, such as special materials.

But, again, this is just debating a strict RAW definition of what the calculation should be. Logically, treating the darkwood tower shield as the "normal counterpart" makes the most sense.

[MadGreenSon]

That thing would have to be at least 5 ft by 5 ft. to cover your square. Additionally hiding behind the tower shield gives omnidirectional total cover. A wall placed near you only provides cover if it is between you and the attacker.

Let's not go step-by-step over how to weasel the definitions and specifications around until I've got mobile cover as good as a Tower Shield that just doesn't get called "Tower Shield" so that the rules for how to use Tower Shields don't apply.
I've never used the Unseen Servant thing in a game, I've never seen it used. I was pretty much just being facetious.

Weight reduction? Now that's a fun tangent. :smallbiggrin:

Personally, I think feycraft and mithral should cover it.

[Zweisteine]

Even if RAI is that hiding behind a tower shield is a standard action, I'd say it's only a move action. I mean, you're basically ducking behind a wall. This prevents the "hide, full attack, hide" you get with free action cover.

Never mind all of that. I'd say hiding behind a tower shield is comparable to taking the total defense action. You're focusing on holding the shield up and turning so it's between you and your enemy.