Can a paladin early entry anything?

[CyberThread]

Unsure, but can a paladin, actually gained early entery to any PRC at level 4 or 5?

[Flickerdart]

Not any better than another class.

There are typically five reasons why it might be impossible to enter a PrC before a particular level:

BAB limit. This is very hard to break - you essentially have to get extra HD temporarily. Paladins can't do this.
Skill ranks. Primary Contact is the only way to break this (aside from bonus HD).
Spells/CL. Paladins have a slow spell progression and half CL, so they're awful at this.
A ton of feats that a regular character can't get before a certain time. Paladins don't get bonus feats (even the ACFs don't give them enough).
A combination of class features that's only possible to get after a certain amount of levels in a class or classes. Paladins don't get anything good, early or otherwise.

[JungleChicken]

They can BoneKnight

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

Bone Knight, Ordained Champion, racial paragon classes (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/races/racialParagonClasses.htm), that's about it.

[Flickerdart]

Bone Knight, Ordained Champion, racial paragon classes (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/races/racialParagonClasses.htm), that's about it.
Racial paragon classes aren't PrCs - they have no prerequisites and anyone can take them at level 1, provided they're the right race.

Paladins also have no way of entering Ordained Champion earlier than any other divine casting class - the only level-related prerequisite is a skill one.

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

Racial paragon classes aren't PrCs - they have no prerequisites and anyone can take them at level 1, provided they're the right race.

Paladins also have no way of entering Ordained Champion earlier than any other divine casting class - the only level-related prerequisite is a skill one.

Racial paragon classes technically are prestige classes, since they're not base classes or racial hit dice and they do have a single prerequisite.

He was asking about prestige classes he could enter at level 4 or 5, Ordained Champion definitely qualifies.

[Flickerdart]

Racial paragon classes technically are prestige classes, since they're not base classes or racial hit dice and they do have a single prerequisite.
Prestige classes have prerequisites, but having prerequisites doesn't make something a prestige class. The description of paragon classes clearly differentiates them from both base classes and prestige classes: "A character can multiclass freely between standard character classes, prestige classes for which he or she qualifies, and the character's appropriate racial paragon class."

[Fax Celestis]

Actually, paladins can get into prestige paladin slightly faster than a cleric/fighter multiclass.

Why you would want to do such a thing is another thing entirely.

[Brookshw]

Actually, paladins can get into prestige paladin slightly faster than a cleric/fighter multiclass.

Why you would want to do such a thing is another thing entirely.

Because they have two sticks?

[Talya]

Actually, paladins can get into prestige paladin slightly faster than a cleric/fighter multiclass.

Why you would want to do such a thing is another thing entirely.

By RAW, doesn't the existence of the PrC paladin in a campaign make the paladin base class cease to exist, and vice versa?

(But you're right...even if they both existed, it would be a horrible idea.)

[Rebel7284]

Actually, paladins can get into prestige paladin slightly faster than a cleric/fighter multiclass.

Why you would want to do such a thing is another thing entirely.

As I recall, prestige paladin has a disclaimer recommending it not be used in the same world as normal paladin...

Anyway, you probably want to look at something with BAB + turn undead requirements.

[Sian]

As I recall, prestige paladin has a disclaimer recommending it not be used in the same world as normal paladin...

Anyway, you probably want to look at something with BAB + turn undead requirements.

Hunter of the Dead (Complete Warrior) ... Paladins can enter at gaining level 6, any other way needs to wait till at least level 7 (well ... you could go Paladin/Full BAB, but that misses the point somewhat)

[T.G. Oskar]

Actually, paladins can get into prestige paladin slightly faster than a cleric/fighter multiclass.

Why you would want to do such a thing is another thing entirely.


By RAW, doesn't the existence of the PrC paladin in a campaign make the paladin base class cease to exist, and vice versa?

(But you're right...even if they both existed, it would be a horrible idea.)

Talya's statement is true, but since WotC has attempted such weird mixes anyways...

You could get a way to replace stuff with ACFs and get them back. The first three levels of Paladin and the first three levels of Prestige Paladin are effectively the same, except you get a Special Mount at 2nd level.

For example: take the ACF that replaces your Paladin (base class) spells with feats. You lose one feat to enter, but you get it back, and at a pretty odd level (4th). Take one level of Cleric or FvS, and you recovered your spells (because Prestige Paladin adds Paladin spells to the Cleric list/FvS list of choices). You can replace, then, stuff like Divine Grace and Lay on Hands, and you'd get them back. If you enter at 5th, you could even get Charging Smite or the first Divine Spirit and keep the mount! If you enter as Cleric, you keep the same MAD problem but you get two domains and the ability to replace Turn Undead from either the Paladin OR Cleric classes, and still keep it. On the other hand, you could replace your Wis-based spellcasting with Cha-based spellcasting, and reduce the Paladin's MAD by dumping Wisdom.

Lay on Hands would be slightly better, since it'd be your Paladin level +3 as one of the multipliers, the other remaining your Charisma modifier. That means you can lose up to 3 points and keep your Lay on Hands at full strength. If you replace Paladin spellcasting with Cleric or FvS casting, you can afford to lose 1 point and get better LoH than the base Paladin, AND replace LoH with something else.

Of course, this isn't really possible, because of the restriction, but since there's a lot of redundancy there, you can toy with the original class and reclaim it through different means. If you stretch it a bit forward, you could stretch up to 6 levels of Paladin (base class) and replace Remove Disease twice, with full benefits. The idea requires a bit of disbelief (basically getting to treat Prestige Paladin levels as actual Paladin levels, and taking the best of both), but it's already a "what-if" scenario, so might as well make it as beneficial as possible.

...but, just to remain on-topic: as mentioned, anything that requires full BAB, 1st level divine spellcasting and TU is better entered as a Paladin. Fist of Raziel can be entered as a Paladin by 6th level, whereas others require 7th (one level of spellcasting, plus BAB +6). I believe you can also enter Shining Blade of Heironeous as a Paladin by 8th level, because of the BAB requirements, but the Will requirement will pretty much screw you unless you dip into a class that grants full BAB and good Will saves (Knight?); then again, you DON'T want to go into SBoH, as presented on Complete Divine. Same thing for Knight of the Chalice, or Gray Guard. You'll notice that most of these classes have a common bond, so there's another thing to think.

[SpawnOfMorbo]

They get to early entry into Pun Pun...

[cakellene]

Isn't there a rule or guideline not to allow entry into PrC earlier than lvl 5?

[Hytheter]

Actually, paladins can get into prestige paladin slightly faster than a cleric/fighter multiclass.

Well, you could just really want to have "Paladin/Paladin" on your character sheet.