New DM needs advice

[Hituro]

So my friends and I are new to DnD and I'm going to attempt to be the DM. I feel I have a good understanding of the rules. My own issue is I'm trying to make a good story but I wanted to know if anyone had any tips for keeping the players involved on a linear story without making them feel like they are being forced to follow a set path and not make choices. I want them to make choices but don't want them to go too far beyond the main quest. Or worse yet, out of the realm of my adventure where I suddenly need to improvise. So can anyone provide some good adventure development tips for an aspiring DM? :)

[Know(Nothing)]

There's nothing wrong with running pre-made adventures, so long as you study them properly. Other people can help you on specifics better, but I've heard good things about Red Hand of Doom.

On a more personal note, you should get familiar with improvising eventually. Even the most interesting, well-designed railroad track gets tiresome after a while. A sandbox world is hard to run, but somewhere between the two can make for a much more rewarding experience for the players and the DM.

[Hituro]

Thanks Know(Nothing), I kind of figured this. Would you say I should have, say, 3 different outcomes planned for choices? I guess one thing I'm worried about is my group can be somewhat... spontaneous and unpredictable at times. I want them to bump into the main villain, but they won't know it's the main villain at first. I'm just worried that instead of helping him at first, they may just decide to kill him for fun :P and if that happens then.. the whole story is kind of botched XD I suppose I just worry about scenarios like that occurring

[Know(Nothing)]

Have a skeletal flow chart of possibilities, and based on where they are, flesh out a couple of the nearer ones. That way you at least have an idea started about where they might be headed.

As far as specifics with villain interaction, you know your players better than anyone else. Usually I find that a villain works better starting as an idea rather than a statted-out character that they directly interact with. They have heard of him, or they find clues to his existence, something like that(though I do appreciate the Usual Suspects-style wolf among lambs thing you have going.)

But yeah, the hard and fast rule is that if something has stats, the players can(and will) kill it. What is the party made up of?

[Quiddle]

I agree with know nothing, if you have an idea of what you want to happen gentaly in a meet both long term goals and short term ones it should go fine.
ie players start to notice creepy things occurring around them(because you have a horror bbeg who has been doing things)
An get players to investigate cave(which could be accomplished in a number of reasons that would occur based on who they talk to)

[NevinPL]

So can anyone provide some good adventure development tips for an aspiring DM? :)
1. It should be fun for you and players, so ask them what they want too.
2. Iron out a compromise.
3. ???
4. Profit.

As Know(Nothing) said, learn to improvise, have some "in case of emergency", generic adventure or two, NPC's, monsters, etc.
"Carrot and stick approach", can help you to control the "derailing factor", as long as you don't make it too obvious, don't abuse it.


Would you say I should have, say, 3 different outcomes planned for choices?
As much as all of you need.


I'm just worried that instead of helping him at first, they may just decide to kill him for fun :P and if that happens then.. the whole story is kind of botched XD I suppose I just worry about scenarios like that occurring
Contrary to what some players think, world doesn't revolve around them\their characters, so their\their character's actions have consequences. Bad ones too.

[NikitaDarkstar]

Also don't be afraid of moving things, events and people around. The players decide to explore the back alleys of a city when you planned for them to bump into someone in the temple district? Well maybe that someone was on their way back from the market and decided to take a short-cut (the main streets can get so horribly crowded!) and they bump into them there. They bypassed <random little village> where you had planned an orc raid during the night while they stayed at the inn? Well perhaps they hear about it in the tavern they're in right now, and next time they hit the road they get attacked by the very same orcs who were feeling rather bold due to their previous success, etc.

As long as you're not to heavy-handed about things you can generally guide people back to the plot, or bring the plot to them. Just make sure everyone is on-board for the same type of adventure. You'll run into problems if you were planning dungeon crawling and your players wants to be pirates and sail the high seas. But as long as you're more or less on the same page you should be good. Just make sure you have a backup plan for if the players decide to join the bad/wrong guys at some point. It can still make for a very fun game, but it will change the direction a bit. :p

[Hituro]

Also don't be afraid of moving things, events and people around. The players decide to explore the back alleys of a city when you planned for them to bump into someone in the temple district? Well maybe that someone was on their way back from the market and decided to take a short-cut (the main streets can get so horribly crowded!) and they bump into them there. They bypassed <random little village> where you had planned an orc raid during the night while they stayed at the inn? Well perhaps they hear about it in the tavern they're in right now, and next time they hit the road they get attacked by the very same orcs who were feeling rather bold due to their previous success, etc.

As long as you're not to heavy-handed about things you can generally guide people back to the plot, or bring the plot to them. Just make sure everyone is on-board for the same type of adventure. You'll run into problems if you were planning dungeon crawling and your players wants to be pirates and sail the high seas. But as long as you're more or less on the same page you should be good. Just make sure you have a backup plan for if the players decide to join the bad/wrong guys at some point. It can still make for a very fun game, but it will change the direction a bit. :p

I really like your suggestion. And if my players do decide to turn evil that could work with my story so far as well. Another thing I'm wanting to add is some puzzles. Do many DMs use puzzles in dungeons? I also want to use some RL objects to hand to players. Like if they find a special skeleton key for a secret door in a dungeon or something. Just to add some fun immersion. Or is this too weird? XD

[hemming]

I really like your suggestion. And if my players do decide to turn evil that could work with my story so far as well. Another thing I'm wanting to add is some puzzles. Do many DMs use puzzles in dungeons? I also want to use some RL objects to hand to players. Like if they find a special skeleton key for a secret door in a dungeon or something. Just to add some fun immersion. Or is this too weird? XD

Yup - puzzles are awesome. If your players seem to like them, keep throwing them in.

Props too - I don't use a lot, but the occasional prop is usually fun for the players in my experience

[Talesin]

In terms of keeping them on a specific path I find talking to people OOC is usually the best way. Just explain that you've not really planned for them to do the thing they're proposing but say you'll look into that for the next (or whenever) session so they can pick up where they've left off.

Everyone is there to have fun and I find people are pretty reasonable when you're upfront with them.

Obviously if they come up with a great idea and you want to improv it, then go nuts!

[HighWater]

Puzzles can be fun, but they can also easily break immersion. Therefore, only include them if they make in-story sense. (Why the heck are there 5 switches that need to be activated in a certain order?...)

It can also be difficult to make puzzles. Integrating puzzles made by others can be a bit tricky to do in a way that makes story-sense. It also runs the risk that players figuring out a puzzle are no longer their characters: the brainiac that plays the barbarian crushes your logic puzzles under his heals, while the hyper-intelligent wizard, played by a dude that's more socially apt than a rigorous mind leans back at the first sight of the Real Life puzzle, cause he's not gonna be the one to crack it anyhow. If you want character-connection, have skill-checks and knowledge-checks be involved in getting clues and activating triggers. Be sure to build in redundancies to cover for botched rolls.

[lytokk]

I'll go ahead and second (third, fourth?) starting with a basic skeleton, and only really planning one or 2 sessions ahead. Thats not saying you can't put things in and have them not really matter until 10 sessions from now. Throwing in little plot hooks now that don't take place until much much later. Had one of my players bitten by a lycanthrope, and it took abou 6 sessions to actually get to the first transformation. So little things like that.

This plan also helps you to keep re-tuning the plot to match what the PCs want to do and need to do, so you don't write yourself into a hole, and keeps it sandboxy enough so that the players don't see the rails beneath the sand.

[lumberingmenace]

Puzzles, riddles, and props are all great. They are a good cerebral challenge where the sword can stay in its sheath for a change. Coded messages are fun as well. I recently made a coded letter in a new vocabulary and my friends had to decode it from scratch. They thought it would be difficult at first and were worried it would take a long time but they had the entire letter decoded in an hour and they felt very satisfied doing it without hints or tips. Also try making a general map of the land your players will be in first and as they travel they can run into challenges that you can put as numbers on a map key for you to remember what they would run into traveling north south east or west and for how mny days.

[Gwaednerth]

I recommend looking at the 5-room dungeon. Room 1 is The Guardian, 2 is The Roleplay/Skill Challenge, 3 is The Combat Challenge, 4 is The Boss, and 5 is The Plot Hook. This way if they veer off course you can throw them a basic dungeon that ends in a plot hook leading back to your story. This way, their exploration is rewarded, you keep your story intact, and you don't have to do any real backflips.

[delenn]

In terms of keeping them on a specific path I find talking to people OOC is usually the best way. Just explain that you've not really planned for them to do the thing they're proposing but say you'll look into that for the next (or whenever) session so they can pick up where they've left off.

Everyone is there to have fun and I find people are pretty reasonable when you're upfront with them.

Obviously if they come up with a great idea and you want to improv it, then go nuts!

Yes, this! When it comes to the campaign, saying "look, I haven't fleshed this area out yet, but I know you're interested now, so I'll make it a priority for future sessions' is a lot better than in-game railroading. Players are a lot more willing to work with you if you show you're working with them.

[VoxRationis]

It can also be difficult to make puzzles. Integrating puzzles made by others can be a bit tricky to do in a way that makes story-sense. It also runs the risk that players figuring out a puzzle are no longer their characters: the brainiac that plays the barbarian crushes your logic puzzles under his heals, while the hyper-intelligent wizard, played by a dude that's more socially apt than a rigorous mind leans back at the first sight of the Real Life puzzle, cause he's not gonna be the one to crack it anyhow. If you want character-connection, have skill-checks and knowledge-checks be involved in getting clues and activating triggers. Be sure to build in redundancies to cover for botched rolls.

So true. My brother ran a campaign in which I played an easy-going Int 10 fighter who found, along with the rest of the party, an ancient artifact of some technological/magical blend. I, who would like to think of myself as well above Int 10, immediately set forth to deciphering the puzzle, and was hard-pressed to keep my actions in character (my fighter wouldn't have been particularly interested in it).

[Talos]

when i create a new campaign, i story board the entire thing. ie here is the main story plot. I usually have 2 or 3. I break it in to acts, act one 1-3 level they should be here know this info, choose one of 2 or 3 paths. Act 2 4-7 level they are effient killing machine by now ie working well together. PLOT twist make them think about the past decisions. you should have a pretty good idea which main plot they are following. they should be enough to become a pain to the main baddy and his minions. act 3 8-11 level actively trying to stop main baddy and his minions, over come well placed plans main baddy has in place perhaps by the skin of their teeth. you get the idea. in among all of this main plot there will be side adventures and possible over lap from the other 1 or 2 main plots they choose not to follow. well becuase your world lives and things happen with or with out your PC's.

i usually use the side plot to let each of the PCs shine for the day

and yes in most situations plan for a violent solution, a diplomatic, then a crazy off the wall one. ( guess which one your pcs will use) none of the above. lol isn't DMing fun .

[Ailowynn]

Have a basic idea of where you want the game to go. Detail the first adventure and sketch the first story arc. But don't railroad; I did that for most of my first campaign, and it was...okay. At the end, I loosened up and it was SO much better.

Also, if you do railroad, don't make choices for the players; just guide them. Don't say, "you can't go right," say, "you can go right, but there's a giant monster that way."

[mashlagoo1982]

1. It should be fun for you and players, so ask them what they want too.
2. Iron out a compromise.
3. ???
4. Profit.

As Know(Nothing) said, learn to improvise, have some "in case of emergency", generic adventure or two, NPC's, monsters, etc.
"Carrot and stick approach", can help you to control the "derailing factor", as long as you don't make it too obvious, don't abuse it.


As much as all of you need.


Contrary to what some players think, world doesn't revolve around them\their characters, so their\their character's actions have consequences. Bad ones too.

I have to echo the improvise and consequences advice.

Without knowing much of the game you are running, I can say it would be much easier to have a villain with a motive trying to kill the party if they killed your originally planned villain... especially if the party had no reason to kill your original villain. The new villain is simply an individual related to the original villain. Simple revenge motive. Maybe the new villain is the understudy of the original villain and is following the same plans even.

I would think you can probably keep all the other adventure details the same.

This reminds me of something else I read once. A new DM once asked an experienced DM what he did when his party ignored a plot hook to explore a cave? Was he angry with all the wasted time spent making the cave?

The experienced DM responded that he was not. He would just use the cave layout when the party entered the next cave.

This can be taken even further by performing a "palette swap" as I like to call it. Didn't want to explore the cave, maybe they would enjoy this ruined castle better (same basic map, different descriptions and random monsters)... no? Perhaps this mountain pass? etc.

[Mootsmcboots]

Go for illusion of choice!

Just find random ways to make whatever choice they make lead where you like. Video games do it all the time.

PCs wander off? Look they find a random mysterious cave, they wander in, are knocked out and wake up tied up and being delivered to bad guy's tower.

[Hituro]

What's a good boss for a group of five level 1's? @_@. Possibly a boss that might make sense with goblins

[lytokk]

A hobgoblin level 2 fighter. Feats Weapon focus (longsword) and Iron Will. Possibly, depending on your group, put 1-3 goblin archers with some cover someplace in the room. Be sure to give the PC's the option of cover also.

[Arbane]

Go for illusion of choice!

Just find random ways to make whatever choice they make lead where you like. Video games do it all the time.

PCs wander off? Look they find a random mysterious cave, they wander in, are knocked out and wake up tied up and being delivered to bad guy's tower.

There's a difference between 'all roads lead to Rome' and 'railroading'.

[Shining Wrath]

A lot of good advice above.

Have some ideas that can be dropped into your campaign when the players go "off-course". Any town can have a thieves guild's. Any village can have bandits nearby. Any wilderness can have druids who need help with aberrations or outsiders. Assuming you have access to a laptop or tablet, you can have a folder full of these and just open one as needed. And as others have suggested, something found during the side quest steers the PCs back toward your planned path.

Have your story ready. Have some side quests that are flexible ready.

And then if they do something *completely* off the rails, be ready to tell them "I was not ready for this!". If they are good players, they'll understand. When they attack the kindly priest who is supposed to give them directions to the Hidden Lair of BBEG, it can be difficult to adapt.

Until the kindly priest morphs into his true form, that of a demon enslaved by the BBEG. Or whatever wing-it you wing.

[Hituro]

A hobgoblin level 2 fighter. Feats Weapon focus (longsword) and Iron Will. Possibly, depending on your group, put 1-3 goblin archers with some cover someplace in the room. Be sure to give the PC's the option of cover also.

Would a goblin master and a goblin shaman be too strong for a first boss? Or maybe an owl bear and some goblins?

[Darkz0r]

Would a goblin master and a goblin shaman be too strong for a first boss? Or maybe an owl bear and some goblins?

Everything depends on the group and how you want to play it out.
Do they have higher ground? Traps?

You could make a lvl 1 boss and use 3-4 cr 1/2 underlings or you could make a lvl 2 boss and 2 lvl 1 underlings...

Everything depends really!

Careful though, I hate lvl 1 since you can die so easily...