Can you think of a way to combine Hexblade and Sublime Chord and Vestige magic?

[(Un)Inspired]

These are some of my favorite Charisma based things and I'd love to combine them in a meaningful way. I'm not sure is it's possible to do in the way I'd hope...

I'd love to get to at least 4th level with Hexbade to grab the dark companion and to gain 9th level spells from sublime chord.

Anima mage can be gotten into without any actual binder levels right?

I can't figure out a way to get the skill requirements and bardic music requirements for sublime chord in time however. Do you guys have any ideas?

[Hytheter]

These are some of my favorite Charisma based things and I'd love to combine them in a meaningful way. I'm not sure is it's possible to do in the way I'd hope...

I'd love to get to at least 4th level with Hexbade to grab the dark companion and to gain 9th level spells from sublime chord.

Anima mage can be gotten into without any actual binder levels right?

I can't figure out a way to get the skill requirements and bardic music requirements for sublime chord in time however. Do you guys have any ideas?

You need to bind 2nd level Vestiges for Anima Mage. Idk if you can do that without being a binder. To get Bardic Music will probably require at least one level in Bard, or some weird feat or ACF in another class.

[(Un)Inspired]

You need to bind 2nd level Vestiges for Anima Mage. Idk if you can do that without being a binder. To get Bardic Music will probably require at least one level in Bard, or some weird feat or ACF in another class.

I think improved vestige bind and bind vestige can get you second level vestiges. Idk of any feats that grant bardic Muzak. Otherwise a level dip would probably donk up my already tricky pre level ten hypothetical build of hexblade 4/ x 6 where x can give me 3rd level spells ( ideally cha based ), bardic music and a buncha skill points.

[Hytheter]

Do you really need the Hexblade levels? From what I can tell the Hexblade's familiar doesn't differ from the Sorcerer's, aside from you counting as three levels lower...

[Darrin]

Bard 1/Hexblade 4/Binder 3/Anima Mage 2/Sublime Chord 2/Anima Mage +8 should work if you do something like Illumian with Improved Sigil (Krau) and Sanctum Spell. Improved Sigil (Krau) + Versatile Spell + Heighten Spell would also work, or Improved Sigil (Krau) + Earth Sense + Heighten Spell + Earth Spell.

If you prefer going the Bind Vestige/Improved Bind Vestige route, you could probably try something like:

Bard 4/Hexblade 4/Anima Mage 2/Sublime Chord 2/Anima Mage +8
Feats: Bind Vestige (1st), Improved Bind Vestige (3rd), Improved Sigil (6th)

Hmm... maybe take Requiem at 9th, and we can might be able to squeeze in a level of Dirgesinger in there for Song of Sorrow, and then Haunting Melody (Heroes of Horror) or Doomspeak (Champions of Ruin) at 12th/15th, and you might have a pretty scary debuffer there.

(I was wondering if we could get Paladin of Tyranny 3's aura of despair in there somehow, maybe with Ordered Chaos from Exemplars of Evil, but I don't think that will work without a DM handwave.)

[(Un)Inspired]

Paladin of tyranny would be pretty sweet.

I'd like to squeeze Gexblade 4 in their for there dark companion which is kinda a key part of their overall extreme debugging strategy.

[Urpriest]

Paladin of tyranny would be pretty sweet.

I'd like to squeeze Gexblade 4 in their for there dark companion which is kinda a key part of their overall extreme debugging strategy.

I know this is a result of autocorrect...but that's an excellent euphemism.

[Nihilarian]

I know this is a result of autocorrect...but that's an excellent euphemism.I'd love to play a Gexblade.

[(Un)Inspired]

Paladin of tyranny would be pretty sweet.

I'd like to squeeze Gexblade 4 in their for there dark companion which is kinda a key part of their overall extreme debugging strategy.

ehhh I was still half asleep when I wrote that and in class.. and on my phone...

I think I'm just gonna leave it unedited

[Donox]

Hmmm...

So Binder 1/Wizard (or Sha'ir) 3/Hexblade 4/Anima Mage 2/Bard 1/Sublime Chord 1/Anima Mage 8

You get 9s. However, you'd never max out Sublime Chord casting pre-epic. This is a low cheese build though.

Alternately (with cheese)

Binder 1/Dread Necromancer 1/Bard 1/Hexblade 4/Anima Mage 3/Sublime Chord 2/Anima Mage 8/Whatever 1

That would require versatile spellcaster to qualify for Sublime Chord. In my book, at least, that interpretation would be sketchy.

Or theres the always-sketchy southern magician/alternate source ur priest entry.

Bard 1/Hexblade 4/Ur Priest 3/Binder 1/Anima Mage 1 (advancing bard)/Sublime Chord 1/Anima Mage 9


Pretty much all of these builds require high int and able learner to meet skill requirements, as well as improved binding. You might also be able to pull off some stupid tricks with blood lines, granted I'm not entirely sure there.

[A_S]

8 levels of Hexblade casting + Versatile Spellcaster + some way of getting higher level spells known will hit the "level 3 spells" requirement, if you'd prefer to avoid Sanctum/Earth Spell cheese. The Mother Cyst feat or one of the Bloodline feats are good choices to grab the higher level spells to cast with Versatile Spellcaster.

Bard 1/Binder 1/Hexblade 4/Anima Mage 4/SC 1/Anima Mage +6/SC (or whatever) +3

...would get the job done. Feats to include Verstile Spellcaster, Mother Cyst or a Bloodline Feat, Improved Binding, and a metamagic feat of choice by level 6 (this would require Human or one flaw).

*edit* Legacy Champion or Uncanny Trickster looks like it would advance the Anima Mage's progression without any problems; the class features are worded as "at each Anima Mage level." So if you finish off with Uncanny Trickster 3, you get Sublime Chord 9ths and 8th level vestiges.

[(Un)Inspired]

Hmmm if I make peace with the fact that I would have some vestigial Int casting I could do

Bard 1/wizard 5/Hexblade 4/Sublime Chord 2/Anima Mage 8

I could use bind vestige and improved vestige bind to get into anima mage and I could take able learner at 1st to help meet sublime chord prerequisites.

Ai, it feels so tacked on to have just a little bit of wizard casting at the beginning of the build. (sigh) I guess third level wizard spells with a decent caster level isn't the end of the world.

[Coidzor]

These are some of my favorite Charisma based things and I'd love to combine them in a meaningful way. I'm not sure is it's possible to do in the way I'd hope...

I'd love to get to at least 4th level with Hexbade to grab the dark companion and to gain 9th level spells from sublime chord.

PrCs that grant independent spell progression. (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=181091)

Hexblade 7 with Apprentice(Entertainer) for Perform as a Class Skill. PrC into Heartfire Fanner 1 Then Virtuoso 1, then continue Heartfire Fanner or Virtuoso until you have 11 levels of Hexblade casting. So Hexblade 7/Heartfire Fanner 4/Virtuoso 1/Sublime Chord 2/Heartfire Fanner+1/Virtuoso+5.

That'd get you 9th level spells from Sublime Chord 9 casting, The abilities of a... 5 + 4 + 6 + 2... ~16th level bard, at least for Inspire Courage, and your Dark Companion.

Alternatively Hexblade 5 should qualify for Knight of the Weave, Knight of the Weave 5 gets 3rd level spells and 1 level of Heartfire Fanner gets you bardic music, though you can substitute out one of those Knight of the Weave levels and take Heartfire Fanner in order to qualify for Sublime Chord after 10th level. Or if you can get Warrior Skald(IIRC) to be adapted to 3.5, then you can use Warrior Skald 1. Then you can finish up however you like.

Hexblade 6 with some finagling can become a Suel Arcanamach, I believe, and 4 levels of Suel Arcanamach gets them 3rd level spells, though you can substitute one of those levels for Heartfire Fanner I believe. So that's much the same boat as Knight of the Weave, really.

With the right skill allocations Rogue 1/Hexblade 4 should be able to get into Trapsmith which gives 3rd level spells at 5th level, and one can take a level of Heartfire Fanner to advance the Trapsmith casting, though it's definitely going to be hurting for skillpoints and require some shenanigans there... and it doesn't have enough levels to spare 1 for Virtuoso and still get into Sublime Chord on time like the others, taking 10 levels to get ready for SC just like Suel Arcanamach and Knight of the Weave.

Assassin's in the same boat, can't qualify before 5th level, takes 5 levels to get 3rd level spells, has a bunch of skill prereqs you're basically just setting on fire, and you *really* can't have Nymph's Kiss as one(although an Avenger could, but there's wonkiness with Hexblades and becoming good, sadly).

Really, the main thing enabling this is Heartfire Fanner, since that PrC is amazing. Unfortunately it's also Dragon Magazine.


Anima mage can be gotten into without any actual binder levels right?

I can't figure out a way to get the skill requirements and bardic music requirements for sublime chord in time however. Do you guys have any ideas?

Oh, it's the skill requirements giving you trouble? Uh... Item Familiar Abuse + Human? I believe the Apprentice feat will easily let you qualify for one or the other by adding either Knowledge(The Planes) or Perform to your class skills, but getting into both PrCs without having Able Learner, being Human, and dipping another class just for skillpoints along with item familiar abuse? Seems tricky to say the least...

Hexblade at least gets you everything you'd need as a class skill but those two...

[Jack_Simth]

Bind Vestige + Improved Bind Vestige. You don't need levels in binder to qualify for Anima Mage. You can skip Dark Companion by taking Obtain Familiar - then it's based off your caster level.

Hexblade-3/Bard-7/Sublime Chord-1/Anima Mage-9. Bind as a 9th level Binder, cast as a Sublime Chord 10 (with 7 bard levels, so caster level 17... 21, potentially, via Practiced Spellcaster(Bard)), Arcane Resistance, and Mettle.

Alternately, if you insist on Hexblade-4, Versatile Spellcaster + Heighten Spell (in addition to the stuff above) lets you go:

Hexblade-4/Bard-6/Sublime Chord-1/Anima Mage-9. Bind as a 9th level Binder, cast as a Sublime Chord 10 (with 6 bard levels, so caster level 16... 20, potentially, via Practiced Spellcaster(Bard)), Arcane Resistance, and Mettle.

[Coidzor]

Bind Vestige + Improved Bind Vestige. You don't need levels in binder to qualify for Anima Mage. You can skip Dark Companion by taking Obtain Familiar - then it's based off your caster level.


Is that really an option for a Hexblade though? Trading a familiar gained from Obtain Familiar for the Dark Companion? I mean, I could definitely see it being allowed by a DM as a house rule, but it seems suspect. Granted, I don't remember the wording on the Dark Companion ACF offhand and I'm AFB so there might be a RAW basis there I've just forgotten? :smallconfused:

OTOH: I'm not really sure why the OP wants the Dark Companion over a Familiar or why they'd want a Familiar either given the direction they seem to be going in. :smallconfused:

[(Un)Inspired]

Is that really an option for a Hexblade though? Trading a familiar gained from Obtain Familiar for the Dark Companion? I mean, I could definitely see it being allowed by a DM as a house rule, but it seems suspect. Granted, I don't remember the wording on the Dark Companion ACF offhand and I'm AFB so there might be a RAW basis there I've just forgotten? :smallconfused:

OTOH: I'm not really sure why the OP wants the Dark Companion over a Familiar or why they'd want a Familiar either given the direction they seem to be going in. :smallconfused:

I like the idea of having save debuffs like dark companion and curse and focalor and chupoclops on a full caster. even if focalor and chupolops mean getting uncomfortably close to people with sharp stuff.

As far as familiars go, all arcane casters want one right? I mean, It's just another way
to win the action economy game.

[Nihilarian]

Is that really an option for a Hexblade though? Trading a familiar gained from Obtain Familiar for the Dark Companion? I mean, I could definitely see it being allowed by a DM as a house rule, but it seems suspect. Granted, I don't remember the wording on the Dark Companion ACF offhand and I'm AFB so there might be a RAW basis there I've just forgotten? :smallconfused:

OTOH: I'm not really sure why the OP wants the Dark Companion over a Familiar or why they'd want a Familiar either given the direction they seem to be going in. :smallconfused:Step 1: Trade your familiar (gained at 4th level) for Dark Companion.
Step 2: Take Obtain Familiar feat.
Step 3 (optional): Take Improved Familiar feat.

Now you have a familiar and a dark companion.

[Coidzor]

Step 1: Trade your familiar (gained at 4th level) for Dark Companion.
Step 2: Take Obtain Familiar feat.
Step 3 (optional): Take Improved Familiar feat.

Now you have a familiar and a dark companion.

I know about that, but the proposal seemed to be.

Step 1: Take Obtain Familiar feat.
Step 2: Trade the Familiar gained from the Obtain Familiar feat for Dark Companion.

Or that they confused Dark Companion for the way Hexblades gain a familiar. :smallconfused: