Yet Another Fighter Fix

[Baroknik]

What do you all think of this idea as far as balance goes -- I am not concerned if it is "more powerful than class x" other than as a metric (game balance is inherently uneven). I am more interested in trying to target the fighter to be T3 or close to it for the sake of fun.

Advanced Combat Training
Beginning at 1st level and every odd numbered level after that, a fighter gains a new advanced combat training. These are chosen from the following list (not currently exhaustive). The fighter must meet all pre-reqs listed before taking the ACT.

Fast Movement
Pre-req (none)
As Barbarian (including no heavy armor)

Uncanny Dodge
Pre-req (none)
As Barbarian

| Improved Uncanny Dodge
| Pre-req (Uncanny Dodge)
| As Barbarian

Warrior of Nature
Pre-req (none)
The Fighter adds Survival, Handle Animal, Move Silently, and Hide to his Fighter class skill list. The Fighter gains an additional +1 skill point per level.

| Animal Companion
| Pre-req (Warrior of Nature)
| As Ranger

|| Improved Animal Companion
|| Pre-req (Animal Companion)
|| As Druid

Flurry of Blows
Pre-req (none)
As Monk, except a light weapon that the fighter is proficient with is chosen as the type of weapon that can be flurried with. A fighter who knows Flurry of Blows always gains the ability to use it with unarmed strikes as well. This flurry does not see a decrease in the attack penalty as it levels.

| Improved Flurry of Blows
| Pre-req (Flurry of Blows)
| As Flurry of Blows, except the attack penalty does decrease with fighter levels (as a monk)

Monk Unarmed Damage Progression
Pre-req (none)
As Monk

Evasion
Pre-req (none)
As Monk

| Improved Evasion
| Pre-req (Evasion, character level 7th)
| As Monk

Sneak Attack +1d6
Pre-req (none)
As Rogue, this can be taken up to three times.

Summon Familiar
Pre-req (none)
As Sorcerer

Insightful Strike
Pre-req (none)
As Swashbuckler

Fights from the Heart
Pre-req (none)
The Fighter adds Diplomacy, Bluff, Sense Motive, and Perform to his class skill list. The Fighter gains an additional +1 skill point per level.

| Staredown
| Pre-req (Fights from the Heart)
| As Samurai

|| Mass Staredown
|| Pre-req (Staredown, Intimidate 10 ranks)
|| As Samurai

| Inspire Courage
| Pre-req (Fights from the Heart)
| As Bard, but always remains at +1 bonus

|| Improved Inspire Courage
|| Pre-req (Inspire Courage)
|| As Bard, scales with level as bard as well.

Mettle
Pre-req (none)
As Hexblade

Skirmish +1d6
Pre-req (none)
As Scout

Skirmish +1AC
Pre-req (none)
As Scout

Sudden Strike +1d6
Pre-req (none)
As Ninja

Arcane Blade
Pre-req (none)
The Fighter adds Spellcraft, Knowledge (the planes), Knowledge (arcana), and Use Magic Device to his Fighter class skill list. The Fighter gains an additional +1 skill point per level.

| Arcane Training
| Pre-req (Arcane Blade)
| The Fighter gains the ability to cast a single 0th level arcane spell 3x/day. He must pass a DC 15 Spellcraft check for the spell to be cast, failure means the use for the day is wasted. Any DC's for the spells effects are equal to 10+INT mod.

| Arcane Mastery
| Pre-req (Arcane Training)
| The fighter may cast his Arcane Training spell at will if he can pass the same check. The DC for the spells effects are equal to 12+INT mod.

| Advanced Arcane Training
| Pre-req (Arcane Training)
| The Fighter gains the ability to cast a single 1st level arcane spell 1x/day. He must pass a DC 20 Spellcraft check for the spell to be cast, failure means the use for the day is wasted. Any DC's for the spells effects are equal to 11+INT.

(Un)Holy Soldier
Pre-req (none)
The Fighter adds Knowledge (religion), Concentration, Heal, and Diplomacy to his Fighter class skill list. The Fighter gains an additional +1 skill point per level.

| (Un)Holy Blessing
| Pre-req ((Un)Holy Soldier)
| The Fighter gains the ability to turn/rebuke undead 3x/day with an effective Cleric level equal to half his Fighter level (rounded down).

|| (Un)Holy Voice
|| Pre-req ((Un)Holy Blessing)
|| The Fighter's effective Cleric level is equal to his Fighter level for turning/rebuking undead.


This is just a list using the abilities from the PHB, but could be expanded to include other class abilities as well. The idea is to make the fighter the modular combat chassis.

Another idea I am playing around with to boost fighter is to allow FBF's to ignore ability-score pre-reqs of feats (or add their fighter level to their ability scores for determining if they qualify).

Anyways, dissect away!


EDIT: Added some more ACT's, still not complete, but updated!

[OldTrees1]

Advanced Combat Training
Beginning at 1st level and every odd numbered level after that, a fighter gains a new advanced combat training. These are chosen from the following list (not currently exhaustive). The fighter must meet all pre-reqs listed before taking the ACT.

This is just a list using the abilities from the PHB, but could be expanded to include other class abilities as well. The idea is to make the fighter the modular combat chassis.


This structure would work. It maintains the design purpose of fighter while also being open ended enough to achieve an actual fix.

Problems so far:
1) The list is not yet extensive enough
2) The list is not consistent in power (Ranger animal companion is more efficient than the rest of the options)
3) The list does not yet address the failures of the Fighter class
3a) Failures like difficulty handling certain enviroments
3b) Difficulty countering certain tactics
3c) Difficulty bypassing certain defenses/targeting different defenses
3d) Lack of high level options
3e) Be helpful in all non combat encounters

However the structure of this fix should be able to handle these issues if the content for this fix is improved/overhauled

[Baroknik]

This structure would work. It maintains the design purpose of fighter while also being open ended enough to achieve an actual fix.

Problems so far:
1) The list is not yet extensive enough
2) The list is not consistent in power (Ranger animal companion is more efficient than the rest of the options)
3) The list does not yet address the failures of the Fighter class
3a) Failures like difficulty handling certain enviroments
3b) Difficulty countering certain tactics
3c) Difficulty bypassing certain defenses/targeting different defenses
3d) Lack of high level options
3e) Be helpful in all non combat encounters

However the structure of this fix should be able to handle these issues if the content for this fix is improved/overhauled

Yeah, it just occurred to me a bit ago, so it's far from a finished product, but I tend to forget about things unless I write them down somewhere. Will start working on the list more...

By the way to balance out some of the power issues (AC for instance), what do you think of adding something like...

Nature's Warrior
The fighter may add Survival, Hide, and Move Silent to his Fighter class skills.

And make that a pre-req for the AC one? It addresses the out-of-combat utility (to some extent) of the fighter, as well as making the AC option less ideal.

[Anxe]

A few more skill pack ones would be nice. I'd be tempted to increase them to 5 skills per pack. You'd also want to include an extra skill point or two per level with each skill pack. Otherwise, the fighter's measly two skill points are still going to feel like not enough.

Something to deal with flight would be nice.

And is this in addition to the feats already granted?

[Baroknik]

A few more skill pack ones would be nice. I'd be tempted to increase them to 5 skills per pack. You'd also want to include an extra skill point or two per level with each skill pack. Otherwise, the fighter's measly two skill points are still going to feel like not enough.

Something to deal with flight would be nice.

And is this in addition to the feats already granted?

Not sure if I will directly address flight or not, but I may see if I can find a way (maybe down the Arcane tree).

And yes, it is in addition to bonus feats. It may make the Fighter a bit strong compared to other melees, but the idea is to largely replace things like Ranger/Paladin/Monk with an actually decent modular package that can simulate them effectively.

[Anxe]

I'm a little hesitant about including sneak attack then. Making Fighter into a sort of "all the full BAB classes" makes sense, but sneak attack seems like it steps on the Rogue's toes. Do people in your campaigns often avoid rogue? If that's the case it makes sense. Otherwise, you might want to leave sneak attack off the list.

[Baroknik]

I'm a little hesitant about including sneak attack then. Making Fighter into a sort of "all the full BAB classes" makes sense, but sneak attack seems like it steps on the Rogue's toes. Do people in your campaigns often avoid rogue? If that's the case it makes sense. Otherwise, you might want to leave sneak attack off the list.

My thoughts with sneak attack is that if you want to match a rogue's progression, you can -- after all you are the combat guy. The trade off is that doing that makes you have basically no other place outside of combat. Where a rogue would have evasion, more skill points, more skills, trapfinding, etc. The all sneak-attack ACT fighter would have FBF and sneak attack... that's it.

I could tone it down some and put a cap on it though -- maybe make it so you can take each precision damage thing a maximum of 3 times? You could still get +3d6 sneak attack +3d6 sudden strike and +3d6 skirmish that way, just would be a pain to track each one...

[Anxe]

My point was that if there is a rogue in the party he is now going to feel useless in combat. The fighter has his only combat trick and is better at it because his BAB, AC, and HP are higher.

It could work if sneak attack was allowed every other level, but I still don't see a reason anybody would play a rogue if this is also presented as an option.

[Baroknik]

My point was that if there is a rogue in the party he is now going to feel useless in combat. The fighter has his only combat trick and is better at it because his BAB, AC, and HP are higher.

It could work if sneak attack was allowed every other level, but I still don't see a reason anybody would play a rogue if this is also presented as an option.

Gotcha, though my campaigns tend to be fairly intrigue based with combat thrown in for flavor (so there would be other reasons to play a rogue). I can see your point though -- for a lot of people, combat is the central part of the campaign. While in overall game balance a fighter being better than a rogue in combat isn't a bad thing, if he just objectively outstrips the rogue in combat he can be anti-fun in that case.

Then again, a fighter with full SA already exists with full BAB. Though they do lose the fighter bonus feats... Will adjust the line up though... Putting a cap of 3d6 on it.

[Deeds]

I like the idea! I'm gonna use this in my campaign. I'll give you credit. :P