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View Full Version : Pathfinder [PF] A few feats for Gunslingers... (PEACH)



TheOneWhoWalks
2014-03-17, 01:17 PM
Effectively and consistently using guns in melee in something I love the idea of, and have been trying to make work in a non-clunky way for a while now. I've tried one or two gunslinger archetypes, but I could never quite get them right. I think I'm closer this time, with a few feats that more or less accomplish what I'm looking for, so I'm putting them out there to be picked apart :smallsmile: Thanks in advance for your input!

EDIT: Updated Gun Kata to deal with magic weapons more appropriately, and also renamed it Gun Fu, to avoid generating unnecessary confusion.


Gunslinger's Rebuke [Grit]
While they are complex devices designed for ranged combat, gunslingers know that firearms are also made of hardwood and metal; heavy, solid, and blunt. What’s more, they occasionally find it necessary to remind their adversaries of this fact, if they get too close for comfort.
Requirements: Grit class feature or Amateur Gunslinger feat, Pistol-Whip deed, BAB +6
Benefit: As long as you have at least 1 point of Grit and are armed with a one- or two-handed firearm that you are proficient with, you threaten your adjacent squares and can make attacks of opportunity as though you were armed with a melee weapon with which you are proficient. Any such attack is resolved as though you had used the Pistol-Whip deed, except that you do not make a combat maneuver check to knock the target prone.



Resounding Rebuke [Grit]
You've learned to make quick, opportunistic attacks that none the less carry the full weight of your gun behind them.
Requirements: Gunslinger's Rebuke, BAB +9
Benefit: When you use Gunslinger's Rebuke to make an attack of opportunity, the attack now functions exactly like the Pistol-Whip deed, including the combat maneuver check.



Gun Fu [Grit]
After long practice using firearms for fighting in a way other than what is intended, you've learned a style of holding and moving your weapon and body that seamless blends ranged and melee combat, into something resembling a martial arts form or dance.
Requirements: Gunslinger's Rebuke, Two-Weapon Fighting, BAB +12
Benefit: As long as you have at least one point of Grit, you can treat any two-handed firearm that you are proficient with as a double weapon; the second end of the weapon is a melee bludgeoning weapon that deals 1d10 points of damage, has a crit range of 20, and deals double damage on a critical hit. Any attacks made with the bludgeoning end gain a bonus on attack and damage rolls equal to enhancement bonus of the firearm. You can make both ranged and melee attacks in any given round, as per the usual rules for two-weapon fighting, although this does not give you the ability to make ranged attacks in melee without provoking attacks of opportunity. Due to the unusual, somewhat fluid nature of this fighting style, you may choose each round whether the ranged or melee end of the weapon is in your off hand for the purposes of determining how many of each type of attack you are entitled to in a round.

Milo v3
2014-03-19, 08:01 PM
Requirements: Gunslinger's Rebuke, Two-Weapon Fighting, BAB +12
Benefit: As long as you have at least one point of Grit, you can treat any two-handed firearm that you are proficient with as a double weapon; the second end of the weapon is a melee bludgeoning weapon that deals 1d10 points of damage, has a crit range of 20, and deals double damage on a critical hit. Any enhancement bonus or weapon special ability the firearm possess functions equally well for the bludgeoning side (unless the ability only affects ranged weapons, such as seeking or distance.) You can make both ranged and melee attacks in any given round, as per the usual rules for two-weapon fighting, although this does not give you the ability to make ranged attacks in melee without provoking attacks of opportunity. Due to the unusual, somewhat fluid nature of this fighting style, you may choose each round whether the ranged or melee end of the weapon is in your off hand for the purposes of determining how many of each type of attack you are entitled to in a round.
Why use two weapon fighting and the name gunkata, if it only works with two-handed weapons. I mean, isn't gunkata generally two one handed weapons.

Durazno
2014-03-19, 10:12 PM
Because it turns those two-handed weapons into double weapons. (http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/SRD:Double_Weapon) You need to be good at two weapon combat to use double weapons to their fullest potential. If you imagine the style resulting from this, "gun kata" is a fitting name; the kata's style is just more like you're using a bo staff than a pair of sai.

Milo v3
2014-03-19, 10:54 PM
Because it turns those two-handed weapons into double weapons. (http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/SRD:Double_Weapon) You need to be good at two weapon combat to use double weapons to their fullest potential. If you imagine the style resulting from this, "gun kata" is a fitting name; the kata's style is just more like you're using a bo staff than a pair of sai.

Gun Kata has nothing to do with using a two handed gun as a double weapon, it has nothing do to with even hitting someone with your gun as a melee weapon. The closest their is to that in gun kata is parrying the opponents gun to get them to not aim at you.

Thus, as I said. Why call it Gun Kata when it has no relation to it?

Aergoth
2014-03-19, 11:30 PM
While the name is borrowed from the Gun Kata in Equilibrium and isn't strictly correct in that sense, Equilibrium's Gun Kata represents a style of combat borrowed from hong kong action movies where improbable (and impractical or impossible) gun play adds an element of fantasy to the combat. Compare wire-fighting. While Gun Kata doesn't have any elements of melee combat, the aesthetics it borrows from do use that, and so I can't say there's anything wrong with the name.

Also it makes sense considering the some of the stuff that more artistic rifle drill performers can get up to.

Getting on to topic though, I love that gunslinger's rebuke is a 'grit reserve' style deed. They've always been my favourite type.
My issue with Gun Kata is more of rules continuity. Double weapons have always needed to be enchanted seperately on either end, so the musket butt suddenly being treated as sharing the enhancements that get applied to bullets is a little weird. By this standard a similar effect should happen with pistols and the like when you get Pistol-Whip.

Also if I afix a bayonet, can I still use gun-kata and turn my whole musket into a melee double weapon that has the melee appropriate enhancements of my firearm on both ends?

TheOneWhoWalks
2014-03-20, 02:01 PM
Hurrah, input! :-D Thanks for chiming in, guys! And yeah, I was slightly unsure of the Gun Kata name because of the Equilibrium reference, but I actually thought of the name independently (though with the feeling that I'd heard it someplace before, I haven't seen Equilibrium in close to 10 years), and it wasn't until my wife pointed it out to me that I remembered the movie. However, "Gun Kata", for the reasons Durazno and Aergoth pointed out, still felt the most appropriate for the imagery I was trying to get across, so I decided to stick with it.

Now, back to business :-)



My issue with Gun Kata is more of rules continuity. Double weapons have always needed to be enchanted seperately on either end, so the musket butt suddenly being treated as sharing the enhancements that get applied to bullets is a little weird. By this standard a similar effect should happen with pistols and the like when you get Pistol-Whip.

Actually, I did this specifically *because* pistol whip does the same...


Pistol-Whip (Ex): At 3rd level, the gunslinger can make a surprise melee attack with the butt or handle of her firearm as a standard action. When she does, she is considered to be proficient with the firearm as a melee weapon and gains a bonus on the attack and damage rolls equal to the enhancement bonus of the firearm. The damage dealt by the pistol-whip is of the bludgeoning type, and is determined by the size of the firearm. One-handed firearms deal 1d6 points of damage (1d4 if wielded by Small creatures) and two-handed firearms deal 1d10 points of damage (1d8 if wielded by Small creatures). Regardless of the gunslinger’s size, the critical multiplier of this attack is 20/×2. If the attack hits, the gunslinger can make a combat maneuver check to knock the target prone as a free action. Performing this deed costs 1 grit point.

(emphasis is mine)

...and then I went back just now and reread pistol whip, and I realized It's just the enhancement bonus, and that I'd read it wrong. So, I will be going back and changing Gun Kata to match. That does, however, leave the slightly tricky question of how you'd go about getting it fully enchanted as a double weapon. However, as far as I know nowhere does it say non-weapons can't be enchanted as though they are weapons, as long as they're masterwork. I suppose, if you tell a wizard that you want the back of your gun enchanted separate from the front, he'll look at you like you're crazy, but if you gold is good...


Also if I afix a bayonet, can I still use gun-kata and turn my whole musket into a melee double weapon that has the melee appropriate enhancements of my firearm on both ends?

Yes, which would give you some pretty fun-to-picture options in combat, but you would have to pay to enchant all three dangerous parts of your weapon separately, which might be cost-prohibitive... but if you want to forgo enchanting the butt of your gun separately, it will still benefit from whatever enhancement bonus you give the shooting end. :-)

Aergoth
2014-03-20, 02:22 PM
If the Gun Kata name becomes an issue the broader term Gun Fu might work.

Also it's clearly been a while since I read pistol whip!

TheOneWhoWalks
2014-03-20, 02:34 PM
Good call... maybe Gun Fu would just be better, so as not to give people a false impression at first glance... Think I might go with that. I hate naming things >.<

Also, yeah, it had been for me, too. I'd thought it gave you all the magic properties... but alas. Still, two-for-one enhancement bonus isn't half bad :-)