Soul Eating Fiend of Possession

[oncnawan]

I've got what I believe is a devastating combination of two PrCs; Soul Eater from Book of Vile Darkness and Fiend of Possession from the Fiend Folio. I'd like some help rounding it out.

Soul Eater drains levels through touch. Fiend of Possession goes ethereal and then possesses things and creatures. The FoP possession ability states that you stop being ethereal when you possess the creature (or thing) and become part of it, while not being injured/damaged by effects that harm the host. Energy Drain (Su) requires a touch.

So, it seems reasonable to possess a creature and drain one level per round until dead.

Entry to FoP would probably be best through Divine Minion or Neraph, with alignment ritual. I would probably take Fiend of Possession to level 6 for the Control Creature ability. That would net +3 BAB, which means I only need +2 from the entry into FoP, Will save +5, and Hide +6 and Knowledge (arcana) +6.

So, my questions are:
1. What would be the best entry into FoP?
2. How far to go in Soul Eater?
3. What classes after Soul Eater? I'd prefer a class that has abilities that can be used while possessing a creature.
4. Best way to get a natural weapon as required by Soul Eater (Feral template?)
5. How to deal with Magic Circle Against Evil and Protection from Evil?

[Dr. Azkur]

Maybe Warlock:

It fits thematically very well
Bit of a CHA synergy.
The Eldritch Claws are among the best natural weapons in the game, which you get through a feat and are Warlock-only.
Some invocations are very worthwhile, and you can use all of them while in possession.
Since you're being this evil, and this does not seem like a very feat-starved build you can jump for Mindbender 1, which Warlock grants access to and then grab Mindsight.
How to deal with protection from evil? There are like three invocations intended for dispelling. Pick one.

[icefractal]

I have to ask - if you don't care about getting much use out of the things you possess, why not just make them slit their own throat? Or does FoP Possession not give full control?

[Dr. Azkur]

I have to ask - if you don't care about getting much use out of the things you possess, why not just make them slit their own throat? Or does FoP Possession not give full control?

I just checked it out. It says nothing about the things you can't make the other do. It is effectively full control. (Although it neither clarifies what happens to the fiend if the possessed victim dies).

EDIT: Do have in mind that if you have levels of Soul Eater, you won't ever be able to possess anyone and do useful stuff with them for long cause there's not turning off your death touch.

[Lanson]

I just checked it out. It says nothing about the things you can't make the other do. It is effectively full control. (Although it neither clarifies what happens to the fiend if the possessed victim dies).

EDIT: Do have in mind that if you have levels of Soul Eater, you won't ever be able to possess anyone and do useful stuff with them for long cause there's not turning off your death touch.

I believe that is his plan, instead of jumping in and driving them around like a new car, he plans on just killing them through the possession.

However, if your DM says it won't work by simply possessing them, you can just make them "Touch" themselves. :smallamused:

[Xaktsaroth]

I've got what I believe is a devastating combination of two PrCs; Soul Eater from Book of Vile Darkness and Fiend of Possession from the Fiend Folio. I'd like some help rounding it out.

Soul Eater drains levels through touch. Fiend of Possession goes ethereal and then possesses things and creatures. The FoP possession ability states that you stop being ethereal when you possess the creature (or thing) and become part of it, while not being injured/damaged by effects that harm the host. Energy Drain (Su) requires a touch.

So, it seems reasonable to possess a creature and drain one level per round until dead.

Entry to FoP would probably be best through Divine Minion or Neraph, with alignment ritual. I would probably take Fiend of Possession to level 6 for the Control Creature ability. That would net +3 BAB, which means I only need +2 from the entry into FoP, Will save +5, and Hide +6 and Knowledge (arcana) +6.

So, my questions are:
1. What would be the best entry into FoP?
2. How far to go in Soul Eater?
3. What classes after Soul Eater? I'd prefer a class that has abilities that can be used while possessing a creature.
4. Best way to get a natural weapon as required by Soul Eater (Feral template?)
5. How to deal with Magic Circle Against Evil and Protection from Evil?

I've been playing with this idea for awhile myself, so I can give you my insights:

1)
Incarnate 2(Tiefling Sub Levels)/Swordsage 1
Totemist 2/Swordsage 1
Warlock 2/Swordsage 1

I'm a fan of Incarnate 2(Tiefling Sub Levels)/Swordsage 1 for quick entry and no feat investment. This set up ensures that no matter what you possess, you have some options. My prefered entry is Totemist 2/Swordsage 1 with one of the feats to grab Know(Arcane). I like this better from a style perspective because having your body decay isn't enough for me. I want you to become a bit of a freak and grow tentacles just to look more corrupted and open more chances to attack for more negative levels, but I constantly play the Lovecraft power chord, so if you want more subtle tactics, use the first/third one.

2) There are basically 2 break off points, Soul Eater 1 and Soul Eater 7. Drain 1 level for a small investment, or drain 2 for a larger one. I've occasionally seen Soul Eater 6 as a cut off for the Soul Radiance, but I don't it's worth the deep investment for that ability alone.

3)For a warlock/FOP, my instints lean towards Tainted Scholar. Advances warlock AND further pushes the corrupted look as what you possess would instantaniously gain your taint/corruption. :D Other than that, go forward with some ToB advancment to up you fighting abilities.

4) I'd go grafts or feats for a lower overall investment than a level of LA.

5) On pg. 22 of the Fiendish Codex 1, it gives rules for hiding from a magic circle against evil. You can actually walk right through them. As for protection against evil, use the warlock entry and dispel it, or possess something else and make them your first target.

Hope that helps. :D

[Necroticplague]

I just checked it out. It says nothing about the things you can't make the other do. It is effectively full control. (Although it neither clarifies what happens to the fiend if the possessed victim dies).

EDIT: Do have in mind that if you have levels of Soul Eater, you won't ever be able to possess anyone and do useful stuff with them for long cause there's not turning off your death touch.

But do keep in mind those who die of negative levels rise as wights you can re-posses (now immune to said negative levels).

[Dr. Azkur]

But do keep in mind those who die of negative levels rise as wights you can re-posses (now immune to said negative levels).
Hah, true. Nice catch. I was thinking along the lines of replacing the king, but yours is a very nice detail.



Incarnate 2(Tiefling Sub Levels)/Swordsage 1
Totemist 2/Swordsage 1
Warlock 2/Swordsage 1

Unfortunately, unless you don't have to be a Tiefling to get Tiefling Substitution Levels (which I find preposterous, but I've heard it about Drows), that's not possible in this particular build: Tieflings can't qualify for Fiend of Possession. One of the Pre-reqs is Race: Outsider (Evil). Tiefling is Outsider (Native).

Please correct me if I'm wrong cause I'm liking this PrC and player non-planetouched outsiders annoy me.

[Xaktsaroth]

Hah, true. Nice catch. I was thinking along the lines of replacing the king, but yours is a very nice detail.



Unfortunately, unless you don't have to be a Tiefling to get Tiefling Substitution Levels (which I find preposterous, but I've heard it about Drows), that's not possible in this particular build: Tieflings can't qualify for Fiend of Possession. One of the Pre-reqs is Race: Outsider (Evil). Tiefling is Outsider (Native).

Please correct me if I'm wrong cause I'm liking this PrC and player non-planetouched outsiders annoy me.

Sorry, I glossed over that point, as I figured it was common knowledge. The idea is to add the evil subtype to a Tiefling. This can be done a number of ways:

1)Ritual of Alignment from Savage Species.
2) Divine Minion Template: Here (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/mb/20050209a), be a Minion of Set, gain +1 LA and evil subtype.

Edit: Late Night + Memory = Derp.

[Necroticplague]

Sorry, I glossed over that point, as I figured it was common knowledge. The idea is to add the evil subtype to a Tiefling. This can be done a number of ways:

2) Divine Minion Template: Here (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/mb/20050209a), be a Minion of Set, gain +1 LA and evil subtype.

Set is +2, actually. Plus, it only changes existing alignment subtypes, not giving you new ones.

[oncnawan]

Thanks for all the replies!

It is my understanding that the Soul Eater's energy drain is not always on, but can be activated at will on a touch attack, or while touching a creature. If not, then, yes, I'd never be able to keep my rides for very long.

Warlock looks promising. I'll probably give it a try.

[Necroticplague]

Thanks for all the replies!

It is my understanding that the Soul Eater's energy drain is not always on, but can be activated at will on a touch attack, or while touching a creature. If not, then, yes, I'd never be able to keep my rides for very long.

Warlock looks promising. I'll probably give it a try.

The soul eating attack is actually pretty vaguely written. It doesn't specify an action or a requirement other than "with a touch". However, its a supernatural ability, so it defaults to a standard action to use (though some consider "with a touch" to mean "reflexively, every time I touch something", and build large amounts of natural attacks to take advantage of that).

[Xaktsaroth]

Set is +2, actually. Plus, it only changes existing alignment subtypes, not giving you new ones.

You're right. That'll teach me to go from memory. :P

[Ellowryn]

Best i can think of for you oncnawan is this, using the warlock as the "main" class and trying to gain as early entry as possible assuming your DM is willing to waive the cost of the ritual:

Race: Neraph from planar handbook with the Ritual of Alignment

Warlock 2/Swordsage 2(Or any average BaB Class with hide as a class skill)/FoP 6/Soul Eater 1/Whatever other class's you want.

Unfortunately with FoP giving only 1/2 Bab progression you need 2 Bab from your core classes, but there are no base classes with good Bab, good will saves, and hide as a class skill to the best of my knowledge.

Warlock would probably be your best bet for advancing in after Soul Eater if you only went 1 level, with 11 levels giving you EB 6d6, which you can use while possessing a creature or object(Why is the Sacred Statue of my Deity walking around, cursing us and shooting arcane blasts!?!?!), and up to greater invocations. If you plan to go 7 levels in Soul Eater, I'd imagine you probably would want to go the full 10 levels at that point, yay wraithfarming!

For natural attacks, graft would be the best bet, and if you plan to advance warlock then grab eldritch claw.

Xaktsaroth already mentions how to bypass Protection spells, so go with that.

About the whole negative level on touch thing, id imagine given the entry requirement of the PrC that it was meant to give negative levels whenever the character used his natural attacks. Having it always on could cause unexpected trouble in game play though, as the class gives no resistance to negative levels, and even goes as far as requiring the player to be alive, so having that annoying itch could cause you to kill yourself whenever you scratch it. But this isn't the first nor last time Dnd has had ambiguous wording on abilities.

Overall a very evil way to play, but does require your DM to let a few things slide.

[oncnawan]

The cost of the alignment ritual won't be a problem. My DM requires each new character to draw three cards from the Deck of Many Things. I learned to draw before rolling up stats, when 4 characters in a row got axed by the Deck of Many Things. If the character survives, wonky, but fun, results can ensue. Some characters end up with enough wealth/wishes to take the Ritual of Alignment at first level.

Thanks again, everyone, for the help.