Spells that create things(permanently) out of nothing

[Yogibear41]

Looking for spells that essentially create things out of nothing permanently, some of the major examples I can think of would be things like:

Create Water, Wall of Iron/Stone/Sand, Genesis, Deadfall(does damage but leaves behind alot of dead wood), True Creation.

Things that also take things that are relatively common and turn them into something else could also be pretty cool, like beget bogun or water to acid.

Also while on this topic, spells that alter or create something to do damage, like splinter bolt, don't specifically say if the thing being created or altered sticks around permanently. So for example if you cast spliter bolt a bunch of times would you end up with a lot of large javelin sized pieces of wood? or would they return back to the splinters they use to be after you shot them at something?

If you cast Rain of Spines, does the metal that rains down stick around? Which you could then collect melt down and reforge into a sword or something?

If you were somewhere that was short on metal or wood could you basically cast those spells not to do damage but simply to create more raw materials to work with?

[deuxhero]

You want instantaneously, permanent is a different game term ("permanent can be dispelled" being the main difference).

Prestidigitation's "soiling" lasts indefinitely (WHAT "soiling" is I'm not sure, but it has to create SOMETHING).

[Max Caysey]

You wanna go Conjuration (Creation) for that lasting effect!

[ShurikVch]

You want instantaneously, permanent is a different game term ("permanent can be dispelled" being the main difference). Break Enchantment (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/breakEnchantment.htm) can
reverse even an instantaneous effect.



Prestidigitation's "soiling" lasts indefinitely Prestidigitation (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/prestidigitation.htm) have
Duration: 1 hour

[deuxhero]

Dispel meaning Dispel Magic


Any actual change to an object (beyond just moving, cleaning, or soiling it) persists only 1 hour.

[ShurikVch]

Dispel meaning Dispel Magic Duration of Wall of Force (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/wallOfForce.htm) is far from instantaneous, and yet it can't be dispelled by Dispel Magic


Any actual change to an object (beyond just moving, cleaning, or soiling it) persists only 1 hour. :smallconfused: Does it mean city, torched to the ground with Prestidigitation, will magically rebuild itself 1 hour later?

[Shining Wrath]

Break Enchantment (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/breakEnchantment.htm) can


Prestidigitation (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/prestidigitation.htm) have

Which means when you cast prestidigitation you can do minor little things for an hour, not that the effects of making food tasty or cleaning clothes go away in an hour.

[The Prince of Cats]

:smallconfused: Does it mean city, torched to the ground with Prestidigitation, will magically rebuild itself 1 hour later?
You can burn a city down with prestidigitation? I don't think you're using it right...

[unseenmage]

Using this site (http://www.imarvintpa.com/dndlive/FindSpell.php) I usually search for anything with a duration of Permanent or Instantaneous then ignore all the damage spells on the generated list.

Permanent durations can be Dispel Magic-ed and cease in an Antimagic Field or similar. Stuff created by Instantaneous duration spells persist and are real actual things.

Create Crawling Claw (MC:MoF) and Awaken Sand (Sa) are two of my most favorite 'something from nothing' Instantaneous duration spells as they both turn objects into creatures permanently. Mineralize Warrior (Un) and similar template applying spells are also nice as they permanently alter a subject.

True Creation is nice, especially if you can use it to make Shapesand (Sa) as Shapesand can then be made into whatever else you may need.

You've already touched on the 'Wall of X' line of spells. Most of those leave something real in their wake.

In my sig there's a link to a thread about making and using sand. The Iceberg spell leaves piles of snow behind. There are a lot of spells like it too from what I can tell.

[Chronos]

My favorite is Orb of Force. It's an instantaneous conjuration (creation) spell, and therefore the things it creates will persist until they would otherwise fall apart on their own. Force as a substance is incredibly durable, and can't be destroyed at all except in a handful of very specific ways. Therefore, the orbs created by an Orb of Force spell stick around after casting. Feel free to pick them up and throw them back.

Although, really, this mostly just highlights how dysfunctional the Orb spells are, and why they really ought to be in Evocation.

[Curmudgeon]

My favorite is Orb of Force. It's an instantaneous conjuration (creation) spell, and therefore the things it creates will persist until they would otherwise fall apart on their own. Force as a substance is incredibly durable, and can't be destroyed at all except in a handful of very specific ways. Therefore, the orbs created by an Orb of Force spell stick around after casting. Feel free to pick them up and throw them back.
No, I don't think so. Maybe the force contents aren't destroyed, but the Orb itself needs to break open on impact to release what's inside; if there weren't some containing effect, the spellcaster would be damaged by holding any Orb projectile in the palm of their hand. In short, there's nothing left to pick up after the spell effect is thrown.

As a general rule, spells only do what's stated in their descriptions. Having an Orb be usable repeatedly is not in any of those spells' stated capabilities.

[Chronos]

Not true: You can hold a javelin safely, too, but it can damage things it's thrown at, and needn't break open to do so. The rules state that instantaneous conjuration (creation) effects stick around, and there's nothing in Orb of Force that says that it doesn't, so it does. As you say, the spell only does what it says, and it says nothing about vanishing, so it doesn't vanish.

[Curmudgeon]

As you say, the spell only does what it says, and it says nothing about vanishing, so it doesn't vanish.
OK, so what are you going to do with all those Orb of Force remnants, then? The damage is a spell effect, not a created item property. (Unless you can point to a Weapons table (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/equipment/weapons.htm#tableWeapons) entry listing ranged weapon damage for one, that is.)

[Chronos]

If nothing else, they're an improvised thrown weapon that can hit ethereal targets. I can see how that might be handy, especially if you have Sneak Attack or other damage boosts. Or you could probably use them as sling stones.

[The Oni]

You can burn a city down with prestidigitation? I don't think you're using it right...

It could just be a very small city

[MadGreenSon]

OK, so what are you going to do with all those Orb of Force remnants, then? The damage is a spell effect, not a created item property. (Unless you can point to a Weapons table (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/equipment/weapons.htm#tableWeapons) entry listing ranged weapon damage for one, that is.)

Ummm... Coffee table ornaments? Wow. Any world with many Mailman-type sorcerers is gonna be littered with these things...:smallbiggrin:

[CombatOwl]

If nothing else, they're an improvised thrown weapon that can hit ethereal targets. I can see how that might be handy, especially if you have Sneak Attack or other damage boosts. Or you could probably use them as sling stones.

There are no rules for doing so, so by RAW this is impossible (no damage listed on a table, nor any range increment, nor a weight). I mean, by a strict RAW, there isn't even any indication that the orb ever leaves the target. All we know is that there is an orb of force that streaks at a target. Nothing about it ever falling off, hitting the ground, being usable for other things, etc. There isn't even a suggestion that it is possible to manipulate the globe--perhaps the force forever resists being manipulated after first streaking at a target. For all we know it strikes the target and remains there forever. RAI depends on how the DM conceptualizes an Orb of Force.

And, obviously, rule 0.

[Zweisteine]

Wall of Sand is not actually permanent. The sand disappears at the end. If it just made a wall of sand, it quickly fall apart.

[Phelix-Mu]

Note that energy transformation field is a nifty way to create a mass production effect for whatever it is you are creating, or to place a more common form of the transmute effects on them.

Along the same lines, you can create sand by creating stone and transmuting it. You can create acid by creating water and transmuting it. Other products are lava (which isn't really "permanent," but can be made so with a sufficiently large source of heat), mud, glass (via some of the spells that target things and turn them to glass), flesh (stone to flesh), any type of stone (from any other type of stone via stone metamorphosis).

Finally, you might want to look into the various planar bubble-ish effects. There might be some effect that lets you copy the morphic trait of planes like limbo. Combine with, I think it was, perinarch, you might be able to temporarily create an area of morphic terrain on the Prime, and then use perinarch to stabilize it. Not sure if the result would actually stick, though, once the area of the planar bubble was moved elsewhere.

[Tessman the 2nd]

Halaster's Fetch, while its not from nothing and you might have a confrontation with celestial/fiendish/inevitable beings after serious abuse its fun.

[Cruiser1]

Halaster's Fetch, while its not from nothing and you might have a confrontation with celestial/fiendish/inevitable beings after serious abuse its fun.
Better yet, try the Sanctified spell Create Lantern Archon (CoV), which any non-evil prepared spellcaster can cast. It creates (not summons or calls) a brand new Lantern Archon, so it really is something from nothing. (You take CON drain after creating it, so make yourself immune first.) Use standard infinite spell techniques and you can fill the Celestial realms with new Archons, tipping the balance of power in the Great Wheel in favor of LG. :smallbiggrin:

[RedMage125]

No one's mentioned Fabricate to the OP yet?

Fabricate does what you're looking for. You may need to make a Craft check, though, to create somethign fancy.

Fun fact: If you're using the spell to repair something, no Craft check is needed. For example, statue of a goddess has been smashed up by her enemies, but all the pieces are still there. Fabricate can restore it magically.

[Yogibear41]

Well technically fabricate doesn't create something out of nothing, you have to have the raw materials.

I'm talking you are alone on an empty plane with nothing but the vast emptiness(and maybe a few spell components he he) what can you make?

[RedMage125]

Well, the OP also specified spells that turn ordinary things into other things.

It could be a valid use of fabricate to turn sand into glass, for example.

[Curmudgeon]

Better yet, try the Sanctified spell Create Lantern Archon (CoV), which any non-evil prepared spellcaster can cast. It creates (not summons or calls) a brand new Lantern Archon, so it really is something from nothing. (You take CON drain after creating it, so make yourself immune first.)
That might work exactly once. Failing to honor the sacrifice requirement would mean the spellcaster is assuredly not "willing to utterly devote themselves to good", and thus could never cast a Sanctified spell again.