Bards in high-level games

[sleepyphoenixx]

It's widely accepted that any high level character should get Mind Blank in one form or another.
Since all bardic music is mind-affecting that pretty much means your bard becomes a crippled sorcerer unless your entire party neglects a crucial defense (or they're all undead and you take Requiem i guess).

What i'm looking for is duplicating the effects of Mind Blank as much as possible while still allowing bardic music to be effective.

What i have so far:
Ring of Mind Shielding: protects from Detect Thoughts, Discern Lies and alignment detection - cheap enough for pretty much everyone to get but pretty limited

Exalted armor enhancement or persisted Protection from X: protects from mind control/possession - Exalted is a +3 enhancement and only works for good characters, PfX can be dispelled/run out and also costs significant daily resources even with DMM or Incantatrix.

Nondetection: protects from divinations - has a material component (though it's not too much of a problem at high level), offers a CL check so it's not absolute

What i'm looking for:
Protection from Divination, preferably absolute (no CL checks or saves), in item form or long duration
Protection from as many negative mind-affecting effects as possible, with the same conditions, while still allowing bardic music effects.

[Barbarian Horde]

It's widely accepted that any high level character should get Mind Blank in one form or another.
Since all bardic music is mind-affecting that pretty much means your bard becomes a crippled sorcerer unless your entire party neglects a crucial defense (or they're all undead and you take Requiem i guess).

What i'm looking for is duplicating the effects of Mind Blank as much as possible while still allowing bardic music to be effective.

What i have so far:
Ring of Mind Shielding: protects from Detect Thoughts, Discern Lies and alignment detection - cheap enough for pretty much everyone to get but pretty limited

Exalted armor enhancement or persisted Protection from X: protects from mind control/possession - Exalted is a +3 enhancement and only works for good characters, PfX can be dispelled/run out and also costs significant daily resources even with DMM or Incantatrix.

Nondetection: protects from divinations - has a material component (though it's not too much of a problem at high level), offers a CL check so it's not absolute

What i'm looking for:
Protection from Divination, preferably absolute (no CL checks or saves), in item form or long duration
Protection from as many negative mind-affecting effects as possible, with the same conditions, while still allowing bardic music effects.


Where can I find "Exalted Armor Enchantment"?

[Techwarrior]

This is very true, but between Nondetection and Protection from Alignment you can get most of the effects of Mind Blank.

Beyond that, the rules specifically allow you to lower immunities and accept effects that would benefit you, citing an Elf accepting Sleep. Most DM's seem to house-rule that away though, elsewise you get Golems buffed up to the nines (and possibly even 9's, if you're going to be really screwed).

[Rebel7284]

Well eventually you can get Music Of The Gods [Epic]. Takes a while to get there though.

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

Persistent Magic Circle Against [Alignment] works for the whole party. Most good-aligned outsiders get a permanent supernatural magic circle against evil as a racial ability, so Planar Ally/Binding can gain that for the party. It's good to have this anyway to block extraplanar opponents from attacking, especially if it's supernatural as SR won't allow them to bypass it.

A Hat of Anonymity (MIC) protects the wearer as the Nondetection spell. Its price is set in stone, but if the party crafts it themself the caster level can be higher (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/magicItemBasics.htm#casterLevel) for a higher DC. It's pretty nice when something with supernatural permanent True Seeing has to roll a caster level check (1d20 + their HD) vs DC 35 for it to work on a given character.

A high level Bard should have max level Sublime Chord casting, and can benefit from this trick (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?267805-Sorcerer-Handbook#4) to significantly increase the number of different spells he can cast. Plus Lyric Spell allows him to spend his Bardic Music uses as though they were spell slots.

The casters in the party who don't make attacks can still use Mind Blank. Animal companions and wild cohorts (all Fleshrakers) would benefit the most from Inspire Courage, and there probably won't be enough Mind Blanks to go around for them anyway.

Even if the whole party gets Mind Blank, at that level even Dragonfire Inspiration's 9d6 per attack won't be all that significant compared to Power Attack+Leap Attack. You can retrain (PH2) Inspire Courage to Inspire Awe (Dragon Magic) and go with a build like (Savage) Bard 8/ Dread Witch 1/ Nightmare Spinner 1/ Sublime Chord 2/ Dread Witch 4/ Nightmare Spinner 4. Stack on Haunting Melody, Dreadful Wrath, Imperious Command with Fearsome armor and Never Outnumbered, and Fell Frighten Spell and he'll be the master of debuffing opponents, rather than buffing his allies.

[Deophaun]

Well, one way to do it is make the rest of your party undead, then pick up Requiem. Immunity to mind-affecting all around, but they get the benefits of your music.

'Course, not everyone wants to be raised as an unliving abomination just to suit the guy in the brightly-colored britches.

A high level Bard should have max level Sublime Chord casting,
Only if they want to play a caster, instead of a bard. Otherwise, there's no "should" about it.

Even if the whole party gets Mind Blank, at that level even Dragonfire Inspiration's 9d6 per attack won't be all that significant compared to Power Attack+Leap Attack.
Why stop at 9d6? Bard 20 is IC +4. Song of the Heart +5. Inspirational Boost +6. Badge of Valor +7. A Vest of Legends lets you pull that at level 16. WoC will either make you +12 or +14, depending on stacking rules for your group. Then, if you have a party configured to take advantage of it (TWFers, Natural Attack Totemists or Druids; you can easily get twelve or more attacks out of the later) or silly people who like to use bows, the damage cannot be considered not "all that significant."

You can retrain (PH2) Inspire Courage to Inspire Awe (Dragon Magic) and go with a build like (Savage) Bard 8/ Dread Witch 1/ Nightmare Spinner 1/ Sublime Chord 2/ Dread Witch 4/ Nightmare Spinner 4. Stack on Haunting Melody, Dreadful Wrath, Imperious Command with Fearsome armor and Never Outnumbered, and Fell Frighten Spell and he'll be the master of debuffing opponents, rather than buffing his allies.
At high levels, fear immunity is becoming common, and the Dread Witch's ability to bypass it only applies to their spells. So Inspire Awe is a waste.