Sha'ir Question

[TheNervyOne]

Ok so I have recently looked up the Sha'ir and I have some questions. Mostly about the time it takes for the class to pick up its spells.

Can anyone tell me some experiences or tactics to better fill this type of class? Its an interesting class and I would like to try it out if I can find a way to work it into the story and of course overcome its seeming shortcomings.

[Psyren]

The time to get them isn't a big issue - past low levels, you can request most of your spells in the morning and (provided you mostly stick to known spells) it won't take much longer than the prep time for any other caster.

The bigger problem (which happens at low levels) is that the spells don't stick around very long, forcing you to repeat the retrieval process mid-adventure, and you therefore have a bigger chance of getting caught with your pants down. You also probably won't have the cash for a stave, wands etc. to tide you over.

So if you're playing in a low-level game they can be a pain, but past, say, level 5 or so they won't be too much hassle.

[Hangwind]

Ahh, the Sha'ir. THis is quite possibly my favorite class in the world:smallsmile:

The Sha'ir is an interesting class because of it's spell learning and retrieval mechanism. First, remember that even normal wizards need to spend an hour preparing their spells in the morning. Given that your spells known only take rounds to retrieve, and even arcane spells unknown only take minutes, you can usually get a solid complement of spells in the same amount of time as a wizard. More to the point, you can send your familiar out to retrieve spells at any time. Even in an anti-magic field. Some say that they can't retrieve spells if they are in such a field, but it is important to remember that their at will plane shift is an entirely seperate ability from their retrieve spells ability, and retrieve spells is Ex. It makes for an interesting tactic to save your familiar from death anyway.:smallwink:

Now, their time limit on their spells is perhaps the most important ruling about them. There are a few ways for it to work. The first is that once you retrieve your spells, if they time out you are out of luck. this is not a good ruling since the text says no harm is done by your spells running out. The second and most common is that you fill your slots with spells and if they run out you just have to retrieve more. I'll get back to this. The third and cheesy option is that you can retrieve as many spells as you want and stack them. So, you can have five copies of every spell at any moment and use them at any time. This brings the Sha'ir up to Tier 0 instantly since it essentially gives you a wizard spell list cast by a sorcerer. Not recommended for any but the highest powered games.

So, tactics for the sensible option. First, this is a class where multi-classing is essential. You really want to multiclass somewhere in levels 5-10. Why? Because this will allow you to switch your spell list throughout the adventuring day. Remember, you can change your spells only after your original spells have drained out of your slots. So, you only want your spells to last for a part of the day.

Also, you are a Arcane/Divine caster so you can multiclass into Divine prestige classes. Sacred Exorcist is excellent. However, since your Divine spells take hours to retrieve, you are only going to use them when you have nothing else to do. Their best use is to qualify you for prereqs. Again, Sacred Exorcist.

So, yeah Sha'ir is great if used properly.:smallcool:

[TheNervyOne]

Ok so how in the world does option 3 work? You have spells known, spells retrieve these I get but don't you also have spells per day that sort of eliminates the endless spells idea?

[Hangwind]

True, but by RAW, the only thing that matters is how many spells you cast, not how many you retrieve. So while you can only cast a certain number of, say, first level spells a day, you can retrieve five copies of every spell, essentially letting you use any spell at any time. This works for both spells known and unknown. Yeah, it is very cheesy.

[Just to Browse]

To avoid problems with divine spells, build yourself so you only need 1 per day, end your gen to collect those divine spells at night.

Keep your gen running off to get you spells, since it can die really easily. Get the spells that aren't known during the hour that clerics/wizards prepare their spells, so you have some unique artillery. Save your spells known for really common attack spells so you can always be ready between encounters, and keep a separate list of common utility spells that you can pull up in a few minutes.

Going into skypledged lets you pull off divine spells in a pinch, and the inherent arcane/divine nature of the Sha'ir lets you qualify for mystic theurge with pure Sha'ir class levels. You can use that to bounce into arcane heirophant.

[Hangwind]

Ahh, but remember, the RAW says a gen will planeshift at the first sign of trouble if at all possible. So, really, you don't have to worry about keeping your gen alive. The trick is getting it back from the elemental planes:smallfurious:

[Doc_Maynot]

What I like to do is take a dip in a cha based spontaneous casting class, usually sorcerer.
That way I qualify for Versatile Spellcaster and Arcane Preparation and can use them with Sha'ir spells and slots easier.

[TheNervyOne]

Would a level dip into Bard then run Sha'ir for a bit work just as well?

I also love the flavor of the knowledge bonuses and the skills might be nice.

But thats a clever trick to allow a bit more adaptability to the casting idea.

[Doc_Maynot]

Would a level dip into Bard then run Sha'ir for a bit work just as well?

I also love the flavor of the knowledge bonuses and the skills might be nice.

But thats a clever trick to allow a bit more adaptability to the casting idea.

Yes, that would work. Just needs to be a spontaneous caster.