Ashworm Dragoon/Paladin

[Grayson01]

Okay I found this PrC and it says as follows
"DRAGOON PALADINS
Ashworms have a poison attack, but many paladins forswear the use of poison. As such, most paladins who become ashworm dragoons go through a lengthy ritual known as the Consecration of the Sifting Sand. The daylong ritual includes wilderness fasting, prayer, and the removal of the ashworm's poison-producing glands (followed by cure spells so the ashworm doesn't suffer).

When the Consecration of the Sifting Sand is complete, the ashworm has permanently lost its poison attack, but a mystic bond has developed between the ashworm and the paladin/dragoon. The ashworm gains the benefits of being a paladin's special mount (as described on page 44 of the Player's Handbook), and the dragoon can now call the ashworm from the celestial realms in which it now resides (often the white sands of the Mithardir layer of Arborea, despite that plane's chaotic tendencies)."
If the Dragoon is also a Paladin it can preform said right. But does it get the HD Bonus progressions of the Dragoon and the Paladin does the two classes now stack for determining Paladin Mount Statistics.

What does every one think?

[CyberThread]

The simple answer is , yes

[Nettlekid]

The Ashworm does indeed become the Paladin's special mount, so it gains all benefits befitting a special mount, as they are described in the PHB. That includes higher Int, bonus HD, etc. There is nothing in the Ashworm Dragoon entry which states that the increases in HD and other benefits granted by the class are subsumed by the Paladin entry if the two are used together, so yes, you'd get them both. But the class makes no mention of stacking with Paladin, so you can't count Ashworm Dragoon levels to Special Mount advancement.

[CyberThread]

to make that a little more clear


Pally + ashworm = mount abilties

It does not work as

Pally + (ashworm + pally) = mount abilties.


to add another factor to be aware of, ashworm has this...
4-6 HD (Large); 6-9 HD (Huge)

Paladins mount gets 5th–7th +2 bonus hd
ashworm 1st–2nd +2 bonus hd



IT starts with 3HD, with your 5 levels of Pally, and 1 level of ashworm, you get a 7HD mount, which is huge size....

[Nettlekid]

That definitely does not clarify things. You're treating them like they're from the same list. You shouldn't be adding the levels together at all, saying "Pally + Ashworm" anything.

If you have levels in Paladin, your special mount (whatever that may be) gains advancement as you level up. If your Ashworm is your special mount, it gains the benefits that a Paladin's special mount gets for a Paladin of your Paladin level, but NOT of your Paladin+Ashworm Dragoon level.

If you have levels in Ashworm Dragoon, your ashworm gains advancement as you level up, according to the table in the description of the Ashworm Dragoon PrC. This is entirely unrelated to anything to do with Paladins; it is it's own table.

If you have levels in both classes, they both grant their benefits independently, and those apply to the same creature, your Ashworm. The bonuses will stack, but your levels do not stack for determining those bonuses.

There we go.

It should be noted that any class features or feats or the like which augment the Paladin's special mount now apply to your ashworm. Taking levels in Cavalier will advance the Paladin list further. If you have Ranger levels, the feat Devoted Tracker will let you treat your ashworm as your animal companion, meaning it is powered up by the Animal Companion table too. Ranger and Paladin levels do not stack for those bonuses though. So thus far it's all just your level in each class on its own, with no overlap.

If you took levels in Halfling Outrider, which states that it stacks with both Paladin and Druid/Ranger level for determining the bonuses of a Special Mount and an Animal Companion, respectively, then those levels would apply to both of those classes, and your Ashworm benefits from the advancement of both lists (but the list of the Ashworm Dragoon PrC itself would not progress).

Look at Ubermount builds. They're usually designed for some kind of Paladin that gets a special mount like a dragon, but they could be modified for Ashworm Dragoon.

[CyberThread]

Nettle, where in the world are you coming from. Look at the math, you agreed with me.


Ashworm + Paladin = mount abilities

but it does not count as

Paladin + (Paladin + Ashworm ) = mount abilities.