A Spell Question!

[Wahzu]

Hey everybody I have a question about how this would work...

If I use the feat Ocular spell from Lords of Madness and cast Chill Touch with it what would happen?

Ocular Spell reads as such:

Benefit

You can cast a spell with a casting time of 1 full round or less as an ocular spell. An ocular spell does not take effect immediately, but is instead held in one of your eyes for up to 8 hours. You can store only two ocular spells in this fashion, even if you have more than two eyes. Only ray spells and spells with a target other than personal can be cast as ocular spells. When you choose, you can then cast both of the ocular spells as a full-round action; the spells become brilliant blasts that shoot out from your eyes. You can choose different targets for the two ocular spells. When you release an ocular spell, its effect changes to a ray with a range of up to 60 feet. If the spell previously would have affected multiple creatures, it now affects only the creature struck by the ray. You must succeed on a ranged touch attack to strike your target with an ocular spell, and the target is still permitted any saving throw allowed by the spell.

Example: Ferno, an 11th-level wizard with the Ocular Spell feat, could prepare two scorching ray spells as ocular spells, casting them at the beginning of the day. In combat, he can take a full-round action to fi re off both scorching ray spells. He can fire each spell at a different target, and he gets all three rays from each spell. An ocular spell uses up a spell slot two levels higher than the spell's actual level.


Since Chill Touch fits the pre reqs it can be cast as a ray. But for each caster level I would gain an additional ray. Would all of the rays be fired at once or would I have to limit it it 1 per round per eye?

[Sliver]

You'll get all them all at once. The example you have answers that, too:

"He can fire each spell at a different target, and he gets all three rays from each spell."

[TuggyNE]

But for each caster level I would gain an additional ray.

Why do you say that? Ocular Spell just makes a single ray per spell, not per melee touch attempt the spell grants.

[Wahzu]

I would assume that the other attempts would still be there. Nothing says in the rules that they wouldn't be... It's a fun little thought atleast

[Sliver]

Why do you say that? Ocular Spell just makes a single ray per spell, not per melee touch attempt the spell grants.

Examples aren't RAW, but you can plainly see that it is not intended that you lose out uses.

[Wahzu]

Thanks for the opinions guys it really gives me insight on it :smallbiggrin:

[TuggyNE]

I would assume that the other attempts would still be there. Nothing says in the rules that they wouldn't be... It's a fun little thought atleast

A ray that gives you CL melee touch attacks is not useful (at all), so I'm going with a more favorable interpretation here than is perhaps strict RAW.

What is not reasonable, though, is to assume that a spell that gives you CL melee touch attacks is, upon being converted to single ray form, suddenly a spell that gives you CL rays.


Examples aren't RAW, but you can plainly see that it is not intended that you lose out uses.

For spells that are already rays? No, you don't. But for spells that aren't? The conversion process is not worded in enough detail for that.

[John Longarrow]

Going from a touch spell (one attempt per round, endangers caster to use) to a ray (one shot, doesn't endanger caster) is about equal.
Going from a touch spell (one attempt per round, endangers caster to use) to a ray (LOTS of attacks, doesn't endanger caster) is not equal.

Looking at it from a players perspective, would you like to find out the 5th level wizard with this feat can now dump 10 chill touches on your party as a ranged touch attack?

The reason the example used Scorching Ray is because it is a ray attack that gets more than one ray at higher levels. It was specifying that you keep the extra rays.

[Sliver]

You are using a spell slot two levels higher. Things shouldn't remain "about equal".

[TuggyNE]

Going from a touch spell (one attempt per round, endangers caster to use) to a ray (one shot, doesn't endanger caster) is about equal.
Going from a touch spell (one attempt per round, endangers caster to use) to a ray (LOTS of attacks, doesn't endanger caster) is not equal.

Looking at it from a players perspective, would you like to find out the 5th level wizard with this feat can now dump 10 chill touches on your party as a ranged touch attack?

If I were to substantially houserule the feat, I might allow one ray/round. Or I might not; it's not as though it needs a boost.


The reason the example used Scorching Ray is because it is a ray attack that gets more than one ray at higher levels. It was specifying that you keep the extra rays.

Yes.