3.5 Ninja Build Dilema

[ak grown]

In my current game, I made the unfortunate mistake of forgetting to heal in combat and my Samurai was brutally torn in half by an ogre...ouch

That being said, its time for a new character! And sticking with the theme of terrible Asain themed characters to play, I'm choosing the ninja! (I love the idea of these characters, they just seem to be written poorly and highly underpowered). Also, I am not interested in multiclassing. Maybe a Prestige Class a little later, but I'll mention that shortly.

Here's the quick rundown of what I want him to do. He won't be that great in combat, so I'm focusing him on the use of poisons via shuriken and a blow gun. They do minimal dmg but stack that with my ghost step/sudden strike and it'll be at least a little better, while hopefully dealing some str or con dmg etc., from the poisons. I'm going to be a halfling for the +2 to thrown weapons, amongst other perks. Basically, he'll be an underpowered rogue who stays in the shadows and takes/does whatever he wants.

Since I died at lvl 3, that's where I'll be rejoining the party, and I'm thinking of taking a few lvls PrC Master Thrower at lvl 5 or 6. My DM is letting us take up to 2 character flaws in return for up to 2 bonus feats, giving me 4 total at lvl 3. If I do go Master Thrower eventually, then I need Point Blank Shot, Precise Shot, and Weapon Focus (Shuriken) just as prerequisites, leaving me with 1 more, which I would probably choose Expanded Ki Pool, to give me a few more uses of my ki every day. If I choose not to be a Master Thrower, I'll probably choose Dodge/Mobility/Point Blank Shot/Expanded Ki Pool, and then when I get my next feat at lvl 6 I'll pick up Shot on the Run so that I can ghost step, attack, move to set myself up for an AoO while still invis to get another sudden strike attack.

I guess, have any of you ever played a ninja, and if so, how did you go about building it? Like I said, I wanna focus more on thrown weapons w/poison and stealth than melee. What feats should I take and how can I try to enhance this characters overall effectiveness in many facets of the game?

[Red Fel]

In my current game, I made the unfortunate mistake of forgetting to heal in combat and my Samurai was brutally torn in half by an ogre...ouch

That being said, its time for a new character! And sticking with the theme of terrible Asain themed characters to play, I'm choosing the ninja! (I love the idea of these characters, they just seem to be written poorly and highly underpowered). Also, I am not interested in multiclassing. Maybe a Prestige Class a little later, but I'll mention that shortly.

Here's the quick rundown of what I want him to do. He won't be that great in combat, so I'm focusing him on the use of poisons via shuriken and a blow gun. They do minimal dmg but stack that with my ghost step/sudden strike and it'll be at least a little better, while hopefully dealing some str or con dmg etc., from the poisons. I'm going to be a halfling for the +2 to thrown weapons, amongst other perks. Basically, he'll be an underpowered rogue who stays in the shadows and takes/does whatever he wants.

Since I died at lvl 3, that's where I'll be rejoining the party, and I'm thinking of taking a few lvls PrC Master Thrower at lvl 5 or 6. My DM is letting us take up to 2 character flaws in return for up to 2 bonus feats, giving me 4 total at lvl 3. If I do go Master Thrower eventually, then I need Point Blank Shot, Precise Shot, and Weapon Focus (Shuriken) just as prerequisites, leaving me with 1 more, which I would probably choose Expanded Ki Pool, to give me a few more uses of my ki every day. If I choose not to be a Master Thrower, I'll probably choose Dodge/Mobility/Point Blank Shot/Expanded Ki Pool, and then when I get my next feat at lvl 6 I'll pick up Shot on the Run so that I can ghost step, attack, move to set myself up for an AoO while still invis to get another sudden strike attack.

I guess, have any of you ever played a ninja, and if so, how did you go about building it? Like I said, I wanna focus more on thrown weapons w/poison and stealth than melee. What feats should I take and how can I try to enhance this characters overall effectiveness in many facets of the game?

Here's my question. I know you're asking for how to put together a Ninja (the class). But what I want to know is whether you want to play a Ninja (the class) because you like the class, or a Ninja (the class) because you want to play a Ninja (the profession)?

Because, I have to be honest, there are ways to play a Ninja (the profession) without being a Ninja (the class), that are better than playing a Ninja (the class). More mechanically sound, more exciting features, more options. Just like there are ways to play a shining armored warrior without being a Knight, Paladin or Samurai; ways to play a clergyman without being a Cleric or Favored Soul; ways to engage in hand-to-hand pugilism and martial arts without playing a Monk; and so forth.

If you really want to play Ninja (the class), I can't help you much. But if you want to play Ninja (the profession), I'd suggest taking levels in Swordsage. The Shadow Hand discipline is practically made for ninja arts. Alternatively, you could go with a PsiRogue; I've heard good things can be done with that. Further, as far as PrCs go, if you can make the prereqs, Telflammar Shadowlord is a pretty sick PrC with lots of dark-assassin-in-the-shadows flavor to it.

[Seharvepernfan]

I guess, have any of you ever played a ninja, and if so, how did you go about building it? Like I said, I wanna focus more on thrown weapons w/poison and stealth than melee. What feats should I take and how can I try to enhance this characters overall effectiveness in many facets of the game?

I have never played a ninja, but I am intimately familiar with them.

Improved Initiative, Quick Draw, TWF. To get these by third level, you'll need to be a human, a strongheart halfling, or use flaws. Note that a monk can use shuriken with his flurry of blows ability, so consider taking a level of monk (hey, free unarmed damage, good saves, and a feat) if your DM using fractional Bab/saves. You can stack the flurry of blows with TWF to make three attacks, each of them with a -4 penalty. If you went with halfling, you'll be much better off all around with the whole throwing thing, what with their higher dex, small size (+1 to hit), and racial +1 to thrown weapons. PBS will help negate these penalties and will raise your damage a bit (+1 damage to each hit can add up quick), and it's max range is the same as your sneak attack max range. Have potions (or scrolls or a wand if you have a high UMD bonus) of reduce person to further raise your attacks by +2, and make you much stealthier as well. Shuriken are considered ammunition so you can buy a bunch of masterwork ones for 7gp (I think) each. Finally, poison activates with each hit, so the more attacks you can make, the more poison you can deliver.

Assuming elite array and 3rd level, with a strongheart halfling, you could have this.
Str 10, Dex 17, Con 13, Int 10, Wis 14, Cha 8
Improved Initiative, Quick Draw, TWF
MW Shuriken +8 (+10 with reduce person), +6/+6 with TWF (+8/+8 reduced)
1+2d6 sneak attack

If you took PBS, add +1 to each attack and +1 to damage

At 4th level, you can increase your dex and take a level of monk:
Str 10, Dex 18, Con 13, Int 10, Wis 14, Cha 8
Improved Initiative, Quick Draw, TWF
MW Shuriken +10 (+12 with reduce person), +8/+8 with TWF (+10/+10 reduced), +6/+6/+6 with TWF and flurry of blows (+8/+8/+8)
1+2d6 sneak attack

The more bonuses you can get to attack, the better off you'll be. Bardic music, good hope/heroism, haste, bless, etc. Poisons that knock people out or put them to sleep are better than ones that deal stat damage, and you'll probably be better off getting a bunch of doses of cheap poison rather than a few expensive good ones (unless you're going after a lone or small number of targets). If you see undead, run (you're probably slower than them, so get a potion of hide from undead and a potion of expeditious retreat, just in case).

I'm not too familiar with master thrower, but if it gives you more attacks, then great.

Swordsage is awesome. You'll be better off with that than with ninja, but you won't be good at throwing stuff, and I get the feeling your group doesn't use that high a level of optimization. Still, a level of swordsage at some point later on in your build, along with the feat martial stance (assassins stance) would be a great idea, as it will help you keep up with your sneak attack damage.

[Venom3053000]

this (http://www.minmaxboards.com/index.php?PHPSESSID=d7mem8dmp93oe7uelmtm3mf187&topic=2823) has a of stuff for ninjas

[Story]

I guess, have any of you ever played a ninja, and if so, how did you go about building it? Like I said, I wanna focus more on thrown weapons w/poison and stealth than melee. What feats should I take and how can I try to enhance this characters overall effectiveness in many facets of the game?

I've never played a Ninja, but one of the other players did in my last campaign. His build was

Halfling Ninja 2/Rogue 3/Fighter 2/Master Thrower 5

He took Halfling Rogue subsitution to boost SA, plus Glimmerskin Halfling and Dragonfire Strike to boost both SA and SS. Umbral Collar of Metamorphisis + high Hide check meant he was basically invisible at will, and he could kill 2-3 people a round with shruikens. After that he took Maiming Strike to convert his SA and SS into CHA damage (bypassing most creature defenses while letting him take prisoners unconscious) and Master Thrower doubled all of his attacks.

He was crazy powerful in combat as well as being sneaky and ninja-y. I'm not sure how much this helps though since you said you didn't want to multiclass.