Monster Manual IV (Nevermind. Thread is a waste of space)

[Dr. Azkur]

Okay so I just started reading Monster Manual IV, I think I opened it once to look for something in particular but I had never taken the time to actually read entries one by one. After a while I noticed... there is no entry for monster's HD... This completely baffled me. Right now I'm still not sure how to proceed.

I mean, sure, they point out how much HP the monster has, even how many Hit Dice... but no mention on which dice the creature has. I went to M.M.IV to look for monsters to add templates to! The very first thing a template points out is what the HD changes to. And what if I want to advance a monster by adding HD? I guess I could work out an equation to calculate each monster's quantity of HD based on its monster type (In which case I'd be forced to learn the HD of every monster type, which wouldn't be as bad) and its Con score... but that's a huge amount of work for anyone who doesn't know anything about programming, and even those of us that could automatise the equation is still quite annoying just to find out that small, but important (to me, at least) detail.

I guess the question is why? Why did it get removed? Exactly what am I missing? :smallconfused:

Thanks in advance to everyone.

EDIT: I realise this is a version of the monster block format, not just done in M.M.IV... I'm wondering how I didn't notice this before.

[BowStreetRunner]

The hit dice are determined by the creature type. So if you have a creature type of Magical Beast then you have a 10-sided HD. So for each creature you can check the glossary entry and get the HD type from there.

[Dr. Azkur]

Yes, that's what I meant by "I guess I could work out an equation to calculate each monster's quantity of HD based on its monster type and Con score".

Damn... it's a nice formatting, it takes less space and it looks good, why did they have to blow it like that by actively excluding information?

[BowStreetRunner]

Question:

...why did they have to blow it like that by actively excluding information?
Answer:

...it takes less space...
When printing a book, space costs money. I think it's pretty much as simple as that.

[Grod_The_Giant]

Assumed that they type of hit die is rarely relevant? Unless you're advancing the creature, in which case you'd presumably be looking at the type entry anyway.

[137beth]

It tells you how many hit points and how many hit dice, and what its con score is. Subtract its con bonus*HD to get how many hit-points it has from hit-dice. Divide by total hit-dice. That is the average roll on one of its HD.

[Dr. Azkur]

When printing a book, space costs money. I think it's pretty much as simple as that.


No monster block would take one line longer than it did by adding '(00d00)'. Not buying it.

[BowStreetRunner]

No monster block would take one line longer than it did by adding '(00d00)'. Not buying it.

You really should talk to an accountant at a publishing company. If changing font can save a lot of money (http://www.cnn.com/2014/03/27/living/student-money-saving-typeface-garamond-schools/), then deleting a handful of characters sure can too.

[GilesTheCleric]

I was also pretty irritated when I noticed that. However, each entry does have the advancement information, and the creature type. If you assume the creature has one less HD than the minimum advancement, and you know the creature type, then you now know how many and what type of dice it has. Not too difficult.

[Dr. Azkur]

You really should talk to an accountant at a publishing company. If changing font can save a lot of money (http://www.cnn.com/2014/03/27/living/student-money-saving-typeface-garamond-schools/), then deleting a handful of characters sure can too.

I refuse to take that as an explanation when every single PrC that advances casting ever printed wastes an amazing amount of ink and space with the same old paragraph that nobody ever reads.


I was also pretty irritated when I noticed that. However, each entry does have the advancement information, and the creature type. If you assume the creature has one less HD than the minimum advancement, and you know the creature type, then you now know how many and what type of dice it has. Not too difficult.

Indeed, I never complained about difficulty. But you're right. We're all right here. Let's forget this thread already.

[BowStreetRunner]

I refuse to take that as an explanation when every single PrC that advances casting ever printed wastes an amazing amount of ink and space with the same old paragraph that nobody ever reads.

LOL! You have me there. Although apparently someone does read it occasionally, or else there would not be anyone arguing that the Rainbow Servant has a full 10-level caster progression. :smallamused: But your point is nevertheless taken. There are certainly a lot of other ways they could have saved if it was entirely a financially-driven decision. So maybe they were just lazy.

[Grod_The_Giant]

You really should talk to an accountant at a publishing company. If changing font can save a lot of money (http://www.cnn.com/2014/03/27/living/student-money-saving-typeface-garamond-schools/), then deleting a handful of characters sure can too.
That's been debunked, incidentally (http://www.fastcodesign.com/3028436/why-garamond-wont-save-the-government-467-million-a-year). The letters in Garamond are physically smaller than, say, Times New Roman for any given font size, which is where the ink savings actually come from.


I was also pretty irritated when I noticed that. However, each entry does have the advancement information, and the creature type. If you assume the creature has one less HD than the minimum advancement, and you know the creature type, then you now know how many and what type of dice it has. Not too difficult.
The book does say how many HD creatures have-- it's written as "76 (8 HD)."