Making a fun 3.5 cleric

[Thealtruistorc]

The title says it all. I want to know how to create a fun and effective cleric in 3.5. All ideas are welcome.

[slaydemons]

Well you have to tell us your definition of fun, there is a literal metric butt ton of stuff clerics can do, some of the more popular things is because healing rapidly gets outpaced by damage is to make yourself a buffing cleric and take a weapon into melee yourself. another suggestion might be, become a necromancer. the most powerful combination is by far divine metamagic. what it does is allow you to change your turn undead attempts for meta magics and then there is an item called night stick which allows you to use turn undead attempts.

[Zweisteine]

To optimize fun, I recommend variety. Don't over specialize, as that leads to monotony. If you can get Polymorph and the like, they can be incredibly fun, even if setting it up takes a bit of work.

A cloistered cleric is probaby more fun than standard, because of variety in skills. Stay Neutral, to minimize the number of spells you can't cast. Choose domains that add good spells to your list (sadly, polymorph isn't in any domain).

Choose feats that grant interesting, fun-to-use abilities. Going all-out DMM Persist might be a bad idea, but it can give you variety by letting you change role daily. There are more fun options, though.

[Thealtruistorc]

Let me clarify a bit more. I have a rather boring healbot cleric at this point, and I want to turn him into a powerful buffing frontline battle cleric (pimp my cleric, if you will). I know Ruby Knight Vindicator is an amazing option, but I doubt my dm will allow. I need other ideas.

[sleepyphoenixx]

Get DMM:Persist. After resting, cast long-term buffs. Cast persisted short term buffs (one of which should be Divine Power). Then go and smash faces.
That's really all there is to it.

[Snowbluff]

For something dynamic, Complete Champion has Domain ("Devotion") feats.

[Fouredged Sword]

Yeah, what you are looking for is divine metamagic: persist. You can persist your most powerful buff for 6 turn attempts. Get as many turn attempts as possible and run around as a 9ft fall superfighter.

[Bloodgruve]

If you go the Cloistered Cleric and DMM Persist route,

Travel Devotion to get you to melee and still have full attacks

Knowledge Devotion + Guidance of the Avatar (https://www.wizards.com/dnd/article.asp?x=dnd/sb/sb20010504a)

1h weapons can be wielded 2 handed so you can double your Str and Power Attack damage.

Blood~

[Red Fel]

Let me clarify a bit more. I have a rather boring healbot cleric at this point, and I want to turn him into a powerful buffing frontline battle cleric (pimp my cleric, if you will). I know Ruby Knight Vindicator is an amazing option, but I doubt my dm will allow. I need other ideas.

No RKV? This gives me sadface. Shame on the DM who disallows RKV.

How comfortable are you with multiclassing? One option, for instance, is to basically build a Paladin without the Paladin. I got some help doing this (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?308622-3-5-Let-s-Build-a-Hellborn-Paladin) awhile back, and it was awesome. Consider a Cleric 4/ Ordained Champion 5/ Fist of Raziel 3/ Prestige Paladin 1/ Fist of Raziel +7. You get Cleric CL 17, full BAB, some Turn Undead progression, and tons of smitey goodness. Thanks to OC, you can turn a TU into a smite. Thanks to FoR, you add to your smites/day from PrPal, which nets you a total of 6/day. On top of that, each of these smites benefits fully from the FoR abilities involved, meaning that each one is considered Good-aligned, automatically confirms crits, deals an additional 2d6 to Evil creatures, or an additional 2d8 against Evil Outsiders or Evil Undead, and can chain to an additional 5 targets. And you can do this 6/day, more if you burn TU. On top of that, you get Cleric casting, and thanks to PrPal, you add Paladin spells to your Cleric list.

You will smite. Oh, how you will smite.

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

Go LN Human Cleric of Zarus (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/ex/20041203a&page=1) 6/ Divine Oracle 4/ Contemplative 10 for your build. Get the War domain and either Law or Strength, the Spontaneous Domain Casting ACF in PH2 for one of those, and at 3d level trade your second domain's granted power for Divine Restoration in Dungeonscape. Take two flaws (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/buildingCharacters/characterFlaws.htm): Murky-Eyed and Bravado (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?258440-The-quot-Best-quot-Flaws#30), which gets you two extra feats. Say you visited the Frog God's Fane detailed in CS to get the feat prerequisite for Divine Oracle for 2,000 gp instead of spending a feat on it. Your feats should be Extend Spell, Persistent Spell, DMM: Persistent, Power Attack, Extra Turning, Strength Devotion, Craft Rod, and whatever else you want. Domains from Contemplative are Law or Strength at 1st and Destiny at 6th.

Get a standard Strand of Prayer Beads that's had the Bead of Smiting removed, DMG pricing puts it at only 9,000 gp. Get a Lesser Rod of Extend, a Reliquary Holy Symbol (MIC), and at least one Night Stick (LM). You can make your own metamagic rods and Night Sticks, and the benefits of multiple Night Sticks stacks. You should have enough turn/rebuke uses to persist a few spells, top choices include Divine Power, Mass Lesser Vigor, Righteous Wrath of the Faithful, and especially Choose Destiny from the Destiny domain. Get a +1 Animated heavy shield and some masterwork Full Plate with a Restful Crystal (MIC). Put (Rod of) Extended Magic Vestment on both of those every day, and be sure to use your Bead of Karma before buffing for +4 caster level. You can also put Extended Greater Magic Weapon on your Greatsword. I'm fond of using (Rod of) Extended Delay Poison every day, casting Detect Poison on yourself at the end of the day, and if you're poisoned use Neutralize Poison on yourself.

With Persistent Mass Lesser Vigor on the whole party every day you shouldn't need to worry about healing. Tell everyone to get a Healing Belt (MIC) and they can use it for emergency healing during combat when needed. You can spontaneously convert prepared spells into Restoration-type spells, and your Bead of Healing can take care of other conditions so you won't need to keep them prepared. You can also get a Rod of Bodily Restoration (MIC) for even more ability damage fixing if you think the party will need it.

[Ansem]

Google Mr. Icy Hot, can't be argued that that one isn't fun to play.

[Harkle]

Well, My DM isn't allowing DMM persist. Says it is too powerful... which it probably is. Infact he doesn't allow Meta magic at all. seems every time someone tries to use it there is a game stopping rules discussion for 30 min.

So we avoid those.

However, I'm playing an evil dwarf cleric. and I'm having a blast. I have the highest AC in the group. and can make it even higher. I don't dish out as much damage as the fighters, but I can wade into battle and take a beating with the best of them.

My Fun is all in the Role Play though. Lots of interparty banter.

I will probably be taking a 2 level dip into Divine Oracle to get the evasion in heavy armor.

:)
Harkle

[John Longarrow]

Thealtruistorc,
What is your clerics current alignment / diety / domain choices / level?

Advice for a 2nd level Cleric of Pelor will be very different than advice for a 14th level cleric of Wee Jas.

[Raezeman]

you can go focus on summoning --> take spel focus (conjuration) & augment summoning. Malconvoker prestigeclass (complete scoundrel) is a good one. It requires 4 ranks in the cross class skill bluff, but let's you get away with summoning evil creatures.

you can go focus on melee --> ordained champion is awesome, but needs you to worship hextor or heronious. just 4 levels cleric and you can go ordained for all 5, and finish it with bone knight for the heck of it. Spells like righteous might make you a beast. Feats like extend and persist can give your buffs durability

radiant server of pelor gives great healing and is easy to get in to (need sun domain)

So basically, what do you want to do?

You can also flick through the complete devine and aim for a prestige class that seems cool

[Aolbain]

Well, My DM isn't allowing DMM persist. Says it is too powerful... which it probably is. Infact he doesn't allow Meta magic at all. seems every time someone tries to use it there is a game stopping rules discussion for 30 min.

So we avoid those.

However, I'm playing an evil dwarf cleric. and I'm having a blast. I have the highest AC in the group. and can make it even higher. I don't dish out as much damage as the fighters, but I can wade into battle and take a beating with the best of them.

My Fun is all in the Role Play though. Lots of interparty banter.

I will probably be taking a 2 level dip into Divine Oracle to get the evasion in heavy armor.

:)
Harkle


Ah, then you don't need more help. If role playing is what you're after the evil cleric's where its at. What god are you worshiping?

[Zweisteine]

For a melee cleric, divinely persistent divine favor is a must. That's how you get in your attacks.

[Harkle]

Ah, then you don't need more help. If role playing is what you're after the evil cleric's where its at. What god are you worshiping?

Laduguer - The Exile, The Grey Protector.

I'm not really a Druegar, just a regular dwarf. But I got turned evil by a magic item, and he answered my prayers. hehehe

I've heard a lot of people bemoaning about playing the cleric. "show up late on character creation day and you play a cleric" things like this.

I've now played a Battle Cleric - this dwarf cleric.
a Cloistered Good cleric
And a Cleric in a 4.0 game.

I've had a lot of fun in all three. True, I would like to play some other classes. But a cleric can be fun especially if you have a DM that will work with you a little bit on your role playing.

Harkle.

[Thealtruistorc]

Thealtruistorc,
What is your clerics current alignment / diety / domain choices / level?

Advice for a 2nd level Cleric of Pelor will be very different than advice for a 14th level cleric of Wee Jas.

This is actually for a buddy of mine. He's an 8th-level dwarf cleric of Moradin and he is lagging behind the rest of the party. He wants to become as good as the other 1st-tier character (a rather optimized druid) without altering his alignment/deity.

Does that clear it up?

[Harkle]

This is actually for a buddy of mine. He's an 8th-level dwarf cleric of Moradin and he is lagging behind the rest of the party. He wants to become as good as the other 1st-tier character (a rather optimized druid) without altering his alignment/deity.

Does that clear it up?

Level 8 is a Blast. If he wants to be a Front Line Fighter, then he needs to get some AC, he should already have AC to rival the fighters. Then Divine Power spell.
This will give him 3 Attacks per round. +12/+7/+2 base.
Then... Ice Axe - from the Spell Compendium. Attacks are Touch Attacks. Damage 2d12 +4 per hit.
Unless the Tier 1s are incredibly optimized and have magic items beyond thier level... He should be a force to reckon with.

edit - have a friendly mage like person cast Haste on you.. and bam.. 4 attacks per round. you should be hitting on at least 3 if not all 4 per round. between 6d12 +12 and 8d12 + 16 per round of damage. yeah boy, that is what I'm talking about.

Above all, Role Play.. that is where the fun is. Shout out to Moradin in battle. Curse your foes, Drink Heavily.
:)

-Harkle

[Kaidedshard]

The title says it all. I want to know how to create a fun and effective cleric in 3.5. All ideas are welcome.

Deep gnome, Cleric/runecaster.

Domain craft
Domain meditation
I would suggest taking the "extra domain feats" with a domain of what ever utilitarian spell you wish to use in this build.

With meditation domain you can empower a spell once per day without it affecting the spell level.
While with rune caster you can maximize a spell without increasing its level.

With that in mind. You can now use the craft domain as well you create fantastic machines. For example, but not limited to:
A runic guardian with maximized, empowered spell like ability's up to 5th level.
A automatic crossbow of greater fantastic machine. That fires its own arrows with out the need to reload. You could make guantlets with runes that activate when you grab weapons. For example if you grabbed your cross bow, you could enchant all the bolts with a spell from the rune as a constant effect contingent on grabbing the cross bow handle.
You could craft runes into a bag that holds things like caltrops. It could have a spell built into it like gembomb, slay living. Maybe you just want people who step on it to float. So you enchant the rune to say something like what ever goes in the bag gets said effect after being removed from bag by said caster.
The idea behind this character build is to use magical items in creative ways.
For example, you could make runes of fantastic machines that carry your supplies.
You could make a rune that shapes stone. Thus letting the player walk through walls of dungeons and castles or the like.
You could make a belt that constantly casts warding gems while worn.
You could craft a rune of "animate objects" and place it on what ever and bam instant object thats animated. For example, place it in some ones bag and their bag will come to life under your command. Or maybe you want to put it on some ones armor. So what you do is touch their armor. Now they have to fight their own armor which they are wearing.
Maybe you are trying to catch a bad person. So you cast refugee into a rune and you toss it into their bag. Now when they discover it in their bag the owner is delivered to your door step without you having to give chase.
maybe you want to have a place to hoard all the stuff for your adventures. So you enchant a rune of "gate". You can now go directly to said location where ever you please.
Maybe you want to be like jesus and want to resurect people with a rune with a on touch resurrection spell built into it.
You could make a runic trap that casts "Sarcophagus of Stone" on people who cross it.
Say you went all noble and wish to redeem evil players. You could force them to atone for all their misdeeds via a rune of atonement. You leave one of them in a thieves bag. When ever they touch it they now atone for their ways. Or maybe you place it on a black guards head forcing his evil deeds out of him. Or maybe you leave it in some ones soup while you cook. any one who eats the soup now atones for their sins.
Maybe you want to make a potion stopper or cap that "energizes potions as per the spell" now you have a quick way to make grenades of the most mundane potions.
maybe you wish to play your runecaster as a greedy character. Since many gnomes like gems. You could "detect minerals as per the spell" on one rune. then use another rune you could stone shape to find the elements you wish to look for.
Maybe you want to shake the very earth as you walk. So you put a rune on your boots for earthquake. Now you are a walking natural disaster.
maybe you are a deeply religious gnome And wish to comune with your deity regularly thus you create a rune of "commune" Thus now you can speak with your god regularly.
Maybe you want to create a path to a location using a rune of "darkway"

The point is there are limitless Ideas to creation of items within the runes. So long as you know the spell. While also you have the ability to have a rune crafted that is empowered and maximized without it affecting the over all level of the spell being cast. You can also enlarge or use other meta magic feats on the same rune thus improving it further. Making this build something deviously overpowered if used in such a mannor. Also making runes is much faster than crafting magical items. Thus letting the player enchant other mundane objects on touch without much regard to expenses. For example if you enchanted your armor it cost a lot of exp. But with a rune you can touch your armor. Other peoples armor could be touched by the rune and would adopt that runes enchantment. Thus you could be relatively mundane as gear goes. But with a couple runes your whole party is on roids. So the price investment in the rune is superior to the gear investments of an entire party.

Its all in how creative you play this character. Not in how you build his levels up. So long as you go max rune caster as well as at least a couple levels in cleric you will be able to cross over into what ever else you wish him to evolve into. I Guess the main thing is not how you build up the cleric but rather how well you utilize the spells you have available to you from building him or her up.

[Haruki-kun]

The Winged Mod: Thread Necromancy.