Quick PP Idea

[shamgar001]

I was imagining having a world in which some sort of enlightened secret society existed which had discovered that all forms of magic (divine, arcane, even the physiological martial "magic") was all just different forms of the same forces, and so they learned to use them interchangeably.

From there I was thinking about how to make that idea work in a mechanical way, so I thought of a paragon path for the order which has the following as a level 16 feature:

All Is One (16th): Any powers with a power source keyword are considered to have the Arcane, Divine, Martial, Primal, Psionic, and Shadow keywords.

I'm not used to playing or running the paragon tier, nor am I much into optimizing. Would such a feature be terribly OP? Would it be more prone to abuse than other 16th-level features?

[captpike]

there are not that many things that care about power source keywords, there are undoubtly some edge cases that are not coming to mind but offhand quickened spellcasting (http://www.wizards.com/dndinsider/compendium/feat.aspx?id=1205) is the only thing that comes to mind

[NecroRebel]

Single-classed Sorcerers also get their damage bonus on all Arcane powers, right? Sorcerers don't normally get many multi-tap powers, but this would allow a half-elf sorcerer to use Twin Strike every round, which, combined with whatever minor-action attacks they can pull off, would let them get quite high consistent DPR on single targets. Probably better than anyone else can get.

[GPuzzle]

White Lotus feats, Quickened Spellcasting, Arcane Admixture, Divine Mastery, Font of Radiance, Punishing Radiance, Martial Mastery...

That's plenty of ways to exploit that PP.

[shamgar001]

White Lotus feats, Quickened Spellcasting, Arcane Admixture, Divine Mastery, Font of Radiance, Punishing Radiance, Martial Mastery...

That's plenty of ways to exploit that PP.

To some extent, those kinds pf exploitations are the whole point of it. By learning that all magic is the same, you can use techniques for one type with another.

But is it much more exploitable than any other 16th-level feature?

[Inevitability]

Maybe make it so that you can change the power source of a power? It'll still be exploitable, but at least you don't get 5 power source-specific feats boosting a single power.

Or make it an epic destiny.

[Sol]

To some extent, those kinds pf exploitations are the whole point of it. By learning that all magic is the same, you can use techniques for one type with another.

But is it much more exploitable than any other 16th-level feature?

Than any other 16th-level feature? No, it definitely would not be the best 16F ever.

It is rather better than the average 16F, though.

[Zaq]

It seems dicey to me, since unless you're doing shenanigans with it, it won't do you any good. So you're basically saying that you HAVE to engage in shenanigans for your 16F to be anything other than fluff, and that doesn't sit well with me.

Of course, there's also the wrinkle that a lot of the feats that affect a given power source require you to have a class from that power source already, and since you can only have a max of three classes (hybrid|hybrid/multiclass) without a specific PP that doesn't happen to be this one, I'm not sure how much benefit you'd even be ABLE to wring out of such shenanigans.

[Inevitability]

*Cough*Bards*Cough*

[Zaq]

*Cough*Bards*Cough*

I concede that particular point, but that's just shifting the issue rather than solving it.

[GPuzzle]

So, how do we fix that? By using the level 11 feature as that.

What do I mean?

One is All (11th): You are now considered to be part of the martial, arcane, divine, primal, psionic and shadow power sources.

[shamgar001]

So you'd qualify for power source feats, but not class-specific feats in the power source?

[captpike]

So you'd qualify for power source feats, but not class-specific feats in the power source?

this is correct

[GPuzzle]

Actually, sorry for taking over the thread, but I think I have an idea for the Utility power.

Everypower
Encounter Power
Minor Action

Keywords: Martial, Arcane, Divine, Primal, Psionic, Shadow

Choose one of the following benefits. You gain that benefit until the end of your next turn.

-You shift 3 squares and one ally can charge to an enemy adjacent to you
-You teleport 3 squares and you choose one type of damage to be added to your attacks (acid, cold, lightning, force, fire, necrotic, psychic, radiant, thunder, poison). You deal 5 extra damage of that type of damage.
-You shed bright light within 5 squares of you and enemies adjacent to you take a -2 penalty to hit and take 10 radiant damage.
-You conjure an area of plants in a close burst 3 around you. You and your allies have partial concealment within that area and that area is difficult terrain for your enemies.
-You apply one of the following vulnerabilites on your enemy: Vulnerable 5 force, Vulnerable 5 psychic, Vulnerable 5 lightning, Vulnerable 5 thunder.
-You become invisible, shift 3, and can move through enemies.

Is it too overpowered or is it alright?

[Zaq]

Actually, sorry for taking over the thread, but I think I have an idea for the Utility power.

Everypower
Encounter Power
Minor Action

Keywords: Martial, Arcane, Divine, Primal, Psionic, Shadow

Choose one of the following benefits. You gain that benefit until the end of your next turn.

-You shift 3 squares and one ally can charge to an enemy adjacent to you
-You teleport 3 squares and you choose one type of damage to be added to your attacks (acid, cold, lightning, force, fire, necrotic, psychic, radiant, thunder, poison). You deal 5 extra damage of that type of damage.
-You shed bright light within 5 squares of you and enemies adjacent to you take a -2 penalty to hit and take 10 radiant damage.
-You conjure an area of plants in a close burst 3 around you. You and your allies have partial concealment within that area and that area is difficult terrain for your enemies.
-You apply one of the following vulnerabilites on your enemy: Vulnerable 5 force, Vulnerable 5 psychic, Vulnerable 5 lightning, Vulnerable 5 thunder.
-You become invisible, shift 3, and can move through enemies.

Is it too overpowered or is it alright?

The ones I bolded are significantly more powerful than the others. Any leader worth their salt would kill to get their hands on the first one (it seems like the kind of thing that would be a standard action, honestly), and while the vulnerability one isn't overpowered in and of itself, it's still markedly more powerful (or rather, has the potential to be markedly more powerful) than the ones I didn't bold, just because of the way vulnerability works in 4e.

[GPuzzle]

Damnit. Those you bolded are the Martial and the Psionic ones - the ones I had the most trouble coming up with. Any idea on how to improve them?

[NecroRebel]

Maybe move your speed or your speed + some for the martial one? More movement range than the arcane option, but more dangerous. Possibly give a bonus to AC against OAs for the move, or maybe just an AC bonus UENT.

Psychic is harder though. "Your next successful attack before the end of your turn dazes its target until the end of your next turn" possibly, but that's still quite strong...

[Inevitability]

How about: 'You become invisible until the end of your turn'?

It's not too strong, but it fits the mindbender theme, and it can be really useful in the right situation.

[Sol]

Psionic is easy: you gain telepathy 5 or your telepathy range increases by 5. If you have the Psionic Augmentation class feature, you also regain 2 Power Points.

The 2 power points bring this PP in line with native Psionic paragon paths, which all grant an additional 2 power points.