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View Full Version : Should Class Balancing Issues have their own Forum?



Scalenex
2007-02-12, 02:01 AM
Just a thought given the large number of threads and heated response on the topic. That way it would filter out the main topic into smaller more manageable chunks.

Here are many of the Questions that get debated.

Are the classes balanced relative to each other?

Are they balanced at some levels and not others?

How can you tell if something's imbalanced?

Are imbalances necessarily detrimental?

Which classes are too powerful and which are too weak?

How big is the imbalance?

What should be done (if anything) to fix the imbalances?

Frankly it seems that a lot of posts get hijacked into one of these debates and I prefer this not dominate every thread. Also it creates more friction and flame wars than any other topic. Creating a sub-forum may be a solution.

NullAshton
2007-02-12, 07:26 AM
Well, anything that has to do with trying to balance the classes should really go in the homebrew section.

Malik
2007-02-12, 07:31 AM
I think that they should get their own section, mainly because i am tired of seeing topics that state this class is better that that one.

Jimp
2007-02-12, 11:02 AM
I think it should get its own subforum. Every few days there is a new topic started and the same stuff is being repeated time and time again. If it had its own area it could be sorted and maybe organised better.

ken-do-nim
2007-02-12, 11:19 AM
C'mon guys, class balance discussions are good for the soul. ;-)

Seriously though, a thread called "my latest attempt to balance the classes" should go in homebrew. A thread called "I think monks are overpowered, but this other guy thinks monks are underpowered, what do you think?" belongs here.

Fax Celestis
2007-02-12, 11:19 AM
I'd say so, but I don't call the shots around here.

Counterspin
2007-02-12, 01:45 PM
I will chipperly embrace the idea of a class balance forum as long as it becomes a warnable offense for someone to wander into a mechanics discussion with the "mechanics don't matter" argument in that subforum. I actually enjoy the balance discussions, but people whining about other people spending time to fix something they themselves admit is unbalanced drives me up the wall.

Lord Iames Osari
2007-02-12, 01:54 PM
Please, not another subforum. Personally, I've started to wish that the Gaming and Homebrew forums be merged back into one, because the rules expertise of the people who frequent Gaming would be a great help in balancing the creations of the homebrewers.

Fax Celestis
2007-02-12, 02:01 PM
Please, not another subforum. Personally, I've started to wish that the Gaming and Homebrew forums be merged back into one, because the rules expertise of the people who frequent Gaming would be a great help in balancing the creations of the homebrewers.

This. Is why. You pimp. Your stuff. *indicates signature*

Ramza00
2007-02-12, 02:07 PM
No but maybe a little warning tag in the title like some forums have an "on topic"

Merlin the Tuna
2007-02-12, 02:11 PM
Attempts to rebalance classes are, by their nature, house rules. Ergo, they are homebrew remedies. Ergo, they should use the Homebrew Forum. Ergo, they already have their own forum. Ergo, leggo my ergo.

NullAshton
2007-02-12, 02:40 PM
I personally avoid the homebrew forums most of the time, because I'd probably never use any of those homebrew classes, and there tends to be several 'class-balancing' house rules at any given time.

ReluctantDragon
2007-02-12, 05:01 PM
I will chipperly embrace the idea of a class balance forum as long as it becomes a warnable offense for someone to wander into a mechanics discussion with the "mechanics don't matter" argument in that subforum. I actually enjoy the balance discussions, but people whining about other people spending time to fix something they themselves admit is unbalanced drives me up the wall.


The problem is we use the intarweb(Blagoblog, webweb, etc.). Any rules that you setup will then be broken if only for spite. Anonymity requires no adherence to any guidelines, hence posts that derail topics. So even if you create a new forum or subforum, people will still derail/offtopic those.

Now keep in mind, I, like I hope most people are, am exhausted and repelled by any topic that says anything at all about class balance, so I would welcome those posts being sent to any number of nether realms. But it won't happen.

Counterspin
2007-02-12, 05:19 PM
ReluctantDragon : This forum has a variety of rules, most of which seem to be well enforced, so I don't know why one would think that rules are unenforcable on the internet in general, or these forums in particular.

Secondly, why do you hope people are sick of class balance discussions? I can understand that you're sick of them, but I'm rather fond of them. I don't hope that you suddenly become reinterested in class balance, I figure you're good where you are. *shrug*

Maybe we should consider a mechanics tag? Something to let people who aren't interested steer clear without having to add another subforum?

Jimp
2007-02-12, 05:24 PM
Maybe we should consider a mechanics tag? Something to let people who aren't interested steer clear without having to add another subforum?

That sounds good to me.

Roland St. Jude
2007-02-12, 05:39 PM
Alternatively, you can just read until you realize it's a topic you're not interested in and then not read any further. It's a time-honored, fool-proof method for avoiding topics of non-interest. :smallwink:

Quietus
2007-02-12, 05:44 PM
What? Common sense?

Pah, what nonsense is that?

Fax Celestis
2007-02-12, 05:48 PM
A Reading from the Gospel of Jude:


And Lo, did the Voice of MOD speak thus,1 "Perhaps common sense and precise reading comprehension shall save thee.2"

ReluctantDragon
2007-02-12, 05:58 PM
ReluctantDragon : This forum has a variety of rules, most of which seem to be well enforced, so I don't know why one would think that rules are unenforcable on the internet in general, or these forums in particular.

Because, though these forums are well modded, does not keep threads from going off topic, from derision ridden posts being added, etc. and so on. A simple rule of the internet is that people will conflict with the original design of any type of forum that allows opinion to be easily stated.


Secondly, why do you hope people are sick of class balance discussions? I can understand that you're sick of them, but I'm rather fond of them. I don't hope that you suddenly become reinterested in class balance, I figure you're good where you are. *shrug*


Because as you stated, I am sick of them, and noone wants to be alone.:smalltongue:
Everyone seeks to have the majority be on their side, and I will never give the idea that I am not one of those people. More than anything else, those topics tend to degenerate into the same people giving the same opinions over and over again, each for a new post. While there is no physical negative aspect of such, it seems to me a waste of time and effort. Hence my opinion. Which is as insignificantly valid as everyone else's.

And sure you hope that I see your way. Maybe not me specifically, but definitely others aside from yourself. The existence of all mankind is to find those of like mind and congregate. Its the basis of religious and social culture. To deny that is to deny your human aspects. RE: previous closing statement in above paragraph.

RD

Whamme
2007-02-12, 06:08 PM
Attempts to rebalance classes are, by their nature, house rules. Ergo, they are homebrew remedies. Ergo, they should use the Homebrew Forum. Ergo, they already have their own forum. Ergo, leggo my ergo.

Not true. I debate fixes without implementing them as house rules.

Why? I object to house rules (my GM/DM of choice uses them often, but I try to dissuade him and consider it a small flaw in an otherwise amazing GM).


Discussing how the game should be OFFICIALLY changed is different from how you're going to unofficially change it.

Merlin the Tuna
2007-02-12, 06:34 PM
Not true. I debate fixes without implementing them as house rules.

Why? I object to house rules (my GM/DM of choice uses them often, but I try to dissuade him and consider it a small flaw in an otherwise amazing GM).


Discussing how the game should be OFFICIALLY changed is different from how you're going to unofficially change it.Now, I don't mean to put words in your mouth, but this sounds a lot like "I'd much rather complain about the problem than actually fix it."

Quietus
2007-02-12, 06:41 PM
But it's not. Whamme doesn't like house rules, which is understandable - it can get confusing trying to keep track of the differences between the RAW and house rules. That isn't to say that they necessarily AGREE with the RAW, just that it's cumbersome to track several sets of rules.

I, personally, have no issues with them, since we base our houserules on sensibility more often than not, or simply to rebalance things since our DM figures anything our CRx3 for a 2 person group is fair game - kinda negates any saving throws, or SR checks, or the like. But I don't know whether I agree or disagree on keeping a separate board for balance changes/house rules... I'm afraid that I've got less than a week of time on these boards, hardly enough time to really get into the feel of them.